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Super new gaming rig, to last a decade, with future upgrades

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October 22, 2012 10:49:55 PM

EDIT: No: 1
changed video Card

removed:
Sound CARD,

stick with ram, future CPU cooler up grade maybe a water unit


Approximate Purchase Date: 2 – 3 months

Budget Range: $2000 AU After Shipping

System Usage from Most to Least Important: gaming, surfing the internet,

Are you buying a monitor: Yes

Parts to Upgrade: ALL

Do you need to buy OS: Yes

Preferred Website(s) for Parts: http://www.scorptec.com.au

Location: Australia, Melbourne

Parts Preferences: NIL

Overclocking: Maybe

SLI or Crossfire: Maybe

Your Monitor Resolution: 1920x1080

Additional Comments: I would like a quiet PC. BF2, Bf3, upgradeable, overclock-able for 10 years

And Most Importantly, Why Are You Upgrading: 10 year old PC, single core P4 CPU with 256mb AGP video card, starting to slow down...:) 

Intel Core i5 3570K
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/45512-bx80637i53570...

Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD3H Motherboard
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/45494-ga-z77x-ud3h

G.Skill F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM 8GB Kit (2x4GB) 1600Mhz DDR3
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/40622-f3-12800cl8d-...

OCZ 256GB Agility 4 SATA III 2.5" SSD
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/46189-agt4-25sat3-2...

Western Digital WD1002FAEX 1TB Caviar Black HDD
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/36727-wd1002faex

CoolerMaster Storm Enforcer Case
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/41147-sgc-1000-kwn1

Asus DRW-24B5ST DVD Burner
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/46436-drw-24b5st

Gigabyte Radeon HD7950 WindForce, 3GB
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/44615-gv-r795wf3-3g...

Gigabyte Geforce GTX660 Ti Overclocked, 2GB
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/47341-gv-n66toc-2gd


Asus Xonar DG soundcard
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/38960-xonar-dg


Antec High Current Gamer 750w PSU
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/39376-hcg-750

BenQ 24 Inch Widescreen LED Gaming Monitor
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/47763-rl2450h

Microsoft Win7 Pro SP1, 64bit OEM
http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/40518-fqc-04725

Thankyou
October 24, 2012 11:01:39 AM

Very good, with a couple of minor observations. I see you haven't included an aftermarket cooler, at this stage. If you intend to do so later, to facilitate overclocking of CPU, I recommend you use low profile RAM, such as Corsair's CML series. That will ensure your choices, for cooler, are not limited, by the height of the RAM.
I very much doubt that, unless you are a real audiophile, you will need a sound card. The onboard sound of motherboard is quite good, in itself. Recommend you, initially, leave that until you hear the onboard sound. If you find onboard is not good enough for YOU, you may wish to get even better sound card.
You could always put what you save towards a Gigabyte GTX670. Mind you, their 660Ti is also pretty good.
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October 24, 2012 8:51:15 PM

That's an excellent start. Future proofing is a moot point - the only way to truly future proof a build is that you don't want to limit any long term expansion plans. These would be my suggestions:

1. Get a Vertex 4 instead of an Agility 4.

2. The sound card isn't needed - you can drop that.

3. Unless you need the extra RAM capacity (for gaming you don't), or you need access to the extra networking features, you don't need Windows 7 Pro. You can use Home Premium and be fine.

4. Don't get the aforementioned Corsair XMS series. Get this instead: http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/45017

5. By dropping the sound card you can upgrade your GPU to a Radeon 7950: http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/44618
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October 24, 2012 8:56:08 PM

Good advice there. I'll just be devil's advocate and say it's gonna last 3 years tops without a major overhaul.
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Best solution

October 24, 2012 9:05:08 PM

I'd suggest atleast GTX 670 and / or Radeon 7970 GHz ED. I would strongly go against anything bellow these if you are looking to have this system last as long as possible.
The 660 ti has half the memory bandwidth and that is compounded if you SLI compared to the GTX 670 so for the upgrade and future upgrade I'd really recommend stepping it up to the next level.

