Werewolf TV special

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It's a bit late NOW, but somebody did ask about it before, so...

Earlier today, apparently in honor of the new Van Hellsing movie, The
History Channel ran episodes of exploring the origins of The Great
Monsters. One of these was a documentary on werewolves. Throughout the
program, interspersed with period woodcuts depicting lycanthropes, was
artwork taken from WWs' Werewolf the Apocalypse. Toward the end of the
episode, they even showed some Werewolf LARPers, and showed a brief
snippit of explanation of the game from the "Storyteller". Many
authors of Werewolf stories were also spoken to (including the guy who
wrote The Howling novels), and one mentioned how the game was unique
to extolling the positive virtues of the creatures...

BTW, apparently most of the Hollywood conventions we all recognize as
werewolf lore, was invented by a German scriptwriter (Kurt something),
who felt he needed to spice up the mythology some...so he came up with
the bite changing one into a werewolf, the vunerability to silver,
etc.

According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
novel, and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
scenes for a long time...

Interesting stuff, tho I found the info on Dipple, the "real-life" mad
scientist with his alchemical experiments in Castle Frankenstein, more
interesting...

Dex
 
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Hand-of-Omega wrote:

> BTW, apparently most of the Hollywood conventions we all recognize as
> werewolf lore, was invented by a German scriptwriter (Kurt something),
> who felt he needed to spice up the mythology some...so he came up with
> the bite changing one into a werewolf, the vunerability to silver,
> etc.

I'm going to have to remember to throw this in the face of the next
person who professes a hope that Werewolf: The Forsaken will adhere more
closely to the genuine folklore and have the curse transmitted by bite...

> According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
> produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
> Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
> novel, and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
> scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
> scenes for a long time...

*blink*

That's very borderline for me. On the one hand, it inspires HATRED AND
RAGE. On the other, it causes sniggering at the stupid people.
--
Stephenls
Geek
"I'm as impure as the driven yellow snow." -Spike
 
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"Hand-of-Omega"

> According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
> produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
> Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
> novel,

Actually, I've been saying that for years.

I also had an amusing (to me, at least) rant in my Live Journal about it.

> and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
> scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
> scenes for a long time...

Doesn't surprise me. Hollywood is the apex of stupid, not just in this era.

> Interesting stuff, tho I found the info on Dipple, the "real-life" mad
> scientist with his alchemical experiments in Castle Frankenstein, more
> interesting...

The stuff man-kind has done to dead bodies is both grotesque, hysterical,
and utterly wacky. ^_^

*coughcoughGoreadSTIFF:theCuriousLivesofHumanCadaversCoughCough*
 
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"Stephenls"
> Hand-of-Omega wrote:

> > BTW, apparently most of the Hollywood conventions we all recognize as
> > werewolf lore, was invented by a German scriptwriter (Kurt something),
> > who felt he needed to spice up the mythology some...so he came up with
> > the bite changing one into a werewolf, the vunerability to silver,
> > etc.

> I'm going to have to remember to throw this in the face of the next
> person who professes a hope that Werewolf: The Forsaken will adhere more
> closely to the genuine folklore and have the curse transmitted by bite...

I just wanted something other than "We defend the Earth." Granted, in
what's happened in the 20th century, that should definately come into play,
especially if you're half wild animal, but I'd rather not see a game
ENTIRELY dedicated to that angle. Just a personal preference.
 
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Hand-of-Omega wrote:

> According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
> produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
> Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
> novel, and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
> scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
> scenes for a long time...

Heh heh. "Darwinism"? Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
--
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Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote in message news:<2g6rigF51rnlU1@uni-berlin.de>...
> Hand-of-Omega wrote:
>
> > According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
> > produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
> > Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
> > novel, and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
> > scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
> > scenes for a long time...
>
> Heh heh. "Darwinism"? Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
> suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
> interesting to see a sentient species that is...)

