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Canon 20D review posted on dpreview

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Anonymous
November 8, 2004 3:54:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos20d/


Cheers,
Alan

-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
Anonymous
November 10, 2004 12:02:47 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Except it is missing leading as it doesn't mention any of the problems
people have had and are still having with it. Problems that so far Canon has
done nothing to fix. I don't call that a good review I call that good
marketing for Canon!

John


"Ken Ellis" <kenellis@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message
news:s540p0hdqo8ihf3ch8q9c9a7pdo1c870ek@4ax.com...
> On 8 Nov 2004 12:54:33 -0800, alan1browne@hotmail.com (Alan Browne)
> wrote:
>
>>http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canoneos20d/
>>
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Alan
>>
>>-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
>>-- [SI gallery]: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
>>-- [SI rulz]: http://www.aliasimages.com/si/rulz.html
>>-- e-meil: there's no such thing as a FreeLunch.
>
> Excellent review
>
> rgds
>
> Ken
Related resources
Anonymous
November 10, 2004 7:42:27 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:

> The remove and replace the battery thing is basically a hardware reset. I
> had this problem with my 20D. For anyone who changes lenses all the time, I
> imagine this would be a real inconvenience. Ask yourself how many times you
> would be likely to change a lens and if popping the battery when you do is
> going to be drama and you'll get to decide if the problem is trivial or not.
>
> I applied the Canon firmware upgrade - released a few days after the
> problem surfaced in the wild - and have nothing but praise for the
> camera.

Douglas, from your message is not clear if the firware upgrade solved the
problem with changing lenses. Do you still have the problem or is it gone
after the upgrade?

Bye, Dragan

--
Dragan Cvetkovic,

To be or not to be is true. G. Boole No it isn't. L. E. J. Brouwer

!!! Sender/From address is bogus. Use reply-to one !!!
Anonymous
November 10, 2004 7:49:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

What problems? How about some more information?

--
Colm


"John Doe" <john_doe@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:Xfakd.4352$_3.52572@typhoon.sonic.net...
> Except it is missing leading as it doesn't mention any of the problems
> people have had and are still having with it. Problems that so far Canon
has
> done nothing to fix. I don't call that a good review I call that good
> marketing for Canon!
Anonymous
November 10, 2004 10:07:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"Colm" <colmgall@gmail.com> writes:
> What problems? How about some more information?

A number of EOS 20D owners are reporting that the camera locks up at
random intervals - and need to be reset by removing and re-inserting
the battery.

Google for "20D lock-up" for more information.
--
- gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no - http://folk.uio.no/gisle/ ]
========================================================================
When you say you live in the real world, which one are you referring to?
Anonymous
November 11, 2004 1:54:35 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In message <q5oei57f28.fsf@viisi.ifi.uio.no>,
Gisle Hannemyr <gisle+njus@ifi.uio.no> wrote:

>"Colm" <colmgall@gmail.com> writes:
>> What problems? How about some more information?
>
>A number of EOS 20D owners are reporting that the camera locks up at
>random intervals - and need to be reset by removing and re-inserting
>the battery.
>
>Google for "20D lock-up" for more information.

Are there specific ranges of serial numbers involved?

I have taken about 1200 images with mine, with about 10 different lenses
plus TCs and extension tubes, and have not had a lockup yet. My 10D
would have locked up a couple of times by now.
--

<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
John P Sheehy <JPS@no.komm>
><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
Anonymous
November 11, 2004 2:20:24 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Lock ups, focus issues things like that. While not every is reporting
problems there are enough of them to be concerned. An honest review would
have mentioned the problems that have been reported by purchasers even if
the reviewer hasn't experienced any. Though now that the full review has
been done and the problems weren't mentioned it makes the whole thing more
suspect. For example since he wasn't honest from the start one has to wonder
if he did or didn't have problems and just decided not to mention them. With
him taking advertising money for ads on his site one has to really wonder
how honest he is.

John


"Colm" <colmgall@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2veuv6F2kjaamU1@uni-berlin.de...
> What problems? How about some more information?
>
> --
> Colm
>
>
> "John Doe" <john_doe@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:Xfakd.4352$_3.52572@typhoon.sonic.net...
>> Except it is missing leading as it doesn't mention any of the problems
>> people have had and are still having with it. Problems that so far Canon
> has
>> done nothing to fix. I don't call that a good review I call that good
>> marketing for Canon!
>
Anonymous
November 11, 2004 10:36:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Gisle Hannemyr wrote:
> "Colm" <colmgall@gmail.com> writes:
>
>>What problems? How about some more information?
>
>
> A number of EOS 20D owners are reporting that the camera locks up at
> random intervals - and need to be reset by removing and re-inserting
> the battery.
>
> Google for "20D lock-up" for more information.

