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Gtx 670 vs 7970 with latest drivers.

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December 20, 2012 3:29:41 PM

I know this question has been asked alot, but it seems that all the benchmarks with AMD's latest drivers and few with Nvidia's latest (310.6 / 310.7) .

My question is this. I have a 560 ti, and I'm looking at upgrading after Christmas. I was wondering what the performance difference is now that Nvidia has rolled out a new driver to combat AMD's 12.11 betas.

Anyone with a 670 on latest drivers compare their performance to the 7970 (non ghz) after the 310.7 drivers?

I only game at 1920*1080p , but I want to futureproof for at least a year, maybe two.

I'm pretty hesitant going with AMD as i've always been team green, and physx and all that (although it's pretty much only in batman and borderlands at this point, and hawken?) . Are AMD's drivers generally bad? and what is you guys recommendations?

I'm sorry to ask ANOTHER thread on this, but I haven't noticed any up to date comparisons or benches in my searches.

Thanks all!
a c 80 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 3:41:29 PM

The 7970 costs more, but it performs better too. As for drivers, it's a case of YMMV. I've heard horror stories from both sides. Personally I switched from team green to team red a few years ago and have experienced less grief with drivers since then. By chance as much as anything. Nvidia seems to get better support for stuff involving third parties - 3D, CUDA etc.
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a c 185 U Graphics card
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December 20, 2012 3:43:51 PM

The 670 and 7970 perform basically the same at stock up to 1080p resolution, trading blows depending on the game. The 7970 most likely will OC better and it will murder the 670 at high resolution (and has way more compute power), the 670 gives you CUDA , PhysX, TXAA, FXAA, ADap. Vsync etc and lower power draw. Both are solid buys.If you still can't decide which card to take try looking at the games that you play or specific features that you want.If cost really matter to you then you might want to go with whatever is cheaper to you.
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a c 109 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 4:11:53 PM

Sakkura said:
The 7970 costs more, but it performs better too. As for drivers, it's a case of YMMV. I've heard horror stories from both sides. Personally I switched from team green to team red a few years ago and have experienced less grief with drivers since then. By chance as much as anything. Nvidia seems to get better support for stuff involving third parties - 3D, CUDA etc.



What nvidia driver horror stories ? :o 
Nvidia had better drivers before and still has better drivers today, saying that switching nvidia to amd cause of the drivers, made me laugh...
As for the question, see bigcyco1 post.
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a c 80 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 4:28:43 PM

djangoringo said:
What nvidia driver horror stories ? :o 
Nvidia had better drivers before and still has better drivers today, saying that switching nvidia to amd cause of the drivers, made me laugh...
As for the question, see bigcyco1 post.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/372657-15-nvidia-dr...

Heck it's only a quick google away. Driver problems happen with all graphics cards. And I did not say anything about switching because of the drivers, so I don't know what you're laughing about. I just, for whatever reason, haven't had to roll back drivers to get a game running on my 6850. I did with my 7800 GT. Like I said, YMMV.
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a c 109 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 4:35:13 PM

If i had to put links to amd graphic cards with driver problems, it will take a year to read from...and a huge wall of text.

I had several nvidia gfx cards even before the one you mention, never had any problems.
I never seen anyone complain about the nvidia drivers from switching from amd to nvidia, now i've seen a LOT of people complaining of the drivers from switching from nvidia to amd.
There're exceptions of course.
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December 20, 2012 4:39:09 PM

djangoringo said:
If i had to put links to amd graphic cards with driver problems, it will take a year to read from...and a huge wall of text.

I had several nvidia gfx cards even before the one you mention, never had any problems.


Frankly, I know AMD had lots of drivers problems a few years back, but now not as much I think.
http://www.techspot.com/review/603-best-graphics-cards/
That has latest drivers I think?, amd catalyst 12.11 and nvidia 310.61 beta
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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December 20, 2012 4:50:56 PM

kracker said:
Frankly, I know AMD had lots of drivers problems a few years back, but now not as much I think.
http://www.techspot.com/review/603-best-graphics-cards/
That has latest drivers I think?, amd catalyst 12.11 and nvidia 310.61 beta

The latest Nvidia drivers are 310.70 WHQL.
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December 20, 2012 4:53:55 PM

Mousemonkey said:
The latest Nvidia drivers are 310.70 WHQL.


