754 vs. 939 pin

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".

Jonah Falcon
36 answers Last reply
More about tomshardware
  1. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Socket 939 has dual channel memory. 754 does not.

    DaveL


    "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    > What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    > architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    > motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >
    > Jonah Falcon
    >
  2. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Thusly "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> Spake Unto All:

    >What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".

    Apart from the socket?
    The 939 socket supports dual channel memory access, which doesn't
    really make much difference, so the main difference is that the 939
    socket will be intentionally made obsolete by AMD somewhat later than
    the 754 socket, and so be possible to upgrade somewhat longer.
    I.e. AFAIK no 90nm 'winchester' cores will be made for the 754, and
    you do want 90nm cores. Not all socket 939 Athlon64's have winchester
    cores, though.

    A fairly good but slightly out of date (it doesn't have the 90nm
    Winchester cores) can be found here:
    http://www.short-media.com/review.php?r=247
  3. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    > What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    > architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    > motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >
    > Jonah Falcon
    >
    >

    As others have pointed out, the 939 supports dual channel memory. Oh, and
    you did order a 939 cpu to go with that 939 mb?

    Toms Hardware site has a nice chart showing the AMD cpu specs
    http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/20041221/images/cpu_table_amd_big.gif

    Some info on AMD 939 cpus
    http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/cpu/article.php/3453401
  4. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "OldDog" <OldDog@city.pound> wrote in message
    news:QjpUd.66206$cW2.56583@fe2.texas.rr.com...
    >
    > "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    > news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >> What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >> architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >> motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>
    >> Jonah Falcon
    >>
    >>
    >
    > As others have pointed out, the 939 supports dual channel memory. Oh,
    > and
    > you did order a 939 cpu to go with that 939 mb?

    Of course. ;)

    939-pin GigaByte GA-K8NS-939 nForce3 Ultra Chipset AGP8X w/LAN,USB2,&Audio
    on the motherboard, with the Athlon64 939-pin CPU. I got the 1024 MB
    (512MBx2) PC3200 400MHz Dual Channel DDR memory to go with it.

    To defray costs, I only got a Geforce-FX 5500 256MB DDR --- I have a better
    videocard, and just going to swap them between computers (the 5500 goes to
    the older CPU, the Geforce 6800 GT 256MB AGP8X goes to the new one.)

    Jonah Falcon
  5. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    news:2nqUd.1544$wy3.881@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >
    > "OldDog" <OldDog@city.pound> wrote in message
    > news:QjpUd.66206$cW2.56583@fe2.texas.rr.com...
    >>
    >> "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    >> news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>> What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >>> architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >>> motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>>
    >>> Jonah Falcon
    >>>
    >>>
    >>
    >> As others have pointed out, the 939 supports dual channel memory. Oh,
    >> and
    >> you did order a 939 cpu to go with that 939 mb?
    >
    > Of course. ;)
    >
    > 939-pin GigaByte GA-K8NS-939 nForce3 Ultra Chipset AGP8X w/LAN,USB2,&Audio
    > on the motherboard, with the Athlon64 939-pin CPU. I got the 1024 MB
    > (512MBx2) PC3200 400MHz Dual Channel DDR memory to go with it.
    >
    > To defray costs, I only got a Geforce-FX 5500 256MB DDR --- I have a
    > better videocard, and just going to swap them between computers (the 5500
    > goes to the older CPU, the Geforce 6800 GT 256MB AGP8X goes to the new
    > one.)

    Isn't it a little late in the game to go with AGP on a new system? I took
    the plunge with PCI-E and nForce 4. And what CPU speed did you get?

    turk
    --
    "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and
    more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day
    the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the
    White House will be adorned by a downright moron." - H. L. Mencken,
    Baltimore Evening Sun on 26 July 1920
  6. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "turk" <turk96@comcast.net> wrote in message
    news:96Kdna615JDBo7_fRVn-jQ@comcast.com...

    > Isn't it a little late in the game to go with AGP on a new system? I took
    > the plunge with PCI-E and nForce 4. And what CPU speed did you get?

    AGP is not even being maxed out yet. There is currently no benefit to PCIX
    except more revenue for Intel. The video cards are also more expensive than
    AGP.

