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AMD trinity vs intel 4 gen

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March 2, 2013 10:54:42 AM

I will buy a pc in the end of june. So, intel, was the choice, but amd as sent a cpu with gpu, so, if i buy a similar card i can crossfire.

i'll play games like bf3 and i would like a good thing to later upgrade if needded. thank you

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March 2, 2013 6:53:23 PM

I am assuming you are referring to Haswell which is unreleased until Q3 and no real indication as to retail pricing but new socket and expected to cost more than Sandy/Ivy.

The question is can you wait? and what budget are you looking at?

To answer one of your issues, AMD AM3+ and FM2 will be carried over until at least after Steamroller which will be out in Q4 2013(Kaviri) and Q1 (Steamroller or AMD's 3rd generation Bulldozer microarchitecture after Zambezi and Vishera)

If you are looking for a good cheap build;

FM2

Athlon II x 4 750K or 740 (basically a Trinity without the Graphics SIMD enabled) $100 or $55
A8 5600K. $105
ASRock FM2A85X Extreme 6 $90
G.Skill Snipers Low Voltage DDR3 12800 2x4GB (for the Athlon) or RipJawsX 2133 if you want intergrated graphics on the A-Series parts. $55 or $65
Sapphire HD7850OC $165
Corsair CX500M $70
March 2, 2013 7:04:41 PM

sarinaide said:
I am assuming you are referring to Haswell which is unreleased until Q3 and no real indication as to retail pricing but new socket and expected to cost more than Sandy/Ivy.

The question is can you wait? and what budget are you looking at?

To answer one of your issues, AMD AM3+ and FM2 will be carried over until at least after Steamroller which will be out in Q4 2013(Kaviri) and Q1 (Steamroller or AMD's 3rd generation Bulldozer microarchitecture after Zambezi and Vishera)

If you are looking for a good cheap build;

FM2

Athlon II x 4 750K or 740 (basically a Trinity without the Graphics SIMD enabled) $100 or $55
A8 5600K. $105
ASRock FM2A85X Extreme 6 $90
G.Skill Snipers Low Voltage DDR3 12800 2x4GB (for the Athlon) or RipJawsX 2133 if you want intergrated graphics on the A-Series parts. $55 or $65
Sapphire HD7850OC $165
Corsair CX500M $70


my budget is about 700€. the lower the better (of couser lol)
and everyone tells me intel is the way to go, but amd is cheaper. i was looking for a intel, that is onld: core2: 4 cores 4 thereds and for 3ghz is not that bad. better than the one i have now. the gpu i would go for the nvidia gtx660, or, the 700 series same price when it cames to us. or, the 7870, is about the same price as the 660, so, i wouldnt go for the 7850.

first build would be:
i5 3570
asrock xtreme4
gtx660
8gb ram

but i would like to be able to upgrade, so, the new socket would be better, as i would like to buy latter a better cpu. but, if amd is the way to go, amd i shall go. so, with this said, what do you think?
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March 2, 2013 7:30:57 PM

Haswell will be officially announced in June. Therefore, it should be available for sale in June/July.

AMD's socket FM2 is decent if you plan on installing at best a Radeon HD 6670 for dual graphics setup. Anything faster will disable the integrated Radeon HD 7660D. The Radeon HD 8xxx may not be compatible with the Raden HD 7660D for dual graphics so once you replace the Radeon HD 6670, then you basically loose dual graphics capabilities.

Haswell's iGPU (Intel HD 4600) is expected to be only 20% more powerful than the Intel HD 4000 so that more or less places it about as powerful as the Radeon HD 7640D. And it will not "dual graphics" with any card. The main strength of Haswell will be the CPU core which is more powerful than the Trinity core.

Price is unknown. However, then Ivy Bridge CPUs were released Sandy Bridge CPUs drop $5 in price and Ivy Bridge CPUs were about $10 more than Sandy Bridge CPUs. If the same follows though with Haswell, then that basically means Haswell will likely cost $5 more and current Ivy Bridge CPUs.
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March 2, 2013 7:46:22 PM

Enderegg said:


first build would be:
i5 3570
asrock xtreme4
gtx660
8gb ram


Since you are going with the GTX 660, then you will not benefit from AMD's dual graphics capabilities in socket FM2.

Of the three different sockets: AM3+, FM2 and 1155; socket FM2 have the weakest CPU core. That means assuming you use the same GTX 660 in all 3 configurations, socket FM2 will give you the lowest FPS while socket 1155 will give you the highest FPS; generally speaking.

Going with the i5-3570k (I assume the "k" model and no the "vanilla" model) means you can overclock to improve performance. But you will not have any real upgrade path. If you tend to upgrade somewhat frequently, then going with Intel may not be the best choice, however, AMD's CPU performance is behind Intel's CPU performance for the vast majority of games. Will Steamroller catchup to Ivy Bridge? Maybe. Maybe not. If you buy Ivy Bridge, then you will get "Ivy Bridge performance". If you buy AMD's FX CPU, then you will get lower performance now and maybe "Ivy Bridge performance" (or better) in the future.

