Get Ivy Bridge now or wait?

[wrenaudrey]

I currently have a very old CPU, C2Q Q8300 2.5Ghz. I dont game on this.
I really wanna start PC gaming (on xbox atm) so i will be building a new system towards the end of this year.
Now my dilemma is: Shall i wait for Haswell or just go with Ivy Bridge now (or maybe SB?)?

Apart from the socket changing (1155 to 1150)...
+Will there be a huge difference between them two? In terms of gaming and light file conversions?
+How d'you guys think the prices will go- much more expensive for Haswell or will it be thesame as Ivy now?
+How d'you think OC'ing go? Much hotter (than Ivy) as much smaller die size?
+Any other things i should be aware?

Thanks people!

 

[nikorr]

Haswell is ~ 1 year from the market. Can u wait?

Looks like it will OC better, due to increased power consumption.

 

[wrenaudrey]

Haswell is ~ 1 year from the market.

1 Year? I read somewhere that it would come out 2013 around Feb-April time

But if i did wait, do you think it would have been really worth the wait?

 

[nikorr]

~ 1 year : ))

Well, AMD is not driving Intel crazy.

I hope for Jan1st But, who knows.

 

[Maxx_Power]

Who really knows on the Haswell launch times. Ivy Bridge was delayed, and it is likely Haswell will be delayed at least an equal amount of time. In addition, the core i3 ivy's are not even launched yet, so the Ivy Bridge launch isn't complete.

 

[nikorr]

I want Intel Haswell-EP .
http://vr-zone.com/articles/intel-haswell-ep-platform-detailed/16419.html

I hope they wont wait till 2014.

 

[wrenaudrey]

Ah! I guess it wouldnt be a bad idea to upgrade to Ivy now then instead of waiting.

How long d'you think Iyv will be able to last until you would REALLY need to upgrade again? As im sure there wont be atleast 50% improvement from Ivy to Haswell or probably even Broadwell.

 

[nikorr]

Well, I am "waiting" with 2600K.

 

[shanky887614]

i think im going to wait to see what comes after haswell

got a i5-2400

board supports ivy so id rather get better gpu in the future (an ssd as well, waiting for price of large ones to drop)

 

[nikorr]

I don't thing prices will be dropping anytime soon.

AMD is not pushing Intel, so who wants the fastest, it will cost, hopefully the same.

It could get worst too. RAM is about to go up.

 

[wrenaudrey]

AMD is not pushing Intel, so who wants the fastest, it will cost, hopefully the same.
It could get worst too. RAM is about to go up.

Very good point!
And why is RAM going up anyway?

 

[Guest]

Apart from the socket changing (1155 to 1150)...
+Will there be a huge difference between them two? In terms of gaming and light file conversions?

The socket changing issue could be a problem selecting a new motherboard the latest socket is 2011 if many upcoming processors will run to that socket nobody really can answered for sure except Intel.

Differences between Processors is not always visible in the “real life computing” you will not find many x64 applications, games that use more than 3.5 GBytes ram, you will not find many games that are using more than 1 core either. There for expecting your real life experience will not be improved as much as you thing.

In Tom’s hardware reviews are running many different benchmarks not just 1 and end up saying this processor is 5% or 15% better you can see here a review of the new ivy:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ivy-bridge-benchmark-core-i7-3770k,3181.html

The data are really valuable and the safe jump to conclusion is that i7-2700K with more aggressive OC frequency nearly matching the -3770K’s performance in the process!? Maybe OCing a bit your processor is what you really need. 2 ssd’s in raid 0 will give you a performance boost visible in your real life experience, even in idle, is always good to look for an onboard raid controller.

+How d'you guys think the prices will go- much more expensive for Haswell or will it be thesame as Ivy now?

how much more expencive it will be no one can tell the price's dosen't always mach the perrfonace impact i7-2700K prices are going up as many choose to move in there at the time moment.

+How d'you think OC'ing go? Much hotter (than Ivy) as much smaller die size?
+Any other things i should be aware?