    You just can't change the standard overnight like Intel thinks they can do.
  7. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "turk" <turk96@comcast.net> wrote in message
    news:96Kdna615JDBo7_fRVn-jQ@comcast.com...
    > "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    > news:2nqUd.1544$wy3.881@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>
    >> "OldDog" <OldDog@city.pound> wrote in message
    >> news:QjpUd.66206$cW2.56583@fe2.texas.rr.com...
    >>>
    >>> "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    >>> news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>>> What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >>>> architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >>>> motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>>>
    >>>> Jonah Falcon
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> As others have pointed out, the 939 supports dual channel memory. Oh,
    >>> and
    >>> you did order a 939 cpu to go with that 939 mb?
    >>
    >> Of course. ;)
    >>
    >> 939-pin GigaByte GA-K8NS-939 nForce3 Ultra Chipset AGP8X
    >> w/LAN,USB2,&Audio on the motherboard, with the Athlon64 939-pin CPU. I
    >> got the 1024 MB (512MBx2) PC3200 400MHz Dual Channel DDR memory to go
    >> with it.
    >>
    >> To defray costs, I only got a Geforce-FX 5500 256MB DDR --- I have a
    >> better videocard, and just going to swap them between computers (the 5500
    >> goes to the older CPU, the Geforce 6800 GT 256MB AGP8X goes to the new
    >> one.)
    >
    > Isn't it a little late in the game to go with AGP on a new system? I took
    > the plunge with PCI-E and nForce 4. And what CPU speed did you get?

    Only 3500. By the way, this system is only costing me $800. I'm on a budget,
    ya know.

    Jonah Falcon
  8. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Thus spake "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com>, Sun, 27 Feb 2005
    06:00:26 GMT, Anno Domini:

    >What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >
    >Jonah Falcon

    From what I've heard & read (+ benchmarks I've seen), a comparison of, for
    example, the AMD 3400+ 754 pin slightly outdoes the 939 pin 3500+ in gaming
    tests, though the 939 squeezes ahead in windows (non-graphically intensive)
    tests. I'm getting a 3400+ this week actually >;-p

    --
    No matter how many times you save the world, it always manages to get back in jeopardy again.
    Sometimes I just want it to stay saved! You know, for a little bit?
    I feel like the maid; "I just cleaned up this mess! Can we keep it clean for... for ten minutes!"

    Replace 'spamfree' with the other word for 'maze' to reply via email.
  9. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Nostromo wrote:
    > Thus spake "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com>, Sun, 27 Feb 2005
    > 06:00:26 GMT, Anno Domini:
    >
    >
    >>What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >>architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >>motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>
    >>Jonah Falcon
    >
    >
    > From what I've heard & read (+ benchmarks I've seen), a comparison of, for
    > example, the AMD 3400+ 754 pin slightly outdoes the 939 pin 3500+ in gaming
    > tests, though the 939 squeezes ahead in windows (non-graphically intensive)
    > tests. I'm getting a 3400+ this week actually >;-p
    >

    Do you have a source for this "gaming" v "windows" test? Sounds strange.
  10. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    PCI Express is on AMD boards as well, so it's not just Intel pushing it
    (I have an AMD chip on a PCIE board on my new system). PCI Express may
    not be much benefit now, but it will be in the near future. It's just
    that considering the price difference is pretty small on the
    motherboards, and the video cards are cheaper than their AGP
    equivalents, I don't see any reason for going with AGP on a whole new
    system. Pretty soon, AGP video cards will be rarer and much more
    expensive than the PCI Express cards, not to mention obsolete. Already
    ATI is not making some of their cards in AGP models.

    turk
  11. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    How did I pay too much now? My mobo was slightly more expensive with
    PCI-E and my video card costs less than the same model in AGP. I might
    have spent $20 more. Why wouldn't I choose PCI-E over AGP given almost
    identical costs in an entirely new system? Check out some online
    prices before you talk garbage. I'm not financing anything for you,
    unless you're on welfare, which would mean you have bigger problems
    than video card format.

    turk
  12. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Thus spake Walter Mitty <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk>, Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:28:02
    +0100, Anno Domini:

    >Nostromo wrote:
    >> Thus spake "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com>, Sun, 27 Feb 2005
    >> 06:00:26 GMT, Anno Domini:
    >>
    >>
    >>>What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >>>architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >>>motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>>
    >>>Jonah Falcon
    >>
    >>
    >> From what I've heard & read (+ benchmarks I've seen), a comparison of, for
    >> example, the AMD 3400+ 754 pin slightly outdoes the 939 pin 3500+ in gaming
    >> tests, though the 939 squeezes ahead in windows (non-graphically intensive)
    >> tests. I'm getting a 3400+ this week actually >;-p
    >>
    >
    >Do you have a source for this "gaming" v "windows" test? Sounds strange.

