Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

recording drums on two tracks

Tags:
Last response: in Home Audio
Share
August 16, 2004 1:35:10 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.

More about : recording drums tracks

Anonymous
August 16, 2004 9:01:08 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Ha ha. Yeah, it can be tough. What you want to try to do is to mix the drums
correctly *before* you actually start recording them. I'm sorry, but what
you're doing just sounds stupid. There are actually a couple of other
newsgroups that are tailor-made for newbies and/or people that just seem to
grasp the basics. Check out harmony central, and you'll be able to find a
newsgroup more suited to your limited needs. We don't really deal with
questions from people that have roommates and 2 track recorders here. Hope this
helps. And good luck!
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 9:01:09 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

What you may want to try to achieve is a way of mixing the drums with some
reference of the other instruments and vocal. This will not lock you into
having to cater to a mediocre drum mix. I couldn't be sure what kind of
equipment you have or what level you are at, but you should most certainly
get yourself at least an inexpensive multitrack DAW, which will complement
your analog recorder or maybe even render it obsolete! Some of the powerful
Software packages can be a little intimidating if you're new to it all but
it's the ticket to pro sounding mixes if you're eager to spend the time.

Neil R

"Youngsexcandy" <youngsexcandy@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040816010108.24921.00001082@mb-m20.aol.com...
> Ha ha. Yeah, it can be tough. What you want to try to do is to mix the
drums
> correctly *before* you actually start recording them. I'm sorry, but what
> you're doing just sounds stupid. There are actually a couple of other
> newsgroups that are tailor-made for newbies and/or people that just seem
to
> grasp the basics. Check out harmony central, and you'll be able to find a
> newsgroup more suited to your limited needs. We don't really deal with
> questions from people that have roommates and 2 track recorders here. Hope
this
> helps. And good luck!
Related resources
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 2:06:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <e6236419.0408152035.c7e9e31@posting.google.com> ot7doc@yahoo.com writes:

> Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> is madness.

Then what do you call recording the whole band on two, or even one
track? They did that for a long time, and I'll bet you've even heard
some of those recordings and liked the sound.

> Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
> machines that let you just record on two tracks.

I'll admit that when you're trying to record multitrack, being able to
record only two tracks at once is a hard way to go, but that isn't
really multitrack recording, it's one- or two-track recording with a
lot of overdubbing and mixing later.

> Maybe if I was good
> at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief.

That's the ticket!


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 2:16:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

On 15 Aug 2004 21:35:10 -0700, ot7doc@yahoo.com (Nat) wrote:

>Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
>is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
>machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
>at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
>for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
>ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
>anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
>my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
>again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
>the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.


Is it the recording, or is it the drummer?

Is he "laying down tracks" in isolation, or playing as part of a
musical performance? Perhaps he just isn't leaving room for other
instruments.

CubaseFAQ www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm
"Possibly the world's least impressive web site": George Perfect
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 3:41:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

>We don't really deal with
>questions from people that have roommates and 2 track recorders here.
Hope this
>helps. And good luck!

I dunno if even have anything to say to this ^ I thought that was the
point of the group. At any rate I think we do deal with questions like
this.... often.

I think a lot can be done with 2 tracks on drums. Hell I've had great
success with one mic. Don't think you're limited by you mic selection
or your hardware. Much can be done with so little. I remember reading
an interview with Phill Ramone i believe, he said something to the
effect "All you need is one SM57 and creativity" Just be creative.
Also think about the song and what it needs for the recording. All to
often I would get caught up with getting "THE" tone for the drums or
guitar and it would sound great by itself but didn't fit the song. As
a friend put it "It sounds great.... And if i was going to buy a CD
that was just drums that sounded awesome i think this would be it. But
it's just too good sounding for my songs." We ended up using on 57
pointed into the kit and that ended up fitting the song better. No I
find the sound of a couple mic's and a good drummer in the right
location to be far more pleasing.