At stock clocks these cards will last 1-2 years, then you can overclock then further. if you go with something lower as others suggest, you'll end up overclocking it sooner to match the above mentioned higher end cards and thus need upgrades even sooner.
Though FinneousPJ came in as the devil's advocate, I'll have to agree that there wont be a single system you'll end up with that will last 5+ years let alone 10. Anything you make now will be obsolete by gaming standards by the end of 5 years. So get the most out of your system now while you can and have it stretch as long as possible.


Drop the sound card-
replace the MB with this : http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/45270-z77-extreme4
use the saved money and get a step up on the GPU such as I mentioned.
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October 24, 2012 9:25:11 PM

Apropo said:
I'd suggest atleast GTX 670 and / or Radeon 7970 GHz ED. I would strongly go against anything bellow these if you are looking to have this system last as long as possible.
The 660 ti has half the memory bandwidth and that is compounded if you SLI compared to the GTX 670 so for the upgrade and future upgrade I'd really recommend stepping it up to the next level.

At stock clocks these cards will last 1-2 years, then you can overclock then further. if you go with something lower as others suggest, you'll end up overclocking it sooner to match the above mentioned higher end cards and thus need upgrades even sooner.
Though FinneousPJ came in as the devil's advocate, I'll have to agree that there wont be a single system you'll end up with that will last 5+ years let alone 10. Anything you make now will be obsolete by gaming standards by the end of 5 years. So get the most out of your system now while you can and have it stretch as long as possible.


Drop the sound card-
replace the MB with this : http://www.scorptec.com.au/computer/45270-z77-extreme4
use the saved money and get a step up on the GPU such as I mentioned.


Yeah but you have to take into mind USD = AUD conversion rates. Any decent 7970 model is going to run you a good $650 AUD. You have to make some *MAJOR* changes to the build in order to get one. It's entirely possible though.
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October 24, 2012 9:26:24 PM

ewww conversion >_<
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October 24, 2012 10:54:01 PM

FinneousPJ said:
Good advice there. I'll just be devil's advocate and say it's gonna last 3 years tops without a major overhaul.

Depending on the OP's needs, it can last 10 years like their current P4 system.
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October 24, 2012 11:57:51 PM

KenwoodGT said:
Depending on the OP's needs, it can last 10 years like their current P4 system.


I wouldn't say that long - maybe 5 - 6 years before the motherboard is due for an upgrade.
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October 25, 2012 12:05:32 AM

g-unit1111 said:
I wouldn't say that long - maybe 5 - 6 years before the motherboard is due for an upgrade.



It can last that long if you're too cheap to upgrade sooner. :p 
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October 25, 2012 12:32:29 AM

KenwoodGT said:
It can last that long if you're too cheap to upgrade sooner. :p 

I really can't stand it when people make an argument for the sake of NOTHING....

I have a f'ing commadore 64 that still works it doesn't make it relivent at all.... Saying that a system you build now is going to last 10 years is unrealistic and naive. Just because someone can make a system WORK doesn't mean it is worth using 10 years down the road.
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October 25, 2012 12:41:30 AM

Apropo said:
I really can't stand it when people make an argument for the sake of NOTHING....

I have a f'ing commadore 64 that still works it doesn't make it relivent at all.... Saying that a system you build now is going to last 10 years is unrealistic and naive. Just because someone can make a system WORK doesn't mean it is worth using 10 years down the road.


I wasn't arguing. I also didn't say that it would still be worth using 10 years down the road. I said that the OP may be too cheap to upgrade in 3-5 years because he said he wants a computer to last 10 years, and I deduced that he wouldn't be upgrading anytime soon (after this new computer) because he's still using his Pentium 4 system from 10 years ago.

Just because someone says they want a computer to last 10 years does not mean that they mean the computer will last 10 years. Want is different than need/will.

I'll assume you knew that.

OP: If you go with a high end GPU (GTX 670/7970), you'll probably be wanting to upgrade the GPU in 3-5 years, or until it dies.
Edit - Haswell's going to be released in a couple of months, it's best to wait until then to get "Super New" from Intel.
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October 25, 2012 1:21:15 AM

KenwoodGT said:
It can last that long if you're too cheap to upgrade sooner. :p 


True, true. :lol: 
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October 25, 2012 3:18:45 AM

The sound card is actually a very good sound card if you listen to headphones. Can power up to 150ohm headphones and has dolby headphone if you care about that kind of thing.