Ah ok, I see :)  So I guess it isn't that accurate
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a b U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 4:56:40 PM

With an overclock, the 7970 beats even the GTX 680.
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 5:00:40 PM

kracker said:
Ah ok, I see :)  So I guess it isn't that accurate

It might have been accurate at the time though! :lol:  Things always move on though so it might be worth checking on the latest driver versions before linking to an article published at the end of November.
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December 20, 2012 5:01:23 PM

samuelspark said:
With an overclock, the 7970 beats even the GTX 680.

But what happens when the 680 is also OC'd?
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December 20, 2012 5:02:35 PM

djangoringo said:
If i had to put links to amd graphic cards with driver problems, it will take a year to read from...and a huge wall of text.

I had several nvidia gfx cards even before the one you mention, never had any problems.
I never seen anyone complain about the nvidia drivers from switching from amd to nvidia, now i've seen a LOT of people complaining of the drivers from switching from nvidia to amd.
There're exceptions of course.


There are issues on both sides, which are largely dependent on individual hardware configurations.
Both companies have driver problems from time to time, but as was said above, the best option is to look at which games you like and which card/drivers support it better.
If that doesn't answer the question for OP, go with the cheapest and save a bit of cash.

At the end of the day, they're both fine cards.
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December 20, 2012 5:33:47 PM

djangoringo said:
If i had to put links to amd graphic cards with driver problems, it will take a year to read from...and a huge wall of text.

I had several nvidia gfx cards even before the one you mention, never had any problems.
I never seen anyone complain about the nvidia drivers and switch from amd to nvidia nVidia to AMD, now i've seen a LOT of people complaining of the drivers and switch from nvidia to amd AMD to nVidia.
There're exceptions of course.


Your forum contributions always seem to be well thought out and insightful. :sarcastic: 

Since you obviously have no bias, whatsoever, I've gone ahead and fixed your post to reflect what you meant so that people don't get confused and accidentally buy an AMD card! :o 
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a c 109 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 6:41:42 PM

In fact i recommended several amd cards here, what i was talking about was the drivers, and in that particular thing, nvidia has the advantage and by far they have better drivers, and of that nonsense of the nvidia drivers being a nightmare,bad,etc.
AMD cards have good things about like the raw performance and price point/value,some cards have the best price/performance value, and now they have good offer with the amd never settle thing.
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December 20, 2012 6:48:35 PM

djangoringo said:
In fact i recommended several amd cards here, what i was talking about was the drivers, and in that particular thing, nvidia has the advantage and by far they have better drivers, and of that nonsense of the nvidia drivers being a nightmare,bad,etc.
AMD cards have good things about like the raw performance and price point/value,some cards have the best price/performance value, and now they have good offer with the amd never settle thing.


Indeed, Nvidia's Kepler was beating the crap out of AMD's GCN on most of the cards(mostly high end), But drivers 12.7 and especially 12.11 have REALLY improved.... strange on amd though heh, they usually don't focus on drivers too much sometimes... :) 
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a c 87 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:05:00 PM

Just throwing it out there, wouldn't it make WAY more sense to just wait a couple more months and get the 700 / 8k series graphics cards? Either that or wait for then if only because the 670 and 7970 will be way cheaper.
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December 20, 2012 7:12:11 PM

Mousemonkey said:
But what happens when the 680 is also OC'd?


Aren't the 600s series more restricted on voltage? MSI got in hot waters when they bypassed the voltage control through a circuit design so their GPUs could OC better.
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December 20, 2012 7:16:43 PM

A Bad Day said:
Aren't the 600s series more restricted on voltage? MSI got in hot waters when they bypassed the voltage control through a circuit design so their GPUs could OC better.

Yes but they can still be OC'd from what I've read.
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December 20, 2012 7:30:54 PM

Yeah of course they'll overclock :-) How could manufacturers be selling factory-overclocked models otherwise? And we all know factory overclocks are very rarely anywhere near the limits of the card. But that brings up an important point anyway. It's a point that's often made in response to the 'but Radeons overclock and Geforce is left in the dust!' arguments (other than the fact GeForces also overclock) and that is that the overclock is never guaranteed. People get very different results, since not every GPU comes off the production line exactly the same. You can easily squeeze a little extra out of anything, but it might not be a lot, or as much as other people achieved.

+1 to DarkSable about waiting (and I'd agree), though the counter to that is that there will always be something better around the corner and you'll be waiting forever. And that's a valid argument too. So the important questions: firstly how close are the new models (they're pretty close) and secondly, how desperately do you need an upgrade? That one depends on the settings you want, but there's certainly no game that can't be played on your card.