The problem is when you change a lens, the camera still thinks it has
the old lens and refuses to light up. Specifically, Canon have opted to
leave the camera on all the time in a form of "sleep" mode. Much like
your TV, Computer etc. are when "switched off". The only side effect is
battery drain over a long period of time.

The remove and replace the battery thing is basically a hardware reset.
I had this problem with my 20D. For anyone who changes lenses all the
time, I imagine this would be a real inconvenience. Ask yourself how
many times you would be likely to change a lens and if popping the
battery when you do is going to be drama and you'll get to decide if the
problem is trivial or not.

I applied the Canon firmware upgrade - released a few days after the
problem surfaced in the wild - and have nothing but praise for the
camera. It defines colour gradation much better than the 10D. It meters
faster and more accurately than the 10D and the photos it produces are
more detailed than the 10D.

Oh, did I mention it's a better camera than the 10D?
You get the picture, surely?

Douglas
Anonymous
November 11, 2004 11:14:23 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Dragan Cvetkovic wrote:
> Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>
>>The remove and replace the battery thing is basically a hardware reset. I
>>had this problem with my 20D. For anyone who changes lenses all the time, I
>>imagine this would be a real inconvenience. Ask yourself how many times you
>>would be likely to change a lens and if popping the battery when you do is
>>going to be drama and you'll get to decide if the problem is trivial or not.
>>
>>I applied the Canon firmware upgrade - released a few days after the
>>problem surfaced in the wild - and have nothing but praise for the
>>camera.
>
>
> Douglas, from your message is not clear if the firware upgrade solved the
> problem with changing lenses. Do you still have the problem or is it gone
> after the upgrade?
>
> Bye, Dragan
>

The upgrade (which took all of 2 minutes to do) fixed the problem!

Douglas
Anonymous
November 11, 2004 12:52:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

John Doe wrote:
> Lock ups, focus issues things like that. While not every is reporting
> problems there are enough of them to be concerned. An honest review would
> have mentioned the problems that have been reported by purchasers even if
> the reviewer hasn't experienced any. Though now that the full review has
> been done and the problems weren't mentioned it makes the whole thing more
> suspect. For example since he wasn't honest from the start one has to wonder
> if he did or didn't have problems and just decided not to mention them. With
> him taking advertising money for ads on his site one has to really wonder
> how honest he is.
>
> John
>
>
Be that as it may...
Canon must have sold a few hundred thousand of these things by now. I
only ever got the problem with well used lenses or after using a well
used lens from a different manufacturer. Canon *might* consider the
problem so trivial as to pass over it. The cameras which do have that
problem are still totally functional in every other way and the problem
is fixed with a firmware upgrade taking a few minutes.

Of course you probably wouldn't ever have experienced these sort of
bugs. Using an abacus as you do instead of a computer running Windows!

I feel that DP review has in the past twisted reviews or published
reviews that are less than helpful to potential buyers. This is the way
of the world. Magazine publishers and the likes of dp review all make
their living from publishing advertisements. Any text in between those
ads is only 'bait' to entice you to read the ads.

Ask yourself this:
If you made a living from advertising cameras, would you print a bad
report about one of your major income streams that could seriously
impact your business? Well of course you would but you don't own
dpreview of a million dollar magazine, do you? If you want factual, no
hold back reviews... You'll have buy that camera yourself and publish
your findings.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 12, 2004 2:47:14 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Actually, if you read the reports the firmware upgrade didn't fix the
problems. People are still having problems. Besides we aren't talking about
Canon here we are talking about how honest and how trust worthy DPReview's
reviews are and at this stage he is just a marketing mouth piece for the
companies in question.

