Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

Windows 7 OEM TOS and DIY

Tags:
  • Windows 7
  • Do It Yourself
  • OEM
  • Motherboards
  • Product
Last response: in Windows 7
Share
January 31, 2012 12:22:01 AM

I think it would be a good idea to let people know that the tos for windows 7 oem is very much against do it yourself builds. By their new standard if you install an oem version of windows you can not upgrade your motherboard and processor and use your windows 7.

http://www.microsoft.com/OEM/en/licensing/sblicensing/p...

And it states Q. Can a PC with an OEM Windows operating system have its motherboard upgraded and keep the same license? What if it was replaced because it was defective?
A. Generally, an end user can upgrade or replace all of the hardware components on a computer—except the motherboard—and still retain the license for the original Microsoft OEM operating system software. If the motherboard is upgraded or replaced for reasons other than a defect, then a new computer has been created. Microsoft OEM operating system software cannot be transferred to the new computer, and the license of new operating system software is required. If the motherboard is replaced because it is defective, you do not need to acquire a new operating system license for the PC as long as the replacement motherboard is the same make/model or the same manufacturer's replacement/equivalent, as defined by the manufacturer's warranty.

The reason for this licensing rule primarily relates to the End User Software License Terms and the support of the software covered by that End User Software License Terms. The End User Software License Terms is a set of usage rights granted to the end user by the PC manufacturer and relates only to rights for that software as installed on that particular PC. The system builder is required to support the software on the original PC. Understanding that end users, over time, upgrade their PCs with different components, Microsoft needed to have one base component "left standing" that would still define the original PC. Since the motherboard contains the CPU and is the "heart and soul" of the PC, when the motherboard is replaced (for reasons other than defect) a new PC is essentially created. The original system builder did not manufacture this new PC, and therefore cannot be expected to support it.


As such you would need a full version of windows 7 to be able to upgrade major components. So it does no good to reccomend windows 7 oem to do it yourself pc builders. Its something every one should know before doing a self build. OEM is cheaper but if you upgrade you need tio buy a new oem version for each major upgrade and you would be ahead to buy the full version now as its cheaper if you have to replace defective parts or to upgrade.

http://www.microsoft.com/OEM/en/licensing/sblicensing/P...

They also call us hobbyists. >_<

More about : windows oem tos diy

a b $ Windows 7
a c 236 V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 12:29:50 AM

This topic has been moved from the section Site Feedback to section Windows 7 by Tecmo34
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 12:37:59 AM

Hi :) 

EXCELLENT ...As an OEM builder, it annoys me a lot that DIY builders use an OEM licence, but to be honest it annoys me even more that suppliers are SELLING users OEM licences....and breaking the law....

All the best Brett :) 
m
0
l
Related resources
January 31, 2012 12:49:52 AM

Imagine if the Automobile industry did terms like this with their engines. lol
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 12:50:26 AM

Brett928S2 said:
Hi :) 

EXCELLENT ...As an OEM builder, it annoys me a lot that DIY builders use an OEM licence, but to be honest it annoys me even more that suppliers are SELLING users OEM licences....and breaking the law....

All the best Brett :) 


The Suppliers are not breaking any laws as long as they are selling the oEM package unopened so that the end user is the one breaking the seal and hence agreeing to be bound to the licensing agreement on the package !! -- This is why retailers are able to sell the OEM versions and are not being sued by MS since it is not their responsibility to determine if the end user that orders the OEM version is indeed another system builder or an end user and MS allows unopened OEM packages to be sold by them - From the same article linked above referring to the license terms :

Quote:
What are the different ways in which Microsoft OEM System Builder Windows licenses can be distributed?

A. The current OEM System Builder License allows system builders to distribute Windows desktop operating system licenses in the following ways: Preinstalled on a new PC and resold to a third party.

Unopened OEM System Builder packs (1-, 3-, or 30-packs) can be distributed to other system builders. Note that they must remain unopened so the receiving system builder can accept and be bound by the break-the-seal license agreement affixed to the pack. They should not be distributed to end users.


So it is not the retailer at fault it is the end user if they use the OEM version in a manner it was not designed to be used for.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 12:57:09 AM

JDFan said:
The Suppliers are not breaking any laws as long as they are selling the oEM package unopened so that the end user is the one breaking the seal and hence agreeing to be bound to the licensing agreement on the package !! -- This is why retailers are able to sell the OEM versions and are not being sued by MS since it is not their responsibility to determine if the end user that orders the OEM version is indeed another system builder or an end user and MS allows unopened OEM packages to be sold by them - From the same article linked above referring to the license terms :

Quote:
What are the different ways in which Microsoft OEM System Builder Windows licenses can be distributed?

