Why do people say intel boards stink? For example what is wrong with the dz77re-75k compared to an asus z77 with thunderbolt? Curious.
I would not say Intel boards are bad, it's just that ASUS, Gigabyte and Asrock offer more features with better overclocking for competitive pricing. This is obviously a generalisation over all sockets and classes. Look up benchmarks and reviews, there are many on this very forum. For a particular socket and price point, an Intel board may be best. Finally, if you want thunderbolt, that will limit the choice boards to those which support it.
to me, a novice with no over clocking skills. the intel bios one looks easier because its just a sliding bar to raise up to 4.5 ghz on a 3770k. I also compared this board to the asus one and intel seemed to have equivalent features. And the extras look to have better build quality, wifi antenna, front usb 3 port etc. But the real reason i looked to intel in the first place is that i presume they will have better customer service. am I wrong?
lorgox said:to me, a novice with no over clocking skills. the intel bios one looks easier because its just a sliding bar to raise up to 4.5 ghz on a 3770k. I also compared this board to the asus one and intel seemed to have equivalent features. And the extras look to have better build quality, wifi antenna, front usb 3 port etc. But the real reason i looked to intel in the first place is that i presume they will have better customer service. am I wrong?
You're "wrong" to make an assumption like better customer service if there's no proof of that. For example,
a) People claim Dell "sucks" but my U2711 monitor was replaced in One Day and I even had a return waybill + the packaging. I paid NOTHING. (this also points at that not all products in a company have the same warranty/service).
b) My ASUS motherboard (Z77 Sabertooth) has a FIVE YEAR WARRANTY!
You really want to ask questions like this:
1) how reliable is the company's products, in general?
2) how reliable is THIS product (customer feedback)?
3) can I get a replacement sent to me BEFORE returning the product? (rare but useful)
4) How LONG is the warranty?
5) What does the warranty include? (shipping costs there/back.. )
*I've seen absolutely NO indication that Intel is superior to other companies for motherboards. ASROCK seems to have some good value boards.
Overclocking is a different story. Personally, I have the i7-3770K + GTX680 (ASUS TOP) + Sabertooth motherboard and I do NOT overclock. The CPU already reaches 3.9GHz automatically (when TURBO is set) and 4.5GHz would very rarely benefit in a gaming scenario. No only that, overclocking significantly increases the power used even in idle which makes your PC run much hotter.
lorgox said:ok, any idea where I can find out people's experiences with Intel support? I looked at reviews on online stores.
I don't quite understand why you are so fixated on Intel motherboards specifically. They wouldn't be my top choice.
Assuming you want a Z77 1155 motherboard, this board is really good value with good reviews:
ASRock Z77 EXTREME4
FYI, I discovered that many of the Gigabyte motherboards support VOLTAGE fan control and work with 3-pin fans. I was a little peeved that my new Asus Z77 Sabertooth wouldn't support fan control for my expensive Noctua NH-D14 fans. Just FYI. If you have to buy new fans get 4-pin fans, but if you have an expensive 3-pin fan cooler you may wish to get a motherboard that supports that (apparently mostly just some Gigabyte boards and maybe all newer boards are dropping 3-pin support, I just don't know).
Without Voltage control the 3-pin fans just spin at one, loud speed.
FYI, this is a summary from a review of the Intel board you mentioned:
"As you'll see from our technical analysis, the performance of the board wasn't stellar either, lagging behind other boards - especially in the memory bandwidth stakes. In the end, the DZ77RE-75K's standard features and performance mean it ends up relying on Thunderbolt to stand out from the crowd. This early in Thunderbolt's life, unfortunately, that's just not enough. "
Thunderbolt sounds interesting but I'd never use it. It won't be used for external gaming cards as I thought initially (bandwidth too low). Basically it's a high-speed dedicated interface to products I'll never buy.
Is THUNDERBOLT a must-have for you?
Anyway, I'm not sure what else to say:
1) make sure all the features are there (fan control, eSATA, front USB3, Virtu MVP...) based on what you want/need.
2) Read customer reviews such as NCIX, Newegg, Amazon and make sure most people like the product and there are no obvious issues.
It's been my understanding that INTEL doesn't generally put out a high-end motherboard that is better than anyone else. Thus my recommendation of Asrock, Gigabyte, Asus etc.
Right, I did those things It has fan control, esata, front usb 3, virtu mvp. No thunderbolt is not a must, but $ is not a problem and I read that the board with thunderbolt might have something extra. The only downside with the intel mobo is that the memory is temperamental and one must be very careful about choosing memory.
lorgox said:Right, I did those things It has fan control, esata, front usb 3, virtu mvp. No thunderbolt is not a must, but $ is not a problem and I read that the board with thunderbolt might have something extra. The only downside with the intel mobo is that the memory is temperamental and one must be very careful about choosing memory.
My advice is this motherboard:
It's an 1155 Z77 motherboard, is reasonably priced (about $240) and has an addon wi-fi card, Thunderbolt, all the basics as well as excellent overclocking potential (though you may not use it).
Best CPU is the i5-3570K or i7-3770K. (the i7-3770K is a waste of money unless you use programs that benefit from the hyperthreads)
This is a CANADIAN link, but this is the DDR3 2133MHz RAM that I bought. This is a 16GB kit which is overkill for most. I can verify I absolutely have NEVER used over 6GB while gaming but I do video editing.