cheers
garrett


mrivers@d-and-d.com (Mike Rivers) wrote in message news:<znr1092657979k@trad>...
> In article <e6236419.0408152035.c7e9e31@posting.google.com> ot7doc@yahoo.com writes:
>
> > Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> > is madness.
>
> Then what do you call recording the whole band on two, or even one
> track? They did that for a long time, and I'll bet you've even heard
> some of those recordings and liked the sound.
>
> > Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
> > machines that let you just record on two tracks.
>
> I'll admit that when you're trying to record multitrack, being able to
> record only two tracks at once is a hard way to go, but that isn't
> really multitrack recording, it's one- or two-track recording with a
> lot of overdubbing and mixing later.
>
> > Maybe if I was good
> > at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief.
>
> That's the ticket!
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 5:33:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

Nat <ot7doc@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
>is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
>machines that let you just record on two tracks.

Hell, I use two tracks for the whole orchestra half the time. I don't
get the need for ukubillion drum submixes. Either the drums sound good
and are appropriate for the mix or they aren't.

>Maybe if I was good
>at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
>for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
>ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
>anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
>my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
>again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
>the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.

To some extent you can deal with that sort of thing with EQ, but my
suggestion is to keep trying, and also to try and listen to some
commercial recording and JUST listen to the drums and how the drums
fall into the mix. Get practice at isolating the different tracks
in your head.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 5:54:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

With a decent drummer and a reasonable room, you can get a great drum
sound with one overhead and a kick. I was messing around with this
just the other day... I had four mics set up, but when I played it
back with just the OH and the kick alone, it sounded great. The thing
is that the drummer has to be able to balance the kit with how he
plays it.

Al

On 15 Aug 2004 21:35:10 -0700, ot7doc@yahoo.com (Nat) wrote:

>Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
>is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
>machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
>at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
>for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
>ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
>anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
>my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
>again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
>the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 6:44:27 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Youngsexcandy" <youngsexcandy@aol.com> wrote in message
> We don't really deal with
> questions from people that have roommates and 2 track recorders here. Hope
this
> helps. And good luck!

I stop reading RAP for a week and now we have a new king? Why are you the
spokesman and why do you think that beginning home recordists have no place
here? Because of the low traffic flow in alt.audio.4-track I eventually
unsubscribed. I like having many diverse people all with different ideas
such as here in RAP. It's a much larger knowledge base.

Are you telling me that there will be no more replies to the "What's the
best vocal mic?" threads?
Anonymous
August 16, 2004 10:24:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

"Nat" <ot7doc@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e6236419.0408152035.c7e9e31@posting.google.com...
> Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> is madness.

Madness that was a luxury 35 years ago!

The cleverest method I ever ran into for an 8 track recording of a rock band
was overhead, rack toms and kick on one track and snare and floor tom mikes
on another. This lets you use a combination of eq. and balance between the
two tracks to achieve a great mono drum sound.

--
Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery, Nashville TN
Mastering, Audio for Picture, Mix Evaluation and Quality Control
Over 40 years making people sound better than they ever imagined!
615.385.8051 http://www.hyperback.com
August 16, 2004 11:18:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

> Madness that was a luxury 35 years ago!

I'll tell you what, google groups is a luxury. Wow. I really
appreciate all the advice -- thanks so much for the replies. My
drummer and I are going into a marathon session this weekend and I
hope to incorporate a lot of your suggestions.

This album is only my second, and it's my first time tackling drums,
but then even imperfectly recorded acoustic drums knock the socks of
that drum machine I used last time.

Lucky for me, I have a technically excellent drummer playing with me,
and he's nice enough not to have killed me yet for all my retries. So
I have some faith...

Thanks again.
August 16, 2004 11:19:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

> Madness that was a luxury 35 years ago!

I'll tell you what, google groups is a luxury. Wow. I really
appreciate all the advice -- thanks so much for the replies. My
drummer and I are going into a marathon session this weekend and I
hope to incorporate a lot of your suggestions.

