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Lexar does right !

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June 21, 2005 3:30:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.

Now, when I want to get an additional 4GB card for my 350D/RebXT will
you have some identification on the card or package so I will know
which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.

More about : lexar

Anonymous
June 21, 2005 3:30:46 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Marty wrote:

> Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
> weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
> number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.

You're thanking a company that sold you a _defective_ product which took
2 weeks to resolve?

> which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
> Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.

"Made in USA" probably means the packaged device. The chip inside
("value") was likely fab'd in S. Korea, Taiwan, Japan or ... China.

Cheers,
Alan




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Anonymous
June 21, 2005 6:12:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Alan Browne wrote:

> They are reprogramming chips.

They are replacing the cards, not reprogramming them.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0506/05061001lexar_80xcard...

"Follow the instructions to send the completed RMA form along
with the Lexar product to the nearest Lexar office where the
card will be exchanged for a card with the updated firmware."

If the two weeks is an accurate report, then it is nuts: why not just
let people walk into any store with a good 80x card, do the switch in a
second, and then let the dealer 'wait' the two weeks?
Related resources
June 21, 2005 6:18:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 08:03:36 -0400, Alan Browne
<alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

>Marty wrote:
>
>> Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
>> weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
>> number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.
>
>You're thanking a company that sold you a _defective_ product which took
>2 weeks to resolve?

Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things. Also,
maybe it was "defective" because it was made before the release of the
newest Canons. No one EVER corrected my lemon Mazda and I tried for
years.

>> which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
>> Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.
>
>"Made in USA" probably means the packaged device. The chip inside
>("value") was likely fab'd in S. Korea, Taiwan, Japan or ... China.
>

Well I believe you are right. Still, at least it is supposedly put
together here. BTW, I also have a couple of SanDisks and they are
fine. I just like the way Lexar handled this problem.

Cheers to you as well,
Marty

>Cheers,
>Alan
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 6:18:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Marty wrote:

> On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 08:03:36 -0400, Alan Browne
> <alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>
>>Marty wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
>>>weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
>>>number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.
>>
>>You're thanking a company that sold you a _defective_ product which took
>>2 weeks to resolve?
>
>
> Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things. Also,
> maybe it was "defective" because it was made before the release of the
> newest Canons. No one EVER corrected my lemon Mazda and I tried for
> years.

If it was Canon's fault, you could be sure that Lexar would not be
fixing it.

I have a Lexar (1GB 40x), but my next card (quite soon now) will
probably be SanDisk.

Cheers,
Alan

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Anonymous
June 21, 2005 6:18:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"Marty" <ehasz@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:o 28gb19385plusbfnppkoqcmur721l5jpj@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 08:03:36 -0400, Alan Browne
> <alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
> >Marty wrote:
> >
> >> Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
> >> weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
> >> number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.
> >
> >You're thanking a company that sold you a _defective_ product which took
> >2 weeks to resolve?
>
> Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things.

When I lost an IBM Deathstar harddrive I received one next day.

When the compression nut broke on my mountain bike's front disk brake I
shipped it to Avid, they replaced the broken hardware and cut the hydraulic
hose to the length I specified, and had it back to me the day after they
received them. All at their expense.

When Frame Destination mishipped one insignicant mount they sent me another
next day with two free gifts.

When Harris Cyclery mishipped me some brakes, due to the manufacturer
mispackaging the item (I received two right levers), they shipped next day
and threw in some small gifts.

2 weeks is BS.

Greg
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 7:50:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 09:10:00 -0700, "G.T." <getnews1@dslextreme.com>
wrote:

>
>"Marty" <ehasz@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:o 28gb19385plusbfnppkoqcmur721l5jpj@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 08:03:36 -0400, Alan Browne
>> <alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>> >Marty wrote:
>> >
>> >> Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
>> >> weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
>> >> number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.
>> >
>> >You're thanking a company that sold you a _defective_ product which took
>> >2 weeks to resolve?
>>
>> Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things.
>
>When I lost an IBM Deathstar harddrive I received one next day.
>
>When the compression nut broke on my mountain bike's front disk brake I
>shipped it to Avid, they replaced the broken hardware and cut the hydraulic
>hose to the length I specified, and had it back to me the day after they
>received them. All at their expense.
>
>When Frame Destination mishipped one insignicant mount they sent me another
>next day with two free gifts.
>
>When Harris Cyclery mishipped me some brakes, due to the manufacturer
>mispackaging the item (I received two right levers), they shipped next day
>and threw in some small gifts.
>
>2 weeks is BS.
>
>Greg

