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The New World of Darkness Hoax.

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Anonymous
August 23, 2004 5:51:36 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

So. My theory. I'm convinced it doesn't exist. It's a big joke
played on the few by the many. Most everyone is in on it. Cept me.

Case in point: I cannot post to the forums.

Case in point: two gaming shops and five book stores later = I still
haven't so much SEEN a copy of either book. I asked. Apparently,
though both stores had TONS of White Wolf books, they didn't bother
with the New World of Darkness.

....

....

Yeah. At least, that's my theory until I return to California.

More about : world darkness hoax

Anonymous
August 23, 2004 10:56:43 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Zane Graves wrote:

> So. My theory. I'm convinced it doesn't exist. It's a big joke
> played on the few by the many. Most everyone is in on it. Cept me.

Heh.

> Case in point: two gaming shops and five book stores later = I still
> haven't so much SEEN a copy of either book. I asked. Apparently,
> though both stores had TONS of White Wolf books, they didn't bother
> with the New World of Darkness.

Well they did sell out the first printing run in preorders, but rest
assured, the books exist and they are SEXay. :)  ... Or maybe I'm just
in on it too... o.o
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 1:25:35 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Zane Graves <maltlick@yahoo.com> wrote:
: Case in point: two gaming shops and five book stores later = I still
: haven't so much SEEN a copy of either book. I asked. Apparently,
: though both stores had TONS of White Wolf books, they didn't bother
: with the New World of Darkness.

They already have enough different versions of the WoD rules lying in
their shelves, and you get enough of the new Requiem content by killing
most of the clans, removing Camarilla and Sabbat and reusing the old
names.

//T
Related resources
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 2:06:51 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Teemu T Vilen wrote:

> Zane Graves <maltlick@yahoo.com> wrote:
> : Case in point: two gaming shops and five book stores later = I still
> : haven't so much SEEN a copy of either book. I asked. Apparently,
> : though both stores had TONS of White Wolf books, they didn't bother
> : with the New World of Darkness.
>
> They already have enough different versions of the WoD rules lying in
> their shelves, and you get enough of the new Requiem content by killing
> most of the clans, removing Camarilla and Sabbat and reusing the old
> names.
>
> //T

I've had the books 4 hours now. This is not true:) 

Sadly, most of the other people that believe otherwise have no interest
in actually discovering what the new game is actually like.
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 2:52:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Stephen Williams <steve1.williams@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:<SCuWc.10613$DG.487536@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> Zane Graves wrote:
>
> > So. My theory. I'm convinced it doesn't exist. It's a big joke
> > played on the few by the many. Most everyone is in on it. Cept me.
>
> Heh.
>
> > Case in point: two gaming shops and five book stores later = I still
> > haven't so much SEEN a copy of either book. I asked. Apparently,
> > though both stores had TONS of White Wolf books, they didn't bother
> > with the New World of Darkness.
>
> Well they did sell out the first printing run in preorders, but rest
> assured, the books exist and they are SEXay. :)  ... Or maybe I'm just
> in on it too... o.o

Of COURSE you're in on it. Anyone who has a book is "in on it".
Anyone who's even just SEEN the book is "in on it". Anyone who talks
about page numbers or bloodlines? In on it.

The New WoD doesn't need Bob Schnoblin...CAUSE THEY HAVE ME!!!!

Truth be told...once Chris Bell ended the "Vampire made Mage abort the
baby" stuff, I feel the NWoD needs an anthem.

Or. You know. Not.

I just wanted to hold the book and flip through it before sinking $60
into it. I'm trying to remember how much money I've spent on Vampire,
and how much play I got out of it, and thinking about firing the
accountant over it. ^_^
August 24, 2004 6:10:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Zane Graves wrote:

> I just wanted to hold the book and flip through it before sinking $60
> into it. I'm trying to remember how much money I've spent on Vampire,
> and how much play I got out of it, and thinking about firing the
> accountant over it. ^_^

This is actually why I haven't bought the books yet. I know I'll like
them. I'm just waiting until I find someone else running a game.