John


"Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2vfnhuF2l88jtU1@uni-berlin.de...
> John Doe wrote:
>> Lock ups, focus issues things like that. While not every is reporting
>> problems there are enough of them to be concerned. An honest review would
>> have mentioned the problems that have been reported by purchasers even if
>> the reviewer hasn't experienced any. Though now that the full review has
>> been done and the problems weren't mentioned it makes the whole thing
>> more suspect. For example since he wasn't honest from the start one has
>> to wonder if he did or didn't have problems and just decided not to
>> mention them. With him taking advertising money for ads on his site one
>> has to really wonder how honest he is.
>>
>> John
>>
>>
> Be that as it may...
> Canon must have sold a few hundred thousand of these things by now. I only
> ever got the problem with well used lenses or after using a well used lens
> from a different manufacturer. Canon *might* consider the problem so
> trivial as to pass over it. The cameras which do have that problem are
> still totally functional in every other way and the problem is fixed with
> a firmware upgrade taking a few minutes.
>
> Of course you probably wouldn't ever have experienced these sort of bugs.
> Using an abacus as you do instead of a computer running Windows!
>
> I feel that DP review has in the past twisted reviews or published reviews
> that are less than helpful to potential buyers. This is the way of the
> world. Magazine publishers and the likes of dp review all make their
> living from publishing advertisements. Any text in between those ads is
> only 'bait' to entice you to read the ads.
>
> Ask yourself this:
> If you made a living from advertising cameras, would you print a bad
> report about one of your major income streams that could seriously impact
> your business? Well of course you would but you don't own dpreview of a
> million dollar magazine, do you? If you want factual, no hold back
> reviews... You'll have buy that camera yourself and publish your findings.
>
> Douglas
Anonymous
November 12, 2004 2:31:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

John Doe wrote:
> Actually, if you read the reports the firmware upgrade didn't fix the
> problems. People are still having problems. Besides we aren't talking about
> Canon here we are talking about how honest and how trust worthy DPReview's
> reviews are and at this stage he is just a marketing mouth piece for the
> companies in question.
>
> John
>

>
Well the firmware upgrade fixed both my 20Ds and dpreview is no more or
less of a marketing mouthpiece than any camera magazine you can buy.

What is your problem exactly?
Did you buy a product they promoted and were dissapointed in it?
Do you have a 20D which was not fixed by a firmware upgrade?
No? Hmmm.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 13, 2004 2:15:29 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

But that is the clinker. They aren't a magazine.

John


"Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2viholF2lisg1U1@uni-berlin.de...
> John Doe wrote:
>> Actually, if you read the reports the firmware upgrade didn't fix the
>> problems. People are still having problems. Besides we aren't talking
>> about Canon here we are talking about how honest and how trust worthy
>> DPReview's reviews are and at this stage he is just a marketing mouth
>> piece for the companies in question.
>>
>> John
>>
>
>>
> Well the firmware upgrade fixed both my 20Ds and dpreview is no more or
> less of a marketing mouthpiece than any camera magazine you can buy.
>
> What is your problem exactly?
> Did you buy a product they promoted and were dissapointed in it?
> Do you have a 20D which was not fixed by a firmware upgrade?
> No? Hmmm.
>
> Douglas
Anonymous
November 13, 2004 1:47:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

I'm wondering if John is perhaps looking to shift some of the traffic that
DP review gets to someplace a little closer to home...

Al...

John Doe wrote:
> But that is the clinker. They aren't a magazine.
>
> "Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> What is your problem exactly?
>> Did you buy a product they promoted and were dissapointed in it?
>> Do you have a 20D which was not fixed by a firmware upgrade?
>> No? Hmmm.
Anonymous
November 13, 2004 6:37:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Great..cause i have one being shipped now. Do you know what ver. of
firmware is effected (eg. new cam may have newer firmware)

I am getting the kit with the 18-55 "s"lens. I'm seriously considering
gettin the 10-22 wide angle s lens.

I'm really looking forward to working with this cam. Any suggestions
on a moderately priced telephoto? I see many affordable tamron
70-300. In any event i appreciate your input

