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CMOS camera

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Anonymous
August 28, 2005 2:52:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Is there any mid-range camera with a CMOS sensor?
For now, only low-end cameras like toy cameras and high-end SLR like Canon,
Nikon and Kodak.

Jerry

More about : cmos camera

Anonymous
August 28, 2005 8:24:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:52:11 -0400, "J. Davidson"
<jdavidson3@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>Is there any mid-range camera with a CMOS sensor?
>For now, only low-end cameras like toy cameras and high-end SLR like Canon,
>Nikon and Kodak.

I wouldn't call the Canon 300's High-end and they have CMOS. I would
consider it a low end SLR.


*************************************************************

"I believe that all government is evil,
in that all government must necessarily make war upon liberty...

From "Mencken's Creed"
H.L. Mencken (1880 -1956)
Anonymous
August 28, 2005 8:24:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"John A. Stovall" <johnastovall@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:a7p3h1lvhs7ml0m83mkmlv1cfn1tuke1cr@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 10:52:11 -0400, "J. Davidson"
> <jdavidson3@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>Is there any mid-range camera with a CMOS sensor?
>>For now, only low-end cameras like toy cameras and high-end SLR like
>>Canon,
>>Nikon and Kodak.
>
> I wouldn't call the Canon 300's High-end and they have CMOS. I would
> consider it a low end SLR.
>

I have to agree with this, there are low-end SLRs too. Still a bit too
pricey though!

> *************************************************************
>
> "I believe that all government is evil,
> in that all government must necessarily make war upon liberty...
>
> From "Mencken's Creed"
> H.L. Mencken (1880 -1956)
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Anonymous
August 28, 2005 11:09:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera? If yes,
see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor makes CCDs price
competitive. In this case, why would you want to use a CMOS sensor instead?

Gregor

"J. Davidson" <jdavidson3@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:tckQe.5856$j63.61228@wagner.videotron.net...
>
> Is there any mid-range camera with a CMOS sensor?
> For now, only low-end cameras like toy cameras and high-end SLR like
> Canon, Nikon and Kodak.
>
> Jerry
>
>
Anonymous
August 28, 2005 11:09:06 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"GTO" <gregor_o@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:lZnQe.25$Lh.15@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
> What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera? If
> yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor makes
> CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to use a CMOS
> sensor instead?
>
> Gregor

I didn't say I want to use a CMOS sensor. I am wondering why they are only
installed in DSLR camera on one end and in toy cameras in the other end.
Nothing between. With all the hype they made few years ago about CMOS sensor
being less expansive to manufacture, it is (to me) a bit of a mistery why
they don't use them in mid-range camera (about $150 to $300).

>
> "J. Davidson" <jdavidson3@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:tckQe.5856$j63.61228@wagner.videotron.net...
>>
>> Is there any mid-range camera with a CMOS sensor?
>> For now, only low-end cameras like toy cameras and high-end SLR like
>> Canon, Nikon and Kodak.
>>
>> Jerry
>>
>>
>
>
Anonymous
August 28, 2005 11:09:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

J. Davidson wrote:
> "GTO" <gregor_o@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:lZnQe.25$Lh.15@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
>
>>What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera? If
>>yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor makes
>>CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to use a CMOS
>>sensor instead?
>>
>>Gregor
>
>
> I didn't say I want to use a CMOS sensor. I am wondering why they are only
> installed in DSLR camera on one end and in toy cameras in the other end.
> Nothing between. With all the hype they made few years ago about CMOS sensor
> being less expansive to manufacture, it is (to me) a bit of a mistery why
> they don't use them in mid-range camera (about $150 to $300).


Maybe because in CMOS, the circuitry sits next to each sensor pixel. In
a P&S camera, the pixel pitchs are getting way too tight for CMOS to
achieve good picture quality economically. Sony, however, did say they
are learning from the technique they use on the camera cell phone to
eventually use CMOS on cheap P&S cameras.
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 2:10:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

GTO wrote:
> What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera?
> If yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor
> makes CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to use
> a CMOS sensor instead?
> Gregor
>

Hm...maybe for same reason i looked on SLR's just before i bought
S2...larger sensor, lower noise, better overall picture quality.
But, price decided for me...so i went for S2 and i'm quite happy.
SLR....maybe....one in the future...
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 2:10:17 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I don't buy the argument with the "better overall picture quality" when
using CMOS. Why do think the Hasselblad H1D and H2D sell with a CCD not
CMOS?

Gregor

"SleeperMan" <SleeperMan@too.sleepy> wrote in message
news:o SoQe.1803$cE1.260242@news.siol.net...
> GTO wrote:
>> What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera?
>> If yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor
>> makes CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to use
>> a CMOS sensor instead?
>> Gregor
>>
>
> Hm...maybe for same reason i looked on SLR's just before i bought
> S2...larger sensor, lower noise, better overall picture quality.
> But, price decided for me...so i went for S2 and i'm quite happy.
> SLR....maybe....one in the future...
>
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 2:10:17 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:10:16 +0200, "SleeperMan"
<SleeperMan@too.sleepy> wrote:

>GTO wrote:
>> What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera?
>> If yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor
>> makes CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to use
>> a CMOS sensor instead?
>> Gregor
>>
>
>Hm...maybe for same reason i looked on SLR's just before i bought
>S2...larger sensor, lower noise, better overall picture quality.
>But, price decided for me...so i went for S2 and i'm quite happy.
>SLR....maybe....one in the future...
>

Not necessarily the case.

