AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture - Page 70
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kettu
May 13, 2013 9:49:30 AM
As far as I can remember Intel never implied that turbo frequency was the operating frequency of their chips. Besides, it's not AMD doing this but the shops (unless AMD is telling them to do that, but there is no evidence of that). Either they don't understand the specsheets or they are misrepresenting them on purpose. Or perhaps CPU-world is wrong and the chip is actually a 3.2GHz. In any case some other industry doing shady marketing doesn't make it right. It just makes the other guys wrong. Supposedly EU atleast is investigating the automobile industry and their fuel consumption figures.
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Reply to kettu
Quote:
I think Intel started that trend when their stock frequencies were starting so much lower than AMD FX.Like most marketing it's whatever sounds better. That new 36mpg car won't get 36mpg unless you drive it just right.
Yes but 36 mpg means the same thing on any car. 36 MPG on a Honda is the same on a Ford or a Toyota or a Chevvy.
That is why GHz is a very misleading metric to compare CPU specs with. It's really only good to compare with other CPUs within the same microarchitectural family, but the layperson doesn't understand this. So if you say it's misleading to say that the part is 3.2 GHz instead of 3.0, but it doesn't matter because GHz are relative to parts within that microarchitecure. Hell even the number of cores is beginning to get muddled in the same way. It would make much more sense if instead of having GHZ!!!1!!1!one on the box, they had a list of industry standard benchmark scores like SPEC and 3DMark. Then the buyer could make an informed decision. How great would it be if you could walk into your closes electronics store and see a list of benchmark scores on a chart near all of the components, so that you didn't have to spend 10 hours searching for all of this information on your own before you buy something online.
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Reply to Blandge
Related resources
- Tek Syndicate: Expert Conjecture and Speculation - Forum
- AMD Steamroller rumours ... and expert conjecture - Forum
- Will the 4+4 pin CPU power on the Corsair RM850 Gold reach to 8 pin header on the Asus Z87- Expert in the Corsair Obsidian 750 - Tech Support
- I need a CPU expert's opinion on this - Tech Support
- 5/5 on CPU expert, but no badge? - Forum
mayankleoboy1
May 13, 2013 9:56:52 AM
sarinaide said:
my best example is if you try emulate a PS3 no tweaks nor the fastest Intel Xeon 20 Thread CPU and two of them can muster up playable framerates or experiences, simply because software trying to scale is inneficient. I am really surprised you said this. Isnt this just the opposite of what you have been trying to say : that more gaming workload should be optimised for multicore processors ? Yet, as the example shoes, using the CPU for graphic related loads is worse than sub-optimal.
Quote:
Again we are at that age where software writes are trying to use extentions and code to scale hardware and that never works ....... It is time for a change, AMD provides that chance for hardware to flourish and scale without the need of API's and the works.I hate to ask, but what do these two sentences mean ?
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Reply to mayankleoboy1
mayankleoboy1
May 13, 2013 9:59:41 AM
8350rocks said:
True...the talent they've amassed in the last 1.5 years is mind bending in it's own right:John Gustafson
Jim Keller
Raja Kudori
Those names are household names among technophiles...people who haven't just contributed...but made industry wide impacts. I have no doubts that the rewards for those hirings are still a few years out, and AMD is competitive now! In the next few years...it will be a really interesting series of events unfolding. I can't fathom what leaps and bounds forward will come from minds like those under one roof with CPU and GPU technology at their fingertips.
We live in exciting futures.
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Reply to mayankleoboy1
Blandge said:
Quote:
I think Intel started that trend when their stock frequencies were starting so much lower than AMD FX.Like most marketing it's whatever sounds better. That new 36mpg car won't get 36mpg unless you drive it just right.
Yes but 36 mpg means the same thing on any car. 36 MPG on a Honda is the same on a Ford or a Toyota or a Chevvy.
That is why GHz is a very misleading metric to compare CPU specs with. It's really only good to compare with other CPUs within the same microarchitectural family, but the layperson doesn't understand this. So if you say it's misleading to say that the part is 3.2 GHz instead of 3.0, but it doesn't matter because GHz are relative to parts within that microarchitecure. Hell even the number of cores is beginning to get muddled in the same way. It would make much more sense if instead of having GHZ!!!1!!1!one on the box, they had a list of industry standard benchmark scores like SPEC and 3DMark. Then the buyer could make an informed decision. How great would it be if you could walk into your closes electronics store and see a list of benchmark scores on a chart near all of the components, so that you didn't have to spend 10 hours searching for all of this information on your own before you buy something online.
Too bad average Joe thinks faster is faster
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Reply to JAYDEEJOHN
juanrga
May 13, 2013 10:41:55 AM
mayankleoboy1 said:
juanrga said:
Cinebench is one of those unfair benchmark using the Intel compiler, which forces AMD chips to run the slowest possible code, even if they can run more faster one.Cinebench is based on a software (Maxon) that professionals use for their work. So if Cinebench favours Intel, then the professional will buy an Intel processor. So for that software, intel is the better CPU. If you want to use Cinebench you buy intel, or you go home.
Cinebench has been cheating benchmarks scores for many years now. I am not worried about if one piece of software runs better in a chip or in other but when the benchmarks cheat and give fakes scores. Can you confirm that Maxon is using Intel compiler for its programs? I.e. can you confirm me that Cinebench benchmarks really represent Cinema4D performance?
As you must know, there are laws about fair competition among companies. If Intel and its chips are so good, then why do they embarrass themselves with such illegal and unfair practices?
http://sharikou.blogspot.com.es/2009/12/ftc-accuses-int...
Yes Maxon claims in its website that Cinebench is based in professional software Cinema4D, "which is used extensively by studios and production houses worldwide for 3D content creation", but since Titanic was produced using Linux in 1997 all major studios including Dreamworks Animation, Pixar, Weta Digital, and Industrial Light & Magic have migrated to Linux. Currently more than 95% of the servers and desktops at large animation and visual effects companies use Linux, which imply that 95% of the industry is not using Cinema4D.
mayankleoboy1 said:
If you want completely fair benchmarks, then say goodbye to Windows. Take up a linux distro, and build all the opensource softwares with -O3 -march=native flags. This way you can be assured that no hanky-panky is being done by Intel.
Because no closed source company is going to reveal how they build and code their program.
I am happy with open benchmarks or with closed benchmarks compiled with a fair compiler. I just reject the well-known unfair closed benchmarks that cheat about the scores giving fake advantage to Intel chips.
I repeat, if Intel chips are so superior why do the biased benchmarks exist?
As a final note. AMD already introduced Steamroller optimization in the main compilers as GCC. When SteamRoller was released compilers will use its potential since day one.
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Reply to juanrga
Quote:
I am happy with open benchmarks or with closed benchmarks compiled with a fair compiler. I just reject the well-known unfair closed benchmarks that cheat about the scores giving fake advantage to Intel chips.I repeat, if Intel chips are so superior why do the biased benchmarks exist?
As a final note. AMD already introduced Steamroller optimization in the main compilers as GCC. When SteamRoller was released compilers will use its potential since day one.
