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DRUID. whats better?

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September 9, 2005 2:29:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

i know interlect..
but what about spirt or stamina? which one is better

More about : druid whats

Anonymous
September 9, 2005 2:29:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

Spirit definetily. The thing is, the main strenght of Druid is ability
to switch to Bear when out of mana (well, almost out of mana) and hold
the defence long enough to let the mana restore. Boosting the spirit,
you are capitalizing on this ability.
Basically, the prioritied for Druid are:
Spirit
Intellect
Stamina
Agility
Strength

The highest DPS for druid is, contrary to popular belief, not in cat
form, but combining spells with melee (Starfire, root, Moonfire, Wrath,
Wrath, melee and Moonfire cycle). So the agility is important too,
especially if the staff is good and slow.
Anonymous
September 9, 2005 7:03:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

In article <c%gUe.13248$OT1.6013@fe09.lga>, "Stinger" <dwa14@yahoo.com>
wrote:

> i know interlect..
> but what about spirt or stamina? which one is better

Stamina when you're young, shift to spirit through your 30s.

--
Nabuu, Tauren druid on Dethecus.
Also (rarely):
Chum, Gnome warlock, Bronzebeard
Tost, Dwarven rogue, Bronzebeard
Meadow, Night elf priest, Bronzebeard
Harmany, Undead mage, Dethecus
<http://www.ManyFriends.com/WoW/PhotoAlbum/&gt;
Aka "Misc" -- If you don't remove your pants, I won't get your email.
Related resources
Anonymous
September 9, 2005 9:13:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

"Nabuu" <Nabuu@*YOUR-PANTS*ManyFriends.com> wrote:

> In article <c%gUe.13248$OT1.6013@fe09.lga>, "Stinger" <dwa14@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>> i know interlect..
>> but what about spirt or stamina? which one is better
>
> Stamina when you're young, shift to spirit through your 30s.

Yep. For soloing/PvP, stamina is important for keeping you alive.
Later, when you're mostly in groups and being protected (as
you're the healer), spirit is better. If you go the restoration
tree up until innervate, spirit is even more important.

Chris

--
[WoW] Wildcard - Treehugging Tauren (60) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Lonewalker - Striding Tauren (21) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Jazrah - Brutal Troll (16) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Jivarr - Charming Troll (12) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Anonymous
September 10, 2005 12:11:27 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

yozik wrote:
> Spirit definetily. The thing is, the main strenght of Druid is ability
> to switch to Bear when out of mana (well, almost out of mana) and hold
> the defence long enough to let the mana restore. Boosting the spirit,
> you are capitalizing on this ability.
> Basically, the prioritied for Druid are:
> Spirit
> Intellect
> Stamina
> Agility
> Strength
>
> The highest DPS for druid is, contrary to popular belief, not in cat
> form, but combining spells with melee (Starfire, root, Moonfire, Wrath,
> Wrath, melee and Moonfire cycle). So the agility is important too,
> especially if the staff is good and slow.

Moonfire has a high chance to break roots though. I believe it is better
to use starfire after roots (on melee mobs).

I have spend all talents into catform (level 26) and at times I manage
to steal aggro from a higher level warrior I sometimes play with. (even
though I didn't have charge/dash up till yesterday and thus started
later). This just feel goods for me and isn't much of a problem since
the target will be nearly dead by then :-)

Thomas
--
Life is like a videogame with no chance to win - ATR
Anonymous
September 10, 2005 9:59:34 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

"Stinger" <dwa14@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c%gUe.13248$OT1.6013@fe09.lga...
>i know interlect..
> but what about spirt or stamina? which one is better
>
>

From the Intellect comment I'm assuming you're going Restore Spec. If you
go Feral the answer is different. Restore spec Int/Spi are top priorities
in groups. When soloing it's nice to have some Int/Sta gear around to take
a few extra hits. That being said, I went Restore/Balance and even though I
have the Int/Sta gear I find I rarely switch out since my major HP
contribution comes from healing myself. I specced to Innervate for the
extra mana bar every 6 minutes and I specced Omen of Clarity for the extra
free heals pretty much every fight. I do have some Sta in my Int/Spi gear
setup but Int and Spi are a lot higher than Sta in my build.

For Ferals I'd say Sta/Str and after 1.7 Sta/Str/Agi would be the primary
stats. But since I don't use that build I'll leave it to Ferals to comment
on that further.

Hope that Helps and Happy Healing! :) 
Anonymous
September 10, 2005 3:17:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

Thomas J. Boschloo wrote:
> Moonfire has a high chance to break roots though. I believe it is better
> to use starfire after roots (on melee mobs).