rgds

Ken

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 08:14:23 +1000, Douglas MacDonald
<technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Dragan Cvetkovic wrote:
>> Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:
>>
>>
>>>The remove and replace the battery thing is basically a hardware reset. I
>>>had this problem with my 20D. For anyone who changes lenses all the time, I
>>>imagine this would be a real inconvenience. Ask yourself how many times you
>>>would be likely to change a lens and if popping the battery when you do is
>>>going to be drama and you'll get to decide if the problem is trivial or not.
>>>
>>>I applied the Canon firmware upgrade - released a few days after the
>>>problem surfaced in the wild - and have nothing but praise for the
>>>camera.
>>
>>
>> Douglas, from your message is not clear if the firware upgrade solved the
>> problem with changing lenses. Do you still have the problem or is it gone
>> after the upgrade?
>>
>> Bye, Dragan
>>
>
>The upgrade (which took all of 2 minutes to do) fixed the problem!
>
>Douglas
Anonymous
November 14, 2004 9:51:20 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Ken Ellis wrote:
> Great..cause i have one being shipped now. Do you know what ver. of
> firmware is effected (eg. new cam may have newer firmware)
>
> I am getting the kit with the 18-55 "s"lens. I'm seriously considering
> gettin the 10-22 wide angle s lens.
>
> I'm really looking forward to working with this cam. Any suggestions
> on a moderately priced telephoto? I see many affordable tamron
> 70-300. In any event i appreciate your input
>
> rgds
>
> Ken
>
I have the same kit with a grip. Basically it's identical to the 10Ds
'pro kit'. I have many lenses left over from the 10D and earlier EOS
35mm. The firmware affected is 1.0 and some 1.02. The fix is 1.4 and higher.

My favourite zoom is a Sigma 100-300 f4 APO lens. It's resolving power
is at least equal to a 70~200 Canon f2.8 when used with a 1.4X extender.
A lot less money than a Canon lens too. I also use a 50mm 1.8 lens for
portraits. This lens is a little soft on my 20D but for portraits, it's
ideal.

You might find some focus problems with a new camera - any new camera in
that they do not always focus on the right place. Get yourself a back
focus chart and check it out once you get used to the camera. Canon will
fix it free and usually in a few days. Otherwise, the 20D is the one to
have.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 14, 2004 9:51:21 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 06:51:20 +1000, Douglas MacDonald
<technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Ken Ellis wrote:
>> Great..cause i have one being shipped now. Do you know what ver. of
>> firmware is effected (eg. new cam may have newer firmware)
>>
>> I am getting the kit with the 18-55 "s"lens. I'm seriously considering
>> gettin the 10-22 wide angle s lens.
>>
>> I'm really looking forward to working with this cam. Any suggestions
>> on a moderately priced telephoto? I see many affordable tamron
>> 70-300. In any event i appreciate your input
>>
>> rgds
>>
>> Ken
>>
>I have the same kit with a grip. Basically it's identical to the 10Ds
>'pro kit'. I have many lenses left over from the 10D and earlier EOS
>35mm. The firmware affected is 1.0 and some 1.02. The fix is 1.4 and higher.
>
>My favourite zoom is a Sigma 100-300 f4 APO lens. It's resolving power
>is at least equal to a 70~200 Canon f2.8 when used with a 1.4X extender.
>A lot less money than a Canon lens too. I also use a 50mm 1.8 lens for
>portraits. This lens is a little soft on my 20D but for portraits, it's
>ideal.
>
>You might find some focus problems with a new camera - any new camera in
>that they do not always focus on the right place. Get yourself a back
>focus chart and check it out once you get used to the camera. Canon will
>fix it free and usually in a few days. Otherwise, the 20D is the one to
>have.
>
>Douglas

Thanks alot again for the advice. The focus issue concerns me
most..just got the cam this afternoon...lotta reading to do.

rgds

Ken
Anonymous
November 14, 2004 3:00:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Ken Ellis <kenellis@nycap.rr.com> writes:
> Do you know what ver. of firmware is effected (eg. new cam may
> have newer firmware)

The version with an acknowledged problem was 1.0.4. The latest
version of the firmware is 1.0.5. There are mixed reports on whether
this fixes the problem or not - but the majority of those who has
upgraded from 1.0.4 to 1.0.5 reports that the "lock-up" problem is
gone.
--
- gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no - http://folk.uio.no/gisle/ ]
========================================================================
When you say you live in the real world, which one are you referring to?
Anonymous
November 14, 2004 3:02:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:
> The firmware affected is 1.0 and some 1.02. The fix is 1.4 and
> higher.

