Sign-in / Sign-up
Your question
Solved

IS INTEL A FRAUD ?

Tags:
  • CPUs
  • Intel
  • Turbo Boost
  • Processors
Last response: in CPUs
October 16, 2012 10:36:30 AM

hello everyone.

i bought the intel core i52450m processor which clearly says that it has a maximum clock speed of 2.5ghz.
however when i use the turbo boost monitor, and sometimes when it boosts alot around halfway i see that mark written as 2.5ghz. this i cannot understand, because what i thought the turbo boost should start from 2.5 ghz and then go to 3.1 ghz. please help me out. thanking you guys in advance :) 

More about : intel fraud

October 16, 2012 10:41:46 AM

The key to your question is the Maximum.
Turbo boost will take it up to maximum.
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 11:01:51 AM

thanks for your reply but i couldnt understand the point. i mean the base frequency should be 2.5 ghz all the time and when the turbo boost is needed, it should start from 2.5 ghz to 3.1 ghz. :??: 
m
0
l
Related resources
October 16, 2012 11:05:30 AM

go into the BIOS and make sure settings are correct or need adjustments..
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 11:09:41 AM

Advertisers and Merchandisers word things very carefully to tell the truth in the best light possible and they aren't techies.

If they hear that the turbo speed of the processor is 2.5GHz then they will see that as the Maximum for the processor, NOT the BASE speed because Maximum speed 1.9GHz does not sound as good.

If you think this is wrong then I would check your BIOS has picked up the processor settings correctly.
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 11:11:34 AM

Just checked out the specs and yes you should check the BIOS.
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 16, 2012 11:31:41 AM

Since Intel has sold about 10 million of these things, and everyone else doesn't seem to have a problem with this, I suspect the problem here is not with Intel.
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 11:35:54 AM

+1
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 11:55:15 AM

Number of things to Turbo Boost.

1) it works within a thermal margin. So your base clock (2.5) is your guaranteed clock rate before say, 90*C, after which the CPU throttles itself back to preserve its integrity. But turbo boost operates on tighter margins, so you may not have the thermal headroom available to enter turbo mode.

2) Core load: if you're running a single threaded application and you're with thermal limits, you'll see a higher boost than if you have a load on both cores.

Use a utility like CoreTemp to check your clocks and temps (haven't used turbo boost monitor, i have a Core 2 Quad), maybe you'll get a clue as to what's happening.

Also, like others have said, check your bios settings, it could be disabled there too.

And no, Intel is fine...
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 12:07:17 PM

From http://ark.intel.com/products/53452/Intel-Core-i5-2450M...
Processor Number i5-2450M
Clock Speed 2.5 GHz
Max Turbo Frequency 3.1 GHz

So check to see if it's disabled. If you don't have any options in preboot (BIOS/UEFI whatever they call it), then maybe it's disabled completely due to laptop design (although it would be strange to go that route). Anyways, I would not call Intel a fraud, but maybe the laptop OEM if there is no option.
What laptop is it?

PS: please bear in mind that 3.1 should be achievable only when 1 CPU is 100%. That is the difference between turbo boost and regular power saving (total load vs. individual load). So with all 4 CPUs at 100% is unlikely to go over 2.5GHz.
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 12:13:42 PM

mathew7 said:
From http://ark.intel.com/products/53452/Intel-Core-i5-2450M...
Processor Number i5-2450M
Clock Speed 2.5 GHz
Max Turbo Frequency 3.1 GHz

So check to see if it's disabled. If you don't have any options in preboot (BIOS/UEFI whatever they call it), then maybe it's disabled completely due to laptop design (although it would be strange to go that route). Anyways, I would not call Intel a fraud, but maybe the laptop OEM if there is no option.
What laptop is it?

PS: please bear in mind that 3.1 should be achievable only when 1 CPU is 100%. That is the difference between turbo boost and regular power saving (total load vs. individual load). So with all 4 CPUs at 100% is unlikely to go over 2.5GHz.

that
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 12:36:15 PM

Welcome to the world of mobile CPUs. Your median average will be around 2.5GHz, because when the CPU isn't being fully utilized or if the temperature is too high and it needs to cool, it will throttle down *a lot.*

In that rare circumstance that you're only using one singular logical core AND the thermal threshold hasn't been exceeded for turbo mode, then yes, it will clock itself up to no higher than 3.1GHz. That also means that anything between 2.5GHz and 3.1GHz is acceptable, depending on the CPU load. If it determines that it only needs or can only give 2.55GHz then that's all you'll get.

The best way to equate it is NOS (nitrous oxide) for your CPU, and you don't control when it's injected.
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 16, 2012 12:49:43 PM

Your processor have 3 techs you have to understand: Turbo Boost, Enhanced Intel SpeedStep and Idle States.

