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Advice on scanner

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Anonymous
August 23, 2005 12:59:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.misc,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Hello,

I am looking for a scanner to scan mainly B&W films.

Canon CanoScan 9950F:
http://www.canon-europe.com/For_Home/Product_Finder/Sca...
Epson Perfection 4990 Photo:
http://www.epson.co.uk/products/scanners/Perfection4990...

I was told that one problem with scanning B&W is that
scans don't give a true black and white photos. Some
scanner give it a bluish tint. some other won't give you
true blacks etc.

Does anybody has experience or better have compared
the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?

What about the Nikon Coolscan?

Any advice is welcome.

Many thanks in advance,
Arash.

More about : advice scanner

Anonymous
August 23, 2005 12:59:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Arash Khodabandeh" <arash.khodabandeh@cern.ch> wrote in message
news:430AC950.3080207@cern.ch...
>
> Hello,
>
> I am looking for a scanner to scan mainly B&W films.
>
> Canon CanoScan 9950F:
>
http://www.canon-europe.com/For_Home/Product_Finder/Sca...
ilm_Scanning/CanonScan9950F/index.asp?ComponentID=230302&SourcePageID=26561
#1
> Epson Perfection 4990 Photo:
> http://www.epson.co.uk/products/scanners/Perfection4990...
>
> I was told that one problem with scanning B&W is that
> scans don't give a true black and white photos. Some
> scanner give it a bluish tint. some other won't give you
> true blacks etc.
>
> Does anybody has experience or better have compared
> the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?
>
> What about the Nikon Coolscan?
>
> Any advice is welcome.
>
> Many thanks in advance,
> Arash.
>
>

It depends on the size of film that you want to scan.

The Epson 4870 and 4990 work quite well for medium format and sheet film
sized B&W film (transparency) scans. However you will probably get
significantly better results with the Nikon Coolscan 9000 for 35 mm and
medium format film scanning.

The scanning software supplied with the Epson Pro scanners (Epson Scan and
SilverFast AI) does have a 'Grayscale' setting that you can use for
scanning B&W films. However I have also used three-color (RGB) scanning,
especially when scanning sepia toned B&W prints, and not had any problems
with color casts ... including a 'blue tint.'
Anonymous
August 23, 2005 12:59:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Arash Khodabandeh wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> I am looking for a scanner to scan mainly B&W films.
>
> Canon CanoScan 9950F:
> http://www.canon-europe.com/For_Home/Product_Finder/Sca...
>
> Epson Perfection 4990 Photo:
> http://www.epson.co.uk/products/scanners/Perfection4990...
>
> I was told that one problem with scanning B&W is that
> scans don't give a true black and white photos. Some
> scanner give it a bluish tint. some other won't give you
> true blacks etc.

Even if they do it is no great loss since you can collapse an RGB scan
into a single luminance image if required. I have never seen any
problems of colour cast with my (now elderly) Nikon CS III.
>
> Does anybody has experience or better have compared
> the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?
>
> What about the Nikon Coolscan?

The worst problem scanning traditional silver black and white material
is that digital ice goes absolurtely crazy so there is no easy way for
scratch elimination on old damaged negatives.

Regards,
Martin Brown
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Anonymous
August 23, 2005 6:45:27 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <deejjd$3v1$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>,
Martin Brown <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:

> Arash Khodabandeh wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I am looking for a scanner to scan mainly B&W films.
> >
> > Canon CanoScan 9950F:
> > http://www.canon-europe.com/For_Home/Product_Finder/Sca...
> > lm_Scanning/CanonScan9950F/index.asp?ComponentID=230302&SourcePageID=26561#1
> >
> >
> > Epson Perfection 4990 Photo:
> > http://www.epson.co.uk/products/scanners/Perfection4990...
> >
> > I was told that one problem with scanning B&W is that
> > scans don't give a true black and white photos. Some
> > scanner give it a bluish tint. some other won't give you
> > true blacks etc.
>
> Even if they do it is no great loss since you can collapse an RGB scan
> into a single luminance image if required. I have never seen any
> problems of colour cast with my (now elderly) Nikon CS III.
> >
> > Does anybody has experience or better have compared
> > the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?
> >
> > What about the Nikon Coolscan?
>
> The worst problem scanning traditional silver black and white material
> is that digital ice goes absolurtely crazy so there is no easy way for
> scratch elimination on old damaged negatives.

Yes, I had a coolscan (4000?) in '99 and ICE messed them up bad. I would
scan in grayscale or desaturate them in PS after scanning in color.
Either way it came out very well. Very easy to clone the scratched out
when scanned in grayscale.

If you have $1000 to spend my recommendation is the the Nikon 5000D
super coolscan. But it seems like you don't.
Anonymous
August 24, 2005 3:32:36 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 14:45:27 GMT, kz8rt3 <kz8rt3@mail.com> wrote:

>In article <deejjd$3v1$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> Martin Brown <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>

>> The worst problem scanning traditional silver black and white material
>> is that digital ice goes absolurtely crazy so there is no easy way for
>> scratch elimination on old damaged negatives.
>
>Yes, I had a coolscan (4000?) in '99 and ICE messed them up bad. I would

Can't you turn off the ICE option?

>scan in grayscale or desaturate them in PS after scanning in color.

If ICE goes "crazy" do you still get a proper scan of the negative.

>Either way it came out very well. Very easy to clone the scratched out
>when scanned in grayscale.

By hand of course?
>
>If you have $1000 to spend my recommendation is the the Nikon 5000D
>super coolscan. But it seems like you don't.


