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PSU Requirement for Radeon HD 7770?

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May 4, 2012 2:32:35 PM

Hello all,

I understand my HP p6214y Desktop PC only has a crappy integrated graphics card and I am looking to upgrade. I also understand I am limited because of a 300w power supply and beyond that, I know very little about graphics cards. I guess I need a card that is a PCI Express x16 graphics card? I was hoping someone would be able to recommend a card for me. My main reason for upgrading is I hope to be able to run Diablo 3 with decent settings (supposedly a low demanding game compared to other new games). Any help is appreciated thanks!



As a reference, here are some cards gamespot tested out with the game....



"Hopping onto our test beds, we thought we'd limbo down a bit and pair up an Intel Core i3 with a practically ancient GeForce 9800 GT. Frame rates ended up pegged at 60, the maximum the monitor allowed with V-sync enabled, and we were still running with everything cranked at 1920. Clearly, we were still overestimating the game's demands.

Off we went to our dusty 1.8GHz Core 2 Duo paired with a GeForce 8800 GT. This has to be the bottom, right? Wrong. We maxed out everything and still ended up with a machine that could output 60 frames per second under normal conditions and in average battles.

We finally got the game to chunk up when we dropped the video card down to a GeForce 8600 GTS, a midrange card that was released in 2007. At 1920x1080, with maximum settings, the game was playable if a bit jerky. Dropping the resolution down to 1280x720 resulted in smooth gameplay at 51 frames per second."
a b U Graphics card
May 4, 2012 3:14:47 PM

you should be great with an HD 6670 or 7750
May 4, 2012 3:16:03 PM

I dont think 300w PSU will be enough. I didnt know they still made them that low. i would think 450w would do it....
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a b U Graphics card
May 4, 2012 3:16:58 PM

both the 6670 and 7750 are designed to run off just what the PCIe supplies, 300W is enough
May 4, 2012 3:21:46 PM

First, thanks for the quick responses! Secondly, I just stumbled across this other thread on this forum: Best PCIe Card: $100 And Under, and it has the Radeon HD 6670 DDR3 squaring off against the GeForce GT 440 GDDR5 as a tie.

So out of the following three cards which would you recommend? Also, why is there a minimum power supply listed for the first card, but not the other two? Any further help is appreciated, thanks!



http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...



http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...



http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...
May 4, 2012 4:16:51 PM

Dont worry about the first card, it isnt even in stock and is an old card.

It is a toss up, buyers choice, for the other two. I would go for the Nvidia card because I am partial to Nvidia desktop GPUs (and AMD mobile GPUs).
a b U Graphics card
May 5, 2012 2:17:27 AM

His list was HD 6670, GeForce GT 440, GeForce GT 240. His current system is AMD Athlon II X4 620 based. PSU is a strong HP 300W unit, not slop (BSTEC i think).

For me, none of the above on video cards. An HD7770 at $130 and only 80W will both game for years and work without a PSU swap. The other three above are not strong at all so will end up replaced.

This is a good article. To find real power of video card google card plus TDP -- example google HD7770 and TDP to find the card is about 80 watts. You have about 100 watts to play with from your 300w PSU. Check the hierarchy on the last page for relative performance. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-graphics-car...

edit: Check this out: http://www.brainlazy.com/article/video-games/diablo-3-g...

6670 = medium. 7770 = high (comparable to 6770).


This site is not perfect, but will also help compare many cards: http://www.hwcompare.com/11926/radeon-hd-6770-vs-radeon...
a b U Graphics card
May 5, 2012 3:18:13 PM

7770 however needs a 6-pin PCIe cable, his 300W PSU probably lacks the right cable. 7750 does not need it, and is the most powerful card able to run just off the PCIe power.

6670 wins in Tom's for performance per dollar, the 7750 gets an honorable mention as the most powerful. I'd pick either of those two. looking at the diablo III reviews, either will max out D3 at 1920x1080. and both will play most other games at low-medium

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a b U Graphics card
May 5, 2012 3:40:20 PM
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ScrewySqrl said:
7770 however needs a 6-pin PCIe cable, his 300W PSU probably lacks the right cable. 7750 does not need it, and is the most powerful card able to run just off the PCIe power.

6670 wins in Tom's for performance per dollar, the 7750 gets an honorable mention as the most powerful. I'd pick either of those two. looking at the diablo III reviews, either will max out D3 at 1920x1080. and both will play most other games at low-medium


Hi, molex to PCIe adapters are $5 and included with the video card in many cases liek this one. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Compare benchmarks for 6670 and 7770. If you can't afford the 7770 now, get the 6670. But 6670 and 7770 are on a totally different level gaming. So different that it's hard to find a benchmark that tested both at the same level.