When these techs are enabled in the Bios, the processor frequency will vary according to its need. It means that the speed will change based on what you are doing.

The Clock Speed is 2.5 GHz, and it goes up to 3.1 GHz with Turbo Frequency, but it doesn´t mean it will be 2.5 or 3.1 GHz -- it will vary between these frequency, so it can be 2.7, 2.9, 3.0 GHz, depend upon the tasks that are executed.

With Enhanced Intel SpeedStep and Idle States (C-states) the CPU (processor) even go lower than 2.5 GHz, if it is in idle (no usage). So, sometimes you may see it at 1.6 GHz, which is normal, as the techs are saving energy.

On the other hand if the above doesn´t sound good to you, then you can just disable all these techs in the Bios. In so doing your processor will stick at 2.5 GHz.

From Intel:

Intel Turbo Boost Technology dynamically increases the processor's frequency as needed by taking advantage of thermal and power headroom to give you a burst of speed when you need it, and increased energy efficiency when you don’t.

Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology is an advanced means of enabling high performance while meeting the power-conservation needs of mobile systems. Conventional Intel SpeedStep® Technology switches both voltage and frequency in tandem between high and low levels in response to processor load. Enhanced Intel SpeedStep® Technology builds upon that architecture using design strategies such as Separation between Voltage and Frequency Changes, and Clock Partitioning and Recovery.

Idle States (C-states) are used to save power when the processor is idle. C0 is the operational state, meaning that the CPU is doing useful work. C1 is the first idle state, C2 the second, and so on, where more power saving actions are taken for numerically higher C-states.
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 16, 2012 12:56:15 PM

This analogy assumes the OP is competent and therefore assumes that his issues are not the result of user error/mis-understanding of the technology he is criticizing.

"Dole Fruit Company a fraud?

I bought a single Apple marketed by Dole Fruit Company as being a delicious Apple. When I took a bite it tasted foul. Is the Entire Dole Fruit Company a Fraud?"

If you cannot see the logical fallacy here may your Deity of choice save your soul.
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 1:00:17 PM

^
:lol: 
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 2:23:01 PM

first of all i would like to thank all of you for answering the question.

1)Now what i understand is turbo is dependant on core load and temperature, obviously i wont get 3.1 ghz if i have all 4 cores loaded to maximum 100%.

2)the clock frequency is variable and goes between 2.5 to 3.1 etc etc

3) i play FS2004 which uses all cores so i dont expect any turbo boost but atleast should get 2.5 ghz from all of them

4) there is where my problem lies, the game lags alot and my clock speed remain below 2.5ghz i dont know may be 2.0 or whatever what i know is that it doesnt go to 2.5ghz which it should .

5)my turbo boost shows energy saver mode. my laptop is a ACER 5755G. is there a way to run it constantly at 2.5ghz so that i run the game smoothly

6) there are no options in the BIOS or what so ever. please guys help me out :( 
m
0
l

Best solution

a b à CPUs
a b å Intel
October 16, 2012 2:35:13 PM

Take a look at power options in control panel, set to max performance. Retest.
Most laptops are NOT set to max performance as default.
Share
October 16, 2012 2:36:12 PM

ElMoIsEviL said:
This analogy assumes the OP is competent and therefore assumes that his issues are not the result of user error/mis-understanding of the technology he is criticizing.

"Dole Fruit Company a fraud?

I bought a single Apple marketed by Dole Fruit Company as being a delicious Apple. When I took a bite it tasted foul. Is the Entire Dole Fruit Company a Fraud?"

If you cannot see the logical fallacy here may your Deity of choice save your soul.


thank you for your answer :) 
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
a b å Intel
October 16, 2012 2:36:36 PM

ElMoIsEviL said:
This analogy assumes the OP is competent and therefore assumes that his issues are not the result of user error/mis-understanding of the technology he is criticizing.

"Dole Fruit Company a fraud?

I bought a single Apple marketed by Dole Fruit Company as being a delicious Apple. When I took a bite it tasted foul. Is the Entire Dole Fruit Company a Fraud?"

If you cannot see the logical fallacy here may your Deity of choice save your soul.
:whistle: 
m
0
l
a c 321 à CPUs
a b å Intel
October 16, 2012 2:40:55 PM

mrabduz said:
4) there is where my problem lies, the game lags alot and my clock speed remain below 2.5ghz i dont know may be 2.0 or whatever what i know is that it doesnt go to 2.5ghz which it should .

Use a hardware monitoring program like CPUID HW Monitor to see what your CPU temperatures are. If the CPU is overheating, it will throttle itself to avoid self-destruction and you will not get its rated speeds.