Finally, with regards to drivers, I had a lot of problems on my Radeon 5970 - many blue screens at boot after an update, forcing me to use system restore. I don't recall too many problems with my other Radeons though. The GeForces I owned never had driver issues. Just one more person's experiences :-)

EDIT: With regards to performance gains from drivers, the gains with Catalyst 12.11 were good, but not the huge deal people make out. It varies by game (some see no benefit at all) but one article calculated an average gain. These varied again by the GPU (I think the sub-7850 models saw very little gain) but you were looking at ~7% on average for 7850 upwards. The reason people made such a big deal is that we're not used to seeing these kind of gains from new versions of Catalyst. Really not a game-changer though - 7% represents the difference between 30fps and 32fps.
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:34:53 PM

sam_p_lay said:
Yeah of course they'll overclock :-) How could manufacturers be selling factory-overclocked models otherwise? And we all know factory overclocks are very rarely anywhere near the limits of the card. But that brings up an important point anyway. It's a point that's often made in response to the 'but Radeons overclock and Geforce is left in the dust!' arguments (other than the fact GeForces also overclock) and that is that the overclock is never guaranteed. People get very different results, since not every GPU comes off the production line exactly the same. You can easily squeeze a little extra out of anything, but it might not be a lot, or as much as other people achieved.

AMD fAnTIc's will always overlook that rather inconvenient fact as it gets in the way of their tirade. :lol: 
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December 20, 2012 7:35:00 PM

All I can say is that a few months ago I went with a 7870 and had nothing but issues with it, Firefox crashing, "grey screen of death", games stuttered (and I mean basic games like Walking Dead), could barely over clock it, over-all I hated it wholeheartedly and felt like I made a massive error in switching teams - I was replacing a 560 (non-Ti). I contacted AMD support and they told me that all these issues "may" be fixed in future driver releases. That was the official support I received. I returned the card and went with a 670 and haven't looked back. I am sure it was more of an isolated incident with me but what I could not forgive is AMD's "support". Why do you think they are on beta 11 of a driver? If you really are on the fence with this, I suggest you stick with nvidia or wait until there is clear indication that all is well with driver support for HD7000 series.
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:39:14 PM

omnimodis78 said:
All I can say is that a few months ago I went with a 7870 and had nothing but issues with it, Firefox crashing, "grey screen of death", games stuttered (and I mean basic games like Walking Dead), could barely over clock it, over-all I hated it wholeheartedly and felt like I made a massive error in switching teams - I was replacing a 560 (non-Ti). I contacted AMD support and they told me that all these issues "may" be fixed in future driver releases. That was the official support I received. I returned the card and went with a 670 and haven't looked back. I am sure it was more of an isolated incident with me but what I could not forgive is AMD's "support". Why do you think they are on beta 11 of a driver? If you really are on the fence with this, I suggest you stick with nvidia or wait until there is clear indication that all is well with driver support for HD7000 series.

That sounds about right for AMD/ATi.
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December 20, 2012 7:40:14 PM

Mousemonkey said:
AMD fAnTIc's will always overlook that rather inconvenient fact as it gets in the way of their tirade. :lol: 


Haha +1 to that :-) And nice use of camel case there! omnimodis78, what's the grey screen of death? I also had absolutely terrible experiences with AMD's tech support (with regards to my £500/$750 dual-GPU monster card running Dead Space 2 at below 1fps) and ended up giving up with them. After 4 months of Catalyst updates, I could finally play my game. Could be something to do with the fact that a month earlier, Radeon 6990 was released. So why bother making games play at all on some ancient one-year-old flagship model when there's 2% gain optimising to be done on their new models! </rant> anyway. At least I got to play it eventually (pretty cool game too).
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a c 134 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 7:40:25 PM

People keep taking party lines with the cards I'm curious how the newest drivers (release drivers not beta) fair against the 7970 as well having a 670 myself.
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:42:12 PM

sam_p_lay said:
Haha +1 to that :-) And nice use of camel case there! omnimodis78, what's the grey screen of death? I also had absolutely terrible experiences with AMD's tech support (with regards to my £500/$750 dual-GPU monster card running Dead Space 2 at below 1fps) and ended up giving up with them. After 4 months of Catalyst updates, I could finally play my game. Could be something to do with the fact that a month earlier, Radeon 6990 was released. So why bother making games play at all on some ancient one-year-old flagship model when there's 2% gain optimising to be done on their new models! </rant> anyway. At least I got to play it eventually (pretty cool game too).