A. The current OEM System Builder License allows system builders to distribute Windows desktop operating system licenses in the following ways: Preinstalled on a new PC and resold to a third party.

Unopened OEM System Builder packs (1-, 3-, or 30-packs) can be distributed to other system builders. Note that they must remain unopened so the receiving system builder can accept and be bound by the break-the-seal license agreement affixed to the pack. They should not be distributed to end users.


So it is not the retailer at fault it is the end user if they use the OEM version in a manner it was not designed to be used for.



Interesting, the last two HP I purchased already had system software installed... and in order for me to have disks I had to recreate them using an application they supplied.

Is this a different style of OEM licensing?

scratch that... I didnt see the whole story.
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 1:09:08 AM

biscuitasylum said:
Interesting, the last two HP I purchased already had system software installed... and in order for me to have disks I had to recreate them using an application they supplied.

Is this a different style of OEM licensing?


No -- the OEM is supposed to only sell the system with the OS installed using the OPK (OEM Preinstallation Kit) so HP is doing it properly --- What we are talking about is the retail outlets that sell OEM products to third parties Microsoft allows them to sell the OEM packaging as long as they do not break the seal on the packaging since according to them breaking the seal is agreeing to be bound by the Terms printed on the packaging and as long as a retailer is selling it as a sealed package this is completely within Microsofts policies and is not breaking any laws --- If someone purchases an OEM version and uses it against the terms on the package is up to them and has nothing to do with the retailer (they followed MS's policies and are also doing things the way they should be -- MS no longer requires them to verify that the OEM package will be used in accordance to MS's policies only that it be sold as a sealed package.)
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 1:34:27 AM

I find it funny that i posted this in http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/forum-9-34.html And a moderator did not read it and moved it here >_< Every one who is building a pc themselves for their own personal use should know about this. I build my own pc's as i like knowing whats in it and its capabilities are as what i can use to upgrade it.

And like others i used oem versions as lets face it if you had the choice between paying 100.00 or 200.00 for the same program which would you choose? And with this move they really have slapped do it yourself builders in the face. Those who build their own pc's generally take care of all of their own pcs and never used pre made pcs and they never generally went to pc repair shops.

Microsoft kills each new version of windows eventually forcing people to repeatedly upgrade to THEIR new operating system basically charging you to enter the building and charging you when you are leaving. I wonder if people would react the same way if every few years the electric company put out new wires and those that did not pay to use the new lines had their power shut off on them leaving them very few if any options if they wanted to continue to have electricity.

They were still making money from the oem versions that the do it yourself builders were buying. But because they were making only 100.00 instead of the 200.00 they felt they should have earned they changed their policy. The sad part is that most will not learn of this until they go to do major upgrades to their systems. But by then they would be forced to either buy another oem version or finally buy the full version and in so doing getting another 100.00 to 200.00 profit.

This really should be explained more in the description of the oem versions to at least let people know. A basic "If you buy this then upgrade your system you will need to buy another at each upgrade or buy the full version once" I'm betting that they would really lose their profits quick from the oem versions as people would then stop buying them all together. And i am also guessing that many outlet places and such that sell oem versions would be quite upset at the loss of profits from it as well being stuck with stock that is near impossible to move.

As a consumer i'm not only upset that this is not clear until you read the tos while installing it. But i'm also upset about their over all shady way apon which they are doing it. What are you gonna do? You click no the software is useless and its not like you can take back software thats opened if you say yes then you are agreeing that you will never upgrade your system. >_<
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 1:42:55 AM

I know the electric company analogy is not the best way to put it. As you pay a monthly bill to keep the power. But if every few years they charged you to install new lines to continue your service through them or they would stop your service all together would be a much better one.
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 1:49:27 AM

zolton33 said:

As a consumer i'm not only upset that this is not clear until you read the tos while installing it. But i'm also upset about their over all shady way apon which they are doing it. What are you gonna do? You click no the software is useless and its not like you can take back software thats opened if you say yes then you are agreeing that you will never upgrade your system. >_<


Actually when you purchase an OEM version it is written onto the outside of the sealed packaging so if you do not agree to the terms you can return it for a refund as long as you do not open the package.

While I agree that they should make the licensing details more precise -- I can completely understand the reasoning behind the OEM license being tied to the MOBO that it is first installed on because the OEM license was designed to be sold by a third party company to the end user and that third party company is supposed to be the one providing any needed support to the end user.

So MS had to tie the license to that system hardware in some manner otherwise end users would be using it on new systems and still trying to get either the third party company or MS to provide support -- and MS sold the OEM version at a discount because they are saving by not having to provide support, yet the OEM should not be responsible for supporting that software after it is no longer being used on their hardware so the license had to be somehow tied to the hardware it was purchased with.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 1:52:30 AM

zolton33 said:
I know the electric company analogy is not the best way to put it. As you pay a monthly bill to keep the power. But if every few years they charged you to install new lines to continue your service through them or they would stop your service all together would be a much better one.