I would say that SPEC (specifically CPU2006) is probably one of the best and most fair system benchmarks because it stresses the whole system with real-world workloads, and it allows the use of GCC or ICC. In addition, certain conditions must be met in order for a SPEC run to qualify for submission. The benchmark must be run for 3 iterations, only a certain number of compiler flags may be used (depending on whether a base run or peak run is reported), and configuration and log files are submitted to SPEC so that they can be checked for correctness before the scores are officially accepted.
AMD generally scores pretty well on SPEC CPU2006, so if you want a fair benchmark that's the one I would suggest.
Something like Dhrystone or Coremark do very little to show real world performance. The code is so small that it fits in L1 Cache, and really only benchmarks the number of instructions the CPU can retire, and the compiler can really condense the code into something rather meaningless. They are a decent measure of IPC, but it's not a realistic workload at all.
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Reply to Blandge
kettu
May 13, 2013 11:11:33 AM
Blandge said:
That is why GHz is a very misleading metric to compare CPU specs with. It's really only good to compare with other CPUs within the same microarchitectural family, but the layperson doesn't understand this. So if you say it's misleading to say that the part is 3.2 GHz instead of 3.0, but it doesn't matter because GHz are relative to parts within that microarchitecure.
It does matter especially when the difference between stock/turbo is greater. Would you be happy if a salesrep sold you a 3.2GHz quad-core laptop (A10-4657M) that turned out to be a 2.3GHz instead? I wouldn't be.
Quote:
Hell even the number of cores is beginning to get muddled in the same way. It would make much more sense if instead of having GHZ!!!1!!1!one on the box, they had a list of industry standard benchmark scores like SPEC and 3DMark. Then the buyer could make an informed decision. How great would it be if you could walk into your closes electronics store and see a list of benchmark scores on a chart near all of the components, so that you didn't have to spend 10 hours searching for all of this information on your own before you buy something online.
Synthetic benchmarks are not something people should rely on when making decisions. Especially if those are handed to them by marketing people.
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Reply to kettu
I agree, synthetic benchmarks try to emulate real world performance, sometimes more successfully than others. But, that does not diminish the fact that different applications do things differently. For example, adobe runs comparatively quicker on AMD CPUs than many other applications that perform the same functions, but come from different companies.
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Reply to 8350rocks
Has anyone seen the prices on these 990FX motherboards? I think I may just pick one up after all... Especially since AMD is supposed to have the 990FX motherboards support SR. The z77s are going pretty cheap too, but for a ASUS R2.0 Sabertooth 990FX MoBo priced @ $199.99 is a phenominal value
lol
I wonder what the pricing is going to be on Steam Roller. If a Octo-core AMD surpasses a quad core i7, will it be priced the same as a i7 4770K? Or would it be closer to a hexicore i7?
If the next gen 8core is priced at around $350, I will purchase it. However, If rumors are true, I'm sure it will be far more expensive.
lolI wonder what the pricing is going to be on Steam Roller. If a Octo-core AMD surpasses a quad core i7, will it be priced the same as a i7 4770K? Or would it be closer to a hexicore i7?
If the next gen 8core is priced at around $350, I will purchase it. However, If rumors are true, I'm sure it will be far more expensive.
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Reply to griptwister
I would expect AMD to offer competitive pricing and price products competitively in relation to the intel counterpart they mostly expect it to compete with. For example...if the 8550 (speculating nomenclature) performs about equally with the i7-4770k, then I would expect AMD will price it competitively just under $300 ($250-290). That gives them a small price advantage for comparable performance.
EDIT: IIRC, original BD pricing was expected to be $249.99
EDIT: IIRC, original BD pricing was expected to be $249.99
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Reply to 8350rocks
mayankleoboy1 said:
sarinaide said:
my best example is if you try emulate a PS3 no tweaks nor the fastest Intel Xeon 20 Thread CPU and two of them can muster up playable framerates or experiences, simply because software trying to scale is inneficient. I am really surprised you said this. Isnt this just the opposite of what you have been trying to say : that more gaming workload should be optimised for multicore processors ? Yet, as the example shoes, using the CPU for graphic related loads is worse than sub-optimal.
Quote:
Again we are at that age where software writes are trying to use extentions and code to scale hardware and that never works ....... It is time for a change, AMD provides that chance for hardware to flourish and scale without the need of API's and the works.I hate to ask, but what do these two sentences mean ?
No, not really, I am saying that despite the CPU's having all the technological advantage over the consoles, coding tries to have software artificially scale the hardware. The premise of HSA is that hardware will become less relevant and software compliments it rather than having pure horsepower, having a CPU and GPU operated interdependent of each other to produce more efficient compute performance. The endeavor is to have hardware and software operate in a seamless manner.
On different news, AMD's stock is up to 4.20/share, 20 days ago it was 2.25/share. Suggestions are that by August they may be as high as 6-7/share. Its a week plus on from the Intel acquisition rumor and AMD stocks have still gathered pace, investors are interested in something and perhaps like others already, have seen that AMD have got something special for the computer industry, something worth investing in.
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Reply to sarinaide
I think this is more the bustle from the console design wins and the investor presentation that Steamroller will arrive this year. Additionally, after all that, the volcanic islands announcement came hot on the heels of the other announcements. I believe "the worm has turned" so to speak. Investors are realizing that their profitability did not effect their ability to bring innovative products to market. Thus, they have shown more faith in the company than many did, even a few months ago.
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Reply to 8350rocks
cowboy44mag
May 13, 2013 1:35:25 PM
griptwister said:
Has anyone seen the prices on these 990FX motherboards? I think I may just pick one up after all... Especially since AMD is supposed to have the 990FX motherboards support SR. The z77s are going pretty cheap too, but for a ASUS R2.0 Sabertooth 990FX MoBo priced @ $199.99 is a phenominal value
lolI wonder what the pricing is going to be on Steam Roller. If a Octo-core AMD surpasses a quad core i7, will it be priced the same as a i7 4770K? Or would it be closer to a hexicore i7?
If the next gen 8core is priced at around $350, I will purchase it. However, If rumors are true, I'm sure it will be far more expensive.
Tell you what with Steamroller said to be compatible with AM3+ I would highly suggest the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0. I bought one about two months ago and I couldn't be happier. I upgraded from a crap motherboard (which was half fried) that had my Phenom II 965 BE strangled to 3.8Ghz (to be stable although I could hit 3.9Ghz but the heat was just too great to keep it there). Once I put the Sabertooth and a 1000 W 80+ Gold PSU in I was able to hit a stable 5.0Ghz overclock on my "old crappy" 965 BE!! I don't keep it 5.0Ghz as after 24hrs of Prime 95 I was hitting temps of 61C (I don't like the processor to go over 58C at maxium) so I have an everyday clock at 4.5Ghz which never hits above 54C on Prime 95. Keep in mind although this is on air my system isn't typical of most air cooled systems. I have 7 120mm case fans and a Hyper 212 Evo with 2 Delta 3000rpm 120mm fans. But the fact remains that I'm clocking 4.5-5.0Ghz on a 9 year old processor because of the superior build quality of the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0 board. FYI I got my Sabertooth from Newegg for 189.99, haven't checked prices lately.