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/2012-vga-gpgpu/compa...[5451]=on&prod[5475]=on

As you can see Hd7770 is hitting double the frame rates in many games. Which scale very nicely with the $135 for HD7770 vs. $65 for the HD6670.
May 5, 2012 5:30:19 PM

Thanks for all of the responses, you guys are awesome! and tsnor, you should really be a salesman because you have me considering this 130 dollar card now. I was hoping to get by spending as little as possible to play d3 with good graphics, but you are making too much sense.

before i order a card online, i just want to check a few more things with you guys...
System Specs
http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?lc=en&dlc=e...

Card Specs
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

1. The card says PCI-E 3.0 x16, and the specs only say PCIe x16. Is this not an issue?

2. What is the best way to check to see whether the card will actually fit in my case or not? should i take my computer apart and physically measure how much space there is for the card?
a b U Graphics card
May 5, 2012 5:56:07 PM

bummer re: salesman. was not the intent for sure, so discount and cross check facts.

PCIe is totally upward and downward compatible. PCIe gen 3 gives you more data over the same interface, however PCIe gen 2 already gives more data than the video card can use. Benchmarks say no difference gen3 vs. gen 2. So YES the card will work in your PC and no you are not missing something using the gen 2 HP motherboard.

Opening the case is an excellent idea. (1) it'll get you comfortable knowing you can swap the card. (2) you can cut a piece of cardboard in the size of your card and see what it hits. It should not be a problem, but good to check. Since the slot is currently empty this is easy to do. this is also a good time to check the power connectors and see if they are long enough to reach. One good thing using the molex to PCIe adapters -- they give you another 6 to 12 inches of wire length.
May 6, 2012 2:22:16 PM

i didn't realize PSUs were so cheap. is that combo better than the 7770? i am simple minded enough to think 2gb > 1gb, but i know this isnt always the case for video cards. i do like the price of the combo, and from what i have read, it sounds like the PSU would be easy enough to replace.
a b U Graphics card
May 6, 2012 4:02:17 PM

ttg_avenged is recommending the 6670 which doesn't need a power supply swap. See ScrewySqrl's first post.

Not sure why he is also pointing to a power supply. Especially a cheap one -- you really don't want a cheap power supply. Best case is DOA like the reviews call out. Worse case it's putting out dirty power at slightly wrong voltage and tons of ripple and occasionally crashing your system. There are no good standard for power supplies, so find you need to check for reputable reviews. If you really want a cheap PSU, you can get a case and PSU together for $30 at newegg too.

edit: went looking for a review of the PSU, found this instead: "Mar 11, 2011 – Newegg has the Raidmax RX-450K 450W Power Supply for a low $10.39 Free Shipping after rebate and Coupon Code: RM15MAR (Exp 3/14)." http://www.techbargains.com/news_displayItem.cfm/246284

You really don't want a $11 PSU. This is why: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/low-cost-psu-pc-pow...
May 6, 2012 10:02:35 PM

tsnor said:
ttg_avenged is recommending the 6670 which doesn't need a power supply swap. See ScrewySqrl's first post.

Not sure why he is also pointing to a power supply. Especially a cheap one -- you really don't want a cheap power supply. Best case is DOA like the reviews call out. Worse case it's putting out dirty power at slightly wrong voltage and tons of ripple and occasionally crashing your system. There are no good standard for power supplies, so find you need to check for reputable reviews. If you really want a cheap PSU, you can get a case and PSU together for $30 at newegg too.

edit: went looking for a review of the PSU, found this instead: "Mar 11, 2011 – Newegg has the Raidmax RX-450K 450W Power Supply for a low $10.39 Free Shipping after rebate and Coupon Code: RM15MAR (Exp 3/14)." http://www.techbargains.com/news_displayItem.cfm/246284

You really don't want a $11 PSU. This is why: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/low-cost-psu-pc-pow...


thanks tsnor. i appreciate your time and assistance!
May 8, 2012 1:44:23 AM

Alright, so I ended up going with tsnor's recommendation,

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...

I was looking it over and tigerdirect says the mim power supply should be 600W? I know tsnor says it runs around 85W and that my 300W power supply should be enough to run it, but I guess I am just looking for confirmation from someone else that this is an okay setup.

Thanks!
May 8, 2012 4:26:16 AM

Best answer selected by pkrsccr.
a b U Graphics card
May 8, 2012 2:08:33 PM

pkrsccr said:
Alright, so I ended up going with tsnor's recommendation,

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...

I was looking it over and tigerdirect says the mim power supply should be 600W? I know tsnor says it runs around 85W and that my 300W power supply should be enough to run it, but I guess I am just looking for confirmation from someone else that this is an okay setup.