    Yeah, but I don't think he'd like you Walter...;-p
  13. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 06:00:26 GMT, "Jonah Falcon"
    <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote:

    >What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >
    >Jonah Falcon
    >
    >

    939 is AMDs forseeable-future pin-out for desktop applications
    both single and dual-core.

    940-pin for server/pro applications, with ECC memory.

    754 is dead-end.

    The AMD desktop dual-core processors will only be available in
    939-pin form and <will retrofit> into the current 939-socket boards
    with just a BIOS change.

    If you want maximum future-proofing in the AMD camp, you need
    to seriously consider the following:-

    939-pin PCIe SLI motherboard with nForce4 SLI chip-set, but
    wait a few months for any silicon and BIOS changes to settle down
    ( including any required for dual-core) and prices to start leveling
    out (steeply ramping down at the moment) on all elements- CPU,
    MB, and PCIe video cards. About mid-Summer 2005 would
    probably be optimum to lay out the bucks for a new system.
    ( AMD is due to be shipping dual-core beginning June 2005
    and any system teething problems with single/dual-core MB
    compatibility should have been ironed out )

    BTW, remember that the MB SLI-capability does not have
    to be used for SLI. How about 4-head video in non-SLI configuration ?
    Or a single video card with the spare PCIe 8x slot for some future
    very high-performance video-processing hardware - who knows....

    The Intel camp is still in a horrid mess. The Intel 64-bit dual-core
    processors will NOT retrofit in the current 775-pin motherboards,
    and there is apparently no guarantee that the single-core
    32/64 processors will fit in the future motherboards designed for
    dual core. For current and immediate-future gaming applications,
    dual-processors bring little benefit. However, having the
    AMD-style flexibility of just swapping processors should one
    want to rededicate a gaming machine to - say- desktop video
    editing, where true dual-core brings enormous time-saving
    benefit ( with 4-head output, too ) is sure a very highly
    attractive piece of future-proofing.

    nVidia is wisely holding off on releasing any Intel nForce
    solution until Intel decides to stop screwing around with
    64-bit paper releases.

    John Lewis
  14. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    <turk96@attbi.com> wrote in message
    news:1109570839.149177.55110@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
    > PCI Express is on AMD boards as well, so it's not just Intel pushing it
    > (I have an AMD chip on a PCIE board on my new system). PCI Express may
    > not be much benefit now, but it will be in the near future. It's just
    > that considering the price difference is pretty small on the
    > motherboards, and the video cards are cheaper than their AGP
    > equivalents, I don't see any reason for going with AGP on a whole new

    PCIX cheaper than AGP cards? Every price comparison I've seen has PCIX cards
    considerably more expensive than AGP cards.

    > system. Pretty soon, AGP video cards will be rarer and much more

    The transition from AGP to PCIX is terrible. There IS no transition, and
    those that have both are hack boards. You can't just take AGP slots off the
    boards overnight like they are trying to do.

    > expensive than the PCI Express cards, not to mention obsolete. Already
    > ATI is not making some of their cards in AGP models.

    Which matters not to me since my next video card will not be an ATI.
  15. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    On Sun, 27 Feb 2005, DaveL wrote:

    > Socket 939 has dual channel memory. 754 does not.

    It makes hardly a difference. There is a good comparison of current CPUs
    on Anandtechs regarding Doom 3. Including AMD 939 versus AMD 754 socket.