You have to give the Chinese slave labour time
to ramp up production. They don't work too fast
on that 1500 calorie a day ration. :) 
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 8:49:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

>> Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things.
>
> When I lost an IBM Deathstar harddrive I received one next day.
>
> When the compression nut broke on my mountain bike's front disk brake I
> shipped it to Avid, they replaced the broken hardware and cut the
> hydraulic
> hose to the length I specified, and had it back to me the day after they
> received them. All at their expense.
>
> When Frame Destination mishipped one insignicant mount they sent me
> another
> next day with two free gifts.
>
> When Harris Cyclery mishipped me some brakes, due to the manufacturer
> mispackaging the item (I received two right levers), they shipped next day
> and threw in some small gifts.
>
> 2 weeks is BS.

You guys are kinda harsh! Lexar identified the problem as one of their own
making (rather than blame someone else, *or*, as is popular these days,
spend a whole lot of time "researching the problem", basically stalling for
time while they figure out whether it's worthwhile to bother with a fix or
just figure a few malcontents aren't going to kill their product). And in a
remarkably-short period of time (given manufacturing lead times) they came
out with a new card, with new firmware, and are shipping them to customers.

The other things you mentioned already had ready-to-go "fixes". Nobody had
to redesign and build something new. And as for the IBM Deathstar, you're
lucky you only went through one. I had two or three die. Yes, IBM replaced
them promptly, but what they replaced them with also failed prematurely.

Lexar isn't perfect, and the flap over them caused me to buy a different
product, but I wouldn't write them off as a terrible company based upon how
they're handling this.

Just my two cents.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 8:49:34 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <xyXte.716$N22.339@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>,
Mike Jacoubowsky <MikeJ1@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

[ ... ]

>You guys are kinda harsh! Lexar identified the problem as one of their own
>making (rather than blame someone else, *or*, as is popular these days,
>spend a whole lot of time "researching the problem", basically stalling for
>time while they figure out whether it's worthwhile to bother with a fix or
>just figure a few malcontents aren't going to kill their product). And in a
>remarkably-short period of time (given manufacturing lead times) they came
>out with a new card, with new firmware, and are shipping them to customers.
>
>The other things you mentioned already had ready-to-go "fixes". Nobody had
>to redesign and build something new. And as for the IBM Deathstar, you're

Out of curiosity -- "Deathstar"? I remember that name being
applied to the AT&T computer logo, but not to IBM's.

>lucky you only went through one. I had two or three die. Yes, IBM replaced
>them promptly, but what they replaced them with also failed prematurely.

*And* -- the other screw-ups and fixes mentioned weren't dealing
with the *quantity* of exchanges. Yes, two weeks for a single bad CF
card is a bit long. But -- two weeks given the number that they had to
replace -- the logistics must have been a nightmare.

>Lexar isn't perfect, and the flap over them caused me to buy a different
>product, but I wouldn't write them off as a terrible company based upon how
>they're handling this.

And I have two of the 80X 1GB Lexars which happen to not bear
the deadly product codes, and have been quite happy with them. I would
(and will) buy more from them.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 8:49:34 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:xyXte.716$N22.339@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
> >> Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things.
> >
> > When I lost an IBM Deathstar harddrive I received one next day.
> >
> > When the compression nut broke on my mountain bike's front disk brake I
> > shipped it to Avid, they replaced the broken hardware and cut the
> > hydraulic
> > hose to the length I specified, and had it back to me the day after they
> > received them. All at their expense.
> >
> > When Frame Destination mishipped one insignicant mount they sent me
> > another
> > next day with two free gifts.
> >
> > When Harris Cyclery mishipped me some brakes, due to the manufacturer
> > mispackaging the item (I received two right levers), they shipped next
day
> > and threw in some small gifts.
> >
> > 2 weeks is BS.
>
> You guys are kinda harsh! Lexar identified the problem as one of their own
> making (rather than blame someone else, *or*, as is popular these days,
> spend a whole lot of time "researching the problem", basically stalling
for
> time while they figure out whether it's worthwhile to bother with a fix or
> just figure a few malcontents aren't going to kill their product). And in
a
> remarkably-short period of time (given manufacturing lead times) they came
> out with a new card, with new firmware, and are shipping them to
customers.
>
> The other things you mentioned already had ready-to-go "fixes".