In the mean time, I'll buy those books I _know_ I'll never play with
unless I run them myself but want to read anyway- the current purchasing
list is Transhuman Space, Mage Storyteller's Guide (I found one!) and
whichever one of GoO's eternally-delayed fantasy settings comes out first.

William
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 6:24:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

In article <%TtWc.1738$Y%3.1053@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net>,
Brandon Quina <quinabl@earthlink.net> wrote:

> Teemu T Vilen wrote:
>
> > Zane Graves <maltlick@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > : Case in point: two gaming shops and five book stores later = I still
> > : haven't so much SEEN a copy of either book. I asked. Apparently,
> > : though both stores had TONS of White Wolf books, they didn't bother
> > : with the New World of Darkness.
> >
> > They already have enough different versions of the WoD rules lying in
> > their shelves, and you get enough of the new Requiem content by killing
> > most of the clans, removing Camarilla and Sabbat and reusing the old
> > names.
> >
> > //T
>
> I've had the books 4 hours now. This is not true:) 
>
> Sadly, most of the other people that believe otherwise have no interest
> in actually discovering what the new game is actually like.

Even some of us who *don't* believe otherwise have no interest in
actually discovering what the new game is, again, actually like!

As the people willing to "talk Mage 2nd" dwindle, I'll shake my fist
bitterly and look to see if anybody is doing anything interesting with
Lace & Steel... ;) 

mdf

--
remove 'no junk' to reply
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 6:56:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Brandon Quina <quinabl@earthlink.net> wrote:
: Teemu T Vilen wrote:
: Sadly, most of the other people that believe otherwise have no interest
: in actually discovering what the new game is actually like.

Oh, I've discovered it alright. I don't mind the changes to the
backgrounds. Just for a person who wanted those changes and had a
similar opinion about them, the changes in Requiem are nothing big. Good
changes, good write-ups and good fluff, but nothing spectacular for
those who've gone through the needed changes years ago. Glad that new
players rather find Requiem than the old V:tM.

However..

When it comes to the rules, everything I've seen so far has convinced me
into using anything but the new rules and that core rule book is
certainly one thing I wont be spending my euros into. Following all
reviews and discussions in the assorted forums, it seems there will be a
lot of people doing conversions to systems that are better than the old
Storyteller versions (why not go all the way) and to, of course, the old
Storyteller versions.

Myself, I was planning on using Godlike RPG rules or Over the Edge.
Anyone been outlining the use of Requiem core functions on these systems
already?

//T
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 6:56:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

"Teemu T Vilen" <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in message
news:cgfkua$812$1@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...

> When it comes to the rules, everything I've seen so far has convinced me
> into using anything but the new rules and that core rule book is
> certainly one thing I wont be spending my euros into. Following all
> reviews and discussions in the assorted forums, it seems there will be a
> lot of people doing conversions to systems that are better than the old
> Storyteller versions (why not go all the way) and to, of course, the old
> Storyteller versions.
>
> Myself, I was planning on using Godlike RPG rules or Over the Edge.
> Anyone been outlining the use of Requiem core functions on these systems
> already?

I had a chance to briefly flip through the new WoD core book at Gen Con, but
didn't notice any major changes. For those of you who have given it a more
substantial look, what are the major differences between the new mechanics
and previous editions?

--
heratyk
http://members.cox.net/cyberdungeon/index.html
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day.
Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm the rest of his life.
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 6:56:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

heratyk wrote:

> I had a chance to briefly flip through the new WoD core book at Gen Con, but
> didn't notice any major changes. For those of you who have given it a more
> substantial look, what are the major differences between the new mechanics
> and previous editions?

The "target number" is always 8, and you almost always re-roll 10s.
Specialties add a die to your pool. A task that's easy adds dice to
your pool, and a task that's difficult takes dice away. You only ever
need a single success to succeed.