I think you posted before that you are also still rocking a Phenom II- the Sabertooth will definitely breath new life into your overclock and you should be set for Steamroller. Its also fun as hell to have friends over who like Intel and don't believe you can hit such overclocks on such an old processor. I'm not saying I can shame a i5 2500K, but my processor is far from dead and games like a dream.
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Reply to cowboy44mag
8350rocks said:
I think this is more the bustle from the console design wins and the investor presentation that Steamroller will arrive this year. Additionally, after all that, the volcanic islands announcement came hot on the heels of the other announcements. I believe "the worm has turned" so to speak. Investors are realizing that their profitability did not effect their ability to bring innovative products to market. Thus, they have shown more faith in the company than many did, even a few months ago.I didn't consider this... Let's keep our fingers crossed!
@cowboy44mag, You're awesome! Haha! People already ask me what I'm running, they naturally assume I'm Using an i5 due to the GPU I'm using.
haha! It's pretty funny, the way they look at me when I tell them I'm running a Phenom II 840. I'm debating on weather or not I should buy a 990FX MoBo or a new case first, because my current one makes my GPU run a little on the hot side due to lack of airflow. But, You've got me sold on the MoBo. I can't wait! I've gotta make the money first though... luckily my work season starts next week. -
Reply to griptwister
cowboy44mag said:
griptwister said:
Has anyone seen the prices on these 990FX motherboards? I think I may just pick one up after all... Especially since AMD is supposed to have the 990FX motherboards support SR. The z77s are going pretty cheap too, but for a ASUS R2.0 Sabertooth 990FX MoBo priced @ $199.99 is a phenominal value
lolI wonder what the pricing is going to be on Steam Roller. If a Octo-core AMD surpasses a quad core i7, will it be priced the same as a i7 4770K? Or would it be closer to a hexicore i7?
If the next gen 8core is priced at around $350, I will purchase it. However, If rumors are true, I'm sure it will be far more expensive.
Tell you what with Steamroller said to be compatible with AM3+ I would highly suggest the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0. I bought one about two months ago and I couldn't be happier. I upgraded from a crap motherboard (which was half fried) that had my Phenom II 965 BE strangled to 3.8Ghz (to be stable although I could hit 3.9Ghz but the heat was just too great to keep it there). Once I put the Sabertooth and a 1000 W 80+ Gold PSU in I was able to hit a stable 5.0Ghz overclock on my "old crappy" 965 BE!! I don't keep it 5.0Ghz as after 24hrs of Prime 95 I was hitting temps of 61C (I don't like the processor to go over 58C at maxium) so I have an everyday clock at 4.5Ghz which never hits above 54C on Prime 95. Keep in mind although this is on air my system isn't typical of most air cooled systems. I have 7 120mm case fans and a Hyper 212 Evo with 2 Delta 3000rpm 120mm fans. But the fact remains that I'm clocking 4.5-5.0Ghz on a 9 year old processor because of the superior build quality of the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0 board. FYI I got my Sabertooth from Newegg for 189.99, haven't checked prices lately.
I think you posted before that you are also still rocking a Phenom II- the Sabertooth will definitely breath new life into your overclock and you should be set for Steamroller. Its also fun as hell to have friends over who like Intel and don't believe you can hit such overclocks on such an old processor. I'm not saying I can shame a i5 2500K, but my processor is far from dead and games like a dream.
+9001-1+1 The Sabertooth 990FX R2.0 is THE 990FX board to get. The Phenom II 965BE@4.5 is a very very very potent gaming system (at least until the 8 threaded games come along) just like the heavily underrated Q94/5/650 and QX9650/9770@4GHz
Note: The 965BE is not 9 years old, you must mean 4
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Reply to The Q6660 Inside
I'm pretty happy with my 1100T Phenom and it has no issues playing the latest games, heck even my 6950 is doing quite well in the latest games such as dead island riptide. The Phenom II 965 came out in 09 Aug almost 4 years ago yet it can still play all the latest games and is almost always bottlenecked by the GPU. Sure their is those certain games that might have some issues but then again that's only 2/10 games.
I'm sure Steamroller will last another 5 years after we buy it playing the latest games. This sounds kinda weird for me to say but i think i'm gonna wait to upgrade every 3-4 years instead of every other year. Get me a 9950 and a 8 core Steamroller in the future(after games start to use more and more power when the PS4/720 come out)
I'm sure Steamroller will last another 5 years after we buy it playing the latest games. This sounds kinda weird for me to say but i think i'm gonna wait to upgrade every 3-4 years instead of every other year. Get me a 9950 and a 8 core Steamroller in the future(after games start to use more and more power when the PS4/720 come out)
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Reply to jdwii
juanrga
May 13, 2013 4:12:35 PM
sarinaide said:
The premise of HSA is that hardware will become less relevant and software compliments it rather than having pure horsepower, having a CPU and GPU operated interdependent of each other to produce more efficient compute performance. The endeavor is to have hardware and software operate in a seamless manner.HSA dilutes the traditional difference between CPU and GPU. With HSA the CPU can help the GPU in cases where the GPU is bottlenecking the system and viceverse.
HSA will allow for a better utilisation of resources and for running tasks could not run with the traditional CPU+GPU architecture. Precisely, Sony chose a HSA architecture when found that the traditional PC architecture was not enough for implementing Sony vision about the next gen games.
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Reply to juanrga
juanrga
May 13, 2013 4:26:06 PM
8350rocks said:
I think this is more the bustle from the console design wins and the investor presentation that Steamroller will arrive this year. Additionally, after all that, the volcanic islands announcement came hot on the heels of the other announcements. I believe "the worm has turned" so to speak. Investors are realizing that their profitability did not effect their ability to bring innovative products to market. Thus, they have shown more faith in the company than many did, even a few months ago.But only Kaveri with steamroller cores is confirmed for 2013. Steamroller based FXs and Opterons are still scheduled for 2014. No? That was the reasoning behind the FX Centurion rumour at least.
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Reply to juanrga
cowboy44mag
May 13, 2013 4:40:34 PM
The Q6660 Inside said:
cowboy44mag said:
griptwister said:
Has anyone seen the prices on these 990FX motherboards? I think I may just pick one up after all... Especially since AMD is supposed to have the 990FX motherboards support SR. The z77s are going pretty cheap too, but for a ASUS R2.0 Sabertooth 990FX MoBo priced @ $199.99 is a phenominal value
lolI wonder what the pricing is going to be on Steam Roller. If a Octo-core AMD surpasses a quad core i7, will it be priced the same as a i7 4770K? Or would it be closer to a hexicore i7?
If the next gen 8core is priced at around $350, I will purchase it. However, If rumors are true, I'm sure it will be far more expensive.