And you think that Lexar didn't start manufacturing replacements until 2
weeks ago? They've probably been pumping them out for weeks. They changed
their mind about flashing the customers' cards and sending them back. They
supposedly were shipping out new or refurbished cards from their stock.

> Nobody had
> to redesign and build something new. And as for the IBM Deathstar, you're
> lucky you only went through one. I had two or three die. Yes, IBM replaced
> them promptly, but what they replaced them with also failed prematurely.
>
> Lexar isn't perfect, and the flap over them caused me to buy a different
> product, but I wouldn't write them off as a terrible company based upon
how
> they're handling this.
>

I don't think they're a terrible company. I just think 2 weeks is weak. I
own some of their older cards along with a card reader but I switched to
SanDisk for CF awhile back because I think they have a better cost/speed
ratio.

Greg
June 21, 2005 9:19:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
>>>Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things.
>>
>>When I lost an IBM Deathstar harddrive I received one next day.
>>
>>When the compression nut broke on my mountain bike's front disk brake I
>>shipped it to Avid, they replaced the broken hardware and cut the
>>hydraulic
>>hose to the length I specified, and had it back to me the day after they
>>received them. All at their expense.
>>
>>When Frame Destination mishipped one insignicant mount they sent me
>>another
>>next day with two free gifts.
>>
>>When Harris Cyclery mishipped me some brakes, due to the manufacturer
>>mispackaging the item (I received two right levers), they shipped next day
>>and threw in some small gifts.
>>
>>2 weeks is BS.
>
>
> You guys are kinda harsh! Lexar identified the problem as one of their own
> making (rather than blame someone else, *or*, as is popular these days,
> spend a whole lot of time "researching the problem", basically stalling for
> time while they figure out whether it's worthwhile to bother with a fix or
> just figure a few malcontents aren't going to kill their product). And in a
> remarkably-short period of time (given manufacturing lead times) they came
> out with a new card, with new firmware, and are shipping them to customers.
>
> The other things you mentioned already had ready-to-go "fixes". Nobody had
> to redesign and build something new. And as for the IBM Deathstar, you're
> lucky you only went through one. I had two or three die. Yes, IBM replaced
> them promptly, but what they replaced them with also failed prematurely.
>
> Lexar isn't perfect, and the flap over them caused me to buy a different
> product, but I wouldn't write them off as a terrible company based upon how
> they're handling this.
>
> Just my two cents.
>
> --Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
> www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


There is nothing to praise about Lexar. IBM replaced my deathstar and
microdrive. SanDisk replaced my firewire CF reader. They all had to be
RMA a couple of times and they all replaced promptly. However, they are
all illy designed so it doesn't matter how many times they replace them
and they'll die eventually. I sold the microdrive after I got the new
replacement. Despite I have lots of issues with the SanDisk firewire CF
reader, all other SanDisk 8-in-1 USB2 reader and various memories cards
are trouble free.
June 21, 2005 9:54:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

G.T. wrote:
> "Mike Jacoubowsky" <mikej1@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
> news:xyXte.716$N22.339@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>
>>>>Yes. I think 2 weeks is pretty fast considering all things.
>>>
>>>When I lost an IBM Deathstar harddrive I received one next day.
>>>
>>>When the compression nut broke on my mountain bike's front disk brake I
>>>shipped it to Avid, they replaced the broken hardware and cut the
>>>hydraulic
>>>hose to the length I specified, and had it back to me the day after they
>>>received them. All at their expense.
>>>
>>>When Frame Destination mishipped one insignicant mount they sent me
>>>another
>>>next day with two free gifts.
>>>
>>>When Harris Cyclery mishipped me some brakes, due to the manufacturer
>>>mispackaging the item (I received two right levers), they shipped next
>
> day
>
>>>and threw in some small gifts.
>>>
>>>2 weeks is BS.
>>
>>You guys are kinda harsh! Lexar identified the problem as one of their own
>>making (rather than blame someone else, *or*, as is popular these days,
>>spend a whole lot of time "researching the problem", basically stalling
>
> for
>
>>time while they figure out whether it's worthwhile to bother with a fix or
>>just figure a few malcontents aren't going to kill their product). And in
>
> a
>
>>remarkably-short period of time (given manufacturing lead times) they came
>>out with a new card, with new firmware, and are shipping them to
>
> customers.
>
>>The other things you mentioned already had ready-to-go "fixes".
>
>
> And you think that Lexar didn't start manufacturing replacements until 2
> weeks ago? They've probably been pumping them out for weeks. They changed
> their mind about flashing the customers' cards and sending them back. They
> supposedly were shipping out new or refurbished cards from their stock.
>
>
>>Nobody had
>>to redesign and build something new. And as for the IBM Deathstar, you're
>>lucky you only went through one. I had two or three die. Yes, IBM replaced
>>them promptly, but what they replaced them with also failed prematurely.
>>
>>Lexar isn't perfect, and the flap over them caused me to buy a different
>>product, but I wouldn't write them off as a terrible company based upon
>
> how
>
>>they're handling this.
>>
>
>
> I don't think they're a terrible company. I just think 2 weeks is weak. I
> own some of their older cards along with a card reader but I switched to
> SanDisk for CF awhile back because I think they have a better cost/speed
> ratio.
>
> Greg