The attributes are different, having been divided into Power, Finesse,
and Resistance, as well as Mental, Physical, and Social. Observe:

Mental Physical Social

Power Intelligence Strength Presence
Finesse Wits Dexterity Manipulation
Resistance Resolve Stamina Composure

Abilities are different. They're now called Skills, and also divided
into Mental (Academics, Computer, Crafts, Investigation, Medicine,
Occult, Politics, and Science), Physical (Athletics, Brawl, Drive,
Firearms, Larceny, Stealth, Survival, and Weaponry), and Social (Animal
Ken, Empathy, Expression, Intimidation, Persuasion, Socialize,
Streetwise, and Subterfuge). Those 24 skills are the only skills the
game will ever have -- no more new skills in supplements.

The game no longer has Backgrounds -- instead, it has Merits, which
Backgrounds have been folded into. Some Merits are rated • to •••••,
while some are rated a single number (Encyclopedic Knowledge is ••••,
for example, and Unseen Sense is •••), while some are rated, say, •• to
••••. Merits are also divided into Physical, Social, and Mental, and
most of the former Backgrounds are Social Merits now. Appearance has
become the Striking Looks merit (•• to ••••, every two dots provides a
single bonus die to Presence rolls that benefit from an attractive
appearance).

Speaking of Attributes that disappeared, Charisma is now Presence,
Appearance is now the Striking Looks merit, and Perception has been
folded into Wits (Perception rolls are now either Wits + Composure, or
Wits + a relevant Skill, like Investigation). Oh, yeah -- you can add
two Attributes together to make rolls now. Willpower is no longer ever
rolled -- instead, Resolve + Composure. Speaking of Willpower, spending
it doesn't provide an automatic success anymore. Instead, it provides
three bonus dice to a roll. Also, instead of existing independently,
Willpower is equal to Resolve + Composure. Some events in vampire
require the expenditure of a permanent Willpower point, in which case
the cost of raising it back up to Resolve + Composure is always 8 XP per
dot, regardless of its rating.

The game no longer has freebie points (character creation provides 7
Merit points), and Flaws work completely different. Instead of
providing points at character creation, Flaws are now an optional system
-- chose one flaw at character creation, and any session where it
significantly hinders your character, you get an additional XP.

Combat is /completely/ different -- there's no damage roll, now.
Attacking with, say, a sword is Strength + Weaponry + 3 (because swords
have a damage rating of 3), and every success is a point of damage
inflicted on whoever you're attacking. There's no more Dodge skill, and
dodging isn't a necessary action anymore -- everyone has a Defense
rating (lowest of Dexterity + Wits, modified by certain Merits), and
that rating is subtracted from the dice pools of everyone who attacks.
The Dodge maneuver is "Give up your action this round to double your
Defense." There are no more multiple actions per round. Rounds are now
3 seconds. Some weapons (like shotguns) allow you to re-roll 9s as well
as 10s.

The differences go far beyond that. Saying there aren't any major
differences is very, very inaccurate -- this is easily Storyteller 3.0,
as far beyond the Trinity/Exalted system as that was beyond the old WoD
system. (Although they don't call it the Storyteller system anymore --
it's now the Storytelling System.)

It's also the best iteration of the system for modern games I've seen
yet. The chase rules are /awesome/.
--
Stephenls
Geek
"I'm as impure as the driven yellow snow." -Spike
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 9:06:23 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

"Stephenls" <stephenls@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:2p1dr0FelfoiU1@uni-berlin.de...

> The differences go far beyond that. Saying there aren't any major
> differences is very, very inaccurate -- this is easily Storyteller 3.0, as
> far beyond the Trinity/Exalted system as that was beyond the old WoD
> system. (Although they don't call it the Storyteller system anymore --
> it's now the Storytelling System.)
>
> It's also the best iteration of the system for modern games I've seen yet.
> The chase rules are /awesome/.
> --
> Stephenls

Thanks for the overview. As I said, I only got to skim through the books
very briefly. The line was so long that I didn't bother to buy one,
figuring I could get it cheaper online anyway.