If you go to this web page and then compare overall specs for the
5000D and the 9000D, you might notice that only the 9000D claims:

Improved rod (?) dispersion for smoother picture grain reproductions.

Do you have any idea what this means? Or whether it is also present
in the 5000D but just not mentioned?
Anonymous
August 24, 2005 4:18:04 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Arash Khodabandeh wrote:
> Does anybody has experience or better have compared
> the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?

Recently got the 4990. It works a treat with b&w, colour negative
or color slides, from what I've seen so far. In fatc, it is close to
perfect for colour negatives, to the point I'm considering using
them again!
I do scan the b&w as colour, load it into an editor and desaturate:
it always appears to give better range, no matter what gear I use.
Anonymous
August 24, 2005 1:38:36 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 24 Aug 2005 00:18:04 -0700, wizofoz2k@yahoo.com.au wrote:

>
>Arash Khodabandeh wrote:
>> Does anybody has experience or better have compared
>> the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?
>
>Recently got the 4990. It works a treat with b&w, colour negative
>or color slides, from what I've seen so far. In fatc, it is close to
>perfect for colour negatives, to the point I'm considering using
>them again!

I agree. I bought one to replace a not so good old Canon
flatbed mainly for MF film but I'm amazed how good this
scanner is with 35mm film, better in fact than the Minolta
Scan Dual III that I have. It can produce good scans of some
dense Velvia that I was previously unable to scan at all. I
can certainly recommend the Epson 4990.

>I do scan the b&w as colour, load it into an editor and desaturate:
>it always appears to give better range, no matter what gear I use.

Oddly enough I used to do that with the Minolta, but I use
the Epson in grayscale mode and like the results a lot.

Ed Hamrick's Vuescan does a really good job with the 4990,
but the supplied Epson software isn't as bad as (say)
Minolta's as long as you have reasonably normal originals to
scan.

--
Regards

John Bean
Anonymous
August 24, 2005 5:12:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 08:59:28 +0200, Arash Khodabandeh
<arash.khodabandeh@cern.ch> wrote:

>I am looking for a scanner to scan mainly B&W films.
>

You might want to ask in comp.periphs.scanners

Good luck.
Geo
Anonymous
August 24, 2005 6:13:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <em3og19bn7hnf4uf57e86s52r6pub4ugg8@4ax.com>,
Father Kodak <dont_bother@IDontCare.COM> wrote:

> On Tue, 23 Aug 2005 14:45:27 GMT, kz8rt3 <kz8rt3@mail.com> wrote:
>
> >In article <deejjd$3v1$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>,
> > Martin Brown <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> >
>
> >> The worst problem scanning traditional silver black and white material
> >> is that digital ice goes absolurtely crazy so there is no easy way for
> >> scratch elimination on old damaged negatives.
> >
> >Yes, I had a coolscan (4000?) in '99 and ICE messed them up bad. I would
>
> Can't you turn off the ICE option?

Yup.

>
> >scan in grayscale or desaturate them in PS after scanning in color.
>
> If ICE goes "crazy" do you still get a proper scan of the negative.

Nope.

>
> >Either way it came out very well. Very easy to clone the scratched out
> >when scanned in grayscale.
>
> By hand of course?

Yes, but only if it is scanned with ICE off. You can not fix B&W scanned
using ICE on.

> >
> >If you have $1000 to spend my recommendation is the the Nikon 5000D
> >super coolscan. But it seems like you don't.
>
>
> If you go to this web page and then compare overall specs for the
> 5000D and the 9000D, you might notice that only the 9000D claims:
>
> Improved rod (?) dispersion for smoother picture grain reproductions.
>
> Do you have any idea what this means? Or whether it is also present
> in the 5000D but just not mentioned?

I have NO idea. rod dispersion? Sheesh.

On Nikons site it does not mention grain, only "Nikons proprietary rod
dispersion LED illumination -- no maintenance, no warmup time, and no
risk of heat-related damage to films."

But when I looked at it on a dealers web site I see where you misread.
Anonymous
August 25, 2005 1:02:14 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Arash Khodabandeh apparently said,on my timestamp of 23/08/2005 4:59 PM:

> I was told that one problem with scanning B&W is that
> scans don't give a true black and white photos. Some
> scanner give it a bluish tint. some other won't give you
> true blacks etc.

That seems to be the case. Just scan in colour, then load
it into an image editor and desaturate: you'll end up
with good density range.

> Does anybody has experience or better have compared
> the behaviour of these two scanners on B&W films?

I've used my 4990 with old bw prints and it is simply
superb. Like everything else in this scanner.
So good, I'm going to medium/large format film and
scanning it with this thing: much, much cheaper than
digital.



--
Cheers
Nuno Souto
in sunny Sydney, Australia
wizofoz2k@yahoo.com.au.nospam
Anonymous
August 25, 2005 4:39:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Arash Khodabandeh wrote:

> I was told that one problem with scanning B&W is that
> scans don't give a true black and white photos. Some
> scanner give it a bluish tint. some other won't give you
> true blacks etc.

I don't consider that a scanner problem. B&W negatives are intended
to print on monochrome paper. The digital equivalent are to do a
monochrome scan or to convert to monochrome in the photo editor after
scanning. I haven't scanned B&W negatives, but for starting with B&W
prints, I usually do a color scan in order to better spot and deal
with stains, ink spots, etc. that show up in a different color. That
might be a benefit for negative scans, as well.

Thad
!