Thats my experience too - but it does'nt bother me i just cast roots
again:c)
Anyway, when i attack it is in this order:
Wrath, and as soon the wrath has left my hands i root - they should hit
almost at the same time, FF, moonfire, starfire, root, starfire/wrath..
I seldom spam with moonfire.
Regards

Ding-Dong
├ślkusken - druid - Skullchrusher
Anonymous
September 12, 2005 3:04:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

When I was young (lvl 10) I've put all the druid's spells into an Excel
table. Here are the findings:
-Moonfire has the best damage/mana ratio, if you use DOT in full (wait
till DOT is over until casting next one).
-Starfire/wrath have about the same dmg/mana. If you don't put talens
in the Improved Wrath, then the last learned spell has the best DPS (at
lvl X, you learned wrath - it will have the best DPS until you'll learn
next starfire). With 5 points in Improved Wrath, wrath becomes the best
DPS than either starfire or moonfire.

Still, I have better DPS melee+moonfire than root+wrath.
Don't see any sense of casting FF in the sequence above.
I use starfare for opening only.
Anonymous
September 12, 2005 3:21:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

Do the math. The best trinkets give you like 2 mana/sec. It's nothing.
At the same time +80 spirit gives you 80/4 = 20/tick = 10mana/sec.
Even more important with innervate. With accent on spirit (spirit
around 200 at lvl 45) you get about 25mana/sec regen. Innervate gives
you 25*400%*20sec = 2000 mana. It's not even enough to replenish your
mana pool in full (should be about 2500 at this lvl). Without spirit,
you get 1500 mana after innervate.
Anonymous
September 12, 2005 3:24:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

Twinking out spirit in lieu of more critical stats like int and stam
for one spell that resets every 5 minutes Does-Not-Make-Sense.

Go with the higher int and stam and don't rely on the innervate to
refill your bar. Its great but its not useful when you're at 70% of the
mana and stam of the next guy.
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 6:56:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 08:45:22 +0200, "Christian Stauffer"
<wildcard666@bluewin.ch> wrote:

>For long fights, spirit is better than
>intellect, no matter whether one has innervate or not.

And by long fights I take it that you mean 3-4+ minutes?


If we forget innervate for a second, your mana regen outside of the 5
second rule is:
Regen per tick (2 seconds) = base-regen + spirit / 4

So you regen 1/8 mana per second per point of spirit - since you get
15 mana per int it takes 15 / (1/8) = 120 seconds for 1 spirit to give
you as much mana as 1 int - and this is if you stay out of the 5
second rule...

As a priest I can get a talent (meditation) that lets me keep 15% of
my regen while in the 5 second rule.
This means that I regen 1/8*0.15 = 0.01875 mana per second per spirit
while casting, and thus it takes 800 seconds = 13 minutes 20 seconds
for 1 spirit to produce as much mana as 1 int while casting.


**
Talent - Innervate
Increases the target's Mana regeneration by 400% and allows 100% of
the target's Mana regeneration to continue while casting. Lasts 20
seconds.
**
Of course if we pop innervate, then the mana regen goes up by 400% (so
it becomes 500% total), and it works while casting. This means that 1
spirit only needs 120 / 5 = 24 seconds to give the benefit of 1 int.
Of course, innervate only lasts 20 seconds - in that time 1 spirit
produces (1/8)*5*20 = 12.5 mana, and the last 2.5 mana takes 20
seconds of normal regen to get, so 40 seconds (only 20 have to be
outside 5 second rule) for 1 spirit to become equal to 1 int.



I agree with your assessment that stamina is low priority to a healer,
but only to a degree - some times a mob slips by and hits you, or they
pop some kind of area attack, so you should be able to survive a bit
of damage. Overall though, yes - healers are not tanks and they dont
need much health (paladins excepted).

However, in a one to one stat exchange situation I will pretty much
always chose the one int over the one spirit - having mana now is
almost always better than having a bit more in 2 minutes. Also, if you
have enough mana you rarely go oom anyway - even in the long fights.

Of course, most good healing gear has both int and spirit (at least
cloth - dunno about leather), so it is mostly a moot point anyway...
:) 


Ps. I resently heard about a bug/feature/strange behavior regarding
innervate + meditation. Apparently, innervate works by first setting
the casting regen too 100%, and then multiplying that by 5 - this
gives the result you would expect.
However, if you also have meditation, then your casting regen winds up
at 115%, and then that is multiplied by 5 - resulting in 575% mana
regen while casting. But if you stop casting and go out of the 5
second rule, then the 15% meditation bonus goes away, and you regen at
plain 500%.
So, if you are a priest with meditation and you get innervated by a
druid, you are best off by keeping casting through the 20 seconds so
you can get the extra 75% regen...

I haven't tested it myself, so don't kill me if it turns out to be
wrong.

--
Regards
Simon Nejmann
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 7:38:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

"Simon Nejmann" <snejmann@worldonline.dk> wrote:

> However, in a one to one stat exchange situation I will pretty much
> always chose the one int over the one spirit - having mana now is
> almost always better than having a bit more in 2 minutes.