Tell you what with Steamroller said to be compatible with AM3+ I would highly suggest the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0. I bought one about two months ago and I couldn't be happier. I upgraded from a crap motherboard (which was half fried) that had my Phenom II 965 BE strangled to 3.8Ghz (to be stable although I could hit 3.9Ghz but the heat was just too great to keep it there). Once I put the Sabertooth and a 1000 W 80+ Gold PSU in I was able to hit a stable 5.0Ghz overclock on my "old crappy" 965 BE!! I don't keep it 5.0Ghz as after 24hrs of Prime 95 I was hitting temps of 61C (I don't like the processor to go over 58C at maxium) so I have an everyday clock at 4.5Ghz which never hits above 54C on Prime 95. Keep in mind although this is on air my system isn't typical of most air cooled systems. I have 7 120mm case fans and a Hyper 212 Evo with 2 Delta 3000rpm 120mm fans. But the fact remains that I'm clocking 4.5-5.0Ghz on a 9 year old processor because of the superior build quality of the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0 board. FYI I got my Sabertooth from Newegg for 189.99, haven't checked prices lately.
I think you posted before that you are also still rocking a Phenom II- the Sabertooth will definitely breath new life into your overclock and you should be set for Steamroller. Its also fun as hell to have friends over who like Intel and don't believe you can hit such overclocks on such an old processor. I'm not saying I can shame a i5 2500K, but my processor is far from dead and games like a dream.
+9001-1+1 The Sabertooth 990FX R2.0 is THE 990FX board to get. The Phenom II 965BE@4.5 is a very very very potent gaming system (at least until the 8 threaded games come along) just like the heavily underrated Q94/5/650 and QX9650/9770@4GHz
Note: The 965BE is not 9 years old, you must mean 4
Good catch my friend!! HA!! I was thinking they released in 2009, not 9 years ago!! My bad
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Reply to cowboy44mag
cowboy44mag
May 13, 2013 4:55:46 PM
griptwister said:
8350rocks said:
I think this is more the bustle from the console design wins and the investor presentation that Steamroller will arrive this year. Additionally, after all that, the volcanic islands announcement came hot on the heels of the other announcements. I believe "the worm has turned" so to speak. Investors are realizing that their profitability did not effect their ability to bring innovative products to market. Thus, they have shown more faith in the company than many did, even a few months ago.I didn't consider this... Let's keep our fingers crossed!
@cowboy44mag, You're awesome! Haha! People already ask me what I'm running, they naturally assume I'm Using an i5 due to the GPU I'm using.
haha! It's pretty funny, the way they look at me when I tell them I'm running a Phenom II 840. I'm debating on weather or not I should buy a 990FX MoBo or a new case first, because my current one makes my GPU run a little on the hot side due to lack of airflow. But, You've got me sold on the MoBo. I can't wait! I've gotta make the money first though... luckily my work season starts next week.Your going to love the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0!! Keep in mind if you don't have adequate airflow watch your overclocks till you get a better case and cooling (to hit 5.0Ghz on my 965 BE I had to set the vcore to 1.6v (well above the recommended 1.55v max) and was hitting 61C - 62C is max for Phenom II). In my opinion the Phenom IIs could be pushed harder than the recommended maximums, they are hardy processors, and for overclocking the Sabertooth can handle heat better than most every other motherboard as it is Mil Spec. I don't know what board you currently have, but another thing that surprised me is I went from an AM3 board to the Sabertooth AM3+ and it barely fit in my gamer mid-tower. My case is larger than most mid-towers so it really surprised me how much larger the Sabertooth board was compared to the AM3 board I upgraded from. Honestly though price/performance nothing beats the Sabertooth 990FX!!
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Reply to cowboy44mag
Blandge said:
Quote:
I am happy with open benchmarks or with closed benchmarks compiled with a fair compiler. I just reject the well-known unfair closed benchmarks that cheat about the scores giving fake advantage to Intel chips.I repeat, if Intel chips are so superior why do the biased benchmarks exist?
As a final note. AMD already introduced Steamroller optimization in the main compilers as GCC. When SteamRoller was released compilers will use its potential since day one.
I would say that SPEC (specifically CPU2006) is probably one of the best and most fair system benchmarks because it stresses the whole system with real-world workloads, and it allows the use of GCC or ICC. In addition, certain conditions must be met in order for a SPEC run to qualify for submission. The benchmark must be run for 3 iterations, only a certain number of compiler flags may be used (depending on whether a base run or peak run is reported), and configuration and log files are submitted to SPEC so that they can be checked for correctness before the scores are officially accepted.
AMD generally scores pretty well on SPEC CPU2006, so if you want a fair benchmark that's the one I would suggest.
Something like Dhrystone or Coremark do very little to show real world performance. The code is so small that it fits in L1 Cache, and really only benchmarks the number of instructions the CPU can retire, and the compiler can really condense the code into something rather meaningless. They are a decent measure of IPC, but it's not a realistic workload at all.
Yes I absolutely love SPEC for system performance profiling (aka benchmarking). They've got a wide selection of tests and you can even order a custom benchmark built for your application, though that tends to cost a good chunk of money. Their what the industry heavyweights use to determine system implementations (SPARC vs Power on certain setups and so forth).
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Reply to palladin9479
MSI GX70 3BE: Richland A10 APU and Neptune 8970M Gaming Notebook
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
nvidia's latest gpu scam exposed? 770 is the new 6950? amd calls nvidia out? charlied is rolling on the floor laughing hysterically(roflH)? as usual, take it with a grain of salt.
http://semiaccurate.com/2013/05/13/you-can-upgrade-an-n...
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
nvidia's latest gpu scam exposed? 770 is the new 6950? amd calls nvidia out? charlied is rolling on the floor laughing hysterically(roflH)? as usual, take it with a grain of salt.
http://semiaccurate.com/2013/05/13/you-can-upgrade-an-n...
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Reply to de5_Roy
mayankleoboy1
May 13, 2013 10:30:31 PM
juanrga said:
Cinebench has been cheating benchmarks scores for many years now. I am not worried about if one piece of software runs better in a chip or in other but when the benchmarks cheat and give fakes scores. Can you confirm that Maxon is using Intel compiler for its programs? I.e. can you confirm me that Cinebench benchmarks really represent Cinema4D performance?
I cant confirm, and neither can you that Cinebench cheats against AMD. That is the problem with closed source software. And nobody can say whether a benchmark represents the perf of the actual software. So if you are denouncing Cinebench, you will have to denounce all other closed source benchmarks as well.
Quote:
Yes Maxon claims in its website that Cinebench is based in professional software Cinema4D, "which is used extensively by studios and production houses worldwide for 3D content creation", but since Titanic was produced using Linux in 1997 all major studios including Dreamworks Animation, Pixar, Weta Digital, and Industrial Light & Magic have migrated to Linux. Currently more than 95% of the servers and desktops at large animation and visual effects companies use Linux, which imply that 95% of the industry is not using Cinema4D.Thats a big claim you are making. Got any link to back it up ?
Quote:
I am happy with open benchmarks or with closed benchmarks compiled with a fair compiler. I just reject the well-known unfair closed benchmarks that cheat about the scores giving fake advantage to Intel chips.If the benchmarks are closed source, how do you know they cheat against AMD, or are unfair ? You are just making that up from your idea of what an AMD CPU should perform like.