I think 2-week means from the time the guy drops off the package at the
shipping company. It's a reasonable time frame. I doubt anyone would do
cross-shipping in that case.
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 9:54:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

leo wrote:

> I think 2-week means from the time the guy drops off the package at the
> shipping company. It's a reasonable time frame. I doubt anyone would do
> cross-shipping in that case.

When you consider that the 'touch' time for the device is probably less
than 30 minutes (receiving, inpsection, return prep, reprogram, test,
return to shipping), 2 weeks is about 10 to 11 days of slack time.
Truly poor CTM.

Cheers,
Alan.

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June 21, 2005 10:36:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Alan Browne wrote:
> leo wrote:
>
>> I think 2-week means from the time the guy drops off the package at
>> the shipping company. It's a reasonable time frame. I doubt anyone
>> would do cross-shipping in that case.
>
>
> When you consider that the 'touch' time for the device is probably less
> than 30 minutes (receiving, inpsection, return prep, reprogram, test,
> return to shipping), 2 weeks is about 10 to 11 days of slack time. Truly
> poor CTM.
>
> Cheers,
> Alan.


But you disregard about where the shipper lives and where is the
destination. Maybe the product is very important to worthwhile to ship
overnight. I generally use UPS ground, shipping from east coast to west
coast (where most manufacturers locate). I think the turn around time
within the company is possibly one to two day. How would you know how
much time is spend in shipping or sitting at the warehouse? Also, a
company might experience temporary out-of-stock situation. It's a
replacement of a new product and they also pay for one way shipping. You
might be demanding too much, and also also expecting LOW prices.
Anonymous
June 21, 2005 10:36:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

leo wrote:

> Alan Browne wrote:
>
>> leo wrote:
>>
>>> I think 2-week means from the time the guy drops off the package at
>>> the shipping company. It's a reasonable time frame. I doubt anyone
>>> would do cross-shipping in that case.
>>
>>
>>
>> When you consider that the 'touch' time for the device is probably
>> less than 30 minutes (receiving, inpsection, return prep, reprogram,
>> test, return to shipping), 2 weeks is about 10 to 11 days of slack
>> time. Truly poor CTM.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Alan.
>
>
>
> But you disregard about where the shipper lives and where is the
> destination. Maybe the product is very important to worthwhile to ship
> overnight. I generally use UPS ground, shipping from east coast to west
> coast (where most manufacturers locate).

Even by regular mail, the ship to / return from time should not be more
than 4-6 days total in the US. By other shipping, no more than 2 days
total.

> I think the turn around time
> within the company is possibly one to two day. How would you know how
> much time is spend in shipping or sitting at the warehouse? Also, a
> company might experience temporary out-of-stock situation. It's a
> replacement of a new product and they also pay for one way shipping. You
> might be demanding too much, and also also expecting LOW prices.

Sitting in a warehouse is exactly what should be avoided. They should
be paying two way shipping and do it post haste.

They are reprogramming chips. If it were a replacement, then the time
should be 0; they should simply ship replacements to the customer (24 to
48 hours, max).

LOW prices? The manufacturing cost of these things is on the order of
$10 - $20, if that much. The rest is distribution, marketing,
margin/profit.

These devices are bought by people who make their living in photography.
These people have other cards to cover them in the meantime, but they
also expect to get their materials back FAST.

