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Upgrade GTX 660 vs 7850/7870

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September 29, 2012 2:34:39 PM

I am upgrading from a GTX 250

AMD X4 955 BE @3.6GHZ
4GB Ram
1680x1050 (looking to upgrade to 1920x1080)
500W PSU
MOBO is crossfire ready

Budget is sub 250, so far i am looking into the GTX 660 (non ti) and either the 7850 or the 7870 if I can find a great deal.
a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
September 29, 2012 2:48:58 PM

ASUS HD7870-DC2-2GD5 Radeon HD 7870 GHz Edition 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card
Free sleeping dogs game w/ purchase, limited offer http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168... $249.99

$229.99 after $20.00 rebate(s)
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a c 123 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
September 29, 2012 3:51:35 PM

Benchmarks favour the HD7870 slightly. It's back and forth with several games, but with several noticeable larger wins on the HD7870 side (due to the memory bandwidth bottleneck on the 660).

You really can't go "wrong" with either card but I'd recommend the HD7870. With a free game that also completely changes the value as well.

So get the mentioned Asus, or this card:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
Anonymous
a c 117 U Graphics card
September 29, 2012 4:06:27 PM

photonboy said:
Benchmarks favour the HD7870 slightly. It's back and forth with several games, but with several noticeable larger wins on the HD7870 side (due to the memory bandwidth bottleneck on the 660).

You really can't go "wrong" with either card but I'd recommend the HD7870. With a free game that also completely changes the value as well.

So get the mentioned Asus, or this card:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

noticeable wins? proof please (and 1 -3 fps is not a win but a TIE)







don't see any "memory bottleneck" any where . . .

bottom line it depends on what games the OP is playing to find the better value.
September 29, 2012 4:07:37 PM

photonboy said:
Benchmarks favour the HD7870 slightly. It's back and forth with several games, but with several noticeable larger wins on the HD7870 side (due to the memory bandwidth bottleneck on the 660).

You really can't go "wrong" with either card but I'd recommend the HD7870. With a free game that also completely changes the value as well.

So get the mentioned Asus, or this card:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


+1

and the HD7870 OC better than the 660
a b U Graphics card
September 29, 2012 4:29:45 PM



I agree man and those is some good charts scores was a bit closer then i thought..Even tho the 7950/7970 has better memory bandwidth i think it does depend on what games you play and ive seen different cards favor different games so its really a no lose situation and it comes down to what games "you" play and what you want out of your games
September 30, 2012 2:14:41 PM

The most intense games I have are The Witcher 2 and GuildWars2
a b U Graphics card
September 30, 2012 2:16:28 PM

WiseBagus said:
The most intense games I have are The Witcher 2 and GuildWars2


The 660 (non ti) would do you just fine
a c 123 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 3:24:15 AM

Benchmark results:

It seems the HD7850 and GTX660 are really back and forth. You can find some reviews with 10 games that favor the HD7850, but then find a different review with different games that favor the GTX660.

So I say consider them equal for performance and look at OTHER factors.

I lean towards NVidia these days by a small margin due to these reasons:
1) adaptive VSYNC
2) PhysX
3) TXAA (Unreal 4 engine and others coming)
4) better driver support (IMO, don't flame me. did a lot of reading on this)

When I bought my HD5870 I went AMD solely because NVidia's only competing products ran HOT and LOUD. Unless there's VALUE to be had, I can't actually think of one solid reason to go with an AMD card.
a b U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 5:11:02 AM

I vote GTX 660. I was in the same boat as you and really considered picking up a 7870. The performance is so close to each other it really is a push. Having to roll back drivers just to achieve stability with my now backup hd6770 is what really made the decision for me.