AMD has stated they committed to socket FX until 2015, but I believe I've read their A series APUs will switch over to socket FM3 when Kaveri is released (that after the upcoming Richland core).
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March 3, 2013 5:33:21 AM

jaguarskx said:
Haswell will be officially announced in June. Therefore, it should be available for sale in June/July.

AMD's socket FM2 is decent if you plan on installing at best a Radeon HD 6670 for dual graphics setup. Anything faster will disable the integrated Radeon HD 7660D. The Radeon HD 8xxx may not be compatible with the Raden HD 7660D for dual graphics so once you replace the Radeon HD 6670, then you basically loose dual graphics capabilities.

Haswell's iGPU (Intel HD 4600) is expected to be only 20% more powerful than the Intel HD 4000 so that more or less places it about as powerful as the Radeon HD 7640D. And it will not "dual graphics" with any card. The main strength of Haswell will be the CPU core which is more powerful than the Trinity core.

Price is unknown. However, then Ivy Bridge CPUs were released Sandy Bridge CPUs drop $5 in price and Ivy Bridge CPUs were about $10 more than Sandy Bridge CPUs. If the same follows though with Haswell, then that basically means Haswell will likely cost $5 more and current Ivy Bridge CPUs.


1) I run FM2's a A8-5600K/7870LE and a Athlon II x 4 750K/7870 and both play BF3 64 player maps with the same level and eyecandy I had with my 1100T and 8150 still well above the 65FPS mark, which is about 7FPS less than what the above mentioned parts achieved and 8 less than the 3770K, make no mistake that just because its cost efficient doesn't mean it cannot game using high end discrete cards. If AMD intended it to only work with designated dual graphics cards they would have limited the functionality to such instead $100 FM2 boards feature 3 way support and CFX and SLI at 8x8 speeds and it actually does a good job. While the absence of L3 does result in a moderate loss of frames, the A-Series and Athlons actually have much faster L2 than Zambezi, Vishera, Thuban and Deneb so all in all actually mitigate the loss.

I agree there is more benefit to going FX or core i, but the FM2 platform is very feature rich at a extremely low cost, you basically get $300-500 features crammed onto at most expensive $120


2)Haswell's GT3 is the equivilant of a mid level llano/trinity at around 4 times the cost to produce and will only feature on the high end i7 and i5's representing a waste of time and resources. It will still be slower than the llano A8 3500/3870's HD6550D and around 15% slower than the Trinity 7660D and another 15% slower than Richland.

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March 3, 2013 5:38:24 AM

Enderegg said:
my budget is about 700€. the lower the better (of couser lol)
and everyone tells me intel is the way to go, but amd is cheaper. i was looking for a intel, that is onld: core2: 4 cores 4 thereds and for 3ghz is not that bad. better than the one i have now. the gpu i would go for the nvidia gtx660, or, the 700 series same price when it cames to us. or, the 7870, is about the same price as the 660, so, i wouldnt go for the 7850.

first build would be:
i5 3570
asrock xtreme4
gtx660
8gb ram

but i would like to be able to upgrade, so, the new socket would be better, as i would like to buy latter a better cpu. but, if amd is the way to go, amd i shall go. so, with this said, what do you think?


Its a good build but the HD7870 is a better card than the 660 rather go that route then.

FX 6300
Gigabyte 990FX UD3R
Crucial Ballistix Tracers DDR3 1866
HD7870 Myst/GTX 660
Good 500w+ PSU

The intel build is very good to but you will be locked into socket 1155 so no upgrade path.
March 3, 2013 10:39:36 AM

sarinaide said:
Its a good build but the HD7870 is a better card than the 660 rather go that route then.

FX 6300
Gigabyte 990FX UD3R
Crucial Ballistix Tracers DDR3 1866
HD7870 Myst/GTX 660
Good 500w+ PSU

The intel build is very good to but you will be locked into socket 1155 so no upgrade path.


cant find the mobo in amazon uk..
March 3, 2013 11:08:36 AM

hey guys,
can you buy dell optiplex 760, this is the best pcs for playing games its built in vga card is 256 with 64 bits i like it
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March 3, 2013 11:58:44 AM

If you are building at the end of june don't think about it until then as prices will change and new products release.
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March 3, 2013 1:57:17 PM

Enderegg said:
cant find the mobo in amazon uk..


Try the 990FXA UD3 or the UD5 which is a good board. Alternatively the MSI 990FX GD80 or ASUS M599X Evo v2
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March 3, 2013 5:22:15 PM

sarinaide said:

I agree there is more benefit to going FX or core i, but the FM2 platform is very feature rich at a extremely low cost, you basically get $300-500 features crammed onto at most expensive $120


2)Haswell's GT3 is the equivilant of a mid level llano/trinity at around 4 times the cost to produce and will only feature on the high end i7 and i5's representing a waste of time and resources. It will still be slower than the llano A8 3500/3870's HD6550D and around 15% slower than the Trinity 7660D and another 15% slower than Richland.