You're right, my statement that "spirit is more important that
intellect" was wrong. However, I wouldn't want my spirit go under
about 75% of my int, primarily for innervate. I have seen fights
where I was able to use innervate twice (for a example a PvP duel
against a priest and taking down "The Razza" with 4 people). The 6
minute cooldown of innervate means I can use it every 2nd or 3rd
pull in UBRS (for example). To know that I can double my mana pool
when things go wrong is something that makes me feel more
comfortable than to have 20% more mana.

> Also, if you
> have enough mana you rarely go oom anyway - even in the long fights.

Depends on the length of a fight :-)

Basically, intellect "only" represents your max mana. Once you're oom,
it's not good for anything. I have no idea how long fights in MC take,
but if it's only half as heavy as what I heard, with all that healer
rotation and stuff, spirit will be important there.

> Of course, most good healing gear has both int and spirit (at least
> cloth - dunno about leather), so it is mostly a moot point anyway...
> :) 

Leather is mostly spirit/intellect (maybe due to the fact that the
only leather users who use healing gear are druids whose main stats
are intellect and spirit).

> Ps. I resently heard about a bug/feature/strange behavior regarding
> innervate + meditation. Apparently, innervate works by first setting
> the casting regen too 100%, and then multiplying that by 5 - this
> gives the result you would expect.
> However, if you also have meditation, then your casting regen winds up
> at 115%, and then that is multiplied by 5 - resulting in 575% mana
> regen while casting. But if you stop casting and go out of the 5
> second rule, then the 15% meditation bonus goes away, and you regen at
> plain 500%.
> So, if you are a priest with meditation and you get innervated by a
> druid, you are best off by keeping casting through the 20 seconds so
> you can get the extra 75% regen...
>
> I haven't tested it myself, so don't kill me if it turns out to be
> wrong.

I don't think that bug makes a lot of a difference, as you usually
can't stop healing when someone innervates you (as this would happen
in a battle that turned out to be difficult).

Chris

--
[WoW] Wildcard - Treehugging Tauren (60) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Lonewalker - Striding Tauren (21) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Jazrah - Brutal Troll (16) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Jivarr - Charming Troll (12) on EN Sunstrider [PvP]
Anonymous
September 13, 2005 8:04:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

On Tue, 13 Sep 2005 15:38:11 +0200, "Christian Stauffer"
<wildcard666@bluewin.ch> wrote:

>"Simon Nejmann" <snejmann@worldonline.dk> wrote:
>
>> However, in a one to one stat exchange situation I will pretty much
>> always chose the one int over the one spirit - having mana now is
>> almost always better than having a bit more in 2 minutes.
>
>You're right, my statement that "spirit is more important that
>intellect" was wrong. However, I wouldn't want my spirit go under
>about 75% of my int, primarily for innervate.

Well, here is a difference in perspective - Im a priest you are a
druid, that innervate makes spirit more usefull for you is a given.
Having said that however, I can't remember my stats right now, but I
think my spirit is pretty high up there along with int too - it is a
good stat for long fights, no doubt about that.

>I have seen fights
>where I was able to use innervate twice (for a example a PvP duel
>against a priest and taking down "The Razza" with 4 people). The 6
>minute cooldown of innervate means I can use it every 2nd or 3rd
>pull in UBRS (for example).

Hmm, I don't think I have even seen a "normal" fight last that long -
most bosses (Molten Core) go down in less than 10 minutes too. Of
course, Onyxia takes about 30-45 minutes of straight combat to down,
so... :) 

>Basically, intellect "only" represents your max mana. Once you're oom,
>it's not good for anything. I have no idea how long fights in MC take,
>but if it's only half as heavy as what I heard, with all that healer
>rotation and stuff, spirit will be important there.

Well, I hit 8-8.1k mana fully buffed, and I rarely go oom in Molten
Core anymore.

Of course, I also work on getting a Dancing Sliver with +20 spirit
enchant (result: 49 spirit staff) to pull out when the going gets
tough, and regen is needed.

--
Regards
Simon Nejmann
Anonymous
September 21, 2005 4:05:23 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.warcraft (More info?)

yozik wrote:
> When I was young (lvl 10) I've put all the druid's spells into an Excel
> table. Here are the findings:
> -Moonfire has the best damage/mana ratio, if you use DOT in full (wait
> till DOT is over until casting next one).
> -Starfire/wrath have about the same dmg/mana. If you don't put talens
> in the Improved Wrath, then the last learned spell has the best DPS (at
> lvl X, you learned wrath - it will have the best DPS until you'll learn
> next starfire). With 5 points in Improved Wrath, wrath becomes the best
> DPS than either starfire or moonfire.
> Still, I have better DPS melee+moonfire than root+wrath.
Looks fine, i will have a look see on that:c)

> Don't see any sense of casting FF in the sequence above.
> I use starfare for opening only.
I use it so that i wont forget it when its needed:c) - im sure it have
helped some times:c)
Regards

Ding-Dong
!