Yeah, thats why I made the comment earlier in regards to the automobile industry. lol, imagine if they did this with engine blocks. lol


I was thinking about this even further... I'm a semi-retired Touring Professional and it hit me... Imagine if, let's say JBL put licenses on their crossovers inside their boxes and the minute you changed their drivers to, lets say an Eminence driver... the crossover would short out. lol It would kill our industry.


From my understanding... you have so many "mother board" changes before you're forced into purchasing another new Operating system. Which isnt bad. If you're able to afford to build yourself 12 computers in a year... you surely can afford to buy some operating systems.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 1:54:01 AM

JDFan said:
No -- the OEM is supposed to only sell the system with the OS installed using the OPK (OEM Preinstallation Kit) so HP is doing it properly --- What we are talking about is the retail outlets that sell OEM products to third parties Microsoft allows them to sell the OEM packaging as long as they do not break the seal on the packaging since according to them breaking the seal is agreeing to be bound by the Terms printed on the packaging and as long as a retailer is selling it as a sealed package this is completely within Microsofts policies and is not breaking any laws --- If someone purchases an OEM version and uses it against the terms on the package is up to them and has nothing to do with the retailer (they followed MS's policies and are also doing things the way they should be -- MS no longer requires them to verify that the OEM package will be used in accordance to MS's policies only that it be sold as a sealed package.)



Okay, gotcha... I tell ya... Software licensing is a whole lot more complicated than Music Copyrighting. :pt1cable: 
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:02:45 AM

biscuitasylum said:
Yeah, thats why I made the comment earlier in regards to the automobile industry. lol, imagine if they did this with engine blocks. lol


I was thinking about this even further... I'm a semi-retired Touring Professional and it hit me... Imagine if, let's say JBL put licenses on their crossovers inside their boxes and the minute you changed their drivers to, lets say an Eminence driver... the crossover would short out. lol It would kill our industry.


From my understanding... you have so many "mother board" changes before you're forced into purchasing another new Operating system. Which isnt bad. If you're able to afford to build yourself 12 computers in a year... you surely can afford to buy some operating systems.



No read carefully if you change the mother board 1 time even if its defective to any other make and model that was in it before your license is null and void and you need a new oem. And an oem version plus building your own pc was the cheapest and most viable option to get the pc and the components you want in and with it. Those who build pc's and sell them for a profit are happy as this makes it much less cheaper and viable to build your own using an oem version.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:09:12 AM

JDFan said:
Actually when you purchase an OEM version it is written onto the outside of the sealed packaging so if you do not agree to the terms you can return it for a refund as long as you do not open the package.

While I agree that they should make the licensing details more precise -- I can completely understand the reasoning behind the OEM license being tied to the MOBO that it is first installed on because the OEM license was designed to be sold by a third party company to the end user and that third party company is supposed to be the one providing any needed support to the end user.

So MS had to tie the license to that system hardware in some manner otherwise end users would be using it on new systems and still trying to get either the third party company or MS to provide support -- and MS sold the OEM version at a discount because they are saving by not having to provide support, yet the OEM should not be responsible for supporting that software after it is no longer being used on their hardware so the license had to be somehow tied to the hardware it was purchased with.



It been a much better viable option to tie it to the person who purchased the software and who is using it. Regardless of if you get a pc from a builder or from a big name company you are still sent to microsoft for the os problems. This is nothing more then a way for microsoft to try to sqeeze every little penny out of you that they can. Read the sticky at the top http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/23305-63-windows-vers...

And i quote [Update: As a consumer, you can buy an OEM System Builder copy of Windows from countless online shopping outlets. Technically, you're not supposed to use those copies unless you're building a PC for resale to a third party. But Microsoft's own employees and retail partners, and even its own "decision engine," Bing, aren't so clear on the rules. For a detailed discussion, see Is it OK to use OEM Windows on your own PC? Even Microsoft's not sure.]

Now keep in mind i do not think the sticky at the top has visited the microsoft oem version website and read THEIR new terms concerning the oem versions.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:14:56 AM

zolton33 said:
No read carefully if you change the mother board 1 time even if its defective to any other make and model that was in it before your license is null and void and you need a new oem. And an oem version plus building your own pc was the cheapest and most viable option to get the pc and the components you want in and with it. Those who build pc's and sell them for a profit are happy as this makes it much less cheaper and viable to build your own using an oem version.