This album is only my second, and it's my first time tackling drums,
but then even imperfectly recorded acoustic drums knock the socks of
that drum machine I used last time.

Lucky for me, I have a technically excellent drummer playing with me,
and he's nice enough not to have killed me yet for all my retries. So
I have some faith...

Thanks again.
Anonymous
August 17, 2004 12:04:49 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

.. We don't really deal with
> questions from people that have roommates and 2 track recorders here. Hope
this
> helps. And good luck!

Whatever....

Anyway, it sounds like maybe your drummer needs to get it in his head that
HE is mixing the drums.

Tell him to stop beating the piss out of "anything made of metal", and tell
him to deliberately and consitently whack "anything with a skin on".

IOW - lighten up on the hats and cymbals, and hit the drums themselves real
nice and firm so they 'speak' properly.

Get the blend in the room that you are after.

I got a great drum sound in the weekend just gone with 4 mics :

Coles 4038 as a single overhead, above the snare, about 6' higher than the
snare

A pair of Oktavas' on either side of the drummers head, like a pair of ears

AKG D112 in the kick.


Most of the sound was the kick and the Oktavas, with some squeezed overhead
for ambience.

Basically it sounded good because the drummer plays real well, and his kit
sounds really nice.

Also check out Fletchers site www.mercenary.com for some great drum
recording tips.


Generally, if it sounds good in the room you are off to a good start.

Tuning them nicely helps too - google for "Drum Tuning" and see what you
learn.


Good luck!

Geoff



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.737 / Virus Database: 491 - Release Date: 8/11/2004
Anonymous
August 18, 2004 2:36:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

I would try to record with 2 o/h mics and the kick
just for some space
then hard pan those 2 mics and leave the kick down the center.
and mix down to 2 tracks
almost no thinking to how to get it to come out right.

"playonATcomcast.net" <playon@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:rj72i0haf1mhoif7d3ei9f357gf5k8fce5@4ax.com...
> With a decent drummer and a reasonable room, you can get a great drum
> sound with one overhead and a kick. I was messing around with this
> just the other day... I had four mics set up, but when I played it
> back with just the OH and the kick alone, it sounded great. The thing
> is that the drummer has to be able to balance the kit with how he
> plays it.
>
> Al
>
> On 15 Aug 2004 21:35:10 -0700, ot7doc@yahoo.com (Nat) wrote:
>
> >Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> >is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
> >machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
> >at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
> >for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
> >ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
> >anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
> >my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
> >again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
> >the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.
>
August 18, 2004 3:35:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

In article <%LvUc.133114$J06.132726@pd7tw2no>, Doug Schultz
<Douglas_Schultz@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I would try to record with 2 o/h mics and the kick
> just for some space
> then hard pan those 2 mics and leave the kick down the center.
> and mix down to 2 tracks
> almost no thinking to how to get it to come out right.


Depending on how it sounds and what kinda mic technique you use, you
may want to pan the 2 overheads in slightly if the stereo image is
making things sound a little wishy washy. Can tighten things up in your
mix, depending obviously on what you get.




David Correia
Celebration Sound
Warren, Rhode Island

CelebrationSound@aol.com
www.CelebrationSound.com
Anonymous
August 18, 2004 1:54:47 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

Nat wrote:
> Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
> machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
> at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
> for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
> ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
> anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
> my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
> again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
> the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.

I've had success with an A-B pair of omni's in front of the drum kit,
placed at the height of the top of kick drum. It needs a good, large
room though.