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/ATI-Radeon-Gray-Screen... :whistle: 
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a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:46:41 PM

The way to make people lose their mind in these threads is to bring up lol!! [/quotemsg]
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:50:07 PM

bigcyco1 said:
The way to make people lose their mind in these threads is to bring up lol!!
[/quotemsg]
Borderlands 2 whilst a good giggle is only a DX9 game and can probably be maxxed out with a single 8800GT! :lol: 
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December 20, 2012 7:51:48 PM

amd still has a ways to go on drivers. with that said i would still probably get a 7970.

http://techreport.com/review/23981/radeon-hd-7950-vs-ge...
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6480/amd-enduro-beta-take...
Quote:
We're still back to the same old refrain: where AMD really needs to work is on their drivers and updates. The 7970M is their halo mobile GPU, so it's getting good support (now). In fact, most of the 7000M products are receiving decent support, but earlier Enduro/Dynamic Switchable Graphics laptops are still a bit finicky about getting drivers installed. My overall feeling is that NVIDIA has also had more high profile games in the past couple years; AMD looks like they have a good list of titles for this holiday season, and hopefully they can continue that.
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a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:52:22 PM


Borderlands 2 whilst a good giggle is only a DX9 game and can probably be maxxed out with a single 8800GT! :lol: [/quotemsg]
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a b U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 7:52:53 PM


Borderlands 2 whilst a good giggle is only a DX9 game and can probably be maxxed out with a single 8800GT! :lol: [/quotemsg]

Haha yeah, I maxed it on my 4870 and it was fine, except one or two areas like Washburne Refinery, where it really struggled. Thing is here though, a 7970 won't do the PhysX, while a GTX670 will.
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a c 134 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 7:53:42 PM

lol big! Keep in mind to you can't get high physx on a amd card only medium and when you use medium its being processed by the cpu. hacked drivers don't count and probably aren't nearly as reliable. It baffles me to that its a DX9 game :p  Show Arkham City Phsyx :)  DX11 goodness. Btw game of the year edition on sale for sale for 7.49 on steam woot! (tossing out the cd)

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a c 272 U Graphics card
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 7:54:27 PM

sam_p_lay said:
Borderlands 2 whilst a good giggle is only a DX9 game and can probably be maxxed out with a single 8800GT! :lol: 


Haha yeah, I maxed it on my 4870 and it was fine, except one or two areas like Washburne Refinery, where it really struggled. Thing is here though, a 7970 won't do the PhysX, while a GTX670 will.[/quotemsg]
Yep, can't deny that.
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a b U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 7:56:54 PM

Er... what's going on with the quotes here?
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December 20, 2012 7:59:24 PM

And thanks for the grey screen link, I had no idea about this! At least that's one thing the damned 5970 did right. AMD seem to have a lot of luck bouncing back from this kind of thing. You'd think something like this would really dent their reputation!
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a c 134 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 8:00:52 PM

Big how did you link a video object I've tried a few things it doesn't work >>
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a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 8:05:09 PM

sam_p_lay said:
And thanks for the grey screen link, I had no idea about this! At least that's one thing the damned 5970 did right. AMD seem to have a lot of luck bouncing back from this kind of thing. You'd think something like this would really dent their reputation!

The ATI/AMD faithful have been rather stellar in their shouting down of anyone who dares to mention anything about the crap that their favourite company produces, I wouldn't spend any of my money on their cards but if others want to then that is up to them.
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December 20, 2012 8:08:55 PM

Mousemonkey said:
The ATI/AMD faithful have been rather stellar in their shouting down of anyone who dares to mention anything about the crap that their favourite company produces, I wouldn't spend any of my money on their cards but if others want to then that is up to them.


LOL! Well I won't argue with that. I've used a few Radeons, but each was a negative experience in at least one way. I think the 5970 was worst of all, despite the insane pricetag (that you'd think might be indicative of quality). The only totally positive experiences I've had with flawless performance, stability and no glitches/driver issues were nVidia. My next card will be a GTX770. I'm using a 4870 as a temporary measure until the release, and system keeps hanging for a second or two since I installed it... but whatever. I can deal with it for a few more months until my computer becomes a thing of beauty :-)
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December 20, 2012 8:15:48 PM

Ive had quite a few NvIDIA driver horror stories. (302.xx being the most recent) Of course, I could just be an idiot. But most of my problems were the same issues people were shouting out in GeForce Forums about.