Stating that a socket FM2 APU has $300 - $500 worth of components crammed into one little chip is a bit of an exaggeration. The integrated Radeon HD 7660D in the A10-5800k is less powerful than a desktop Radeon HD 6570 which sells for around $60; it's performance is about 80% of the Radeon HD 6570. The closest AMD CPU that is equivalent in terms of the number of cores and clockspeed is the FX-4300 which sells for about $120. However the FX-4300 is slightly more powerful. So at most the A10-5800k would worth $120 + $60 * 8-% = $168. But the A10-5800k sells for about $130.


To the best of my knowledge, GT3 is only going to be in mobile Haswell CPUs. The desktop versions of Haswell will only get GT1 and GT2 (Intel HD 4600). Presumably, there will be three GT3 models in the mobile CPUs; Intel HD 5200, HD 5100 and HD 5000. Unlike in Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge CPUs where all iGPUs were simply called Intel HD 3000 or HD 4000 regardless of the actual clockspeed. This time around it seems Intel will make it a little easier to differentiate the performance of the mobile iGPU.
March 3, 2013 5:38:06 PM

jaguarskx said:
Stating that a socket FM2 APU has $300 - $500 worth of components crammed into one little chip is a bit of an exaggeration. The integrated Radeon HD 7660D in the A10-5800k is less powerful than a desktop Radeon HD 6570 which sells for around $60; it's performance is about 80% of the Radeon HD 6570. The closest AMD CPU that is equivalent in terms of the number of cores and clockspeed is the FX-4300 which sells for about $120. However the FX-4300 is slightly more powerful. So at most the A10-5800k would worth $120 + $60 * 8-% = $168. But the A10-5800k sells for about $130.


To the best of my knowledge, GT3 is only going to be in mobile Haswell CPUs. The desktop versions of Haswell will only get GT1 and GT2 (Intel HD 4600). Presumably, there will be three GT3 models in the mobile CPUs; Intel HD 5200, HD 5100 and HD 5000. Unlike in Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge CPUs where all iGPUs were simply called Intel HD 3000 or HD 4000 regardless of the actual clockspeed. This time around it seems Intel will make it a little easier to differentiate the performance of the mobile iGPU.


Só, in other words...
Now I'm thinking to buy fx 8320 (then oc), with 990fxa d3
I think that's the best price / performance
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March 3, 2013 5:53:06 PM

Yeah, that should work. The FX-8320 is not a lot less expensive than the FX-8350, but it has pretty good overclocking results. I've seen people who stated they were able to get up to 4.8GHz, but your actual result will differ.

Just be sure to get a good heatsink and a good power supply for overclocking. AMD CPUs are power hungry, and that's before you start overclocking.
March 3, 2013 5:57:21 PM

jaguarskx said:
Yeah, that should work. The FX-8320 is not a lot less expensive than the FX-8350, but it has pretty good overclocking results. I've seen people who stated they were able to get up to 4.8GHz, but your actual result will differ.

Just be sure to get a good heatsink and a good power supply for overclocking. AMD CPUs are power hungry, and that's before you start overclocking.



I'll get a 600w corsair
I went to the gigabyte website and it doesn't say how many power states it has. Can that mobo over clock that cpu?
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March 4, 2013 5:11:13 AM

jaguarskx said:
Stating that a socket FM2 APU has $300 - $500 worth of components crammed into one little chip is a bit of an exaggeration. The integrated Radeon HD 7660D in the A10-5800k is less powerful than a desktop Radeon HD 6570 which sells for around $60; it's performance is about 80% of the Radeon HD 6570. The closest AMD CPU that is equivalent in terms of the number of cores and clockspeed is the FX-4300 which sells for about $120. However the FX-4300 is slightly more powerful. So at most the A10-5800k would worth $120 + $60 * 8-% = $168. But the A10-5800k sells for about $130.


To the best of my knowledge, GT3 is only going to be in mobile Haswell CPUs. The desktop versions of Haswell will only get GT1 and GT2 (Intel HD 4600). Presumably, there will be three GT3 models in the mobile CPUs; Intel HD 5200, HD 5100 and HD 5000. Unlike in Sandy Bridge and Ivy Bridge CPUs where all iGPUs were simply called Intel HD 3000 or HD 4000 regardless of the actual clockspeed. This time around it seems Intel will make it a little easier to differentiate the performance of the mobile iGPU.


A10 5800K dropped to $110. Its designed premised on entry level computing, there is no iGPU comparison to it and very capable of medium setting gaming at respectable resolutions. Diablo 3 managed to game at full settings at 1920x1080 at much higher frame rates than intel can muster up. Most people buying a Trinity will use it for casual gaming, multimedia, HTPC, its iGPU is far and beyond anything in its league and the A85 Hudson socket is better than most intel Z77 boards in terms of features and quality. if a person is wanting a sub $400 setup this is far and beyond the best you can get by a long shot.

My next point is that people say it cannot game with discrete graphics but we tested it with the fastest HD7970 and it managed above 60FPS across the board including a 43 minute BF3 64 player map Fraps recording with a lot of GPU stressing and eyecandy. To achieve that shows that the A series is not some kiddy processor that cannot do a job when needed. Handled 2 way 7850's pretty well as well.

Lastly the OP made the right choice going for the FX 8350, I was just offering experiences I have had with FM2, but ultimately his choice is the smart one.
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