Good Luck
a c 92 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 6:17:50 AM


take a look at metro. Some other games would be crysis 1. You happen to link a heavily OC'ed 660 but if you look the stock 660 is far less powerful. The 7870 is almost always more powerful.
a c 92 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 6:22:09 AM

WiseBagus said:
The most intense games I have are The Witcher 2 and GuildWars2


the 7850 is faster than the reference 660 and the 7870 is much faster.


no 660 but you can see that the 7870's performance is pretty good.
a b U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 6:45:33 AM

esrever said:
take a look at metro. Some other games would be crysis 1. You happen to link a heavily OC'ed 660 but if you look the stock 660 is far less powerful. The 7870 is almost always more powerful.



And this shows that the 660 660 Ti 7950 and 7970 are doing good
Anonymous
a c 117 U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 8:06:57 AM

esrever said:
take a look at metro. Some other games would be crysis 1. You happen to link a heavily OC'ed 660 but if you look the stock 660 is far less powerful. The 7870 is almost always more powerful.

a .8 fps more is a win, really?!? sad. didn't find a cyrsis1 bench in the review and it is the one of more latest reviews for it uses the latest drivers. clearly you need to look at the benches again because the only bench that the 78070 is more "powerful" is D3 . . and you missed SC2 where a stock 660 even beats a stock 7970.

don't take my post out of context; which was a reply to the claim that a 7870 "noticeably wins" over a 660 in all games. less than 5% FPS is not a noticeable win for either card. so to say the 7870 is better would not be correct with that criteria, but spin it any way you want.
a c 92 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 8:42:11 AM

Anonymous said:
a .8 fps more is a win, really?!? sad. didn't find a cyrsis1 bench in the review and it is the one of more latest reviews for it uses the latest drivers. clearly you need to look at the benches again because the only bench that the 78070 is more "powerful" is D3 . . and you missed SC2 where a stock 660 even beats a stock 7970.

don't take my post out of context; which was a reply to the claim that a 7870 "noticeably wins" over a 660 in all games. less than 5% FPS is not a noticeable win for either card. so to say the 7870 is better would not be correct with that criteria, but spin it any way you want.

you do know there is a compilation of the benchmarks at the end of the review right? Rather than you go and pick the ones that work for you.



you can see that the 7870 is faster than the stock 660 and it took the asus overclocked version to match its performance. Considering the 660 costs more than the stock clocked 7870s I don't see your point.
Anonymous
a c 117 U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 10:27:53 AM

esrever said:
you do know there is a compilation of the benchmarks at the end of the review right? Rather than you go and pick the ones that work for you.

http://tpucdn.com/reviews/ASUS/GeForce_GTX_660_Direct_Cu_II/images/perfrel_1920.gif

you can see that the 7870 is faster than the stock 660 and it took the asus overclocked version to match its performance. Considering the 660 costs more than the stock clocked 7870s I don't see your point.

are you serous?
you really think i or any intelligent reader is going to fall for that spin your trying to put on this?

that is a horrible benchmark.

why?

because if card A beats card B in four games by 8% but card B beats A in one game by 10% then it would appear that card B is better by 2% and that would be an erroneous conclusion esp. if the user isn't playing the fifth game but does play the other four.

are you going for troll status on this thread?

edit: and prices for the 660 are generally less than a 7870 . .
http://pcpartpicker.com/parts/video-card/#c=114,82&sort...
a c 123 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 11:16:43 AM

SOME BUNDLES to compare (borderlands 2 is $60, Sleeping Dogs is $50)

GTX660Ti + Borderlands 2: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

HD7850 + sleeping dogs: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

HD7950 + sleeping dogs: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

*The HD7950 seems a good value if you want the game bundled. Sapphire Tech is known for quality cards. You can't go wrong with any of these cards IMO.

The bundle is $310, so the card itself is $260 (after $50 game). I think it would be hard to beat the value of the card at this price.

THOUGHTS?
a c 123 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 11:51:55 AM

http://www.sapphiretech.com/presentation/product/?cid=1...

I believe this is the HD7950 I reference above.

*It's important to note that this card appears to have an identical feature to the NVIDIA GPU BOOST! It's called "Powertune Dynamic Boost".

Why is this important?