    --
    Werner Spahl (spahl@cup.uni-muenchen.de) Freedom for
    "The meaning of my life is to make me crazy" Vorlonships
  16. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    FYI, PCI-X is not the same as PCI-E. I've seen a lot of places use
    them interchangably, but PCI-X is more or less just a souped up version
    of PCI, wheras PCI-Express (PCI-E) has more fundamental changes.
  17. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    <turk96@attbi.com> wrote in message
    news:1109570839.149177.55110@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
    > system. Pretty soon, AGP video cards will be rarer and much more
    > expensive than the PCI Express cards, not to mention obsolete.
    > turk

    Maybe he explicitly wanted Nvidia and it is hard to find 6800 GT PCI-E
    cards.. Nvidia made a wrong call regarding PCI-E demand or so they say..
  18. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Thusly john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) Spake Unto All:

    >939 is AMDs forseeable-future pin-out for desktop applications
    >both single and dual-core.

    I allow myself to be skeptical about that. AMD is very much into
    planned obsolescense through socket change, and has a habit of not
    informing anyone of changes until they're imminent, so I'm guessing
    "the forseeable future" is one to two years.

    >The AMD desktop dual-core processors will only be available in
    >939-pin form and <will retrofit> into the current 939-socket boards
    >with just a BIOS change.

    Oh I'd like to believe that, it would thrill and surprise me if
    there's not a big "BUT..." somewhere.
    Like that those processors require more juice, or less juice, or don't
    support present-gen memory controllers. Something, *anything*, that
    mean they can not be used with present motherboards (or at least are
    severely crippled if they can).

    I use and recommend AMD. I just don't like their tendency for secrecy
    and the way they hinder upgrades by surprise-changing sockets at short
    intervals.
  19. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:04:18 +0100, Mean_Chlorine
    <mike_noren2002@NOSPAMyahoo.co.uk> wrote:

    >I use and recommend AMD. I just don't like their tendency for secrecy
    >and the way they hinder upgrades by surprise-changing sockets at short
    >intervals.

    I haven't owned an Intel based machine for ages, but from what I
    remember they weren't any better on that front. I think every
    processor upgrade I have made has always had a corresponding mobo
    upgrade along with it, I just look at the prospective CPU price and
    add 100 pounds socket tax to it.
    --
    Andrew, contact via interpleb.blogspot.com
    Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
    please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
    Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.
  20. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "Kroagnon" <kroagnon@kroagnon.com> wrote in message
    news:1124vnkep8krt59@news.supernews.com...
    > <snip> The video cards are also more expensive than
    > AGP.
    >

    Not neccesarily. They should be the same price. But Nvidia has a way to
    make a video chip work with either slot type. They use what's called a
    bridge chip to convert one format to the other. So a native PCI-E chip card
    is cheaper in PCI-E format. The addition of the bridge chip to make it work
    with AGP adds about $20 to the cost of the card. If you need proof, do some
    research on the 6600 line of Nvidia cards. The 6800 line is exactly the
    opposite. They are native agp so the PCI-E versions do cost more. At this
    time ATI does not have a bridge chip so cards are either AGP or PCI-E except
    for the XT800 line for which they designed two chips, one for each format.

    DaveL
  21. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "John Lewis" <john.dsl@verizon.net> wrote in message
    news:4222c604.25523842@news.verizon.net...
    > On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 06:00:26 GMT, "Jonah Falcon"

    > nVidia is wisely holding off on releasing any Intel nForce
    > solution until Intel decides to stop screwing around with
    > 64-bit paper releases.
    >

    Nvidia will introduce Nforce for Intel chips to the world tomorrow.
    http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/050228/sfm045_1.html

    DaveL
  22. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "Kroagnon" <kroagnon@kroagnon.com> wrote in message
    news:1126e9j4deduq95@news.supernews.com...
    >
    > <turk96@attbi.com> wrote in message
    > news:1109570839.149177.55110@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
    >> PCI Express is on AMD boards as well, so it's not just Intel pushing it
    >> (I have an AMD chip on a PCIE board on my new system). PCI Express may
    >> not be much benefit now, but it will be in the near future. It's just
    >> that considering the price difference is pretty small on the
    >> motherboards, and the video cards are cheaper than their AGP
    >> equivalents, I don't see any reason for going with AGP on a whole new
    >
    > PCIX cheaper than AGP cards? Every price comparison I've seen has PCIX
    > cards
    > considerably more expensive than AGP cards.