Cheers,
Alan

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-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 3:19:09 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 11:30:45 GMT, Marty <ehasz@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
>weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
>number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.
>
>Now, when I want to get an additional 4GB card for my 350D/RebXT will
>you have some identification on the card or package so I will know
>which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
>Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.

I'll up my 1 Gig card on eBay as soon as it gets back. I'll take my
Sandisk Extreme III's made in China any day over Lexar. I don't have
to worry about their firmware.


****************************************************************

"Anarchism is both a religious faith and a rational philosophy;
and many of its anomalies are the product of the clash between
the two, and of the tensions between the different kinds of
temperament which they represent."

_The Anarchists_
James Joll - 1964
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 4:45:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Tue, 21 Jun 2005 11:30:45 GMT, Marty <ehasz@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
>weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
>number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.

Are you serious, or just astroturfing to try and still some of the bad
PR that is flowing Lexar's way at the moment? Lexar get no thanks
what so ever from me. I returned my defective cards on June 2nd to
Lexar UK and heard nothing for a couple of weeks (they promised an
average 7 days turnaround) so I chased it up on the 13th with Lexar
UK. I was informed that Lexar UK was merely collating the cards and
shipping to the US for processing and was advised to contact the US
office for an update. I did just that and was assured that they would
be shipping my card later that day (this was the 14th), which has now
been clearly revealled to be a lie.

Today (June 21st), I have received an email from Lexar US saying that
they will begin processing replacement cards with new firmware on June
22nd - what happened to "ship later today"? Not only that, but their
clueless mail admins have configured their mail system to scan
outbound email, which would be good except for the fact that their
config exposes the recipients email addresses even if they were BCC'd.
I have over two hundred personal email addresses of Lexar customers in
my email box at the moment, all of which stand to get a lot of junk
email if any of them own a PC infected with a mass mailing worm. Not
to mention the potential for a phishing attack - "Dear Lexar customer,
please go to the following website and confirm your details so we can
despatch your replacement card. Also, if you would care to enter your
credit card details, we will ship you additional Lexar cards at these
special prices as a compensatory gesture..."

I gave Lexar three times their stated turnaround time, which they
still failed to meet, and I was forced to buy additional (not Lexar,
obviously) memory cards to meet my photographic commitments. I am
*extremely* pissed off, will never buy another product from Lexar
again, and will advise anyone who asks me for advice on memory cards
to do the same.

>Now, when I want to get an additional 4GB card for my 350D/RebXT will
>you have some identification on the card or package so I will know
>which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
>Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.

Are you sure about that "Made in the USA"? I'd be very surprised if
it's not just "Assembled in the USA" as pretty much all the raw memory
chips that go into the construction of DIMMs, memory cards and
everything else are manufactured in the far east. At least one major
computer manufacturer (Dell) essentially gets all of its PC built in
China, shipping in component form to Ireland for assembly and still
qualifies for a "Made in Ireland" sticker...

Andy
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 5:09:45 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On 21 Jun 2005 13:28:17 -0400, dnichols@d-and-d.com (DoN. Nichols)
wrote:

> Out of curiosity -- "Deathstar"? I remember that name being
>applied to the AT&T computer logo, but not to IBM's.

It's a pun on the name "DeskStar", a range of IBM hard disks that had
some models that were extremely problematic and prone to catastrophic
failure with total data loss. The drives were heavily used in IBM
desktops and also OEM systems so it impacted a *lot* of people, many
of whom had no backups and blamed their OEMs, prompting them to switch
to alternate HDD suppliers. The huge amount of bad PR that IBM got
from the whole debacle almost certainly led to IBM's selling off of
its hard disk division shortly afterward.

> *And* -- the other screw-ups and fixes mentioned weren't dealing
>with the *quantity* of exchanges. Yes, two weeks for a single bad CF
>card is a bit long. But -- two weeks given the number that they had to
>replace -- the logistics must have been a nightmare.

Doesn't appear to have stopped them shipping new cards to suppliers
instead of looking after their existing end-user customers though. At
least, they all seemed to have *plenty* of Lexar cards in stock when I
was hunting around for SanDisk cards (which appear to be sold out
almost everywhere in the UK, BTW) to replace those Lexar still has.

> And I have two of the 80X 1GB Lexars which happen to not bear
>the deadly product codes, and have been quite happy with them. I would
>(and will) buy more from them.