The card basically sets a maximum thermal load it can't go over. This is good because:
a) can BOOST performance slightly if thermal limit isn't maxed out

b) card can't overheat and DIE like previous cards

Previous go GPU BOOST or this new AMD equivalent (only on some of the new HD7000 series) they had to set a specific clock frequency for the GPU and if the room was hot and/or a game or benchmark utility (FURMARK) was too demanding you could actually KILL YOUR CARD.

Hope that made sense.

The important thing is this feature is a GOOD THING.
a b U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 3:46:22 PM

Everytime theres card vs card yall go into a debate battle which confuses people.. BOTH cards is good
a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 4:13:34 PM

determinologyz said:
Everytime theres card vs card yall go into a debate battle which confuses people.. BOTH cards is good
+1 the problem though is the person buying wants to know which is better which that depends on all sorts of stuff that's why the debates and sometimes it's just because fanboy non sense.
October 2, 2012 4:30:48 PM

Anonymous said:
are you serous?
you really think i or any intelligent reader is going to fall for that spin your trying to put on this?

that is a horrible benchmark.

why?

because if card A beats card B in four games by 8% but card B beats A in one game by 10% then it would appear that card B is better by 2% and that would be an erroneous conclusion esp. if the user isn't playing the fifth game but does play the other four.

are you going for troll status on this thread?

edit: and prices for the 660 are generally less than a 7870 . .
http://pcpartpicker.com/parts/video-card/#c=114,82&sort...


Actually, what he posted is the most accurate way to look at the two cards. He even used the exact same site and comparisons from the same article. So if anyone is trying to put a spin on something its you. The OP asked which card is better, he didn't specify which games he wants to play, etc. The chart shows overall percentages from all the games tested.

It also shows that the 660 only beats a stock 7870 if it is OC'd. Get an OC'd 7870 in the mix, which overclocks better than a 660, and the difference will be even greater.

TLDR: You can't go wrong with either card, but the 7870 will offer more performance and longevity due to the non crippled memory bandwidth.
a b U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 5:24:19 PM

Bolivious said:
Actually, what he posted is the most accurate way to look at the two cards. He even used the exact same site and comparisons from the same article. So if anyone is trying to put a spin on something its you. The OP asked which card is better, he didn't specify which games he wants to play, etc. The chart shows overall percentages from all the games tested.

It also shows that the 660 only beats a stock 7870 if it is OC'd. Get an OC'd 7870 in the mix, which overclocks better than a 660, and the difference will be even greater.

TLDR: You can't go wrong with either card, but the 7870 will offer more performance and longevity due to the non crippled memory bandwidth.


My honest opinion memory bandwidth hasnt been a prob for me and alot of people has been going off of batman arkham city benchmark and im not to crazy on how that game was optimized either but for the most part im able to play with good frames rates. I had a choice between the 7950 and 660 Ti and i went with the 660 and yea yall could say it has ALOT more bandwidth but from what ive seen its only been a few frames difference in alot of games and i play at 1080p so im good
Anonymous
a c 117 U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 5:24:57 PM

Bolivious said:
Actually, what he posted is the most accurate way to look at the two cards. He even used the exact same site and comparisons from the same article. So if anyone is trying to put a spin on something its you. The OP asked which card is better, he didn't specify which games he wants to play, etc. The chart shows overall percentages from all the games tested.

It also shows that the 660 only beats a stock 7870 if it is OC'd. Get an OC'd 7870 in the mix, which overclocks better than a 660, and the difference will be even greater.