--
heratyk
http://members.cox.net/cyberdungeon/index.html
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day.
Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm the rest of his life.
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 10:26:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Teemu T Vilen <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in message
news:cgfkua$812$1@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...
> Brandon Quina <quinabl@earthlink.net> wrote:
> : Teemu T Vilen wrote:
> : Sadly, most of the other people that believe otherwise have no
interest
> : in actually discovering what the new game is actually like.
>
> Oh, I've discovered it alright. I don't mind the changes to the
> backgrounds. Just for a person who wanted those changes and had a
> similar opinion about them, the changes in Requiem are nothing big.
Good
> changes, good write-ups and good fluff, but nothing spectacular for
> those who've gone through the needed changes years ago. Glad that
new
> players rather find Requiem than the old V:tM.
>
> However..
>
> When it comes to the rules, everything I've seen so far has
convinced me
> into using anything but the new rules and that core rule book is
> certainly one thing I wont be spending my euros into. Following all
> reviews and discussions in the assorted forums, it seems there will
be a
> lot of people doing conversions to systems that are better than the
old
> Storyteller versions (why not go all the way) and to, of course, the
old
> Storyteller versions.
>
> Myself, I was planning on using Godlike RPG rules or Over the Edge.
> Anyone been outlining the use of Requiem core functions on these
systems
> already?
-------
Over The Edge is a Unisystem game isn't it? It struck me when I read
the rules for the Buffy RPG how they convert easily to Storyteller
games...

--
You are Not entering Chapeltown.
We walk on two legs, the one abstract
the other surreal.
All important political action should be
aimed at persuading people of the
necessity of further sacrifices.
- Ardian Vehbiu, "Handbook for
Aspiring Stalinists"
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 10:26:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

"Certic" <PJS@winwaed.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:<cgftmg$3b8$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>...
> Teemu T Vilen <tvilen@cc.helsinki.fi> wrote in message
> news:cgfkua$812$1@oravannahka.helsinki.fi...

> > Myself, I was planning on using Godlike RPG rules or Over the Edge.
> > Anyone been outlining the use of Requiem core functions on these
> systems
> > already?

It's pretty simple for OtE. "Central Trait: Do Vampire S--- 4D
(Has pale skin, pointed canines)" should pretty much cover it.
;'/

> -------
> Over The Edge is a Unisystem game isn't it? It struck me when I read
> the rules for the Buffy RPG how they convert easily to Storyteller
> games...

No, OtE has a very different freeform system, one that's simpler
and more flexible then Unisystem.

In fact, given that the character generation in OtE boils down
to "Select One central Trail, Select two Secondary traits,
decide which trait has the highest value, then give you character
a flaw", I'm not sure how much conversion of systems can actually
be done.

- Eric Tolle
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 10:49:14 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

That's the only reason I'm glad I did my preordering on Amazon.com. True,
it takes for freakin' EVER to get them, like Sept. 9 or something, but I
only have to shell out $38.

Then again, I suppose Amazon could be in on the hoax, too, and that's why
they say the books won't ship until September.....

"Zane Graves" <maltlick@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3a33e414.0408232152.543a6aae@posting.google.com...
> Stephen Williams <steve1.williams@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:<SCuWc.10613$DG.487536@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> > Zane Graves wrote:.
>
> I just wanted to hold the book and flip through it before sinking $60
> into it. I'm trying to remember how much money I've spent on Vampire,
> and how much play I got out of it, and thinking about firing the
> accountant over it. ^_^
Anonymous
August 24, 2004 10:49:15 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

"satarina"

> That's the only reason I'm glad I did my preordering on Amazon.com. True,
> it takes for freakin' EVER to get them, like Sept. 9 or something, but I
> only have to shell out $38.
>
> Then again, I suppose Amazon could be in on the hoax, too, and that's why
> they say the books won't ship until September.....

OH! Amazon is TOTALLY in on it.

And it works too, cause a few people I ended up talking to ordered
Apocalypse, Gehenna, and Ascension on there and...well...I know I
never got mine. After about a month, I canceled the order and
scavenged around for them in SoCal.