Please check your facts before posting. There is no 1.4 for the 20D.
The one with the problem was 1.0.4, and the fix is 1.0.5.
--
- gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no - http://folk.uio.no/gisle/ ]
========================================================================
When you say you live in the real world, which one are you referring to?
Anonymous
November 14, 2004 10:14:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On 14 Nov 2004 12:00:04 +0100, Gisle Hannemyr <gisle+njus@ifi.uio.no>
wrote:

>Ken Ellis <kenellis@nycap.rr.com> writes:
>> Do you know what ver. of firmware is effected (eg. new cam may
>> have newer firmware)
>
>The version with an acknowledged problem was 1.0.4. The latest
>version of the firmware is 1.0.5. There are mixed reports on whether
>this fixes the problem or not - but the majority of those who has
>upgraded from 1.0.4 to 1.0.5 reports that the "lock-up" problem is
>gone.

Hmm..well the new 20d has 1.0.4..so i guess i'll go look for the
upgrade..Thanks all for the info

rgds

Ken
Anonymous
November 15, 2004 9:48:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Gisle Hannemyr wrote:
> Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>>The firmware affected is 1.0 and some 1.02. The fix is 1.4 and
>>higher.
>
>
> Please check your facts before posting. There is no 1.4 for the 20D.
> The one with the problem was 1.0.4, and the fix is 1.0.5.

What is it about you Gisle that makes me so angry?
A typo and you just *have* to post a correction.
If you read my message properly you'd see I said 1.04 (corrected) and
higher. Have you got a testerone problem or something?

Douglas
Anonymous
November 15, 2004 10:00:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Ken Ellis wrote:
> On 14 Nov 2004 12:00:04 +0100, Gisle Hannemyr <gisle+njus@ifi.uio.no>
> wrote:
>
> Hmm..well the new 20d has 1.0.4..so i guess i'll go look for the
> upgrade..Thanks all for the info
>
> rgds
>
> Ken
>
Don't bother Ken... Yours is the fixed version. Gisle is just trolling
for my posts to look like it/he/she actually knows something relevant
(which it/he/she doesn't).

The fix is 1.04. They released 1.05 on the Internet because the version
rushed out for released to the public of 1.04 had a couple of bad
characters of code in it. Otherwise it's the same thing. Use this
advise: "Don't fix what ain't broke".

The "problem' was so insignificant. Caused by connecting different
lenses when the camera was powered down and not recognising the
different lens when it was powered up, that it didn't even rate a full
point of upgrade, just a fractional upgrade.

Gisle is a self styled expert at everything photography and computers.
The only problem he/it/she has is there is never any substance in any of
her/it's/his statements. Just ask about the interpolation fiasco
it/he/she got into a while ago.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 15, 2004 1:41:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:
> Gisle Hannemyr wrote:
>> Douglas MacDonald <technoaussie@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>>> The firmware affected is 1.0 and some 1.02. The fix is 1.4 and
>>> higher.

>> Please check your facts before posting. There is no 1.4 for the
>> 20D. The one with the problem was 1.0.4, and the fix is 1.0.5.

> What is it about you Gisle that makes me so angry?
> A typo and you just *have* to post a correction.
> If you read my message properly you'd see I said 1.04 (corrected) and
> higher. Have you got a testerone problem or something?

I am sorry to have made you angry, and I apologise for not doing my
homework in this case.

However, the reason I posted was /not/ to irritate you, but because
I'd just read several threads in the Canon forums on dpreview where
people reported that firmware ver. 1.0.4 were killing their 20D's.
I therefore was concerned, because believed there was a genuine
problem with this version.

As it turns out - the problem was with the update program, and
not the firmware as such.

Here is an excerpt from Canon press release on the matter - which I
should have read before I posted.

«It has been brought to our attention that the version 1.0.4 firmware
released on October 4 had a bug in the program that handles the
update. In cases where the update was performed with a lens attached
to the camera, there were situations in which the firmware could not
be updated correctly.

«In cases where the firmware was not updated correctly, the camera
might not power on, the camera might not communicate properly with
the lens and flash, or similar malfunctions might occur.

«Canon offers its sincerest apologies to customers who have been
inconvenienced by this situation.

«Even for customers who successfully updated to the version 1.0.4
firmware without incident, Canon recommends updating to the new
version 1.0.5 firmware for the sake of certainty.

«Please note that the actual firmware content of versions 1.0.4 and
1.0.5 is the same. If your EOS 20D already had the version 1.0.4
firmware when you purchased it, there is no problem with leaving it
as is.»