Stig Erik Tangen
Anonymous
August 18, 2004 7:04:18 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

"david" <ihate@spamo.com> wrote in message
news:170820041935459483%ihate@spamo.com...
> In article <%LvUc.133114$J06.132726@pd7tw2no>, Doug Schultz
> <Douglas_Schultz@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I would try to record with 2 o/h mics and the kick
> > just for some space
> > then hard pan those 2 mics and leave the kick down the center.
> > and mix down to 2 tracks
> > almost no thinking to how to get it to come out right.
>
>
> Depending on how it sounds and what kinda mic technique you use, you
> may want to pan the 2 overheads in slightly if the stereo image is
> making things sound a little wishy washy. Can tighten things up in your
> mix, depending obviously on what you get.


You are right of course. I very rarely pan all the way and I was just typing
in a hurry should have been more precise. with drum mixes I start at the 3
and 9 o'clock positions and then see how bad the phasing is and move them in
from there.

Doug
August 19, 2004 1:07:20 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

I never tried that. I like that idea and I'm looking forward to testing it out.


"Doug Schultz" <Douglas_Schultz@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<SdKUc.141902$gE.9298@pd7tw3no>...
> "david" <ihate@spamo.com> wrote in message
> news:170820041935459483%ihate@spamo.com...
> > In article <%LvUc.133114$J06.132726@pd7tw2no>, Doug Schultz
> > <Douglas_Schultz@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I would try to record with 2 o/h mics and the kick
> > > just for some space
> > > then hard pan those 2 mics and leave the kick down the center.
> > > and mix down to 2 tracks
> > > almost no thinking to how to get it to come out right.
> >
> >
> > Depending on how it sounds and what kinda mic technique you use, you
> > may want to pan the 2 overheads in slightly if the stereo image is
> > making things sound a little wishy washy. Can tighten things up in your
> > mix, depending obviously on what you get.
>
>
> You are right of course. I very rarely pan all the way and I was just typing
> in a hurry should have been more precise. with drum mixes I start at the 3
> and 9 o'clock positions and then see how bad the phasing is and move them in
> from there.
>
> Doug
August 19, 2004 1:07:28 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

I never tried that. I like that idea and I'm looking forward to testing it out.


"Doug Schultz" <Douglas_Schultz@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<SdKUc.141902$gE.9298@pd7tw3no>...
> "david" <ihate@spamo.com> wrote in message
> news:170820041935459483%ihate@spamo.com...
> > In article <%LvUc.133114$J06.132726@pd7tw2no>, Doug Schultz
> > <Douglas_Schultz@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I would try to record with 2 o/h mics and the kick
> > > just for some space
> > > then hard pan those 2 mics and leave the kick down the center.
> > > and mix down to 2 tracks
> > > almost no thinking to how to get it to come out right.
> >
> >
> > Depending on how it sounds and what kinda mic technique you use, you
> > may want to pan the 2 overheads in slightly if the stereo image is
> > making things sound a little wishy washy. Can tighten things up in your
> > mix, depending obviously on what you get.
>
>
> You are right of course. I very rarely pan all the way and I was just typing
> in a hurry should have been more precise. with drum mixes I start at the 3
> and 9 o'clock positions and then see how bad the phasing is and move them in
> from there.
>
> Doug
Anonymous
August 19, 2004 5:12:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

ot7doc@yahoo.com (Nat) wrote in message news:<e6236419.0408152035.c7e9e31@posting.google.com>...
> Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
> machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
> at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
> for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
> ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
> anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
> my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
> again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
> the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.

Nat, are you looking for ways to record the entire kit with 2 mics,
or, are you trying to improve the stereo submix of drums that you're
forced to do because you only have 8 tracks? I'm guessing it's the
latter of the 2. One thing someone else touched on is getting a sense
of how the drums sit with other instrumentation, even if just scratch
tracks, in the mix. I mic drums with 3 mics and submix to a mono
track, and I have found out the hard way that setting levels to what
sounds like a 'real" kit when bouncing will leave your track kick shy
and snare shy at mixdown. So I usually make the kick and snare a
*little* louder in the bounce, to where it almost seems too loud, so
that they don't disappear after I add 6 guitars, tambourine, handclaps
and vocals!
August 19, 2004 11:27:00 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