I picked one up along with my superlux hd668b with some help narrowing things down on head-fi. Was probably the best investment I had ever done in my computer. For me total price was around 70-80 usd and it hits well above the price I paid in audio quality.

So if you wanted headphone amp and good sound quality on the cheap keep the Asus Xonar DG, and than go to head-fi and talk to them about what kind of headphones you should pick up. You don't know what your missing if you don't own a decent pair of headphones trust me on this.

Now onto the computer:
Now that is out of the way. If you overclock I can almost guarantee you won't get 10yr lifespan out of the parts. The reason is this two things kill computer parts in general, heat and voltage. But voltage creates heat, in order to overclock we generally pump more voltage into parts AND tune up the frequency in which the parts run at. Both of which create heat, and while we can keep that under control to an extent overall we are generally killing our components faster than stock components.

There is also expecting parts to last this long, the avg life span of electrical components such as this is already around 10 years at stock. Overclocking like I said will cut into that, how much I can't say. But in general when I do overclocks I like to overclock to the point where I keep the voltage down the most I can till I get a point where I have to increase it drastically to get to the next bump in performance than back off a bit. For me 3.0ghz was my stopping point on my e2180 as to reach 3.1ghz I had to increase voltage significantly at which point I viewed it as cutting into the life of the CPU too much and would raise heat levels as well.

I think the more realistic thing to do is to build a computer now with a budget of 1200-1400 and do a mild overclock. And to buy things like a blu ray burner, your sound card, and a good case now. And than in 5 years or when you feel like it do a upgrade while still using the parts you can transfer over (blu ray, case, etc) and just upgrade what is neccary with the money you put away from this first build and possibly whatever else you felt like scraping together.

You will probably end up still getting a large amount of the performance of what you can from building at this time, and than you get another large performance boost in a few years when the computer feels a bit sluggish compared to what is currently out.
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October 25, 2012 5:29:59 AM

About the only hardware that is going to last you a decade without being horribly outdated is the case :)  I mean -- just think what kind of hardware was out there in 2002! 10 years is an eternity in pcgaming or just computers in general! Looks like a great build though!
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October 25, 2012 5:37:00 AM

A good "future proofed" system should have:

-BluRay
-Thunderbolt
-PCI Express 3.0
-SSD
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October 25, 2012 6:59:21 PM

nstiver said:
About the only hardware that is going to last you a decade without being horribly outdated is the case :)  I mean -- just think what kind of hardware was out there in 2002! 10 years is an eternity in pcgaming or just computers in general! Looks like a great build though!


Can't really argue there. Switching the hardware from one case to another isn't that difficult though.

Quote:
A good "future proofed" system should have:

-BluRay
-Thunderbolt
-PCI Express 3.0
-SSD


BD-R is debatable. Everything is going online now and the days of optical drives are coming to an end. Optical is the new floppy.

Thunderbolt and SSD I definitely agree with. PCI 3.0 won't be fully utilized for a couple more years at least.
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October 25, 2012 8:53:24 PM

I put PCIe 3.0 because if a system should be "future proofed", then it should be capable of the latest PCI Express technology.

Rethinking the BD-R, I guess it would only be useful if the OP plans on working with BluRay stuff.
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October 25, 2012 9:51:19 PM

KenwoodGT said:
I put PCIe 3.0 because if a system should be "future proofed", then it should be capable of the latest PCI Express technology.

Rethinking the BD-R, I guess it would only be useful if the OP plans on working with BluRay stuff.


Yeah I only include BD-R if specifically requested by the OP. Otherwise it's pointless to have them anymore.
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October 25, 2012 10:51:04 PM

Great posts, starting to get there...