The "human=animal" connection was enough for them. FWIW, part of the
appeal of Dracula's horror for his original Victorian audience was
said to be his "sliding backwards down the evolutionary chain", by
becoming various animals...

Dracula and Frankenstein, like most lasting works of art, did so well
because they dealt with the issues that concerned people at the time,
even if in a metaphorical fashion...

Dex
 
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"Hand-of-Omega" <smilinglord@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:27420f11.0405090930.7baa1407@posting.google.com...
> Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:<2g6rigF51rnlU1@uni-berlin.de>...
> > Hand-of-Omega wrote:
> >
> > > According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
> > > produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
> > > Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
> > > novel, and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
> > > scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
> > > scenes for a long time...
> >
> > Heh heh. "Darwinism"? Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
> > suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
> > interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
>
> The "human=animal" connection was enough for them. FWIW, part of the
> appeal of Dracula's horror for his original Victorian audience was
> said to be his "sliding backwards down the evolutionary chain", by
> becoming various animals...
>
> Dracula and Frankenstein, like most lasting works of art, did so well
> because they dealt with the issues that concerned people at the time,
> even if in a metaphorical fashion...

And in Dracula's case, with the addition of a healthy dose of implied sexual
deviancy, which is *always* topical. ;)

- David Prokopetz.
 
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"Richard Clayton" wrote:
<snip>
Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
> suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
> interesting to see a sentient species that is...)


I'd have to say wolves are sentient. Understanding of complex and abstract
thought? No. Sentient? Yes. I suppose I'm focusing on semantics here, but
still.
--
--
Trashdog
---
"Trash is the eternal enigma of the dog world. It's food ...but if you eat
it you get yelled at."
 
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Trashdog wrote:
>
> I'd have to say wolves are sentient. Understanding of complex and
> abstract thought? No. Sentient? Yes. I suppose I'm focusing on semantics
> here, but still.

Sentient, but not sapient.

--
Christopher Adams
What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nath Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you
understand?

You're not a bad person. You're a terrific person. You're my favorite person.
But every once in a while you just can be a real wise and beautiful woman.
- Bill
 
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Trashdog wrote:

> "Richard Clayton" wrote:
> <snip>
> Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
>
>>suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
>>interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
>
> I'd have to say wolves are sentient. Understanding of complex and abstract
> thought? No. Sentient? Yes. I suppose I'm focusing on semantics here, but
> still.

I agree with you, actually. I would even say they are capable of some
rudimentary abstract thought, although not to the degree we apes are.

Please allow me to rephrase my sloppy phrasing: It would be interesting
to see a technological species descended from wolves.
--
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"I wasn't aware the Tokyo police employed uneducated, paranoid,
delusional foreign delinquents."
"In my case, they made an exception."
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In article <2gsnb2F6911tU3@uni-berlin.de>,
Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote:

> Trashdog wrote:
>
> > "Richard Clayton" wrote:
> > <snip>
> > Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
> >
> >>suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
> >>interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
> >
> > I'd have to say wolves are sentient. Understanding of complex and abstract
> > thought? No. Sentient? Yes. I suppose I'm focusing on semantics here, but
> > still.
>
> I agree with you, actually. I would even say they are capable of some
> rudimentary abstract thought, although not to the degree we apes are.
>
> Please allow me to rephrase my sloppy phrasing: It would be interesting
> to see a technological species descended from wolves.

Such as the Vargr (sp?) from Traveller?


mdf

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Hand-of-Omega wrote:

> Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote in message news:<2g6rigF51rnlU1@uni-berlin.de>...
>
>>Hand-of-Omega wrote:
>>
>>>According to the program, one of the main reasons Hollywood never
>>>produced a werewolf story *quite* as popular as Dracula and
>>>Frankenstein was because A) there never was THE definitive Werewolf
>>>novel, and B) Hollywood censors feared the crucial transformation
>>>scenes were an endorsement of Darwinism, so we didn't get to see such
>>>scenes for a long time...
>>
>> Heh heh. "Darwinism"? Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
>>suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
>>interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
>
> The "human=animal" connection was enough for them. FWIW, part of the
> appeal of Dracula's horror for his original Victorian audience was
> said to be his "sliding backwards down the evolutionary chain", by
> becoming various animals...
>
> Dracula and Frankenstein, like most lasting works of art, did so well
> because they dealt with the issues that concerned people at the time,
> even if in a metaphorical fashion...