Is this strictly for OEM? I have a friend whoes switched his motherboard 3 times in his computer, however he built it himself. Hes had to recert the software everytime and they just gave him a new code. He was told he could do it 3 or 4 times.
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 2:16:51 AM

zolton33 said:
Regardless of if you get a pc from a builder or from a big name company you are still sent to microsoft for the os problems.

Actually if you have an OEM version and call MS they will refer you to the OEM to answer any questions or if you can no longer get support from the OEM they will only provide support if you pay a consultation fee (used to be about $80 not sure what it is currently)

biscuitasylum said:
Is this strictly for OEM? I have a friend whoes switched his motherboard 3 times in his computer, however he built it himself. Hes had to recert the software everytime and they just gave him a new code. He was told he could do it 3 or 4 times.


Correct -- for OEM versions the license is tied to the MOBO it is initially installed on -- once that MOBO is no longer used the license is no longer valid ( but MS is usually flexible and if you call and ask they will usually give you a new code even though their TOS does not require it - if you have not already reused the OEM version on other systems more than a couple times) -- THe full retail license can be reused an unlimited number of times with any combination of hardware as long as it is only in use on a single system (once you reinstall to a new system the old license is invalid) but once it has been used more than a few times you usually have to call for activation so they can ensure you are not using it on more than one system at a time.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:22:54 AM

JDFan said:
Actually if you have an OEM version and call MS they will refer you to the OEM to answer any questions or if you can no longer get support from the OEM they will only provide support if you pay a consultation fee (used to be about $80 not sure what it is currently)



Ok then what do you call their website? I do not know of any one who ever calls the help line. And unless they check your version by the key you use to activate it they do not know if you are oem or full version. Lets face the facts microsofts support is a joke at its best most of the time as they generally put you on hold for long hours as those who man the phones generally don't know dos from ram >_<
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 2:30:26 AM

zolton33 said:
Ok then what do you call their website? I do not know of any one who ever calls the help line. And unless they check your version by the key you use to activate it they do not know if you are oem or full version. Lets face the facts microsofts support is a joke at its best most of the time as they generally put you on hold for long hours as those who man the phones generally don't know dos from ram >_<


Agreed -- which is also why I use the OEM version myself for systems I build for myself and family members even though technically it is against their TOS since I provide my own support or find support on communities like this one before I would ever call MS for support.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:34:10 AM

Q. What is Microsoft doing to clarify these terms to resellers and end-users?
A. In addition to announcing this clarification to the System Builder channel, Microsoft is working with online retailers to post language on their websites explaining the licensing rules for OEM System Builder channel software.


If this is true why is it not listed as so on newegg? (i now looked under details and it does say so but unless you click the deatails you would never know it)

Yet tigerdirect lists it at the very bottom of the page where most will never see it.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...

Now how do they handle this with the sytem builders? If they must replace the systems motherboard for a customer does that mean they need to pay another 100.00 bucks on top of the price of the new motherboard to fix a system on their waranty? So over 200.00 bucks to repair a pc basically and thats not including labor or a new processor if it died with the motherboard? I do not see how pc builders for profit would be happy with that as you can buy a low end pc for the price of one repair.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:37:05 AM

JDFan said:
Agreed -- which is also why I use the OEM version myself for systems I build for myself and family members even though technically it is against their TOS since I provide my own support or find support on communities like this one before I would ever call MS for support.



interesting. if this is the case, hope we're not treading bad territory here (apologies if we are), but lets say you build yourself a new computer... do you just get a new OEM OS?

The reason Im so curious about this, Im R&Ding a new build right now, as its been a while since Ive built one. This happens to be one of my biggest dilemmas, as theyve changed the way their TOS works since I built last time. Which has been several years for me.

Any issues I ever have with an OS, I just come online to find answers or trouble shoot myself. I never call Microsoft or Apple.

I also use Apple Boxes.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:37:14 AM

JDFan said:
Agreed -- which is also why I use the OEM version myself for systems I build for myself and family members even though technically it is against their TOS since I provide my own support or find support on communities like this one before I would ever call MS for support.



But what is the personal pc builder to do if they plainly say no? What you are saying is the best case scenario. And they are under no obligation to allow you to reinstall it on a new system.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:45:37 AM

So if I bought this instead of full version... I could install it on my new build, but i would have to provide my own support and I couldnt upgrade the mother board again unless I actually purchased another OEM?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...



Am I getting that OEM is basically a "deal with your own OS problems" while the full is "call MS if you have OS problems?"

Im trying to follow along with you two... forgive me if im all over the place... im done replying singularly ... its getting confusing for my oldness. lol
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 2:45:58 AM

biscuitasylum said:
interesting. if this is the case, hope we're not treading bad territory here (apologies if we are), but lets say you build yourself a new computer... do you just get a new OEM OS?