--
- gisle hannemyr [ gisle{at}hannemyr.no - http://folk.uio.no/gisle/ ]
========================================================================
When you say you live in the real world, which one are you referring to?
Anonymous
November 16, 2004 10:43:32 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Douglas MacDonald wrote:

> If you read my message properly you'd see I said 1.04 (corrected) and
> higher. Have you got a testerone problem or something

Learn how to spell a word before you post it to a newsgroup. The
correct spelling of the word you were attempting to use is TESTOSTERONE.
Anonymous
November 16, 2004 8:36:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

I don't know what you mean. I don't have a web site and the only problem I
have with dpreview is that his reviews are not be honest about potential
problems one might have with the product. Reviews are supposed to help
people make an informed choice, they can't do that when possible
problems/bugs aren't even mentioned. He spent more time talking about the
memory card door than the did about the bugs one might experience with the
camera. Just because he had no problems and just because not everyone has
had problems is not the point. About 10% of people have had problems and are
still having problems. This should have been mentioned.

A little criticism for Canon putting out a firmware update that actually
killed some peoples cameras was also do.

John
Anonymous
November 16, 2004 8:38:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

That isn't true. The 20D didn't ship with a 1.0 firmware. Even the beta
units sent to reviewers had the 1.02. All of the current firmware have
people reporting lockups including the 1.04 and 1.05. The problems have yet
to be fixed.

John


"Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2vna33F2mqm7fU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Ken Ellis wrote:
>> Great..cause i have one being shipped now. Do you know what ver. of
>> firmware is effected (eg. new cam may have newer firmware)
>>
>> I am getting the kit with the 18-55 "s"lens. I'm seriously considering
>> gettin the 10-22 wide angle s lens. I'm really looking forward to
>> working with this cam. Any suggestions
>> on a moderately priced telephoto? I see many affordable tamron
>> 70-300. In any event i appreciate your input
>>
>> rgds
>>
>> Ken
>>
> I have the same kit with a grip. Basically it's identical to the 10Ds 'pro
> kit'. I have many lenses left over from the 10D and earlier EOS 35mm. The
> firmware affected is 1.0 and some 1.02. The fix is 1.4 and higher.
>
> My favourite zoom is a Sigma 100-300 f4 APO lens. It's resolving power is
> at least equal to a 70~200 Canon f2.8 when used with a 1.4X extender. A
> lot less money than a Canon lens too. I also use a 50mm 1.8 lens for
> portraits. This lens is a little soft on my 20D but for portraits, it's
> ideal.
>
> You might find some focus problems with a new camera - any new camera in
> that they do not always focus on the right place. Get yourself a back
> focus chart and check it out once you get used to the camera. Canon will
> fix it free and usually in a few days. Otherwise, the 20D is the one to
> have.
>
> Douglas
Anonymous
November 17, 2004 11:09:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

EZD wrote:
> Douglas MacDonald wrote:
>
>
>>If you read my message properly you'd see I said 1.04 (corrected) and
>>higher. Have you got a testerone problem or something
>
>
> Learn how to spell a word before you post it to a newsgroup. The
> correct spelling of the word you were attempting to use is TESTOSTERONE.

If your post came from a person instead of someone hiding behind some
alphabetical soup, I might take you seriously. As it is you are just a
troll.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 17, 2004 11:29:29 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

John Doe wrote:
> That isn't true. The 20D didn't ship with a 1.0 firmware. Even the beta
> units sent to reviewers had the 1.02. All of the current firmware have
> people reporting lockups including the 1.04 and 1.05. The problems have yet
> to be fixed.
>
> John
>
Dear John Doe
Is that your real name by any chance?
My Australian bought 20D, purchased from the first shipment to arrive at
Photo Continental in Brisbane, did indeed come with version 1.0.1
firmware. It did indeed lockup if I changed lenses while the camera was
in sleep mode (off) and then I switched it on. The problem did not
happen if I changed lenses with the camera left on. It is a trivial problem.

I used the 1.0.4 firmware upgrade from Canon Japan's web site which I
downloaded about 1 hour after it was posted. The problem is fixed. Some
people reported their camera wouldn't boot after replacing the firmware
and Canon pulled the update off their site, replacing it later with
version 1.0.5. It is the installer, not the firmware upgrade which gave
problems and Canon do indeed ship cameras with 1.0.4 firmware and these
do not lock up with lens changes.

I know several people who probably should never have electronic goods,
much less try to upgrade them, tried to flash the firmware with flat
batteries, tried to flash the firmware by just putting the update on
every flash card they had and yet again, others who seem to think
instructions are for dickheads. These people also had problems... More
than just the genetic ones they inherited.