I'm quite happy with the reliability of my Lexar cards too, but I'm
totally disgusted with the tactics taken by Lexar in dealing with the
issue - see my other post in the thread for some of the details. They
have delayed, lied, revealled customer details (come to think of it,
isn't there now a law about that in California?). Perhaps worst of
all though, they have left their defective products in the hands of
consumers who might well get badly bitten in the future, or didn't you
notice they are only swapping cards owned by users of specific Canon
cameras? What happens to someone who currently has a bad Lexar card
and a non-Canon camera, but buys one of the cameras affected by this
issue later and suffers data loss?

Andy
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 5:09:46 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <kr9hb1l0f1hpv4bmc5cmm8bcieqrro5mhi@4ax.com>,
Andy Blanchard <andyb@localhost.localdomain> wrote:
>On 21 Jun 2005 13:28:17 -0400, dnichols@d-and-d.com (DoN. Nichols)
>wrote:
>
>> Out of curiosity -- "Deathstar"? I remember that name being
>>applied to the AT&T computer logo, but not to IBM's.
>
>It's a pun on the name "DeskStar", a range of IBM hard disks that had
>some models that were extremely problematic and prone to catastrophic
>failure with total data loss. The drives were heavily used in IBM
>desktops and also OEM systems so it impacted a *lot* of people, many
>of whom had no backups and blamed their OEMs, prompting them to switch
>to alternate HDD suppliers. The huge amount of bad PR that IBM got
>from the whole debacle almost certainly led to IBM's selling off of
>its hard disk division shortly afterward.

O.K. Were these IDE disks or SCSI?

[ ... ]

>I'm quite happy with the reliability of my Lexar cards too, but I'm
>totally disgusted with the tactics taken by Lexar in dealing with the
>issue - see my other post in the thread for some of the details.

Yes, I just read it. You say that they used "Bcc: ", but still
managed to expose the addresses of the recipients? How did they manage
to do that? Could it be the receiving MTA which recorded all the local
addresses in the headers? Or do you have addresses for people using
other ISPs as well?

> They
>have delayed, lied, revealled customer details (come to think of it,
>isn't there now a law about that in California?). Perhaps worst of
>all though, they have left their defective products in the hands of
>consumers who might well get badly bitten in the future, or didn't you
>notice they are only swapping cards owned by users of specific Canon
>cameras? What happens to someone who currently has a bad Lexar card
>and a non-Canon camera, but buys one of the cameras affected by this
>issue later and suffers data loss?

Hopefully, by that time, the cameras would have been patched.
It should not be a problem for me, in that I plan to stick with Nikon,
but it might well be a problem with others -- and there should be
provisions for replacing *those* CF cards as well.

When I went to their web site, I thought that there was no
restriction that they would only replace CF cards for Cannon users, but
since my cards did not match the batch numbers for which the page was
posted, I did not have to try whether they would replace ones being used
in a Nikon. (How would they know, anyway? The only place that Cannon
comes into it is the firmware patch needed for the cameras. I believe
that the problem with the Cannons lead to exhaustive testing which also
disclosed the problems with those two batch numbers, which could affect
*any* camera -- at least in theory.

Hmm ... going back to their web site, and searching for the
information, I discovered that they are suing Toshiba for copying their
CF card technology -- which may suggest that Toshiba was the chip
foundry for their chips.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 7:42:58 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

> "Follow the instructions to send the completed RMA form along
> with the Lexar product to the nearest Lexar office where the
> card will be exchanged for a card with the updated firmware."
>
> If the two weeks is an accurate report, then it is nuts: why not just
> let people walk into any store with a good 80x card, do the switch in a
> second, and then let the dealer 'wait' the two weeks?

Or do what the disk drive companies do. Take a credit card number, send out
a new CF immediately and charge the customer if they don't get the original
back in a reasonable length of time.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
June 22, 2005 9:06:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"Marty" <ehasz@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>
> Now, when I want to get an additional 4GB card for my 350D/RebXT will
> you have some identification on the card or package so I will know
> which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
> Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.

America! F**k yeah!!
Lexar! F**k yeah!!
80x! F**k yeah!!
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 8:28:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On 21 Jun 2005 20:36:14 -0400, DoN. Nichols <dnichols@d-and-d.com> wrote:
> In article <kr9hb1l0f1hpv4bmc5cmm8bcieqrro5mhi@4ax.com>,
> Andy Blanchard <andyb@localhost.localdomain> wrote:
>>
>>It's a pun on the name "DeskStar", a range of IBM hard disks that had
>>some models that were extremely problematic and prone to catastrophic
>>failure with total data loss. The drives were heavily used in IBM
>>desktops and also OEM systems [...]
>
> O.K. Were these IDE disks or SCSI?