@ malbluff

Thx,
ill get a cooler when i overclock 2-3 years, i will monitor temps till then
I will get low profile ram, ill look at the options today.
droping the sound card till i hear it is a no brainer, thx
will look at the gtx670 v 660ti "g-unit1111" pointed out the Radeon 7950

@ g-unit1111

Thankyou,

Vertex 4 instead of an Agility 4, there is big price difference, alot of reviews say the performance difference is not much for all the SSD's, just get anyone.

I wont get the sound card

Windows 7 Pro, i want to be able to run my old programs in XP mode, i believe i need PRO to do that..

The RAM, thx ill check the options out today very good info

The Radeon 7950, 3GB card looks great, and cheaper, will looking to the 670 v 7950,

Future proofing is a moot point, but valid, my 10 year old PC was top of the range when i got it, the only thing that is original now is the motherboard, ram and case. I have upgraded everything possible & overclocked that to the max, I even cut holes in the case for extra fans. 2,000 new plus around $500 worth the upgrades at the around the 4 year mark.

FinneousPJ
thx,
3 years sound about right, a couple of GPU side by side and a new CPU cooler and overclock will give her a kick :) 

@ Apropo

Thx,

the Radeon 7970 GHz ED is expensive, the 660 ti memory bandwidth sounds like a problem, i will look at the GTX670 & the ATI7950,

I now i will be pushing for 10 years, if im prepared to drop graphs down it maybe possable, im playing now with low setting and only 30fps

The ASRock Z77 Extreme4 Motherboard, i did see that in a TOM's review, i pulled towards the Gigabyte because it was the same brand as the GPU i was looking at. whats you thought on that, should i try and match brands where possible ?

@ Kenwoodgt

thx, LOL your 100% correct, it can make it last i can be very cheap, I understand the new probably wont play the latest games in 7 years time because gaming manufacturers will set there minimum requirement to high.

@ assasin32

Thx,
I have heard good thing about sound, just as you say, i will see what it is like with out, maybe a sound card and headset could be on the birthday list for next year. I will leave that out for now though.


ill will keep voltages down when i do overclock and keep it cool.

Got 2,000 to spend and im not gunna go any lower or higher,

BluRay i don't use it now, it can be plugged in later as a upgrade,


@ Kenwoodgt

Thx,

this is a full PCI Express 3.0 system isnt it

Thunderbolt what is it.. is it really necessary, i will search thx



Great info, i will update the OP later, a little more research.









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October 25, 2012 10:56:32 PM

matching brands is a personal choice. I did it with my motherboard and GPU.
I love the sturdy quality feel of gigabyte boards and products.

I hope some of the research I passed on to you helps you in choosing the best for your wants / needs.
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October 25, 2012 11:35:45 PM

SOMNIA said:



@ Kenwoodgt

Thx,

this is a full PCI Express 3.0 system isnt it

Thunderbolt what is it.. is it really necessary, i will search thx



Thunderbolt is a new interface that's MUCH faster than USB 3.0 and it's just arriving on Windows PCs. I know Gigabyte makes a handful of Thunderbolt motherboards.

Apple had Thunderbolt first (they had a little agreement with Intel to exclusively have the technology for like a year and a half I think). They did a pretty good job explaining it on their website, it's the same thing for PCs. http://www.apple.com/thunderbolt/

Edit - Intel has a handy webpage showing off Thunderbolt. http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/io/thunderbolt/t...
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October 25, 2012 11:42:54 PM

When considering between Radeon and GTX graphics, Radeon, at the high end, are generally better value, across a broad range of games. However, some games, including BF3, mentioned by OP, favour nVidia, and in those games (others include Borderlands, Starcraft and Portal) GTX cards tend to be better value.
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October 26, 2012 1:27:20 AM

malbluff said:
When considering between Radeon and GTX graphics, Radeon, at the high end, are generally better value, across a broad range of games. However, some games, including BF3, mentioned by OP, favour nVidia, and in those games (others include Borderlands, Starcraft and Portal) GTX cards tend to be better value.



thx,

Update OP,

Bugger lol. thought i had it, your right again, im thinking BF4 will be my next game if they make it like BF2 with commanders and the bf2 squad setup. anyway i know it will be on the same engine as BF3, gtx670 is $110 more , ATI is 1GB more memory.. but the 670 smashes BF3

ill check the BF3 forums

ill also add the $ up,

im down to the 670 v 7950
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October 26, 2012 1:42:48 AM

I doubt you need more than 2GB of memory on the GPU.