/Dracula/ also drew on the time's fascination with eugenics-- he was
described with the aspects of a "genetic" criminal.
--
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"I wasn't aware the Tokyo police employed uneducated, paranoid,
delusional foreign delinquents."
"In my case, they made an exception."
-- MegaTokyo
 
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mdf wrote:

> In article <2gsnb2F6911tU3@uni-berlin.de>,
> Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>
>>Trashdog wrote:
>>
>>
>>>"Richard Clayton" wrote:
>>><snip>
>>> Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
>>>
>>>
>>>>suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
>>>>interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
>>>
>>>I'd have to say wolves are sentient. Understanding of complex and abstract
>>>thought? No. Sentient? Yes. I suppose I'm focusing on semantics here, but
>>>still.
>>
>> I agree with you, actually. I would even say they are capable of some
>>rudimentary abstract thought, although not to the degree we apes are.
>>
>> Please allow me to rephrase my sloppy phrasing: It would be interesting
>>to see a technological species descended from wolves.
>
> Such as the Vargr (sp?) from Traveller?

The whosawhatnow?
--
[The address listed is a spam trap. To reply, take off every zig.]

"I wasn't aware the Tokyo police employed uneducated, paranoid,
delusional foreign delinquents."
"In my case, they made an exception."
-- MegaTokyo
 
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In article <2gt6k1F699mjU1@uni-berlin.de>,
Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote:

> mdf wrote:
>
> > In article <2gsnb2F6911tU3@uni-berlin.de>,
> > Richard Clayton <reZIGclaytonZIG@verizon.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Trashdog wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>"Richard Clayton" wrote:
> >>><snip>
> >>> Um, Hollywood censors ARE aware that nobody
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>suggests we are descended from wolves, right? (Although it would be
> >>>>interesting to see a sentient species that is...)
> >>>
> >>>I'd have to say wolves are sentient. Understanding of complex and abstract
> >>>thought? No. Sentient? Yes. I suppose I'm focusing on semantics here, but
> >>>still.
> >>
> >> I agree with you, actually. I would even say they are capable of some
> >>rudimentary abstract thought, although not to the degree we apes are.
> >>
> >> Please allow me to rephrase my sloppy phrasing: It would be interesting
> >>to see a technological species descended from wolves.
> >
> > Such as the Vargr (sp?) from Traveller?
>
> The whosawhatnow?

http://pcug.org.au/~davidjw/libdata/ALPHABET/V/vargr.htm

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mdf wrote:

>>>> Please allow me to rephrase my sloppy phrasing: It would be interesting
>>>>to see a technological species descended from wolves.
>>>
>>> Such as the Vargr (sp?) from Traveller?
>>
>> The whosawhatnow?
>
> http://pcug.org.au/~davidjw/libdata/ALPHABET/V/vargr.htm

Neat! Thank you.
--
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"I wasn't aware the Tokyo police employed uneducated, paranoid,
delusional foreign delinquents."
"In my case, they made an exception."
-- MegaTokyo
 
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mdf <mdfno@junkmbay.net> wrote in message news:<mdfno-0BB40D.01305118052004@news-central.dca.giganews.com>...

> http://pcug.org.au/~davidjw/libdata/ALPHABET/V/vargr.htm

Like the picture. Kinda sums up what the GlassWalkers are all about!^^

Hmm...It'd be interesting to have a version of Mage/Werewolf where the
GW arose from an adaptive tribe who successfully infiltrated the
Technocracy and took it over...

Dex,
not letting go of the old WoD without a fight!!