IDE. Note "desktop" above, and of course the "desk" in the product's
name. This all happened this century, past the era when SCSI disks
were sometimes found in desktops.

I say that from memory, but I checked it against the information on
this website, which I found through a Google search, and which looks
like it ought to be reasonably accurate.

http://www.ibmdeskstar75gxplitigation.com/

I believe that these drives were not considered suitable for server
use because they would go offline every so often for some kind of
head recalibration. Not a big issue for desktop users, but bad for
high-availability applications. I don't believe this was related to
the high failure rate. Take all of this with a grain of salt,
because I haven't been able to confirm it with Google.

> Yes, I just read it. You say that they used "Bcc: ", but still
> managed to expose the addresses of the recipients? How did they manage
> to do that? Could it be the receiving MTA which recorded all the local
> addresses in the headers? Or do you have addresses for people using
> other ISPs as well?

I think Andy implied that the problem was a badly configured (or
just badly designed) filtering SMTP proxy in Lexar's network.

--
Ben Rosengart (212) 741-4400 x215
Sometimes it only makes sense to focus our attention on those
questions that are equal parts trivial and intriguing.
--Josh Micah Marshall
Anonymous
June 22, 2005 9:15:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

In article <slrndbj4d7.p41.br@panix5.panix.com>,
Ben Rosengart <br+rpdss@panix.com> wrote:
>On 21 Jun 2005 20:36:14 -0400, DoN. Nichols <dnichols@d-and-d.com> wrote:
>> In article <kr9hb1l0f1hpv4bmc5cmm8bcieqrro5mhi@4ax.com>,
>> Andy Blanchard <andyb@localhost.localdomain> wrote:
>>>
>>>It's a pun on the name "DeskStar", a range of IBM hard disks that had
>>>some models that were extremely problematic and prone to catastrophic
>>>failure with total data loss. The drives were heavily used in IBM
>>>desktops and also OEM systems [...]
>>
>> O.K. Were these IDE disks or SCSI?
>
>IDE. Note "desktop" above, and of course the "desk" in the product's
>name. This all happened this century, past the era when SCSI disks
>were sometimes found in desktops.

Well ... I have a large number of Sun workstations (desktop
machines), and all but two use SCSI drives. The two exceptions are a
Blade 100 and an Ultra-5, both of which use IDE drives, but everything
else, including several Ultra-2s, use SCSI.

>I say that from memory, but I checked it against the information on
>this website, which I found through a Google search, and which looks
>like it ought to be reasonably accurate.
>
> http://www.ibmdeskstar75gxplitigation.com/
>
>I believe that these drives were not considered suitable for server
>use because they would go offline every so often for some kind of
>head recalibration. Not a big issue for desktop users, but bad for
>high-availability applications. I don't believe this was related to
>the high failure rate. Take all of this with a grain of salt,
>because I haven't been able to confirm it with Google.

O.K. That should be sufficient information, anyway.

>> Yes, I just read it. You say that they used "Bcc: ", but still
>> managed to expose the addresses of the recipients? How did they manage
>> to do that? Could it be the receiving MTA which recorded all the local
>> addresses in the headers? Or do you have addresses for people using
>> other ISPs as well?
>
>I think Andy implied that the problem was a badly configured (or
>just badly designed) filtering SMTP proxy in Lexar's network.

O.K. That could be.

Thanks,
DoN.

--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
June 23, 2005 5:29:57 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"Marty" <ehasz@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:j6ufb1ph94tdd66eqhgkeefinle2pg51a5@4ax.com...
> Got my new (replaced) 80x card yesterday via UPS after less than two
> weeks from when I returned it via their web site instructions and
> number procedure. THANK YOU Lexar.
>
> Now, when I want to get an additional 4GB card for my 350D/RebXT will
> you have some identification on the card or package so I will know
> which have the new firmware? As long as I have a choice, I will buy
> Made in USA Lexar rather than Made in China SanDisk.

I asked Lexar to send a replacement and charge my visa until I sent the old
one back - I can only afford one 2GB card. They said no way and wanted $10
plus shipping to pay for their mistake.

Two weeks of summer CF camera card gone. I will buy SkanDisk next time.

Lexar does wrong.
!