So who's to say that when you keep on waiting and waiting and waiting
if the book is just sitting there, or if the book doesn't really exist
to begin with.
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 3:09:57 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Stephenls <stephenls@shaw.ca> wrote in message news:<2p1dr0FelfoiU1@uni-berlin.de>...

> The "target number" is always 8, and you almost always re-roll 10s.

Didn't the "10 Again" rule first show up in Adventure?

> Specialties add a die to your pool.

Speaking of pools, do you still "split" them the same way for multiple
actions?

> A task that's easy adds dice to
> your pool, and a task that's difficult takes dice away. You only ever
> need a single success to succeed.

Can you still get automatic success if your dice pool is over the
target number of 8?
>
> The attributes are different, having been divided into Power, Finesse,
> and Resistance, as well as Mental, Physical, and Social. Observe:
>
> Mental Physical Social
>
> Power Intelligence Strength Presence
> Finesse Wits Dexterity Manipulation
> Resistance Resolve Stamina Composure

This really took me a bit to wrap my head around, but I've got it
now!^^
>
> Abilities are different. They're now called Skills, and also divided
> into Mental (Academics, Computer, Crafts, Investigation, Medicine,
> Occult, Politics, and Science), Physical (Athletics, Brawl, Drive,
> Firearms, Larceny, Stealth, Survival, and Weaponry), and Social (Animal
> Ken, Empathy, Expression, Intimidation, Persuasion, Socialize,
> Streetwise, and Subterfuge). Those 24 skills are the only skills the
> game will ever have -- no more new skills in supplements.

Bravo! Not sure about "Weaponry", tho, as that implies Firearms to
me--maybe they should have left it Melee? Also don't like Martial Arts
being a subset of Brawl, but whatever...
>
> The game no longer has Backgrounds -- instead, it has Merits, which
> Backgrounds have been folded into. Some Merits are rated • to •••••,
> while some are rated a single number (Encyclopedic Knowledge is ••••,
> for example, and Unseen Sense is •••), while some are rated, say, •• to
> ••••. Merits are also divided into Physical, Social, and Mental, and
> most of the former Backgrounds are Social Merits now. Appearance has
> become the Striking Looks merit (•• to ••••, every two dots provides a
> single bonus die to Presence rolls that benefit from an attractive
> appearance).
>
Bet this sticks in the craw of those who disallowed Merits as
powergaming twinkery!^~ Actually, this reminds me of Godblooded's
mandatory Merits in Exalted...

> Speaking of Attributes that disappeared, Charisma is now Presence,
> Appearance is now the Striking Looks merit, and Perception has been
> folded into Wits (Perception rolls are now either Wits + Composure, or
> Wits + a relevant Skill, like Investigation). Oh, yeah -- you can add
> two Attributes together to make rolls now. Willpower is no longer ever
> rolled -- instead, Resolve + Composure. Speaking of Willpower, spending
> it doesn't provide an automatic success anymore. Instead, it provides
> three bonus dice to a roll. Also, instead of existing independently,
> Willpower is equal to Resolve + Composure. Some events in vampire
> require the expenditure of a permanent Willpower point, in which case
> the cost of raising it back up to Resolve + Composure is always 8 XP per
> dot, regardless of its rating.

What all is Composure good for? It seems that that's the one trait
you'll want as high as possible...
>
> The game no longer has freebie points (character creation provides 7
> Merit points), and Flaws work completely different. Instead of
> providing points at character creation, Flaws are now an optional system
> -- chose one flaw at character creation, and any session where it
> significantly hinders your character, you get an additional XP.
>
Not sure I like the "no freebie points" bit, esp as the fifth dot
costs double. And aren't the chargen point spreads lower than before?
Is this compensated for with XP costs?

> Combat is /completely/ different -- there's no damage roll, now.
> Attacking with, say, a sword is Strength + Weaponry + 3 (because swords
> have a damage rating of 3), and every success is a point of damage
> inflicted on whoever you're attacking.