Thanks!


only thing I can say is try it. If it has issues, go with a Corsair CX 430W replacement PSU.
a b U Graphics card
May 8, 2012 9:45:32 PM

Please post what happens when you get the card -- OK or FAIL with your existing PSU.
May 10, 2012 3:31:50 AM

Hey ScrewySqrl and tsnor,

thanks for the responses. the longer i wait in anticipation for this card to get here, the more I feel like i will probably have to invest in a new PSU. because i may have prematurely marked this thread as solved, i started a new thread over in the Power supplies, cases, and mods section, because a lot of the numbers i have been seeing for this card are making me worried (100W idle, 250W load - http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/536).

but in response to your recommendation ScrewySqrl, i will definately consider the corsair cx 430W replacement PSU, but i just wanted your thoughts on why the manufactuer website recommends a min of 450W but tigerdirect recommends min 600W.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/ite...

http://www.sapphiretech.com/presentation/product/?cid=1...

edit: and tsnor, i don't like the lack of confidence in the 300W!
edit2: helpful people on my other thread have informed me that the aformentioned 80 and 250W is for the whole system, so it appears as though I will just go through with the original recommendation of trying it out and seeing if it works. Thanks guys!
a b U Graphics card
May 10, 2012 11:28:57 AM

whats critical is the amperage on the 12v line. the 430W PSU has 28 amps on the 12v line. the 7770 uses 12.1 amps, the whole system will use 20-22 amps under load
a b U Graphics card
May 11, 2012 1:33:29 AM

pkrsccr said:
...(100W idle, 250W load) ...
edit: and tsnor, i don't like the lack of confidence in the 300W!...



lol, confidence is high. Wanted you to say 'it worked' so when people googled and found your thread they'd know it worked.

Aside: I used to use a kill-a-watt meter to see power usage on my PC to see how close I was. (now I use the display on my UPS). http://www.amazon.com/P3-International-P4400-Electricit...

You should see a number like 180w, you then discount this by .8 (power supply efficiency) and know you are currently pulling 180*0.8 = 144w.

I doubt you see numbers much higher than this. PSU fan should stay low and slow, PSU efficiency should be great.

p.s. Enjoy gaming at high settings!

a b U Graphics card
May 11, 2012 1:50:31 AM

ScrewySqrl said:
whats critical is the amperage on the 12v line. the 430W PSU has 28 amps on the 12v line. the 7770 uses 12.1 amps, the whole system will use 20-22 amps under load



12.1 amps of 12 volts is way over 100 watts. The total design power draw of the hd7770 is 80W. Can you point to a ref that the 7770 is pulling 12.1 amps ?
a b U Graphics card
May 11, 2012 4:20:44 PM



the 7770 is using something just over 200W, 7750 just under.

at idle:
a b U Graphics card
May 12, 2012 11:44:40 AM

ScrewySqrl said:
http://media.bestofmicro.com/T/B/326351/original/load%20power.png

the 7770 is using something just over 200W, 7750 just under.

at idle:
http://media.bestofmicro.com/T/8/326348/original/idle%20power.png



I know what that is.... that's the TOTAL SYSTEM POWER = 200W. That includes the CPU, Memory, Disk, MB. And it's measured at the power supply, so it also includes PSU efficiency. Assuming 80% efficiency then 200W at wall = 160 watts at PSU. 7770 is probably pulling 60w of its rated 80w, CPU 50, MB 15, mem 8, disk 2, etc.
May 17, 2012 1:18:22 PM

Alright, installed it on Monday and have been using it on and off this week. it appears to be working just fine (although I wouldn't know what to look for that would indicate any hinderance in performance). but i guess tsnor was right, and that my 300W PSU is sufficient to handle this card.

Thanks!
June 17, 2012 9:49:30 PM

pkrsccr said:
Alright, installed it on Monday and have been using it on and off this week. it appears to be working just fine (although I wouldn't know what to look for that would indicate any hinderance in performance). but i guess tsnor was right, and that my 300W PSU is sufficient to handle this card.

Thanks!


Which card did you go for, the 7750 or the 7770? Could you post the full spec (or just CPU) and number of amps on your 12v rail of your PSU?

Many thanks.
August 8, 2012 4:52:23 AM

pkrsccr said:
Alright, installed it on Monday and have been using it on and off this week. it appears to be working just fine (although I wouldn't know what to look for that would indicate any hinderance in performance). but i guess tsnor was right, and that my 300W PSU is sufficient to handle this card.

Thanks!



How is the 7700 holding up on a 300W psu? A lot of people helped you with this so it would be nice to give a update of how everything works.
October 20, 2012 6:41:38 AM

PKRSCCR we are waiting for your feedback on whether your R7770 is working fine on the 300 PSU?

Give us your update, time has passed already, and as mentioned lot of people helped over this and will be really helpful for everyone and future readers to see the conclusions.