Quote:
I repeat, if Intel chips are so superior why do the biased benchmarks exist?Because marketing. And AMD does not have the money to influence benchmarks.
Quote:
As a final note. AMD already introduced Steamroller optimization in the main compilers as GCC. When SteamRoller was released compilers will use its potential since day one.That has been the case with Bulldozer and Piledriver as well. Usually, compiler support is added months before actual product is released.
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Reply to mayankleoboy1
de5_Roy said:
MSI GX70 3BE: Richland A10 APU and Neptune 8970M Gaming Notebookhttp://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
nvidia's latest gpu scam exposed? 770 is the new 6950? amd calls nvidia out? charlied is rolling on the floor laughing hysterically(roflH)? as usual, take it with a grain of salt.
http://semiaccurate.com/2013/05/13/you-can-upgrade-an-n...
If true how is it like the 6950(which was only flashable to a 6970 and not all of them or mine) A 6950 is using a newer design compared to the 6800,5800 series as well.
For Nvidia to do this to a high-end part is sad and even makes me know more that their rushing this 700 series vs Amd were their design is actually going to be GCN 2.0
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Reply to jdwii
Quote:
Once I put the Sabertooth and a 1000 W 80+ Gold PSU in I was able to hit a stable 5.0Ghz overclock on my "old crappy" 965 BE!! Quote:
Your going to love the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0!! Keep in mind if you don't have adequate airflow watch your overclocks till you get a better case and cooling (to hit 5.0Ghz on my 965 BE I had to set the vcore to 1.6v (well above the recommended 1.55v max) and was hitting 61C - 62C is max for Phenom II). the numbers mason, i know when you are lying
5GHz
it is not possible to hit stable 5GHz on 965 -
Reply to truegenius
mayankleoboy1
May 13, 2013 10:44:10 PM
http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTM3...
Anyone heard of "Hainan" GPU from AMD, a.ka. HD8800 ?
AMD has started adding code to the open source AMD drivers.
Anyone heard of "Hainan" GPU from AMD, a.ka. HD8800 ?
AMD has started adding code to the open source AMD drivers.
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Reply to mayankleoboy1
On the Anand link, it has the "new" 8970m, and they go on to say:
"The bad news then is that a 10% clock speed increase from Trinity isn't going to be enough to close the gap in many titles, depending on the resolution and quality settings. Looking at Trinity vs. Ivy Bridge with 7970M, I've seen Intel outperform AMD by 50% or more, particularly in titles that pound the CPU (e.g. Skyrim and StarCraft II); on other games, however, it's basically a wash at high quality 1080p settings, so as a more budget-friendly gaming notebook the GX70 has potential."
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
My question is, why fork out the money for a decent gpu if thats not why youre using it?
And isnt it for eye candy as well?
Not sure what theyre getting at here, but it looks crummy for AMD by their wording vs logic
And here:
The other bad news is that my continuing experience with Enduro is that it's not all that it's cracked up to be, but going pure AMD helps quite a bit. Getting updated drivers with an AMD APU and dGPU is easier, and AMD dGPUs simply cooperate with AMD iGPUs better it seems. I've done some testing with the latest 13.5 Beta2 mobile drivers issue on several other laptops (including the MSI GX60), and for most mainstream applications and games they have been fine. However, there are still times when everything doesn't work quite as smoothly as I'd like.
Isnt this a AMD product? Why the redundancy ?
And then we get the smoother comment.
And it infers AMD doesnt work well with Intel
I hope they have a huge multi system revirew to explain all this, as thats the picture Im getting
"The bad news then is that a 10% clock speed increase from Trinity isn't going to be enough to close the gap in many titles, depending on the resolution and quality settings. Looking at Trinity vs. Ivy Bridge with 7970M, I've seen Intel outperform AMD by 50% or more, particularly in titles that pound the CPU (e.g. Skyrim and StarCraft II); on other games, however, it's basically a wash at high quality 1080p settings, so as a more budget-friendly gaming notebook the GX70 has potential."
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
My question is, why fork out the money for a decent gpu if thats not why youre using it?
And isnt it for eye candy as well?
Not sure what theyre getting at here, but it looks crummy for AMD by their wording vs logic
And here:
The other bad news is that my continuing experience with Enduro is that it's not all that it's cracked up to be, but going pure AMD helps quite a bit. Getting updated drivers with an AMD APU and dGPU is easier, and AMD dGPUs simply cooperate with AMD iGPUs better it seems. I've done some testing with the latest 13.5 Beta2 mobile drivers issue on several other laptops (including the MSI GX60), and for most mainstream applications and games they have been fine. However, there are still times when everything doesn't work quite as smoothly as I'd like.
Isnt this a AMD product? Why the redundancy ?
And then we get the smoother comment.
And it infers AMD doesnt work well with Intel
I hope they have a huge multi system revirew to explain all this, as thats the picture Im getting
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Reply to JAYDEEJOHN
truegenius said:
Quote:
Once I put the Sabertooth and a 1000 W 80+ Gold PSU in I was able to hit a stable 5.0Ghz overclock on my "old crappy" 965 BE!! Quote:
Your going to love the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0!! Keep in mind if you don't have adequate airflow watch your overclocks till you get a better case and cooling (to hit 5.0Ghz on my 965 BE I had to set the vcore to 1.6v (well above the recommended 1.55v max) and was hitting 61C - 62C is max for Phenom II). the numbers mason, i know when you are lying
5GHz
it is not possible to hit stable 5GHz on 965I missed that part actually i can get my CPU stable at 3.9Ghz with only 1.30625V stable with 24 hours on prime95 with my 212+ heatsink with temps only at 51C.
But however 5Ghz even on water(with a Phenom II x4) doesn't seem likely now yes he might have it there but i bet its not stable(at 63C or below) using prime for at least 4 hours.
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Reply to jdwii
JAYDEEJOHN said:
On the Anand link, it has the "new" 8970m, and they go on to say:"The bad news then is that a 10% clock speed increase from Trinity isn't going to be enough to close the gap in many titles, depending on the resolution and quality settings. Looking at Trinity vs. Ivy Bridge with 7970M, I've seen Intel outperform AMD by 50% or more, particularly in titles that pound the CPU (e.g. Skyrim and StarCraft II); on other games, however, it's basically a wash at high quality 1080p settings, so as a more budget-friendly gaming notebook the GX70 has potential."
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
My question is, why fork out the money for a decent gpu if thats not why youre using it?
And isnt it for eye candy as well?
Not sure what theyre getting at here, but it looks crummy for AMD by their wording vs logic
Not trolling but why would you even read an article there of course they're going to say that, When Intel comes out with their haswell their probably say its such a huge difference that the product made the A10 useless compared to the I3. Then they're going to still use horrible benchmarks such as sysmark. If i had it my way toms would buy that site and its whole database of servers and use some military base software to get rid of everything from them once and for all.