> Nat, are you looking for ways to record the entire kit with 2 mics,
> or, are you trying to improve the stereo submix of drums that you're
> forced to do because you only have 8 tracks? I'm guessing it's the
> latter of the 2. One thing someone else touched on is getting a sense
> of how the drums sit with other instrumentation, even if just scratch
> tracks, in the mix. I mic drums with 3 mics and submix to a mono
> track, and I have found out the hard way that setting levels to what
> sounds like a 'real" kit when bouncing will leave your track kick shy
> and snare shy at mixdown. So I usually make the kick and snare a
> *little* louder in the bounce, to where it almost seems too loud, so
> that they don't disappear after I add 6 guitars, tambourine, handclaps
> and vocals!

Yeah, it's the latter. I understand that a lot of songs are recorded
starting with the drums, but I -- for better and worse -- have been
recording drums lately after I have other tracks down... I think my
drummer prefers it, and it has worked out so far. He's got good,
strict, click-track timing, so there's not too many timing problems
for me doing it that way. So, as of late, I actually have mixed most
of my drums in the context of the song itself. In the past, I've had
problems with the snare being too quiet in the mix, and I wonder now
if I was just working for a perfect set sound at the time without
hearing it as part of the mix as a whole.
Anonymous
August 20, 2004 1:01:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <e6236419.0408191827.7c15338@posting.google.com> ot7doc@yahoo.com writes:

> I -- for better and worse -- have been
> recording drums lately after I have other tracks down... I think my
> drummer prefers it, and it has worked out so far. He's got good,
> strict, click-track timing, so there's not too many timing problems
> for me doing it that way.

How do you get good, strict click-track timing without a drummer? Or
are your other tracks machine-generated? Most real musicians are much
more comfortable playing to a drummer than to a click track, even if
it's a drum machine.

> In the past, I've had
> problems with the snare being too quiet in the mix, and I wonder now
> if I was just working for a perfect set sound at the time without
> hearing it as part of the mix as a whole.

That's it. But it may not be that the snare is too quiet, it could be
that something else is too loud, masking the snare. By raising the
level of the snare, you then have a "level spike" which, unless you
limit it, will reduce the maximum apparent loudness that you can
achieve. Maximum loudness may not be your goal, but it's the goal of
many.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
August 20, 2004 1:48:12 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

On 19 Aug 2004 19:27:00 -0700, ot7doc@yahoo.com (Nat) wrote:

> So, as of late, I actually have mixed most
>of my drums in the context of the song itself. In the past, I've had
>problems with the snare being too quiet in the mix, and I wonder now
>if I was just working for a perfect set sound at the time without
>hearing it as part of the mix as a whole.

Careful! That's thinking like a musician. They'll kick you out of
the Recording Engineers' Guild :-)
August 20, 2004 11:52:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

> How do you get good, strict click-track timing without a drummer? Or
> are your other tracks machine-generated? Most real musicians are much
> more comfortable playing to a drummer than to a click track, even if
> it's a drum machine.

I play most of the parts myself, and I don't mind playing to a drum
machine. Then my drummer comes in afterwards and lays drums to what
I've done with a click going. Thus far, it's worked.
August 20, 2004 11:55:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

> but you could do a decent job with two mics. just make sure they are
> two good mics! set the first mic about 6 feet over the drummers head
> and about 8 feet in front of him. have him play loud. put the second
> mic on the kick drum.

Sadly, I'm always forced to tune out when people say "good mics." I
gotta do everything with my 57s and 58s. It's kinda fun, pretty
impossible. On many instruments and vocs I mic model, which is
cheating and probably pretty transparent, but it makes me feel like a
regular princess, changing from fancy mic to fancy mic at will.
Anonymous
September 3, 2004 12:57:04 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

Nat wrote:

> Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting.

Use fewer mics.