Quite clearly you do not have a 20D or you would not be making such
outrageous statements. Anyone who does have the problem after flashing
the firmware (properly) can avail themselves of Canon's 14 day, no
questions asked (world wide -I believe)replacement policy. And don't
tell me someone can own one of these cameras for 14 days and never
change a lens either.

So John Doe... You are just a bloody troll with no knowledge of the
problem, how it occurs or how it's fixed, aren't you? Why don't you try
speaking directly to someone who actually has a clue instead of posting
bullshit you got from other people's posts? All you and the other
posters with no first hand experience are doing is fanning smoke in the
hope of starting a fire.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 17, 2004 11:31:03 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

John Doe wrote:
> I don't know what you mean. I don't have a web site and the only problem I
> have with dpreview is that his reviews are not be honest about potential
> problems one might have with the product. Reviews are supposed to help
> people make an informed choice, they can't do that when possible
> problems/bugs aren't even mentioned. He spent more time talking about the
> memory card door than the did about the bugs one might experience with the
> camera. Just because he had no problems and just because not everyone has
> had problems is not the point. About 10% of people have had problems and are
> still having problems. This should have been mentioned.
>
> A little criticism for Canon putting out a firmware update that actually
> killed some peoples cameras was also do.
>
> John
>
>
Yeah... Wouldn't it be nice if you actually knew something about what
you post?

Douglas
Anonymous
November 17, 2004 6:45:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

John Doe <john_doe@nospam.com> wrote:
> About 10% of people have had problems and are still having
> problems.

You wouldn't mind telling us how you arrived at the 10% number,
would you?

-Wolfgang
Anonymous
November 19, 2004 12:12:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Mr. MacDonald I suggest you pull you head from the ass and take a breath.
You may not be having problems but I am and others are. Your ignorance only
makes you more an ass.

John


"Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:2vvcv8F2qqhtlU1@uni-berlin.de...
> John Doe wrote:
>> That isn't true. The 20D didn't ship with a 1.0 firmware. Even the beta
>> units sent to reviewers had the 1.02. All of the current firmware have
>> people reporting lockups including the 1.04 and 1.05. The problems have
>> yet to be fixed.
>>
>> John
>>
> Dear John Doe
> Is that your real name by any chance?
> My Australian bought 20D, purchased from the first shipment to arrive at
> Photo Continental in Brisbane, did indeed come with version 1.0.1
> firmware. It did indeed lockup if I changed lenses while the camera was in
> sleep mode (off) and then I switched it on. The problem did not happen if
> I changed lenses with the camera left on. It is a trivial problem.
>
> I used the 1.0.4 firmware upgrade from Canon Japan's web site which I
> downloaded about 1 hour after it was posted. The problem is fixed. Some
> people reported their camera wouldn't boot after replacing the firmware
> and Canon pulled the update off their site, replacing it later with
> version 1.0.5. It is the installer, not the firmware upgrade which gave
> problems and Canon do indeed ship cameras with 1.0.4 firmware and these do
> not lock up with lens changes.
>
> I know several people who probably should never have electronic goods,
> much less try to upgrade them, tried to flash the firmware with flat
> batteries, tried to flash the firmware by just putting the update on every
> flash card they had and yet again, others who seem to think instructions
> are for dickheads. These people also had problems... More than just the
> genetic ones they inherited.
>
> Quite clearly you do not have a 20D or you would not be making such
> outrageous statements. Anyone who does have the problem after flashing the
> firmware (properly) can avail themselves of Canon's 14 day, no questions
> asked (world wide -I believe)replacement policy. And don't tell me someone
> can own one of these cameras for 14 days and never change a lens either.
>
> So John Doe... You are just a bloody troll with no knowledge of the
> problem, how it occurs or how it's fixed, aren't you? Why don't you try
> speaking directly to someone who actually has a clue instead of posting
> bullshit you got from other people's posts? All you and the other posters
> with no first hand experience are doing is fanning smoke in the hope of
> starting a fire.
>
> Douglas
Anonymous
November 19, 2004 12:13:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Just read the posts on the the various forums.