Another possibility could be that your laptop does not fully support the CPU you put in it and is therefore unable to make it run at its rated speeds.
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
a b å Intel
October 16, 2012 3:04:25 PM

^ Do not think he put the CPU in the laptop - LOLs

Thermals may be the issue as some laptops (did he say acer - ugh) have very poor cooling espeacially when running games.
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 16, 2012 4:23:54 PM

Lagging game without a maxed out processor means it is likely that your graphics system is overloaded. Even more likely being that you are on a laptop.

What game and what graphics card does your laptop have?
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 4:51:16 PM

twelve25 said:
Lagging game without a maxed out processor means it is likely that your graphics system is overloaded. Even more likely being that you are on a laptop.

What game and what graphics card does your laptop have?



From what i know i am playing FS2004 a flight simulator, its not at all GPU dependant

i5 2450 2.5-3.1 ghz

nvidia gt630m 2gb

acer5755g
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 4:52:12 PM

RetiredChief said:
Take a look at power options in control panel, set to max performance. Retest.
Most laptops are NOT set to max performance as default.


hello and thanks for your reply. i did what you told me and there is CERTAINLY a significant change however i am gonna test it a bit more. by far your answer was the most helpfull Cheers :) 
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 16, 2012 4:54:00 PM

ElMoIsEviL said:
This analogy assumes the OP is competent and therefore assumes that his issues are not the result of user error/mis-understanding of the technology he is criticizing.

"Dole Fruit Company a fraud?

I bought a single Apple marketed by Dole Fruit Company as being a delicious Apple. When I took a bite it tasted foul. Is the Entire Dole Fruit Company a Fraud?"

If you cannot see the logical fallacy here may your Deity of choice save your soul.


One twist I'd add is this is also likely user error.

"When I took a bite out of my pineapple, the skin was all sharp and pointy"

Now to be helpful.
If you need to verify single-threaded speed, not only do you need to be sure that you are running single threaded, you need to be sure the process isn't getting moved around to the different cores.
So if you are testing (like using prime95), use Task Manager to set the affinity of your single threaded process to stay on a particular core before checking the speed.

m
0
l
a b à CPUs
a b å Intel
October 16, 2012 5:04:35 PM

Enjoy
m
0
l
October 16, 2012 5:24:30 PM

Oh god, those i5-2450m's throttle at temperatures well below their threshold. I know, I had an Acer that had one and the FPS would just drop for no reason, even when the laptop was room temperature. Look into Throttlestop:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/hardware-components-aft...

Edit: My advice (and WARNING)- do NOT throttle up to the 3.1GHz theoretical cap and lock Throttlestop at that maximum, you WILL PERMANENTLY DAMAGE YOUR CPU. Do what I did, set Throttlestop to force the CPU to go no lower than 2.0GHz so that, at the very least, it can slow down a bit if it really does get TOO hot, otherwise it will overheat and shut down (possibly damaged).
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 16, 2012 7:33:20 PM

mrabduz said:
From what i know i am playing FS2004 a flight simulator, its not at all GPU dependant

i5 2450 2.5-3.1 ghz

nvidia gt630m 2gb

acer5755g



That should be fine. Just wanted to make sure you were trying to run BF3 or something on a notebook and then wondering why it is slow! :) 

I agree with the others that it is probably the power savings kicking in. I would leave the BIOS where it was. From within windows you can just choose the high performance power profile from the power settings in the control panel (or right clicking on battery status often gives you the choice).

If you mess with the power settings and fix the clock speeds in the BIOS, you will start getting about half the battery life you are used to, or worse.
m
0
l
October 17, 2012 6:09:25 AM

twelve25 said:
That should be fine. Just wanted to make sure you were trying to run BF3 or something on a notebook and then wondering why it is slow! :) 

I agree with the others that it is probably the power savings kicking in. I would leave the BIOS where it was. From within windows you can just choose the high performance power profile from the power settings in the control panel (or right clicking on battery status often gives you the choice).

If you mess with the power settings and fix the clock speeds in the BIOS, you will start getting about half the battery life you are used to, or worse.



thank you very much for your answer, the problem was with the power, i had to select high performance

cheers :) 
m
0
l
October 17, 2012 6:10:00 AM

Best answer selected by mrabduz.
m
0
l
a b à CPUs
October 17, 2012 3:39:55 PM

mrabduz said:
thank you very much for your answer, the problem was with the power, i had to select high performance

cheers :) 


Glad that helped!

If you are on a plane or something and trying to get max battery life, you'll want to go back and pick a power saver setting. Those power settings can make a huge difference on battery life.
m
0
l