So, neither iniative nor To Hit are reliant on Dex?

> There's no more Dodge skill, and
> dodging isn't a necessary action anymore -- everyone has a Defense
> rating (lowest of Dexterity + Wits, modified by certain Merits), and
> that rating is subtracted from the dice pools of everyone who attacks.
> The Dodge maneuver is "Give up your action this round to double your
> Defense." There are no more multiple actions per round. Rounds are now
> 3 seconds. Some weapons (like shotguns) allow you to re-roll 9s as well
> as 10s.

Isn't it true that there's no soak, as such? I suddenly feel very
naked...<g>
>
> The differences go far beyond that. Saying there aren't any major
> differences is very, very inaccurate -- this is easily Storyteller 3.0,
> as far beyond the Trinity/Exalted system as that was beyond the old WoD
> system. (Although they don't call it the Storyteller system anymore --
> it's now the Storytelling System.)
>
True. IMO, one of the largest changes is with Botching. IIRC, if the
penalties subtracting from your dice pool empty it, you can still try
a "chance roll", signifying your character making that last-ditch,
desperate attempt: roll 1D10, and anything but a 10 is a failure,
while a 1 is a botch (tho they call it something else); rolling a 10
allows you to roll again, so you can accumulate suxx so long as you
keep hitting 10...^^ (good luck!) This is the ONLY situation in which
you can Botch a roll.

> It's also the best iteration of the system for modern games I've seen
> yet. The chase rules are /awesome/.

So, we already established this wouldn't work well for Exalted, but
what about for Adventure! et al? I wonder how well Dramatic Editing
and Stunting would work in this system...

Dex,
reciting the above from skimming the books two nights ago, so
apologies if anything is inaccurate...
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 4:59:16 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Hand-of-Omega wrote:

> Didn't the "10 Again" rule first show up in Adventure?

Technically it first showed up in the old WoD, but it was for
specialties only.

> Speaking of pools, do you still "split" them the same way for multiple
> actions?

There are no more multiple actions anymore. At all.

Even Celerity doesn't grant multiple actions anymore.

> Can you still get automatic success if your dice pool is over the
> target number of 8?

No.

> Bravo! Not sure about "Weaponry", tho, as that implies Firearms to
> me--maybe they should have left it Melee? Also don't like Martial Arts
> being a subset of Brawl, but whatever...

Martial Arts is now a set of special Merits that modify your Brawl. So,
in other words, a dude who knows how to fight who starts learning
Martial Arts doesn't have to start from the ground up anymore. It's
far, far better.

> Bet this sticks in the craw of those who disallowed Merits as
> powergaming twinkery!^~ Actually, this reminds me of Godblooded's
> mandatory Merits in Exalted...

Running the new ST system and disallowing Merits as too twinky is a lot
like running D&D and disallowing Feats as too twinky -- Merits are now
the major strength of the system. Along with that merged attack/damage
roll.

> What all is Composure good for? It seems that that's the one trait
> you'll want as high as possible...

Composure is used to resist emotional effects, while Resolve is used to
resist mental attacks and Stamina is used to resist physical attacks.

> Not sure I like the "no freebie points" bit, esp as the fifth dot
> costs double. And aren't the chargen point spreads lower than before?
> Is this compensated for with XP costs?

The game has guidelines for starting play with XP. 35 is the baseline,
then 75, then, um, a number bigger than 75...

> So, neither iniative nor To Hit are reliant on Dex?

Initiative is Dexterity + Composure + 1d10. Fast reflexes plus your
ability to keep your cool and react rationally to stimuli in stressful
situations.

Dexterity modifies Athletics (for thrown) and Firearms (for guns & bows)
attacks. Strength modifies Brawl (for unarmed combat) and Weaponry (for
armed combat) attacks. If you're attacking ranged, it's Dexterity. If
you're attacking close, it's Strength. The Fighting Finesse Merit lets
you chose a weapon that you can use Dexterity with instead of Strength.