Kind regards

Peter Larsen




--
*******************************************
* My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk *
*******************************************
Anonymous
March 30, 2005 11:29:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

In article <e6236419.0408152035.c7e9e31@posting.google.com>, Nat
<ot7doc@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Just for the record I'd like to say that recording drums on two tracks
> is madness. Eight tracks are pretty limiting. Especially on the
> machines that let you just record on two tracks. Maybe if I was good
> at recording, good at listening to drums, I'd suffer less grief. But
> for me, the drums mix is always a bit sour in mixdown -- too much
> ride, too little snare, too little toms, etc. And I can't adjust
> anything, so the only choice is bringing my drummer back in, begging
> my roommate out of the house for a weekend, setting everything up
> again, and then spending another weekend recording only to find that
> the kick drum has disappeared. I'm going crazy.

Back in the 80s and 90s there were a lot of us tracking drums with ever
more mics. My record was 22 on a metal record; top and bottom mics on
the toms (polarity flipped) with shell triggers keying gates etc.
Looking back it all seems absurd. My favorite drum recordings continue
to be a 2-3 mics in a nice room with high ceilings and of course a
great player. I get the impression you are recording in a small room.
Here is where close and multiple micing gets really ugly on anything
heavier than some light brush work. My personal feeling about this kind
of enviornment is to embrace it for what it is. A single radioshack PZM
on the wall (any wall for that matter) will give you a fat and honest
sound. It will sound distinct, organic and no one will confuse it with
a machine. Try it and let your drummer hear it. He may want to adjust
his dynamics but you may both be surprised. Then again it all depends
on the song along with countless other variables. Just keep trying and
dont rule anything out! There are no rules. Some of those mega-mic
setups in the 90s actually worked on occasion;-)
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 2:28:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro,rec.audio.tech (More info?)

Sonicanuck wrote:

> Back in the 80s and 90s there were a lot of us tracking drums with ever
> more mics. My record was 22 on a metal record; top and bottom mics on
> the toms (polarity flipped) with shell triggers keying gates etc.
> Looking back it all seems absurd. My favorite drum recordings continue
> to be a 2-3 mics in a nice room with high ceilings and of course a
> great player. I get the impression you are recording in a small room.
> Here is where close and multiple micing gets really ugly on anything
> heavier than some light brush work. My personal feeling about this kind
> of enviornment is to embrace it for what it is. A single radioshack PZM
> on the wall (any wall for that matter) will give you a fat and honest
> sound. It will sound distinct, organic and no one will confuse it with
> a machine. Try it and let your drummer hear it. He may want to adjust
> his dynamics but you may both be surprised. Then again it all depends
> on the song along with countless other variables. Just keep trying and
> dont rule anything out! There are no rules. Some of those mega-mic
> setups in the 90s actually worked on occasion;-)

I'm with you there. One of the cleanest drum recordings I've ever
worked with was done in an 8x12 room with a 10' ceiling, assorted cheap
sound deadening (read: cardboard egg cartons on parts of the walls),
with a D112 on the kick, SM-58 on the snare, and a pair of RS PZMs, each
attached to a 2x2' piece of plywood and those arranged in a V shape,
hung about 4' above the drums, and panned hard left and right.

The balance of the toms and overheads was near-perfect and the stereo
image on cymbal washes and tom rolls was amazing. The 58 was blended in
just enough to add some 'snap' and body to the snare.

I've recently done an album with the same drummer (much newer and
better-maintained kit, fortunately) in which we used 11 mics on the kit
- double kicks, snare, one each for three rack toms and a floor tom, one
each for hat and ride, and an overhead pair. I can't say that the drums
turned out significantly better... sure there's more control, but
sometimes the overabundance of sources just leads to cancellation and
other problems too.


---
avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean.
Virus Database (VPS): 0514-0, 04/05/2005
Tested on: 4/7/2005 3:28:00 AM
avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software.
http://www.avast.com
!