The reason Im so curious about this, Im R&Ding a new build right now, as its been a while since Ive built one. This happens to be one of my biggest dilemmas, as theyve changed the way their TOS works since I built last time. Which has been several years for me.

Any issues I ever have with an OS, I just come online to find answers or trouble shoot myself. I never call Microsoft or Apple.

I also use Apple Boxes.


Normally since I use AMD MOBOs by the time it is time to retire a MOBO due to the socket type or DDR version supported etc. it is also time to change the OS (ie. XP to Vista - Vista to Win7 - Win7 to Win8 ) anyway so would then buy a new OEM version of the new OS -- Though I have in the past reused an OEM version for a new build and was able to reactivate using the computer activation by just entering the product key and entering the response code it gave me ( Like I said MS is usually fairly flexible even though their TOS does not mandate it -- they are more concerned with Pirate versions that are using the same key on thousands or hundreds of thousands of systems than they are with a person that purchases an OEM version and wants to reuse it on a second system or someone using an OEM version on a system they built instead of buying it preinstalled by a third party builder.)
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:48:33 AM

JDFan said:
Normally since I use AMD MOBOs by the time it is time to retire a MOBO due to the socket type or DDR version supported etc. it is also time to change the OS (ie. XP to Vista - Vista to Win7 - Win7 to Win8 ) anyway so would then buy a new OEM version of the new OS -- Though I have in the past reused an OEM version for a new build and was able to reactivate using the computer activation by just entering the product key and entering the response code it gave me ( Like I said MS is usually fairly flexible even though their TOS does not mandate it -- they are more concerned with Pirate versions that are using the same key on thousands or hundreds of thousands of systems than they are with a person that purchases an OEM version and wants to reuse it on a second system or someone using an OEM version on a system they built instead of buying it preinstalled by a third party builder.)



Interesting... which makes me wonder what version my friend has, because hes done a recert 3 or 4 times by calling directly to MS... i wanna say 3 total... Im gonna have to give him a buzz tomorrow and quiz him about it
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:49:38 AM

biscuitasylum said:
So if I bought this instead of full version... I could install it on my new build, but i would have to provide my own support and I couldnt upgrade the mother board again unless I actually purchased another OEM?

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/ite...



Am I getting that OEM is basically a "deal with your own OS problems" while the full is "call MS if you have OS problems?"

Im trying to follow along with you two... forgive me if im all over the place... im done replying singularly ... its getting confusing for my oldness. lol

That is correct if you decided later to get a better newer mobo by microsofts stance its a brand new pc hence requiring you to get a new oem key to reinstall windows 7 and yes by the same standards you are the builder and as such responsible for your own system. Only thing you'd be entitled to are windows 7 updates.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 2:59:29 AM

I cant believe I never even thought about quizzing the forum about this... Im glad you started this thread... it instantly caught my eye and has cleared some questions Ive had. I might just start opening my wallet now and start building.

Ive got this brand new HAF 912 Case, an Antec 500 watt PSU, and a Budget HD6670 just itching to be put together but I havent done anything because I wasnt sure the route I would be taking as far as motherboard/processor/OS System.

I think its time for my Old Man check up. my brains been farting here lately. lol
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 3:01:03 AM

biscuitasylum said:
Interesting... which makes me wonder what version my friend has, because hes done a recert 3 or 4 times by calling directly to MS... i wanna say 3 total... Im gonna have to give him a buzz tomorrow and quiz him about it


He could have either version though if he has had to call MS then I'd lean toward it being an OEM version (as retail versions will normally activate online with no need to call - It just deactivates the previous system license and activates the new one (which is why you need to be careful not to allow someone else access to the license key or be wary if buying a used system since the original owner may still have the key !!)
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:07:53 AM

JDFan said:
He could have either version though if he has had to call MS then I'd lean toward it being an OEM version (as retail versions will normally activate online with no need to call - It just deactivates the previous system license and activates the new one (which is why you need to be careful not to allow someone else access to the license key or be wary if buying a used system since the original owner may still have the key !!)



Yeah, Im gonna give him a shout tomorrow and see what he has. This has peaked my interest.

