Question about Hyper Threading and Premier Pro 2

[gentrinity]

Wow, thats great to know, no wonder Illustrator was a bit on the slow side. Thats pretty messed up though.

 

[m25]

Especially if you were working on a particularly large file, it has to be slow, because RAM is not enough and it has to swap in on the harddisk, nothing to do with hyperthreading, the most it can add is 20% on Prescott cores.

 

[gentrinity]

I have worked on a couple of files, but I have 1.5GBs and I usually try and not run too many BG apps, either way youre right, thats why Im getting lots and lots of RAM for my next workstation To the tune of 8GBs. That machine is so gonna rock.

 

[gentrinity]

I was rendering something earlier and I noticed in the task manager processes tab that it was only consuming about 52% CPU for Premiere and around 450MBs of RAM on average. I took a wild guess and thought maybe it had something to do with hyperthreading so I went to the BIOS and turned it OFF. Now its using 99% of the CPU and around 600MBs of RAM.

Is this a fluke or did it really have to do with HT?

If so, Id love to hear an explanation on this. Either way its fixed but its important to know why I fixed it, dont you think

Thanks!!!

 

[m25]

YES
Graphics and video editing software are going pretty slow in the implementation of multithreading, so the likes of Photoshop, Premiere, illustrator etc will only use one core/thread. I hope their next versions support multithreading and also 64 bit because they are software that really need to take advantage of it's extra registers and above all 4G and more of RAM.

 

[m25]

I have worked on a couple of files, but I have 1.5GBs and I usually try and not run too many BG apps, either way youre right, thats why Im getting lots and lots of RAM for my next workstation To the tune of 8GBs. That machine is so gonna rock.

I have 2GB on my office PC, no BG programs but when I work on a realy big file, I'm just as lost as if I had 256MB. I really hope in new 64 bit versions as soon as possible because it really is the ultimate future. All professional software HAVE to go 64 bit.

 

[gentrinity]

Finally, someone who can appreciate the concept of 8GBs. I mean, one has to realize how so many people like you and me are limited to a light multitasking workflow because of limited RAM and CPU, a Kentsfield with 8GBs will resolve that, but so might two quad core Xeons. My mouth is watering.

Youre lucky, I had to do consulation for a company that had a P4 2.4, 1GB RAM, and all the files were located on a network drive. Plus they wanted me to work on 6x3 ft type of files, plus a few RAW photos. It wasnt fun.

Ive seen benchmarks for Macs that show a very noticable difference in speed between 2GBs and 4GBs in Photoshop. Obviously, there is no difference between 4GBs and 8GBs, since Photoshop has a 3GB max, but the beauty is that if you have Illustrator, Premiere, and After Effects open at the same time, all of them will be maxed out in performance plus you will have some very speedy switching among them.

 

[NightlySputnik]

First, you should leave Ht on. The reason is probably that Premiere fill out (only an example) the SSE unit but isn't using the ALU at all. So even if HT is on it won't show any activity on the "fictious" second core, because there won't be any available SSE units available for a second tread. But it'll be available for anything elses that need the ALU. So overall, your performances will be much better if you include background task.

That's exactly the type of workload that beneitt from a real dual-core cou as oppose to one with HT. HT will shine in workload with many different type of tread (these are "things to do by any applications, be it encoding, read, write, etc...), because one thread will use one type of unit (SSEx, ALU, etc...) all at the same time as oppose to one tread then the next one. Because they are not legions, HT usually gives much less performances gain than real dual0core cpu where each core has it's own set of unit to work with. From there the 52% usage, where the extra 2% would be used by the Antivirus or anything else.

In case you don't understand, a cpu is form of a mix on different working unit. They can be, but not limited to: SSE, regular old fashion FPU, ALU, reand and write, etc... When a tread is "at work", it can need a lots of the available SSE units but none of the available ALU and others. HT makes these ALU available to other treads that needs them, giving better usage of available units.

To make sure, encode any given scene with and without HT on. Check how long it takes to finish the task. There is a good chance that it'll be a bit faster with HT on because, by exemple, your AV won't use cycle that would have been used by Premiere Pro otherwise.

I hope I wasn't too brief (and mixed you up more than before) or too long¸(and explain stuff not needed).

 

[gentrinity]

Ill definately look into it, since I plan on doing some other work while doing the rendering.

 

[m25]

Finally, someone who can appreciate the concept of 8GBs. I mean, one has to realize how so many people like you and me are limited to a light multitasking workflow because of limited RAM and CPU, a Kentsfield with 8GBs will resolve that, but so might two quad core Xeons. My mouth is watering.