CMOS and CCD compared.

http://www.dalsa.com/markets/ccd_vs_cmos.asp

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/question362.htm

CMOS is cheaper to make and takes less power but CCD will produce the
better image.


*************************************************************

"I believe that all government is evil,
in that all government must necessarily make war upon liberty...

From "Mencken's Creed"
H.L. Mencken (1880 -1956)
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 2:47:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 21:56:51 GMT, John A. Stovall
<johnastovall@earthlink.net> wrote:

>On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:10:16 +0200, "SleeperMan"
><SleeperMan@too.sleepy> wrote:
>
>>GTO wrote:
>>> What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera?
>>> If yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor
>>> makes CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to use
>>> a CMOS sensor instead?
>>> Gregor
>>>
>>
>>Hm...maybe for same reason i looked on SLR's just before i bought
>>S2...larger sensor, lower noise, better overall picture quality.
>>But, price decided for me...so i went for S2 and i'm quite happy.
>>SLR....maybe....one in the future...
>>
>
>Not necessarily the case.
>
>CMOS and CCD compared.
>
>http://www.dalsa.com/markets/ccd_vs_cmos.asp
>
>http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/question362.htm
>
>CMOS is cheaper to make and takes less power but CCD will produce the
>better image.

This is probably better aimed at professional scientific camera makers
(Finger Lakes, SBIG, etc) than the consumer stuff where you don't find
first rate CCDS, only "utility grade" sensors. Also, colour work done
with scientific CCDs is tri-colour using three exposures via red,
green and blue filters and then combining them, which yields much
better colour than a consumer camera is capable of.
Dalsa has changed it's tune in the recent because CMOS has matured as
a fairly good sensor technology and both they and Kodak have purchased
companies that specialized in CMOS production.
-Rich


"Bittorrents are REFUNDS for all the BAD movie products Hollywood
never gave us refunds for in the past"
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 5:01:33 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"J. Davidson" <jdavidson3@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:9LpQe.13817$A%2.272898@weber.videotron.net...
SNIP
> I am wondering why they are only installed in DSLR camera on one end
> and in toy cameras in the other end. Nothing between. With all the
> hype they made few years ago about CMOS sensor being less expansive
> to manufacture, it is (to me) a bit of a mistery why they don't use
> them in mid-range camera (about $150 to $300).

It seems that mostly Canon has achieved a sofar un-precedented quality
leap in sensor design/quality control in CMOS devices in larger sizes.
It probably has to do with them being largely in control of their own
sensor production (they manufacture the chip producing equipment
in-house as well). Canon is also one of the largest patent producing
investors in Research and Development for digital photography. Others
will follow (maybe at a distance), no doubt.

Bart
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 11:42:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Bart van der Wolf" <bvdwolf@no.spam> wrote in message
news:4312424e$0$11063$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
>
> "J. Davidson" <jdavidson3@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:9LpQe.13817$A%2.272898@weber.videotron.net...
> SNIP
>> I am wondering why they are only installed in DSLR camera on one end and
>> in toy cameras in the other end. Nothing between. With all the hype they
>> made few years ago about CMOS sensor being less expansive to manufacture,
>> it is (to me) a bit of a mistery why they don't use them in mid-range
>> camera (about $150 to $300).
>
> It seems that mostly Canon has achieved a sofar un-precedented quality
> leap in sensor design/quality control in CMOS devices in larger sizes. It
> probably has to do with them being largely in control of their own sensor
> production (they manufacture the chip producing equipment in-house as
> well). Canon is also one of the largest patent producing investors in
> Research and Development for digital photography. Others will follow
> (maybe at a distance), no doubt.
>
> Bart

Now if they can just work on their reliability.
Anonymous
August 29, 2005 3:46:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Pete D" <no@email.com> wrote in message
news:R%yQe.14219$FA3.2327@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
SNIP
> Now if they can just work on their reliability.

You mean the sensor is not reliable, or do you mean there are
occasional issues with the complete system? Given the huge numbers of
cameras sold (and their complexity), I'd view user issues (including
user error) with the system in the context of the large quantities.
Still it's better to have no issues at all, but then I very rarely (if
ever, depending on model) have one.

Bart
Anonymous
August 30, 2005 1:33:08 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

John A. Stovall wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 22:10:16 +0200, "SleeperMan"
> <SleeperMan@too.sleepy> wrote:
>
>> GTO wrote:
>>> What do you call a "mid-range" camera? Is a DSLR a mid-range camera?
>>> If yes, see Canon's 350D. If no, the small size of the image sensor
>>> makes CCDs price competitive. In this case, why would you want to
>>> use a CMOS sensor instead?
>>> Gregor
>>>
>>
>> Hm...maybe for same reason i looked on SLR's just before i bought
>> S2...larger sensor, lower noise, better overall picture quality.
>> But, price decided for me...so i went for S2 and i'm quite happy.
>> SLR....maybe....one in the future...
>>
>
> Not necessarily the case.
>
> CMOS and CCD compared.
>
> http://www.dalsa.com/markets/ccd_vs_cmos.asp
>
> http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/question362.htm
>
> CMOS is cheaper to make and takes less power but CCD will produce the
> better image.
>
>
this conversation has just been made, while agruments are still not cleared,
so i won't say no more...
!