I can definitely appreciate that on the used system part... luckily im one of those who wont buy a complete used system so anything I get is in used parts or new parts or new complete. So either way... I'd still be buying a new OS.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:09:33 AM

Sorry Zolton, if Ive kinda jumped in and thread hogged a little. This is something thats been bugging me for a few weeks. you guys rock (JDFan) with your answers.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:21:14 AM

I understand what you mean about a long time since building a system. I'm still using my athlon 64 x2 4400+ i built about 6 years ago (and its still in 32 bit windows xp). >_< And i would not have known about the tos if i hadn't went looking around at its features. And the tos may be clear to some but i'm also one of the guilty people that just click accept without reading it lol

I am also planning a new build and was researching os systems. If i did not game as much as i do i'd probably tell microsoft what they could do with windows and go pure linux like most people. But sadly from what i understand linux has alot of problems with games installing and running. Its just a shame there is no law to prevent you being charged twice for a nonconsumable product. But i would guess microsoft is legal in what they are doing although i would call it unethical. Imagine a game company charging you each time you installed their game on a new system. >_<
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:25:50 AM

Its on par with the topic really in that it involves do it yourself building and windows oem version and their tos. And you asked questions most other people would ask. so this topic alone helps to give people answers they might be looking for. There should be a sticky in the system builders forums explaining the oem version of windows and its tos to help those building their pc's know their options.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:33:21 AM

zolton33 said:
I understand what you mean about a long time since building a system. I'm still using my athlon 64 x2 4400+ i built about 6 years ago (and its still in 32 bit windows xp). >_< And i would not have known about the tos if i hadn't went looking around at its features. And the tos may be clear to some but i'm also one of the guilty people that just click accept without reading it lol

I am also planning a new build and was researching os systems. If i did not game as much as i do i'd probably tell microsoft what they could do with windows and go pure linux like most people. But sadly from what i understand linux has alot of problems with games installing and running. Its just a shame there is no law to prevent you being charged twice for a nonconsumable product. But i would guess microsoft is legal in what they are doing although i would call it unethical. Imagine a game company charging you each time you installed their game on a new system. >_<


lol looks like were in the same boat, friend. I'm running an Athlon 64 x2 3800+ with the 32 bit XP.

My laptops are current, but they are strictly for work. My desktop is a different story.


Yes, Linux does have some problems with games. you end up soending more time troubleshooting than playing. If it was a more mainstream system it would own MS. Its a really great OS.

Over christmas my Radeon x1650 pro died and I had replaced it with the XFX HD6670 because it was a cheap $64 and came with a free game which my kiddo enjoys.

In doing so, I decided... it was time to build a new system.

Someone gave me an old Gateway 4200-09 that has the Phenom x4 9150e which was bare... only mother board, case and processor.

I went and bought memory for it... shoved everything from this HP in it just to see if it booted... and it booted all the way to the recert screen.

I debated a couple of days and decided to just go all out on a new build... so i took the memory back and exchanged it for a new HAF 912 case and ready to shove stuff in it. lol
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:34:50 AM

zolton33 said:
Its on par with the topic really in that it involves do it yourself building and windows oem version and their tos. And you asked questions most other people would ask. so this topic alone helps to give people answers they might be looking for. There should be a sticky in the system builders forums explaining the oem version of windows and its tos to help those building their pc's know their options.


I just didnt want ya to think I was hogging... i just never thought to ask here... it just slipped my mind. When I saw your post... I was like... "now we're talkin" lol
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:43:36 AM

lol i decided to do a rebuild since i noticed how far behind my pc is. My motherboard runs a bit hot sometimes causing my monitor to go black for a few seconds then coming back (i'm using my on board geforce 6100 built into my motherboard) lol

Seems to be my northbridge getting hot and causing it. I think i'll stick a cheap (under 50.00) video card in it to let this one live a while longer but my new build i want to do from the ground up. The phenom chips are still considered some what new and are known as the higher class of amd processors.

I'm debating going intel or waiting to see if amd does better with the new upcoming cpus the pile driver (where is amd getting their names? wrestling fans much i wonder?) the fx chips seem to be terrible (the bulldozer) So i'm on the fence. Technicly this is my second build my first was an intel and a plastic lever to hold the heat sink down melted and fried my first build (i learned then to research parts better lol) But first need to get the wife a pc so we are not scrambling to see who gets on first >_<
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 3:49:46 AM

Yeah and its something every pc do it yourself person should know. But its not really brought up much. I may just buy the upgrade it comes with both 32 and 64 windows 7 upgrade and windows xp to windows 7 qualifies so it be alot cheaper over all. I'm just unsure how the tos handles moving your windows xp to a new system then upgrading works.

Is it considered a full new version? (installing windows 7 upgrade from windows xp you have to do a custom install which is a full new install wiping everything out you can upgrade regulary but if you choose that option windows 7 becomes bothersome) Theres alot more reading for me to do and in 2014 with windows 8 it starts all over again >_<
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:00:26 AM

Lol at the wrestler names...

Yeah, Im like you... Ive been on the fence about AMD since ive started researching. Mainly what processor to go with... and how to handle to OS situation since rules have changed so much.