There are a FEW games that will actually benefit from this RAM vs 1600MHz when paired with a high-end CPU like the i5-3570K and GTX680. Most games won't but some even improved by 15% frame rates!
Not sure what you bought but my recommend is something like this:
1) the Gigabyte board I linked
2) i5-3570K (i7-3770K only if utilized)
3) 8GB DDR3 2133MHz low-latency (16GB only if utilized)
4) 750W PSU (Antec, Corsair etc)
5) game card? (AMD HD7950 is a great deal, such as a Sapphire version with the THREE FREE GAMES COUPON! I own the Asus GTX680 TOP)
6) case (Corsair?; some of the cheap Antec's aren't bad for value); get one with FRONT USB3
7) CPU HSF
(*WARNING: most motherboards don't have FAN CONTROL for 3-pin fans on the CPU. This Gigabyte board MIGHT. Not sure. I have the Noctua NH-D14 which is great but fans are 3-pin and my new Asus Z77 Sabertooth won't control them. I have to replace them which may be an issue as they pin onto the heatsink. SIGH. My old Gigabyte board controlled them by VOLTAGE. However, 4-pin fans use PWM.)
The NOCTUA NH-D14 is also OVERKILL I think. Look for a $30 to $60 cooler with good reviews and a 4-pin 120mm.
I recommend a 120GB SSD for Windows/apps, plus an HDD like the WD 2TB GREEN for STEAM, backups, downloads, videos etc.
- OCZ Vertex 4
- Samsung 830/840
- newer Intel's
*If in doubt, don't get just any SSD as some are prone to bricking, reduced performance etc.
9) Windows 8 64-bit OEM
10) BluRay or DVD burner ( Lite On IHBS312-98 ). I did a LOT of research before deciding on that BluRay burner. If in doubt you'd use it yet, just get a $20 DVD burner as this BD burner is $90.
lorgox said:Im rich so $ is not really a problem for me
As am I.
FYI, here's some lessons I've learned:
I recently finished building and TESTING my new gaming rig and have learned a few things:
1) The Asus Z77 Sabertooth is a fine board but I got it primarily for the five-year warranty. There were a few caveats I learned:
a) RAID0 differs between chipsets so I lost all my data as the Sabertooth had no support for the Gigabyte chipset version of it.
b) the little 35mm fans are annoying. Luckily, you can turn them OFF. I set them to turn on ONLY if the temperature hit 50degC (which appears will never happen).
c) My Noctua NH-D14 fits however the Sabertooth (and most boards) do NOT support the VOLTAGE control method, only PWM for 4-pin fans. I have to get a specific Noctua and four case, 4-pin fans so I can get fan control working properly. (many people don't realize this and the CPU and/or case fans just run at a single, high speed creating more NOISE than needed.
d) The 8-pin plug for the CPU power is so high up on the board it actually hit my top case fan. I had to disable it and either buy a thin version or use no fan there.
e) The Sabertooth board supports front USB3 but my case doesn't. Every case I looked for was either too wide for my desk or had issues with the graphics card or simply didn't have front USB3. I gave up, kept my current Antec ONE (discontinued) and will buy a 5.25" bay module for USB3.
2) Windows 8
- I attempted to use the new interface but finally gave up. I use Stardock's Start8.
- I'd still recommend Windows 8 over Windows 7 but NOT as an upgrade from Windows 7.
- There are still a few GLITCHES possibly mostly driver issues.
- The latest BIOS in November caused major stability issues (what it was supposed to fix). I rolled back and things are fine now.
- *There are several advantages to Windows 8 such as boot times and security/file system changes. Oddly Windows Explorer is much improved despite Microsoft moving us away from that type of interface.
WINDOWS 8 is a fine Operating System and superior to Windows 7 as a slight upgrade if we IGNORE the new interface. Again, I've tried to give it the benefit of the doubt and would do so if it was BETTER however I like the normal desktop environment with the Taskbar, System Tray and Start Menu and simply will NEVER use the new Start Menu again except to play with it. It's simply stupid on the desktop.
3) Windows 8 and GAMES:
I've tested 40 games and most work fine.
(Call of Duty: Modern Warfare #1 is incredibly sluggish with low frame rates. Strange.)
- stutters during the daytime. This is a known issue to the company and strangely they have not or can not fix it as it's been months. Very pissed off. I thought it might be a Windows 8 issue at first. I'll put it aside for a few months.
Batman Arkham City:
Since you sound like a gamer, I thought I'd throw this in in case you weren't aware:
*DISABLE DX11 and PHYSX completely. It causes major stuttering and they aren't fixing this. I retested with my new system (i7-3770K/GTX680/16GB 2133MHz) and it still sucks. Neither feature is visually very important anyway. Smooth gameplay is the important thing.
Spider-Man Web of Shadows:
Actually a very good game. You MUST disable hyper-threading in your BIOS or the game will be unplayably sluggish. Oddly, I tried to on my Asus Z77 Sabertooth and it did NOT disable in Windows 8. Still investigating if it's a BIOS or Windows issue. It shows disabled in the BIOS but all eight threads are active in W8. Weird.