Youre lucky, I had to do consulation for a company that had a P4 2.4, 1GB RAM, and all the files were located on a network drive. Plus they wanted me to work on 6x3 ft type of files, plus a few RAW photos. It wasnt fun.

Ive seen benchmarks for Macs that show a very noticable difference in speed between 2GBs and 4GBs in Photoshop. Obviously, there is no difference between 4GBs and 8GBs, since Photoshop has a 3GB max, but the beauty is that if you have Illustrator, Premiere, and After Effects open at the same time, all of them will be maxed out in performance plus you will have some very speedy switching among them.

Furthermore, I guess all these software will come 64 bit in their new versions because even 3G are not that much for the likes pf photoshop or after effects. I use Blender for 3D modelling and rendering exactly an unofficial 64bit release on my Athlon64; 10-16% faster than the 32 bit and there are certain rendering methods which I dream of using only when I get 4G of RAM. Get a good workstation if you can afford it but in a budget situation, never trade RAM off for the CPU

 

[gentrinity]

Im still a bit undecided between a dual xeon workstation, which will in a later time be upgradable to a 8 core system. The issue I have is with FMDIMM RAM since its not as good as regular RAM for workstation purposes.

 

[bberson]

YES
Graphics and video editing software are going pretty slow in the implementation of multithreading, so the likes of Photoshop, Premiere, illustrator etc will only use one core/thread.

Adobe disagrees with you. Check the requirements for Premiere Pro 2.0 and for Elements. Also Google for "adobe dual core" to see many pages with test results that show how well Adobe uses multiple cores. Google "adobe qx6700" for even a more impressive shock.

OTOH I didn't see them test Illustrator...

I just with FS-X would do a better job with multiple cores.

-Brad

 

[gentrinity]

I think he was refering to HT. He might have added core by accident, because youre 100% right, thats why im getting a Kentsfield.

Now, if youre saying that Premiere utilizes HT, then thats another thing. All I know is that I saw 50%, and now I see 100%.

I havent run the rendering benchmark yet but I will, then well know for sure if I should leave it on or not. For now, I gotta finish the project first

 

[bberson]

What's interesting is that Premiere Elements specifically supports HT.

Not certain about the full-blown Premiere.


-Brad

 

[gentrinity]

Straight from the horses mouth

• Hyperthreading—Adobe Premiere Pro takes advantage of Intel Pentium 4’s hyperthreading technology. That is, if Adobe Premiere Pro detects you have a hyperthreading CPU, it will divide its processing into multiple streams to work faster and more efficiently. The corollary to this is that it also takes advantage of PCs with multiple processors (both non-hyperthreading and hypterthreading). Theoretically (at least until someone makes such a PC), Adobe Premiere Pro can use up to 16 threads! Note: To see graphic evidence that CPUs with hyperthreading really are doing their job take a look at Windows Task Manager. Access the Task Manager by right-clicking the task bar (or pressing Ctrl+Alt+Delete) then clicking the Performance tab. The DV used for the
following figure has

The big question is, does this include rendering?

 

[bberson]

I'm not certain but I'd say it's likely. From what I've heard, After Effects doesn't benefit quite so much however. There are other ways to skin that cat but it'll cost ya' (distributed computing solutions).

 

[m25]

YES
Graphics and video editing software are going pretty slow in the implementation of multithreading, so the likes of Photoshop, Premiere, illustrator etc will only use one core/thread.

Adobe disagrees with you. Check the requirements for Premiere Pro 2.0 and for Elements. Also Google for "adobe dual core" to see many pages with test results that show how well Adobe uses multiple cores. Google "adobe qx6700" for even a more impressive shock.

OTOH I didn't see them test Illustrator...

I just with FS-X would do a better job with multiple cores.

-Brad
Maybe but after effects does not seem to benefit ant the same is for photoshop for what I know. However, more crucial than dual core is 64 bit support; it is the key to unleash the full potential by blowing away the 3.2GB memory ceiling.

 

[gentrinity]

First of all, I saw from Adobe that Multithreading DOES help with After Effects. Second, I ran a sort of a benchmark, it wasnt fool proof, but from what I saw, Premiere did render faster with HT on. Actually, it had to do more with the fact that it was actually using close to 90% of the CPU compared to 50%.

So now the question is, why the heck was it using 50% that first time around.

 

[m25]

First of all, I saw from Adobe that Multithreading DOES help with After Effects. Second, I ran a sort of a benchmark, it wasnt fool proof, but from what I saw, Premiere did render faster with HT on. Actually, it had to do more with the fact that it was actually using close to 90% of the CPU compared to 50%.

So now the question is, why the heck was it using 50% that first time around.

The answer is that no the whole application may be multithreaded, some routines are still singlethreaded, so it depends on what you are particularly doing.