I will build an AMD box... not because Im a fan or anything... shoot one of my laptops is an intel and one is a Mac OS... so it has nothing to do with being a fan... I just prefer an AMD desktop because I tend to get carried away with soldering irons and tinker a bit and have been know to screw things up and AMD is a cheaper toy to play with. Plus I tend to stick with the little guy so i can help fund the idea of not seeing a company like intel become a monopoly. if that makes any sense. lol

Its funny for me, I never noticed how far behind I was till I was walking through an electronics store and started seeing heat sinks on motherboard chipsets. something ive been doing myself well before the motherboard companies started doing it.

I tinker with electronics alot... so ill experiment with things till I screw em up.

If you get a card... that xfx hd6670 is a great budget card... im having good fun with it. I play mostly source engine games, the Guild Wars series and a few driving sims. Nothing too major.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:02:59 AM

zolton33 said:
Yeah and its something every pc do it yourself person should know. But its not really brought up much. I may just buy the upgrade it comes with both 32 and 64 windows 7 upgrade and windows xp to windows 7 qualifies so it be alot cheaper over all. I'm just unsure how the tos handles moving your windows xp to a new system then upgrading works.

Is it considered a full new version? (installing windows 7 upgrade from windows xp you have to do a custom install which is a full new install wiping everything out you can upgrade regulary but if you choose that option windows 7 becomes bothersome) Theres alot more reading for me to do and in 2014 with windows 8 it starts all over again >_<



thats what Im not sure about with all the changes to TOS. Its one of the main reasons I didnt combine the Gateway and HP together into one just to get by.

But it seems as though ill just go ahead and get a new OEM OS then begin the trail from there.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:18:37 AM

Yeah i like amd chips mine has been running almost entirely 24/7 365 days a year for 6 years. Not many cpus or builds can boast that lol And the amd athlon 64 x2 i have is still considered a mid level cpu 0_0 I'm seriously considering a phenom x4 or x6. I may even go with a bulldozer chip (windows 7 doesn't really play nice with it and has not started using it to its best yet but we are promised its in the works by microsoft as an update and windows 8 is boasting to really take advantage of them)

When i game i generally do not look at or care about fps. All i care about is if i'm going to lag and if it will run smoothly. And almost any of the new chips will do that lol I'm actually gonna get http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/ite... Some old pci express slots do not play nice with 2.1 cards and most of the newer ones are all 2.1 I'm so behind on products and operating system ram (can now use more then 4 gigs woohoo!!!) cpus mother boards and cases power supplies graphics cards i feel my head is gonna crack open and little sticks of ram are gonna start leaking out.

Its just a shame microsoft is going down the path they are. But give it a few more years and linux might atually be considered the better product. They get games running perfectly i'll jump ship just on the principal of what they are doing and how they are doing it.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:21:05 AM

biscuitasylum said:
thats what Im not sure about with all the changes to TOS. Its one of the main reasons I didnt combine the Gateway and HP together into one just to get by.

But it seems as though ill just go ahead and get a new OEM OS then begin the trail from there.

I wouldn't if you have windows xp to install. I'd just do a fresh install in the new system then install the upgrade. Its a little bit cheaper then an oem version in some places.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:27:54 AM

"mine has been running almost entirely 24/7 365 days a year for 6 years"

Mine also... its been shut down only on vacations. lol

We both are in the same boat... I didnt even realize we had progressed into solid state hard drives... lol

There is so much to take in to catch up on... I almost said the heck with it and was going to purchase a system from ibuypower.com then was like... where is the fun in that? lol

this HP im on is the first store box ive ever bought... i was touring heavily and didnt have time to build so i just bought a store computer and said the heck with it. ive always built em or salvaged oems and put them together into my own oem. which can be easy or one heck of a pain in the butt to do.

Zolton, great to talk with ya this evening... but the bed is calling my name sir....

Dont be a stranger... im sure well run into more conversations on here as i plan to be a regular here.

Have a good evening friend.

m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:31:30 AM

Same here good night i'm probly going to search windows 7 a bit more to check the versions out so when i do a build i know full well what to expect from the operating system. I also plan to be a regular though will probably disapear a while after my new pc is built to game but during server maintenence you can bet i'll be here lol
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:37:13 AM

Hey, if you have a steam account... feel free to add me... you can find me under the simple name "Civilian"

m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:42:38 AM

Lol don't have steam yet but plan to it seems to be the best pc gaming store (i like that i can always redownload my games if i need to do a full system restore)
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 4:46:08 AM

When ya get it... add me... I have a free game just sitting waiting to give someone... its not the best... but hey. lol

Good night man...
m
0
l
a b $ Windows 7
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 1:02:15 PM