> Isn't it true that there's no soak, as such? I suddenly feel very
> naked...<g>

No soak. Health levels are equal to Stamina + Size, where Size is 5 for
an adult human. Wound penalties go -3 for the last box, -2 for the next
to last box, -1 for the next to next to last box, and that's it.

> True. IMO, one of the largest changes is with Botching. IIRC, if the
> penalties subtracting from your dice pool empty it, you can still try
> a "chance roll", signifying your character making that last-ditch,
> desperate attempt: roll 1D10, and anything but a 10 is a failure,
> while a 1 is a botch (tho they call it something else); rolling a 10
> allows you to roll again, so you can accumulate suxx so long as you
> keep hitting 10...^^ (good luck!) This is the ONLY situation in which
> you can Botch a roll.

This is true.

> So, we already established this wouldn't work well for Exalted, but
> what about for Adventure! et al? I wonder how well Dramatic Editing
> and Stunting would work in this system...

It could work well for Adventure!, but you'd have to do some
number-juggling and re-do all the Knacks that deal with multiple
actions. I'd just use the original Adventure! system, as there's
nothing wrong with it.
--
Stephenls
Geek
"I'm as impure as the driven yellow snow." -Spike
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 2:26:33 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Stephenls <stephenls@shaw.ca> wrote in message news:<2p5jiiFfu133U1@uni-berlin.de>...

>
> There are no more multiple actions anymore. At all.
>
> Even Celerity doesn't grant multiple actions anymore.

Huh. Then what does it do? Increase Iniative and Movement speeds?

> > What all is Composure good for? It seems that that's the one trait
> > you'll want as high as possible...
>
> Composure is used to resist emotional effects, while Resolve is used to
> resist mental attacks and Stamina is used to resist physical attacks.

I recall reading thru it and thinking "Man, Composure is an absolute
necessity to pump up"...How many Attributes does it combine with?

> Initiative is Dexterity + Composure + 1d10. Fast reflexes plus your
> ability to keep your cool and react rationally to stimuli in stressful
> situations.

So Wits doesn't cover that anymore, huh?
>
> No soak. Health levels are equal to Stamina + Size, where Size is 5 for
> an adult human. Wound penalties go -3 for the last box, -2 for the next
> to last box, -1 for the next to next to last box, and that's it.

So, the rating of your Armor stacks with Defense?

Incidentally, I did like the Virtue and Vice replacements for Nature
and Demeanor (we saw something similar in Adventure), and the Morality
scale was pretty well worked out. I wonder how that'll apply to Garou
and Magi?

Dex
Anonymous
August 26, 2004 2:38:41 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.whitewolf (More info?)

Hand-of-Omega wrote:

> Huh. Then what does it do? Increase Iniative and Movement speeds?

Initiative, movement, and defense.

First, you add your Celerity to your initiative score any round you use
celerity.

Second, your Speed rating increases by itself again for every dot of
Celerity you have when you activate it -- so one dot of Celerity means
your speed doubles, while two dots means it triples, three means it
quadruples, etc..

Finally, in any turn you've activated Celerity, you add your Celerity
score to your Defense -- and Celerity-based defense applies even to
things that defense usually doesn't apply to. Like bullets.

> I recall reading thru it and thinking "Man, Composure is an absolute
> necessity to pump up"...How many Attributes does it combine with?

I forget. Two or three.

There aren't any dump stats.

> So Wits doesn't cover that anymore, huh?

Wits covers perception and quick thinking, now, but not cool-headedness
under fire.

> So, the rating of your Armor stacks with Defense?

Yes, and it applies to things that Defense doesn't apply to. Also,
bulletproof armors downgrade bullet damage from lethal to bashing,
unless the attacker makes a called shot.

> Incidentally, I did like the Virtue and Vice replacements for Nature
> and Demeanor (we saw something similar in Adventure), and the Morality
> scale was pretty well worked out. I wonder how that'll apply to Garou
> and Magi?

No idea, but I agree with you about Virtues and Vices.
--
Stephenls
Geek
"I'm as impure as the driven yellow snow." -Spike
!