Many People think because is smaller and consumes less energy it will run cooler they are dead rong the new ivy cpu’s are runnging up to +20 C hotter!! This will help you understand in deep details why I say no to new ivy cpu’s:

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/340000-10-corei-7920-bloomfield

The heat spreaders removed, thermal camera is used, etc.

Finally I’m forced to say a big NO to the new ivy cpu’s.

 

[InvalidError]

And why is RAM going up anyway?

A couple of things:
- one of the DRAM manufacturers (Elpida) has gone bankrupt
- many of the others have slowed down their production to reduce their inventory
- some are preparing to convert production lines to DDR4

In other words, surplus production of DDR3 is nearing its end. If you still do not understand what that means, look at DDR2 prices for a preview of where DDR3 might stand 2-3 years from now.

 

[geofelt]

I currently have a very old CPU, C2Q Q8300 2.5Ghz. I dont game on this.
I really wanna start PC gaming (on xbox atm) so i will be building a new system towards the end of this year.
Now my dilemma is: Shall i wait for Haswell or just go with Ivy Bridge now (or maybe SB?)?

Apart from the socket changing (1155 to 1150)...
+Will there be a huge difference between them two? In terms of gaming and light file conversions?
+How d'you guys think the prices will go- much more expensive for Haswell or will it be thesame as Ivy now?
+How d'you think OC'ing go? Much hotter (than Ivy) as much smaller die size?
+Any other things i should be aware?

Thanks people!

If you wait for the next best thing on the horizon, you will wait forever.
If you have a need now, buy now. It is a good time to buy.
Prices are competitive, and new product issues have been resolved.

1) No difference. Gaming is mostly graphics card dependent, not cpu dependent.
2) Prices will be the same, but you will get a small improvement in performance for your dollar. Just like past new cpu introductions. Think 10%, probably coming from better Instruction per clock.
3) I suspect that the OC potential will be better a bit, since the packaging has had time to get improved. Ivy is not hotter, actually cooler than sandy bridge. The problem comes only when seeking maximum overclocks needing higher voltages.
I expect haswell to be similar.

If you owned a sandy bridge cpu, there is no compelling reason to upgrade to ivy bridge today.
I see the same situation when haswell arrives, at least for the gamer. If you need to use integrated graphics, then haswell will shine.

 

[Maxx_Power]

We've still got a Q6600 (older than your CPU) kicking running games. Chokes a little bit on CPU intensive games like StarCraft 2, but only for very high unit counts. If you are trying to game, I think you will be fine. Also, it might be really nice to game with your current setup for a while, to get a baseline feel of how well games perform on this setup, so when you upgrade, you can really notice the difference, and/or pinpoint what upgrades you want to spend a lot of money on by observing the games you play as either CPU limited, or GPU limited (more common).

 

[Guest]

If you wait for the next best thing on the horizon, you will wait forever.
3) I suspect that the OC potential will be better a bit, since the packaging has had time to get improved. Ivy is not hotter, actually cooler than sandy bridge. The problem comes only when seeking maximum overclocks needing higher voltages.
I expect haswell to be similar.

This one didn't oc he gets 90c with a simple prime95 test

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/341561-10-temps-3770k

Maybe I wasn't good enought for propertly explaining why these chips are runnging hotter by the hour in my link above! In fact They end up downclocking then to 1.5 Ghz in idle just to get some cool trempratures. I run my cores at 3Ghz idle....

I really hope the next Intel cpu's will not have the same cooling methods

 

[geofelt]

If you have a decent cooler in an adequately ventilated case, 70c. should not be a problem.

Before I started this reply, I started up prime95 with a 3570K oc'ed to 4.3. Voltage is 1.192v.
My hottest core has maxed at 68c, and the coolest one has maxed at 59c. I don't think it will go hotter.

Just one anecdotal sample.

 

[Guest]

Can you run a prime95 torture test 4 threads, minimal fft 6000Mbytes (all your cpu cache) and only half of your system ram and provide us a screenshot? i figured 1 hour is more than enough to feel the heat to the bone.

Put i have to warn you i know something you don't and you really need to read this first word by word:

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/340000-10-corei-7920-bloomfield

 

[InvalidError]

This one didn't oc he gets 90c with a simple prime95 test

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/341561-10-temps-3770k

Maybe I wasn't good enought for propertly explaining why these chips are runnging hotter by the hour in my link above!