I agree with bigcyco1, Thats pretty much the choice you have to make. Ive always been Nvidia on my major systems and have used AMD/ATI as a budget option.

I can say Ive always had a good experience with GeForce. Cant say anything about AMD/ATI as the only AMD/ATI cards I ever had were Low end Mobile models
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a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 8:30:26 PM

bigshootr8 said:
Big how did you link a video object I've tried a few things it doesn't work >>
Click quote on my post you will see ;) 
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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December 20, 2012 8:31:27 PM

simmons33 said:
Ive had quite a few NvIDIA driver horror stories. (302.xx being the most recent) Of course, I could just be an idiot. But most of my problems were the same issues people were shouting out in GeForce Forums about.

I agree with bigcyco1, Thats pretty much the choice you have to make. Ive always been Nvidia on my major systems and have used AMD/ATI as a budget option.

I can say Ive always had a good experience with GeForce. Cant say anything about AMD/ATI as the only AMD/ATI cards I ever had were Low end Mobile models

I did a jump from 301.42 to 304.48 so I didn't see any of the issues you might have had.
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a c 134 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 8:38:37 PM

Thanks big I figured it out!
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a b U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 8:46:08 PM

djangoringo said:
What nvidia driver horror stories ? :o 
Nvidia had better drivers before and still has better drivers today, saying that switching nvidia to amd cause of the drivers, made me laugh...
As for the question, see bigcyco1 post.


What you don't know about the drivers that fried cards?
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a c 185 U Graphics card
a b À AMD
December 20, 2012 8:47:33 PM

bigshootr8 said:
Thanks big I figured it out!
No problem.
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December 20, 2012 8:51:12 PM

RussK1 said:
What you don't know about the drivers that fried cards?

It didn't fry all cards and Nvidia did tell their partners to replace any cards that were damaged which is a darn sight more than ATI/AMD have ever done when their drivers cause problems that render their cards next to useless.
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a b U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 8:51:33 PM

RussK1 said:
What you don't know about the drivers that fried cards?


Yeah that was nVidia's big mistake - a glitch in the driver made the fans not spin up faster as temperature increased (like they're meant to), meaning some people's cards overheated. Big screwup there, though covered by warranty of course. I'm not sure that general glitchyness/flakeyness with Radeon drivers would be grounds for an RMA - manfs would just tell people that it's a software issue and AMD are working on it (like that grey screen business above).

EDIT: That is an awesome avatar, RussK1 :-D
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a b U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 8:52:45 PM

Mousemonkey said:
I did a jump from 301.42 to 304.48 so I didn't see any of the issues you might have had.


296.10 on my 550ti caused weird pink and green pixels in WoW.

302.xx Caused my monitor to not be recognized at all. Had no screen whatsoever. Had to take the 550ti out, boot up with Intel HD 2000, System restore back a month since Nvidia would not let me download drivers since they didnt detect a Nvidia GPU in my system (Cause I took it out, I couldnt boot with it in the first place). Put GPU back in, Delete old drivers and give them a fresh install of 285.62.

Using a 660 with 306.97 and no issues at all =D

If your curious Mousemonkey =D

DISCLAIMER!

"This post should in no way discourage the origianl poster as these issues can arise depending on user configuration, application used, and Driver Stability from either company"

See what I did there :sol: 

Also wasnt using addons as they are unstable at best. Issues arised from a clean install of both Windows and WoW
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a c 134 U Graphics card
December 20, 2012 8:53:35 PM

Yea no one is perfect in terms of drivers/ product issues. I prefer companies to make these bad mistakes so they learn from it look at AMD they have been doing quite well in the graphics sector this generation despite I suppose this long history of drivers going abrupt.
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a c 272 U Graphics card
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December 20, 2012 8:57:31 PM

simmons33 said:
296.10 on my 550ti caused weird pink and green pixels in WoW.

302.xx Caused my monitor to not be recognized at all. Had no screen whatsoever. Had to take the 550ti out, boot up with Intel HD 2000, System restore back a month since Nvidia would not let me download drivers since they didnt detect a Nvidia GPU in my system (Cause I took it out, I couldnt boot with it in the first place). Put GPU back in, Delete old drivers and give them a fresh install of 285.62.

Using a 660 with 306.97 and no issues at all =D

If your curious Mousemonkey
=D

I'm not but then I don't play WoW (which is known to be buggy anyway) so I didn't have any problems with that driver.
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