Yeah the TOS for the Upgrade versions makes things even a bit more complex -- According to MS's TOS the upgrade versions are for any full version of XP or Vista (they do not define Full version so it could be taken to mean any activated license or could be interpreted as only Retail versions as OEM versions could be considered not "Full versions" so it is also debated. Since once you upgrade the TOS says that the combined license becomes a Retail License and is useable on new systems (figure since you are combining in essence 2 licenses to create the final it should be considered retail but some people argue that you can not upgrade an OEM license to get a retail licensed upgrade)

When Upgrading from XP to Win7 you have to use the custom option as win7 does not support in place upgrades from XP to WIN7 so the HDD must be formatted and then a Clean install of win7 done from the upgrade media ( Microsoft has a video tutorial and guide that walks you through the process - HERE - which also details how to get things ready for the upgrade (like ensuring all of your Hardware is compatible and will work and backing up important files before doing it)

Some people run into problems getting the activation to work properly after using the upgrade media to do a clean install but coming from XP it is the only way to do it so calling MS activation support will get it done (you just need to provide the key code from the existing XP license and the key code for the Upgrade and they will provide you with a valid response code to type in to activate it.) -- Sometimes it will auto activate still but many times it requires a phone call so do not be worried if at first it does not automatically activate !
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 5:26:12 PM

Yeah the licenses get more then a little fuzzy when it comes to the upgrading. I'm also concerned by this http://www.microsoft.com/oem/en/licensing/sblicensing/p... Notice how it does not specify what version of windows this is for? From my understanding they are also including windows xp oem to that list as well as stated on the CNET forums http://forums.cnet.com/7723-6142_102-374254/note-window...;threadListing

Now this is where it gets quite grey. How can they change a tos for an existing product that has been out for a long time and the tos is not included in the original oem disk or on its packaging? The user installing the windows xp version of oem would have no clue of this tos unless it was shown to them. Installing windows xp does not bring you to that tos even after updated.

It would be nice to have this clarified. As well as for system builders for profit and the replacement of motherboards and cpus that are out dated and hence have to be upgraded to stand by a waranty. Do they then have to purchase a new oem to replace the hard ware? If so then the over all costs for the system builder would really punish their customers. Costs of most motherboards? 100.00 (at the least for a decent one) And 150.00 cpu (you could probably go as cheaper but probably be downgrading your clients pc) Add to that the extra 100.00 for a new oem and you are at around 350.00.

The cost of the low end of most major pc manufacturers (i've seen even big name companies selling refurbished and out dated stock around that price range alot) And how pleased will their client be to be told :

"Sorry but to fix it i need to replace your motherboard and they do not make that one any more so i would need to upgrade it "

Customer thinks that is awesome until

"As well as the processor and microsoft considers that a new pc and as such would require a new oem version of windows costing over 350.00 not including labor" (or ram as they would need ram more then likely as the ram for the older board may no longer be made)

I do not see how even pc builders would be pleased by the news that oem licenses now work that way. The new tos is nothing more then a new way to stick it to the little guys (the do it yourself the pc builder for profit as well as the customers of pc builders) Do you honestly think they have big name companies jumping through these same hoops and putting out these same costs as well as paying the same price as most pc builders and do it yourself people for the oem? If so i have some prime beach front property to sell you in Arizona. >_<
m
0
l
a b V Motherboard
January 31, 2012 5:48:02 PM

This is a Really Helpful post, After reading this i will get a full copy of windows 7 from now on so everytime i change my motherboard i won't have to go get a new copy.
m
0
l
January 31, 2012 6:27:24 PM

Rockdpm said:
This is a Really Helpful post, After reading this i will get a full copy of windows 7 from now on so everytime i change my motherboard i won't have to go get a new copy.



Yeah and the sad thing is that most are unaware :pfff:  Some interesting reads here:

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/is-it-ok-to-use-oem-wind...

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/oem-licensing-confusion-...

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/mssmallbiz/archive/2007/02/18/o...

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/seven-perfectly-legal-wa...

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/windows-7-deals-harder-t...

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/what-microsoft-wont-tell...

http://www.winsupersite.com/article/win7/no-oem-for-you...

And it still continues to remain confusing as all the experts are even confused.

Now lets look at it a bit:

DIY buys oem for 100 bucks sounds cheap right? But those who buy pc's from the big companies get not only free full versions on their systems but also get tech support from them for free. DIY have to rely on sites like here and themselves for support. Those getting builds from a system builder also get support from their builder. So DIY are basically getting the software and wished the best of luck. And now they are told they have to pay twice the costs in most circumstances and still wished the best of luck? Microsoft is still getting their cash regardless as most DIY do not pirate the software. They BUY IT FOR PERSONAL USE Its just a shame they are being so shady.
m
0
l
      • 1 / 2
      • 2
      • Newest
!