Keep in mind that the guy in the thread you linked is running his 3770k in a SFF PC, which means a lot less airflow than usually available in a standard case.

You cannot generalize based on results from what essentially is a worst-case scenario. The same CPU in a standard ATX case and an inexpensive enthusiast HSF like the 212EVO would be unlikely to go much beyond 70C in Prime95, maybe less.

 

[Guest]

Keep in mind that the guy in the thread you linked is running his 3770k in a SFF PC, which means a lot less airflow than usually available in a standard case.

You cannot generalize based on results from what essentially is a worst-case scenario. The same CPU in a standard ATX case and an inexpensive enthusiast HSF like the 212EVO would be unlikely to go much beyond 70C in Prime95, maybe less.

This one had NH-D14, was a member in tom's hardware and also tried something i asked him to:

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/forum2.php?config=tomshardwareuk.inc&cat=10&post=341689&page=1&p=1&sondage=0&owntopic=1&trash=0&trash_post=0&print=0&numreponse=0&quote_only=0&new=0&nojs=0

Anyway in here you may understund why is not what cooler you have related the problem:

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/340000-10-corei-7920-bloomfield

 

[geofelt]

No way am I going to take out half my ram to run those tests.
I did change from blend to smal fft, and yes, the max hottest core has gone up to 73c, and the coolest core maxes at 67c.

I think the key is to be reasonable on how high you try to OC. If you are looking for the maximum stable oc, then things can get very toasty.
If you are satisfied, as I am with 4.3 then you do not have much to worry about.

 

[Guest]

No way am I going to take out half my ram to run those tests.
I did change from blend to smal fft, and yes, the max hottest core has gone up to 73c, and the coolest core maxes at 67c.

I think the key is to be reasonable on how high you try to OC. If you are looking for the maximum stable oc, then things can get very toasty.
If you are satisfied, as I am with 4.3 then you do not have much to worry about.

Here is a 2 hours test pirme95 torture, my cpu cache more than my half memory ussed and furmark 1.8 extrem burning running together

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/3953/prime956gbytesfurmark18.jpg

Your Cpu can handle the half i asked and i know it.

PS the OP in here with his processor, the right choices in cpu cooler, pc box, fans, ect can run the same test better! Have no doubt that his CPU will run cooler than any ivy. Whatever you do you can't couch him and this is why:

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/340000-10-corei-7920-bloomfield

 

[wrenaudrey]

No way am I going to take out half my ram to run those tests.
I did change from blend to smal fft, and yes, the max hottest core has gone up to 73c, and the coolest core maxes at 67c.

Here is a 2 hours test pirme95 torture, my cpu cache more than my half memory ussed and furmark 1.8 extrem burning running together

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/3953/prime956gbytesfurmark18.jpg

I'd appreciate it if both of you guys could answer these questions

If i was to upgrade my cpu now, dyou think i should get SB or IB? Will probably be doing mild OC (around 4.2Ghz)

If i was to get an IB, what temps could i expect as 'normal idle' temp? Cause my Q8300 right now cannot be OC'ed but idles 33c
If i was to get an SB, what temps could i expect as 'normal idle' temp?

If i was to get an IB, what temps could i expect as 'mid to max' temp if i OC to 4.2Ghz? Lets say the cpu is a 3570k and 3770k
If i was to get an SB, what temps could i expect as 'mid to max' temp if i OC to 4.2Ghz? Lets say, 2500k and a 2700k

 

[nikorr]

Very good point!
And why is RAM going up anyway?

I think we can hope for the prices to stay where they are,

but it depends on the global demand.



iSuppli: Expect DRAM Prices to Climb

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/dram-prices-trends-ddr3-elpida,16333.html

 

[jaguarskx]

I got a Q9450 @ 3.0GHz.

I'm waiting for Haswell next year before I upgrade. I might even wait until Broadwell is released in 2014, but that's unlikely.

If your Q8300 is too slow for your tastes, then it's probably best to upgrade to IB. If you feel that the performance is still good enough or you think you can limp by, then wait for Haswell.