TLDR: You can't go wrong with either card, but the 7870 will offer more performance and longevity due to the non crippled memory bandwidth.

no again that is a horrible measurement. along with what i said before; what is the percentage in relation to? 25 fps, 40 fps, 60 fps pr 100 fps?
8% difference of 25 is 2 fps . .wow, yeah that would be huge in what i am going to spend my hard earned money on. (if you didn't get it that was sarcasm)

bottom line is stock for stock both cards are equal because of trading blows depending on the game. no spin there.

anything else (overclocking, memory bandwidth) is putting a spin on it; because just as you pointed out that at that time no one mentioned any game; neither was any reference made to a particular manufacturer or model.
a b U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 5:29:44 PM

Anonymous said:
no again that is a horrible measurement. along with what i said before; what is the percentage in relation to? 25 fps, 40 fps, 60 fps pr 100 fps?
8% difference of 25 is 2 fps . .wow, yeah that would be huge in what i am going to spend my hard earned money on. (if you didn't get it that was sarcasm)

bottom line is stock for stock both cards are equal because of trading blows depending on the game. no spin there.

anything else (overclocking, memory bandwidth) is putting a spin on it; because just as you pointed out that at that time no one mentioned any game; neither was any reference made to a particular manufacturer or model.


Wait man 2 frames..YOO im getting that card bro!!! lol
a c 92 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 5:40:00 PM

Anonymous said:
no again that is a horrible measurement. along with what i said before; what is the percentage in relation to? 25 fps, 40 fps, 60 fps pr 100 fps?
8% difference of 25 is 2 fps . .wow, yeah that would be huge in what i am going to spend my hard earned money on. (if you didn't get it that was sarcasm)

bottom line is stock for stock both cards are equal because of trading blows depending on the game. no spin there.

anything else (overclocking, memory bandwidth) is putting a spin on it; because just as you pointed out that at that time no one mentioned any game; neither was any reference made to a particular manufacturer or model.

And the 660 is only 9% faster than the 7850, might well say the 660 is equal to the 7850 then amirite?
Anonymous
a c 117 U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 6:07:51 PM

esrever said:
And the 660 is only 9% faster than the 7850, might well say the 660 is equal to the 7850 then amirite?

in metro and D3 i wouldn't mind having a 7850 compared to a 660 so in those two instances you are right.
a b U Graphics card
October 2, 2012 6:12:37 PM

bigcyco1 said:
If your picking your card only based on games here this might help click on it to enlarge ]http://imageshack.us/a/img685/2592/2066vs787big.png

Uploaded with ImageShack.us Source: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/graphics/display/gefor... and see if more than half the games you play appear on this list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_games_with_hardwar... hope that helps like i said can't go wrong either way imo.


Good stuff on the chart bro
a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
October 2, 2012 6:25:33 PM

determinologyz said:
Good stuff on the chart bro
Thanks i can't take all the credit though it's from a thread i made asking for everybody to help me figure out which games favored which hardware found here http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/122827-25-list-game...
September 16, 2013 3:57:22 PM

This thread didn gave me cance.. Go fight in the PM dont confuse the one who makes the thread or who checks the thread to know which card is better ! ffs -_- I m doing a reply on 1 year old thread but it was needed lol
a c 169 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
September 16, 2013 6:06:05 PM

to be honest, you probably wont notice the difference between gtx660 and 7870 while playing a game they are so close in performance. especially with a phenom x4 you are going to be cpu bound most of the time anyway. I would just be looking at features/price/game bundle. and if you want to go dual cards for sli/crossfire in future, nvidia offers a better dual card solution with better drivers/game support. Forget about memory bandwidth BS that people rave on about, it is not the only thing determining a cards performance, the benchmarks speak for themselves and its a toss up between different sites benchmarking, games, test setup, in game settings etc as to which card is better. the 7870 has a small lead overall, but is also generally more expensive, not to mention you wont find a factory clocked gtx660 anywhere, they are all OC versions which negates any difference in performance, and there are plenty of factory OC'd 7870's too.

Best solution

a c 123 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
September 17, 2013 5:42:05 PM
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I don't know why you guys are responding here, but this old thread should be CLOSED.
a c 169 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
September 20, 2013 5:19:21 AM

photonboy said:
I don't know why you guys are responding here, but this old thread should be CLOSED.


But maybe he has been dwelling on this answer for a year?........but probably not.

good 1 photonboy, you get best answer!
!