BF3 seems to like NVIDIA cards more (as previously said by malbluff), maybe the 670 is right for you. :) 
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October 26, 2012 2:24:36 AM

SOMNIA said:
thx,

Update OP,

Bugger lol. thought i had it, your right again, im thinking BF4 will be my next game if they make it like BF2 with commanders and the bf2 squad setup. anyway i know it will be on the same engine as BF3, gtx670 is $110 more , ATI is 1GB more memory.. but the 670 smashes BF3

ill check the BF3 forums

ill also add the $ up,

im down to the 670 v 7950



I'm currently playnig BF3 ultra settings, I have my GTX Windforce 670 Gigabyte card overclocked @ 1.25Ghz and since my Monitor is 60Hz I have the Frames locked to 60Hz. I barely ever see my FPS drop bellow 50FPS. In the future when my system starts to feel its age, I'll just drop another of the same card in and gain %50, which I already tested since we have 2 of them in the house ^_^. I benched my system with 3Dmark 11 and graphics scored higher then a GTX 680 with the same system but barely lower then overall system score.

People I play with in BF3 have 7970s Ghz ED and GTX 680's and nearly all of them wish they would have saved and went with the 670. Go figure ^_^
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November 27, 2012 6:03:55 AM

New Rig just ordered, should run BF2

Thanyou to everyone for there assistance,

Special thx to TOMS HARDWARE, this system is all built using all your reviews and recommendations.

CPU Intel - BX80637I53570K
Description: Intel Core i5 3570K (3.40Ghz / 6MB / LGA1155 / Quad Core, Overclocking Enabled)
Motherboard Gigabyte - GA-Z77X-UD3H
Description: Gigabyte GA-Z77X-UD3H MB, Z77, 4x DDR3, 2x PCI-E3.0 x 16, 4x SATA3, 8x USB3.0, HDMI, DP, D-Sub, DVI-D, 7.1CH, GBLAN, RAID, CrossFireX, SLI, ATX
Memory G.Skill - F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM
Description: G.Skill 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 Kit, PC-12800 (1600Mhz), Ripjaws X, 8-8-8-24-2N, Dual Channel Kit
Hard Disk SanDisk - SDSSDX-240G-Q25
Description: Sandisk 240GB Extreme SSD, 2.5", SATAIII, Read 550MB/s, Write 520MB/s
Case CoolerMaster - SGC-1000-KWN1
Description: CoolerMaster Storm Enforcer SGC-1000-KWN1, ATX, No PSU, 2 x USB2.0, Black
Optical Drive ASUS - DRW-24B5ST
Description: Asus DRW-24B5ST 16x DVD+-R, 12x DVD-RAM, DL, SATA, Black, Nero 10 Essentials, Retail Box.
Video Card Gigabyte - GV-N670OC-2GD
Description: Gigabyte Geforce GTX670 Overclocked (Base:980Mhz, Boost:1058Mhz), 2GB GDDR5 (6008Mhz), PCIE3.0, Dual DVI, DisplayPort, HDMI
Power Supply Antec - HCG-750
Description: Antec 750W High Current Gamer Power Supply, 80 PLUS Bronze, 135mm fan, High Current +12V rail(s), 4x PCI-E, 9x SATA, 6x Molex
Monitor BenQ - RL2450H
Description: BenQ 24" Widescreen LED Gaming Monitor, 1920x1080, 2ms, 12M:1 DCR, VGA, DVI, HDMI, Headphones Jack, Black EQ, RTS Mode, Smart Scaling Display Mod
Operating System Microsoft - FQC-04725
Description: Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64bit with Service Pack 1 DVD OEM
Hard Disk #2 Western Digital - WD1002FAEX
Description: Western Digital 1TB, Caviar Black, SATA-III, 7200RPM, 64MB Cache
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December 4, 2012 12:21:02 AM

Best answer selected by Somnia.
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