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The recent talk about Lunars and Werewolves reminds me of a Mystery
Science Theatre 3000 episode where they're watching a Werewolf movie;
the afflicted character transforms and runs howling down the street,
scaring people. He runs into a burly guy staggering out of a bar, who
starts to fistfight him...and, at first at least, does quite well!

Crow's comment: "So...an average bystander can kick a werewolf's
ass?!"^_^

Granted, this is unlikely to happen in WtA and even less so in
Exalted...though a properly prepared Heroic Mortal probably could
curb-stomp a Garou...Hmmm, Lunars may not be all they're cracked up to
be, but as long as they can walk all over Garou, they're nothing to
laugh at...^^

Dex
 

william

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Hand-of-Omega wrote:
> The recent talk about Lunars and Werewolves reminds me of a Mystery
> Science Theatre 3000 episode where they're watching a Werewolf movie;
> the afflicted character transforms and runs howling down the street,
> scaring people. He runs into a burly guy staggering out of a bar, who
> starts to fistfight him...and, at first at least, does quite well!
>
> Crow's comment: "So...an average bystander can kick a werewolf's
> ass?!"^_^
>
> Granted, this is unlikely to happen in WtA and even less so in
> Exalted...though a properly prepared Heroic Mortal probably could
> curb-stomp a Garou...Hmmm, Lunars may not be all they're cracked up to
> be, but as long as they can walk all over Garou, they're nothing to
> laugh at...^^
>
> Dex

Being in the middle of making a Werewolf character right now, I can say
that it feels like I am going cold-turkey on kick-ass ability after 3
years of playing only Mages and Fomori in the WOD.

God, starting werewolves are such one-trick ponies. I am trying to make
an effective Theurge and it _just won't work_. Arrrgh!

William
 
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William wrote:
> God, starting werewolves are such one-trick ponies. I am trying to make
> an effective Theurge and it _just won't work_. Arrrgh!
>
> William
>

Take Spirit Speech.
 
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William squarked:
> God, starting werewolves are such one-trick ponies. I am trying to
> make an effective Theurge and it _just won't work_. Arrrgh!
I don't think this is any more true for werewolves as for, say, vampires.
Now if you are used to Mages, of course you are going to feel limited...

Remember, a starting werewolf is just that. However, the power of theurges
is their knowledge of the secrets of spirits and the Umbra (Cosmology in my
games, probably Rituals using default abilities). The next power is their
rites. The Rite of Binding and with it the ability to make Talens can be
extremely useful, as is the Rite of Summoning. And of course Theurges can
start to build a host of spirit allies (or if you take the darker route,
spirit servants).
--
Picks-at-Flies
Beware acronyms.
http://www.werepenguin.co.uk
 
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> Being in the middle of making a Werewolf character right now, I can say
> that it feels like I am going cold-turkey on kick-ass ability after 3
> years of playing only Mages and Fomori in the WOD.

> God, starting werewolves are such one-trick ponies. I am trying to make
> an effective Theurge and it _just won't work_. Arrrgh!

Actually they are not...

The following part depends on whether you are Homid or Lupus...

Homid
Spend AT LEAST 4 freebies to get your Gnosis up to three... If possible use
more to get more gnosis... Gnosis is a usefull bargaining chip with spirits
and allows you to head to umbra more easier

Lupus
You're set with Gnosis... but you'll need the freebies to get some of the
more intristic Spirit connected abilities...

Now these are general...

First thing to remember is that you are playing a Rank 1 Werwolf, who has
just gotten out of his Rite of passage, and hasn't been dealing with spirits
more then what he was traine with... if you take this as granted then you
need to remember this while you're making the character...

As your Theurge gift grab Spirit Speech (about 30% of all spirits can speak
"human" or "Garou", the rest communicates in some very odd things like pure
ideas, pure emotions or total chaos... Spirit Speech allows you to
understand them and for them to understand you)

PaF's choice of starting rites are pretty good choice for a fledgeling
Garou... The Rite of Summoning allows you to get spirits that you want to
talk to, and Rite of binding is an excellent route to get interesting tools
(it's also a springboard towards the Rite of the Fetish if you're ever
inclined to make fetishes)... I'd also suggest the Rite of Spirit Awakening
(this one can be really powerfull) as it's a very interesting ritual and
most spirits you have awakened liek this will be quite favourable towards
you... The rite of Talisman dedication is really, really usefull, it allows
you to take your stuff around with you, to help others to protect their
clothes and equipment when they shift and is generally one of the rites that
are usefull for Garou..

Depending on the Storyeller you may start with or without a Totem binding
the pack... you don't need the Totem rite, as it will be either preformed
upon you in case, or will be a part of learning and gaining your totem...

Among the Rites of Accord you will find some more fun rites as well, namley
Rites of Cleanising and Contrition... the First is excellent for helping
people who are suffering from the wyrm taint in some for m or another... the
other one is great for placating angered spirits...

Skip the Rites of Punishment, Renown, Seasonal Rites,Death Rites and Caern
Rites as these are usually performed by senior Garou... and as for Gathering
for the Departed, there will be surley someone willing to teach you if a
packmate has died...

All the minor rites are nice, as the spirits like when you are a nice and
devout shaman :) My suggestion would be to head and grab two and do them
every now and then as flavour for your character... (their bonuses are
minor, but it's a nice thign to do gamewise...)


Okay now for the important bit... cowing spirits is generally not a good
idea... the thign is that you don't have the sort of power, or hierarchical
backing even the minor spirits have... with certain spirits it will work,
but for most politeness and acting within their type will get you a lot
further...
If ysou trafic with Banes work with your packamates not to let them escape
so you can do what you wish with them... for them pain is the best way of
getting a favor out

Charisma and Manipulation are very important for a Theurge... you will be
talking a lot with spirits... and these are what you'll be using for most of
the time... Intelligence and Wits can also be pretty usefull

For skills the following are all usefull... you should make your mix...
Empathy -> This may help if you don't take spirit speech, and is ultimatley
usefull to see what motoves the spirits have
Expression -> Spirits really like flattery and interesting oratory...
Intimidation -> Yes, spirits can be pushed... just watch it that you don't
push far, because the word WILL spread... and you don't want to have a talk
with the spirts superiors...
Crafts -> Gifts and sacrficies for spirts can be made through crafts and
tend to be pretty usefull
Subterfuge -> This can be usefull, but never EVER use it with spirits that
are connected to honor, law or anything similar... you'll end up in deep
trouble
Enigmas -> Thsi will help you figure out the spirits and their own odd
concepts
Occult -> General knowledge of the odd... i'd forgo it though for...
Cosmology -> This is knowledge about the Umbra,spirits, conepts, ideas,
travel...
Rituals -> do i really need to explain this one? :)

With specific spirits specific skills will be appreciated in you... Spirits
of War will like high brawl or melee, while Electricity elementals will love
someone with high Science...


Use this as a guideline for making a character... trust me, playing a
Theurge is fun... rom here you should pick what sounds bet to you... and
with Spirits you will have a really powerfull tool and weapon... all you
need once you have them at your disposal is to know how to treat them...

.... that you will learn through trial and error :)


--
Asmodai
------------------------------------
Asmodai@post.h1n3t.hr
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"Majesty, although i believe the world is flat, i figure
that with sufficient men and a big enough tire-pump
we could inflate it again"
--The First American
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Change the 1 and 3 for I and E :)