Did you used the mole to PCI-E adapter? is it was a two molex to one PCI-E adapter.

Please reply.
January 2, 2013 10:19:36 PM

i'm in a similar situation as the op. I have a 340W psu and i just installed an MSI 7770 card. So far so good, will update on the situation.

On another note, I tried to install a Geforce GTX 650 along with the same psu and was working fine until after about a day, then i started getting 'NVIDIA Windows Kernel Mode Driver stopped working' errors.

My system:

ASUS M5A97
AMD FX-8350 4.0 GHZ
8GB DDR3 RAM
290GB Western Digital and 150GB Samsung Harddrive
January 2, 2013 10:33:56 PM

makavelipau said:
i'm in a similar situation as the op. I have a 340W psu and i just installed an MSI 7770 card. So far so good, will update on the situation.

On another note, I tried to install a Geforce GTX 650 along with the same psu and was working fine until after about a day, then i started getting 'NVIDIA Windows Kernel Mode Driver stopped working' errors.

My system:

ASUS M5A97
AMD FX-8350 4.0 GHZ
8GB DDR3 RAM
290GB Western Digital and 150GB Samsung Harddrive



I've been using a a Asus HD 7750 820Mhz on a 250W industry standard PSU for just over 5 months now without a problem. The 7770 uses more power than the 7750 but only like 25 watts or so. But my processor is 65W TDP yours is 125W TDP.

You should take a look at your power supply and and see how many amps are on the 12V rail and let me know. I honestly don't think your power supply is powerful enough and imo it's not worth the risk. You can get the Corsair CX 430W power supply for only $40. 430W might not seem much of a upgrade from 340W but it has 32A on the 12V rail if your power supply is OEM it probably has only like 18A on the 12V rail.

EDIT: What is the name of your power supply? That's something important i forgot to ask.
January 2, 2013 10:58:40 PM

K K0 said:
I've been using a a Asus HD 7750 820Mhz on a 250W industry standard PSU for just over 5 months now without a problem. The 7770 uses more power than the 7750 but only like 25 watts or so. But my processor is 65W TDP yours is 125W TDP.

You should take a look at your power supply and and see how many amps are on the 12V rail and let me know. I honestly don't think your power supply is powerful enough and imo it's not worth the risk. You can get the Corsair CX 430W power supply for only $40. 430W might not seem much of a upgrade from 340W but it has 32A on the 12V rail if your power supply is OEM it probably has only like 18A on the 12V rail.

EDIT: What is the name of your power supply? That's something important i forgot to ask.


It's 12A on the 12V rail. it's an HP PS-5341-4CP similar to this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hp-PS-5341-4CF-Hp-Power-Supply-...

I basically just gutted my old HP DC7100 and added in the new parts minus power supply.
January 2, 2013 11:09:08 PM

makavelipau said:
It's 12A on the 12V rail. it's an HP PS-5341-4CP similar to this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hp-PS-5341-4CF-Hp-Power-Supply-...

I basically just gutted my old HP DC7100 and added in the new parts minus power supply.



Yea that is definitely not enough for your PC my 250W is 15A on 12V. Just do the math.

12V X 12A = 144W on 12V Rail. Your processor alone is 125W TDP and the 7770 is about 80W TDP.

The Corsair CX 430 has 32A for the 12V which is 384W. I would recommend not gaming until you get a new PSU because very bad things can potentially happen if you push your PC.
January 15, 2013 2:37:19 PM

K K0 said:
Yea that is definitely not enough for your PC my 250W is 15A on 12V. Just do the math.

12V X 12A = 144W on 12V Rail. Your processor alone is 125W TDP and the 7770 is about 80W TDP.

The Corsair CX 430 has 32A for the 12V which is 384W. I would recommend not gaming until you get a new PSU because very bad things can potentially happen if you push your PC.


Forgive my late reply, but thanks for the advice K K0!

I had the 7770 running on my old 340w psu for a week. I just tried to consume as little power as possible, unplugged my extra hd, dvdr drive, extra usb ports, as well as limiting my cpu power to 80%. I still played games for about a week but got a little uneasy each day so i went ahead and got an Antec 500w psu. Everything is working great, plugged all my other hardware devices back in.
January 15, 2013 7:24:50 PM

makavelipau said:
Forgive my late reply, but thanks for the advice K K0!

I had the 7770 running on my old 340w psu for a week. I just tried to consume as little power as possible, unplugged my extra hd, dvdr drive, extra usb ports, as well as limiting my cpu power to 80%. I still played games for about a week but got a little uneasy each day so i went ahead and got an Antec 500w psu. Everything is working great, plugged all my other hardware devices back in.


Right on man glad to help that's good you got a new power supply better to be safe than sorry! Plus a cheap power supply being used at full load will likely be way less efficient.
!