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Reply to jdwii
mayankleoboy1
May 13, 2013 11:20:14 PM
Quote:
If i had it my way toms would buy that site and its whole database of servers and use some military base software to get rid of everything from them once and for all. meaning Toms isnt biased ? Toms sometimes publish reviews that look like paid promotions of softwares. And all that front page promotion to write a "Windows 8 guide " .
Anandtech is quite Intel 'friendly' . And every one of them is a fucking Apple fanboi. Every time Apple releases anything, they are squealing like little girls.
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Reply to mayankleoboy1
JAYDEEJOHN said:
On the Anand link, it has the "new" 8970m, and they go on to say:Spoiler
"The bad news then is that a 10% clock speed increase from Trinity isn't going to be enough to close the gap in many titles, depending on the resolution and quality settings. Looking at Trinity vs. Ivy Bridge with 7970M, I've seen Intel outperform AMD by 50% or more, particularly in titles that pound the CPU (e.g. Skyrim and StarCraft II); on other games, however, it's basically a wash at high quality 1080p settings, so as a more budget-friendly gaming notebook the GX70 has potential."
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
"The bad news then is that a 10% clock speed increase from Trinity isn't going to be enough to close the gap in many titles, depending on the resolution and quality settings. Looking at Trinity vs. Ivy Bridge with 7970M, I've seen Intel outperform AMD by 50% or more, particularly in titles that pound the CPU (e.g. Skyrim and StarCraft II); on other games, however, it's basically a wash at high quality 1080p settings, so as a more budget-friendly gaming notebook the GX70 has potential."
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
My question is, why fork out the money for a decent gpu if thats not why youre using it?
And isnt it for eye candy as well?
imo because it brings down the price and in gpu bound situations, plays on par with intel rigs (higher perf/price in gpu bound scenarios). i think this laptop is a prime example how amd can get a bigger chunk of the bom(moar moniez) by going full-amd. and additional publicity - new richland, new 8000 series gpu - marketing. they (also toms, with gx60) have already shown that ivy with discreet gfx can outperform apu with discreet gfx, especially in the upper-mid+ prices.
JAYDEEJOHN said:
Not sure what theyre getting at here, but it looks crummy for AMD by their wording vs logic
Spoiler
And here:
The other bad news is that my continuing experience with Enduro is that it's not all that it's cracked up to be, but going pure AMD helps quite a bit. Getting updated drivers with an AMD APU and dGPU is easier, and AMD dGPUs simply cooperate with AMD iGPUs better it seems. I've done some testing with the latest 13.5 Beta2 mobile drivers issue on several other laptops (including the MSI GX60), and for most mainstream applications and games they have been fine. However, there are still times when everything doesn't work quite as smoothly as I'd like.
And here:
The other bad news is that my continuing experience with Enduro is that it's not all that it's cracked up to be, but going pure AMD helps quite a bit. Getting updated drivers with an AMD APU and dGPU is easier, and AMD dGPUs simply cooperate with AMD iGPUs better it seems. I've done some testing with the latest 13.5 Beta2 mobile drivers issue on several other laptops (including the MSI GX60), and for most mainstream applications and games they have been fine. However, there are still times when everything doesn't work quite as smoothly as I'd like.
Isnt this a AMD product? Why the redundancy ?
And then we get the smoother comment.
And it infers AMD doesnt work well with Intel
I hope they have a huge multi system revirew to explain all this, as thats the picture Im getting
enduro is still maturing lacking while nvidia has better optimus tech.
apus seem to hit thermal ceiling fast (needs much better cooling) and throttle as seen on toms' gx60 review. but, if the apu is kept under 60c (despite amd's stated 100c max.temp.), it'll perform at its peak.... at least that's the impression i got.
where did you get the idea that amd doesn't work well with intel? that statement points to amd's own usual lack of software support.
(this following part is not addressed to you)
and no cralfs, amd having less resources than intel is irrelevant for driver development.
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Reply to de5_Roy
de5_Roy said:
MSI GX70 3BE: Richland A10 APU and Neptune 8970M Gaming Notebookhttp://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
nvidia's latest gpu scam exposed? 770 is the new 6950? amd calls nvidia out? charlied is rolling on the floor laughing hysterically(roflH)? as usual, take it with a grain of salt.
http://semiaccurate.com/2013/05/13/you-can-upgrade-an-n...
Lol, not even rebadging, now just flashing and selling dubious products that are the same product people already have anyways.
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Reply to sarinaide
mayankleoboy1 said:
Quote:
If i had it my way toms would buy that site and its whole database of servers and use some military base software to get rid of everything from them once and for all. meaning Toms isnt biased ? Toms sometimes publish reviews that look like paid promotions of softwares. And all that front page promotion to write a "Windows 8 guide " .
Anandtech is quite Intel 'friendly' . And every one of them is a fucking Apple fanboi. Every time Apple releases anything, they are squealing like little girls.
Well for me its alot easier to test software than hardware, so i care more about hardware reviews and extremely little for software reviews.
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Reply to jdwii
mayankleoboy1
May 14, 2013 12:28:17 AM
mayankleoboy1 said:
juanrga said:
Cinebench has been cheating benchmarks scores for many years now. I am not worried about if one piece of software runs better in a chip or in other but when the benchmarks cheat and give fakes scores. Can you confirm that Maxon is using Intel compiler for its programs? I.e. can you confirm me that Cinebench benchmarks really represent Cinema4D performance?
I cant confirm, and neither can you that Cinebench cheats against AMD. That is the problem with closed source software. And nobody can say whether a benchmark represents the perf of the actual software. So if you are denouncing Cinebench, you will have to denounce all other closed source benchmarks as well.
It is known that cinebench uses ICC
What does ICC offer AMD in terms of performance?
http://www.agner.org/optimize/blog/read.php?i=49
Tests with AMD bd 8150
MS 17.00 1 SSE2 code path: 724 clock cycles
Intel 12.1.3 1 generic code: 1950 clock cycles
Intel 12.1.3 1 Intel forced path: 720 clock cycles
obviously this test was to show near maximum benefit with code path and won't always be this obvious, but the truth is still evident.
with ICC and intel's checking system for GenuineIntel, amd gets the slowest code path available (yes at times slower than MSVC, but generally near identical). Benchmarking with this compiler is not representative to AMD's performance on an even playing field.
Cinebench may not be intentially "cheating", ICC is doing that for them.
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Reply to noob2222
kettu
May 14, 2013 3:35:20 AM
juanrga said:
But only Kaveri with steamroller cores is confirmed for 2013. Steamroller based FXs and Opterons are still scheduled for 2014. No? That was the reasoning behind the FX Centurion rumour at least.
http://techreport.com/news/24594/amd-roadmap-confirms-s...
It's probably Kaveri based opteron though.
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Reply to kettu
mayankleoboy1
May 14, 2013 4:31:21 AM
noob2222 said:
It is known that cinebench uses ICC
Spoiler
.http://www.agner.org/optimize/blog/read.php?i=49
Tests with AMD bd 8150
MS 17.00 1 SSE2 code path: 724 clock cycles
Intel 12.1.3 1 generic code: 1950 clock cycles
Intel 12.1.3 1 Intel forced path: 720 clock cycles
obviously this test was to show near maximum benefit with code path and won't always be this obvious, but the truth is still evident.
with ICC and intel's checking system for GenuineIntel, amd gets the slowest code path available (yes at times slower than MSVC, but generally near identical). Benchmarking with this compiler is not representative to AMD's performance on an even playing field.