John
Anonymous
November 19, 2004 11:32:33 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

John Doe wrote:
> Mr. MacDonald I suggest you pull you head from the ass and take a breath.
> You may not be having problems but I am and others are. Your ignorance only
> makes you more an ass.
>
> John
>
>

If what you say is true "John Doe". Why have you not taken your camera
back and had it replaced under Canon's 14 day replacement policy? Maybe
if you let someone know exactly what your problem is(the camera one I
mean), you might get some advise.

Anyone who has a problem with a Canon DSLR can have it replaced, any
time up to 14 days after buying it. Provided of course the "problem" is
not caused by another manufacturer's lens or accessory and can be
reproduced on request.

I'll bet there are plenty of jokers out there trying to make old Tamron
and Sigma lenses which never entirely worked with EOS cameras anyway,
work on 20Ds and lock them up. No warranty there.

Douglas
Anonymous
November 19, 2004 11:32:34 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

I have that was the first thing I did. The new one does the same thing.

John


"Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:304lt2F2rv8bfU1@uni-berlin.de...
> John Doe wrote:
>> Mr. MacDonald I suggest you pull you head from the ass and take a breath.
>> You may not be having problems but I am and others are. Your ignorance
>> only makes you more an ass.
>>
>> John
>>
>>
>
> If what you say is true "John Doe". Why have you not taken your camera
> back and had it replaced under Canon's 14 day replacement policy? Maybe if
> you let someone know exactly what your problem is(the camera one I mean),
> you might get some advise.
>
> Anyone who has a problem with a Canon DSLR can have it replaced, any time
> up to 14 days after buying it. Provided of course the "problem" is not
> caused by another manufacturer's lens or accessory and can be reproduced
> on request.
>
> I'll bet there are plenty of jokers out there trying to make old Tamron
> and Sigma lenses which never entirely worked with EOS cameras anyway, work
> on 20Ds and lock them up. No warranty there.
>
> Douglas
Anonymous
November 19, 2004 5:19:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"John Doe" <john_doe@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:aacnd.6093$_3.80206@typhoon.sonic.net...
> I have that was the first thing I did. The new one does the same
thing.

Your top-posting and lack of snipping makes it a bit difficult to
understand what remark you're responding to. However, assuming it was
about Canon's 14 day replacement policy, you seem to be either
unfortunate or the lens(es)/Battery pack cause the issue.

I've recently bought two 20Ds, and both do fine, you've tried two 20Ds
and both have problems. What's the pattern here? Also, you suggest in
other posts that you and others have post 1.05 problems, however I'm
unable to find them. Maybe you can point them out?

Sure there seem to be occasional lens contact errors (never
experienced one myself), but those are not related to the early
lock-up issue. Lens contact issues have existed forever, and they
always will. I do think there is a poor contact issue with the
optional Battery pack, but that's not firmware related either.

Bart

> "Douglas MacDonald" <technoaussie@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:304lt2F2rv8bfU1@uni-berlin.de...
SNIP
> > If what you say is true "John Doe". Why have you not taken your
camera
> > back and had it replaced under Canon's 14 day replacement policy?
Maybe if
> > you let someone know exactly what your problem is(the camera one I
mean),
> > you might get some advise.
[...]
Anonymous
November 20, 2004 10:31:18 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

The only lens I have is the EF-S 18-55 that came with the camera. If it has
problems with the body then again this is a Canon problem. One would only
expect problems with non Canon lenses because if Canon can't make the
products backwards compatible with their own lenses then they are trully
screwed.

As for the problems try the dpReview forums. There are good number of posts
their with people with the 1.05 firmware still having lock-ups.

John
Anonymous
November 20, 2004 4:32:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In message <apCnd.6398$_3.81919@typhoon.sonic.net>,
"John Doe" <john_doe@nospam.com> wrote:

>The only lens I have is the EF-S 18-55 that came with the camera. If it has
>problems with the body then again this is a Canon problem. One would only
>expect problems with non Canon lenses because if Canon can't make the
>products backwards compatible with their own lenses then they are trully
>screwed.
>
>As for the problems try the dpReview forums. There are good number of posts
>their with people with the 1.05 firmware still having lock-ups.

Maybe those cameras will need servicing. I have a 20D that came with
1.05 already installed, and have had no lockups after about 2000 images,
and scores of lens changes (about 12 different lenses). If it were to
start locking up about every 2000 images, I would consider that trivia.
dead batteries and full CF cards will cause many more lost shots than a
rare lockup.
--

<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
John P Sheehy <JPS@no.komm>
><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
!