Cinebench may not be intentially "cheating", ICC is doing that for them
Tests with AMD bd 8150
MS 17.00 1 SSE2 code path: 724 clock cycles
Intel 12.1.3 1 generic code: 1950 clock cycles
Intel 12.1.3 1 Intel forced path: 720 clock cycles
obviously this test was to show near maximum benefit with code path and won't always be this obvious, but the truth is still evident.
with ICC and intel's checking system for GenuineIntel, amd gets the slowest code path available (yes at times slower than MSVC, but generally near identical). Benchmarking with this compiler is not representative to AMD's performance on an even playing field.
Cinebench may not be intentially "cheating", ICC is doing that for them
Maybe Cinebench people are using assembly code specially for AMD procs, and using ICC only because its the best compiler. Since CB is so CPU dependent, this probability is very very high.Maybe they manually removed the CPU check. Maybe they added other shims for AMD procs.
We only know that CB is compiled by ICC. We dont know what and how is the code written by CB developers.
Edit : I was just checking the link you gave. It mentions only some libraries that give separate code for Non-intel procs. Those libraries are high performance, and obviously tuned for the internal architecture of Intel procerssors.
Or do you think that the internal arch of AMD is the same as Intel, just because both support x86 ? Or does AMD hand out the details of its architectures to general public and competitors ? Or the marketing PR architecture slides we see at review time is sufficient to make a high performing, tuned library ?
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Reply to mayankleoboy1
juanrga
May 14, 2013 5:51:20 AM
mayankleoboy1 said:
juanrga said:
Cinebench has been cheating benchmarks scores for many years now. I am not worried about if one piece of software runs better in a chip or in other but when the benchmarks cheat and give fakes scores. Can you confirm that Maxon is using Intel compiler for its programs? I.e. can you confirm me that Cinebench benchmarks really represent Cinema4D performance?
I cant confirm, and neither can you that Cinebench cheats against AMD. That is the problem with closed source software. And nobody can say whether a benchmark represents the perf of the actual software. So if you are denouncing Cinebench, you will have to denounce all other closed source benchmarks as well.
You cannot confirm your claims, but I can confirm the mines. It is well-known that Cinebench, Sysmark, and other benchmarks cheat against AMD
http://sharikou.blogspot.com.es/2009/12/ftc-accuses-int...
mayankleoboy1 said:
Quote:
Yes Maxon claims in its website that Cinebench is based in professional software Cinema4D, "which is used extensively by studios and production houses worldwide for 3D content creation", but since Titanic was produced using Linux in 1997 all major studios including Dreamworks Animation, Pixar, Weta Digital, and Industrial Light & Magic have migrated to Linux. Currently more than 95% of the servers and desktops at large animation and visual effects companies use Linux, which imply that 95% of the industry is not using Cinema4D.Thats a big claim you are making. Got any link to back it up ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux#Market_share_and_upt...
mayankleoboy1 said:
Quote:
I am happy with open benchmarks or with closed benchmarks compiled with a fair compiler. I just reject the well-known unfair closed benchmarks that cheat about the scores giving fake advantage to Intel chips.If the benchmarks are closed source, how do you know they cheat against AMD, or are unfair ? You are just making that up from your idea of what an AMD CPU should perform like.
There are ways to detect if a closed source benchmark is cheating or not. Sysmark and Cinebench are biased
http://sharikou.blogspot.com.es/2009/12/ftc-accuses-int...
PCmark gives up to a 40% more score when believes that a given chip is "made by Intel".
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/pcmark-2005-memory-b...
mayankleoboy1 said:
Quote:
I repeat, if Intel chips are so superior why do the biased benchmarks exist?Because marketing. And AMD does not have the money to influence benchmarks.
You are contradicting yourself. If intel chips are so good. Marketing dept. only needs to emphasize how good the chips are.
But, if the chips are not so good as you believe, then Intel needs to cheat about the benchmarks giving fake scores and fake figures.
It is not about money. There are companies so big like Intel and none of them has been accused of continuous cheating/lying about benchmarks or about illegal practices.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel#Competition.2C_antit...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel#Competition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_v._Intel
mayankleoboy1 said:
Quote:
As a final note. AMD already introduced Steamroller optimization in the main compilers as GCC. When SteamRoller was released compilers will use its potential since day one.That has been the case with Bulldozer and Piledriver as well. Usually, compiler support is added months before actual product is released.
One of the problems of Bulldozer was the lack of software prepared for its innovative technology. AMD is not repeating the same mistake:
Quote:
it is evident that the company is more concerned about ensuring that peculiarities of the Steamroller cores are taken into consideration by software designers on the first place.http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20121011232630...
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Reply to juanrga
juanrga
May 14, 2013 6:16:42 AM
JAYDEEJOHN said:
On the Anand link, it has the "new" 8970m, and they go on to say:"The bad news then is that a 10% clock speed increase from Trinity isn't going to be enough to close the gap in many titles, depending on the resolution and quality settings. Looking at Trinity vs. Ivy Bridge with 7970M, I've seen Intel outperform AMD by 50% or more, particularly in titles that pound the CPU (e.g. Skyrim and StarCraft II); on other games, however, it's basically a wash at high quality 1080p settings, so as a more budget-friendly gaming notebook the GX70 has potential."
http://www.anandtech.com/print/6949/msi-gx70-3be-richla...
My question is, why fork out the money for a decent gpu if thats not why youre using it?
And isnt it for eye candy as well?
Not sure what theyre getting at here, but it looks crummy for AMD by their wording vs logic
And here:
The other bad news is that my continuing experience with Enduro is that it's not all that it's cracked up to be, but going pure AMD helps quite a bit. Getting updated drivers with an AMD APU and dGPU is easier, and AMD dGPUs simply cooperate with AMD iGPUs better it seems. I've done some testing with the latest 13.5 Beta2 mobile drivers issue on several other laptops (including the MSI GX60), and for most mainstream applications and games they have been fine. However, there are still times when everything doesn't work quite as smoothly as I'd like.
Isnt this a AMD product? Why the redundancy ?
And then we get the smoother comment.
And it infers AMD doesnt work well with Intel
I hope they have a huge multi system revirew to explain all this, as thats the picture Im getting
Anandtech is well-known for its Intel/Apple bias. They are not professional about benchmarks, quality, price, power consumption... In their forums they make all kind of attacks against AMD, and ban people who says they the truth. However posters saying that people who chose AMD instead of Intel are "mentally insane" (sic) are allowed to post and even applauded...
Google is your friend

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Reply to juanrga
JAYDEEJOHN said:
@de5_royThey say AMD works better with AMD, and even then its not great, so whats that saying how AMD works with other chips?
Thats my point, and left rather ambiguous by Anand.
they mentioned gpus and enduro, so i am guessing that they're hinting at gpu switching. since both gpus are amd's, software support is(or should be) easier. meanwhile the usage experience, while functioning, isn't smooth enough - that's my assumption. i think relatively higher amount of stuttering or slowdown is involved, probably the cpu can't handle it well enough yet. the writer has hinted at enduro's shortcomings and lack of improvement for a while. iirc amd launched enduro with quite a bit of fanfare.
imho, the vagueness of that statement does lead to assuming amd doesn't work well with intel. i think it's a failure on both amd's and intel's lack of mutual cooperation and software support(both are well-known for it), if true.
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Reply to de5_Roy
juanrga said:
Anandtech is well-known for its Intel/Apple bias. They are not professional about benchmarks, quality, price, power consumption... In their forums they make all kind of attacks against AMD, and ban people who says they the truth. However posters saying that people who chose AMD instead of Intel are "mentally insane" (sic) are allowed to post and even applauded...
Google is your friend
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BHNkE2yCYAEmtGF.png:large
is that screenshot supposed to mean something? anything? i just typed tomshardware intel -> google corrected it to tom's hardware intel -> the second and 4th suggestions are 'intel bias', 3rd and 4th if you type tom's hardware bia...
some friend google turned out to be...
edit:
s/a is on a roll
http://semiaccurate.com/2013/05/14/why-would-nvidia-rel...
tpu's take
http://www.techpowerup.com/183936/geforce-gtx-680-can-b...
First Richland desktop part available in Europe (with 'benches')
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/31376-first-richland-...
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Reply to de5_Roy
de5_Roy said:
JAYDEEJOHN said:
@de5_royThey say AMD works better with AMD, and even then its not great, so whats that saying how AMD works with other chips?
Thats my point, and left rather ambiguous by Anand.
they mentioned gpus and enduro, so i am guessing that they're hinting at gpu switching. since both gpus are amd's, software support is(or should be) easier. meanwhile the usage experience, while functioning, isn't smooth enough - that's my assumption. i think relatively higher amount of stuttering or slowdown is involved, probably the cpu can't handle it well enough yet. the writer has hinted at enduro's shortcomings and lack of improvement for a while. iirc amd launched enduro with quite a bit of fanfare.
imho, the vagueness of that statement does lead to assuming amd doesn't work well with intel. i think it's a failure on both amd's and intel's lack of mutual cooperation and software support(both are well-known for it), if true.
Agreed, AMD isnt out of the woods yet here, and my POV is, RR is fixing all the little things while keeping a firm grip at the helm.
If you look at the talent theyve brought in, as well as new up and comers we havnt heard about yet, I just dont see AMD as being known as tolerable, at least, not any more.
You can say, you have only so much to work with, but the things you can, you can do very well, and thats the legacy of some of the new/old hires
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Reply to JAYDEEJOHN
cowboy44mag
May 14, 2013 7:20:46 AM
jdwii said:
truegenius said:
Quote:
Once I put the Sabertooth and a 1000 W 80+ Gold PSU in I was able to hit a stable 5.0Ghz overclock on my "old crappy" 965 BE!! Quote:
Your going to love the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0!! Keep in mind if you don't have adequate airflow watch your overclocks till you get a better case and cooling (to hit 5.0Ghz on my 965 BE I had to set the vcore to 1.6v (well above the recommended 1.55v max) and was hitting 61C - 62C is max for Phenom II). the numbers mason, i know when you are lying
5GHz
it is not possible to hit stable 5GHz on 965I missed that part actually i can get my CPU stable at 3.9Ghz with only 1.30625V stable with 24 hours on prime95 with my 212+ heatsink with temps only at 51C.
But however 5Ghz even on water(with a Phenom II x4) doesn't seem likely now yes he might have it there but i bet its not stable(at 63C or below) using prime for at least 4 hours.
I don't keep my overclock at 5Ghz and the vcore has to be set too high and heat does become a problem. I live in Pa, and we have just started to have a little warm weather here and there, when I had it overclocked to 5Ghz I turned the heat off to my "man cave" (family room in basement) and let it run overnight and next day (almost 24 hrs) ambient room temps were probably 40F or below, and like I said not too many people put two delta fans on a Hyper 212 EVO, it makes a difference. I'm not saying it was totally stable at that overclock as past running Prime 95 and playing a little Skyrim to enjoy the overclock I didn't keep it there for long. A lot of overclockers will also say its not stable unless it can post Intel Burn Test too, it passed Prime 95, however I shut Burn Test down after a few minutes as it was jumping to nearly 70C, way too high. Most overclockers won't push the vcore past 1.55v, they will stop there and start to find highest stable overclock at 1.55. I had mine a little past 1.6v, which most "experts" say will fry the processor within seconds. Those must be the same "experts" who say 5Ghz is impossible, because my processor is fine.
It is also noteworthy that just about all people who had Phenom IIs have upgraded as they upgrade the "supporting hardware" (ie motherboards, ram, psu, ect) to bigger and better processors. I couldn't even hit a true 4Ghz overclock on my old motherboard, psu, ram configuration. It wasn't until I put the Sabertooth 990FX R2.0, a 1000W 80+ Gold psu, and Crucible Tactical RAM that I was able to hit that overclock. 5Ghz is more than possible, as these chips have been pushed to at least 8Ghz by overclock enthusiasts (they were of course using insane cooling).
With summer coming and warm weather coming there is no way I can keep a 5Ghz overclock, which is why I set it to 4.5Ghz which is more manageable, however I my have to set to 4.2 or 4.1 if summer temps get too high (one summer almost every freaking day was high 90s or over 100F). Running air conditioners just to keep a overclock gives too much money to the hated electric company.
People tend to forget some very important rules about overclocking. The first and most important is every chip is different, no two processors exactly the same will overclock the same. One may only be stable to 3.8Ghz, one may hit 4.2, and one may hit 4.5, ect.. But the other thing is most people don't keep a 4 year old processor as their "workhorse" and see what an older processor can do with new supporting hardware. Most people have never tried to over clock a Phenom II 965 or 980 using a Sabertooth 990FX R2.0. A lot of remaining Phenom IIs in everyday use are hecta core which don't tend to overclock as high as the Phenom II quad cores so right away people jump on the "impossible" bandwagon. Anytime in history that someone said "that's impossible" someone else did it. 5Ghz was never meant to be an everyday overclock, just wanted to see how high I could push it.
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Reply to cowboy44mag
http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/31264-amd-creates-cus...
Looks like AMD has setup a shop to do more custom solutions like PS4. Apparently, they will offer integrated x86 and ARM based APUs.
That's catering to a niche that doesn't really exist from a manufacturer yet. Creating a custom solution without having to burn copious amounts of R&D cash. Maybe that will take off, maybe not, but the idea has some merit.
Looks like AMD has setup a shop to do more custom solutions like PS4. Apparently, they will offer integrated x86 and ARM based APUs.
That's catering to a niche that doesn't really exist from a manufacturer yet. Creating a custom solution without having to burn copious amounts of R&D cash. Maybe that will take off, maybe not, but the idea has some merit.
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Reply to 8350rocks
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