    What site? I'm going by newegg mostly, but I've seen a few more.

    >> system. Pretty soon, AGP video cards will be rarer and much more
    >
    > The transition from AGP to PCIX is terrible. There IS no transition, and
    > those that have both are hack boards. You can't just take AGP slots off
    > the
    > boards overnight like they are trying to do.

    You mean there is no transition as in PCIE now exists? Yeah, I guess, there
    is no hybrid AGP/PCIE motherboard that takes both that I know of. And if
    there is a motherboard that does, it seems kind of stupid to me. Remember
    PCI graphics cards? AGP didn't exactly tip-toe in the door. Not many
    people bought an AGP motherboard with intentions to put a PCI video card in
    it.

    >> expensive than the PCI Express cards, not to mention obsolete. Already
    >> ATI is not making some of their cards in AGP models.
    >
    > Which matters not to me since my next video card will not be an ATI.

    I'm sure Nvidia will follow. Or will Nvidia take hold of the "two steps
    behind owners" and sell them $50 video cards? You figure it out.

    turk
    --
    "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and
    more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day
    the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the
    White House will be adorned by a downright moron." - H. L. Mencken,
    Baltimore Evening Sun on 26 July 1920
  23. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Thusly "Kroagnon" <kroagnon@kroagnon.com> Spake Unto All:

    >PCIX cheaper than AGP cards? Every price comparison I've seen has PCIX cards
    >considerably more expensive than AGP cards.

    Not true for the same card. E.g. ASUS Geforce 9600GT and 9800GT PCI-E
    are cheaper than the AGP versions.
  24. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:04:18 +0100, Mean_Chlorine
    <mike_noren2002@NOSPAMyahoo.co.uk> wrote:

    >Thusly john.dsl@verizon.net (John Lewis) Spake Unto All:
    >
    >>939 is AMDs forseeable-future pin-out for desktop applications
    >>both single and dual-core.
    >
    >I allow myself to be skeptical about that. AMD is very much into
    >planned obsolescense through socket change, and has a habit of not
    >informing anyone of changes until they're imminent, so I'm guessing
    >"the forseeable future" is one to two years.
    >
    >>The AMD desktop dual-core processors will only be available in
    >>939-pin form and <will retrofit> into the current 939-socket boards
    >>with just a BIOS change.
    >
    >Oh I'd like to believe that, it would thrill and surprise me if
    >there's not a big "BUT..." somewhere.
    >Like that those processors require more juice, or less juice, or don't
    >support present-gen memory controllers.

    AMD 64-bit has a built-in memory controller. The single reason for the
    easy single/dual compatibility - to everything external, the processor
    looks the same. A truly smart and forward-looking architectural
    decision. Not so with Intel's external memory controllers - hence they
    will need to update/kludge chip-sets if they want single/dual
    compatibility on the same MB - and I have no idea whether that is
    their intent with the 945 chip-set...........

    >Something, *anything*, that
    >mean they can not be used with present motherboards (or at least are
    >severely crippled if they can).
    >

    Engineering samples of the AMD dual-core has already been tried out in
    the Asus A8N-SLI. Works just fine, according to the reports. Built on
    the 90nm process and run at a slightly-lower clock-rate than the
    single-core; no problem with power/heat.

    However, if you are an overclocker-- do not rush out and buy the
    current A8N-SLI... see today's review by Anand on the current crop of
    SLI motherboards.

    >I use and recommend AMD. I just don't like their tendency for secrecy
    >and the way they hinder upgrades by surprise-changing sockets at short
    >intervals.
    >

    Have you observed Intel recently? Why shift from 478 to 775-pin at all
    for the 32-bit single core, since they were planning for
    near-simultaneous release of 64-bit and dual core. Why not delay
    pin-out/MB gyrations until the full 64-bit release and architecture
    full single-/dual-core/32-bit/64-bit compatibility into that
    CPU-design, pin-out and associated chip-sets ?? Both the current
    775-pin 32-bit Prescott and their 915/925 motherboards are soon-to-be
    orphans, after far less than a year of production. Compare with the
    life-time of the 478-pin P4 family and the associated chip-sets.

    BTW, up to this point I have only had Intel processors in all my
    machines and systems that I have built for others. However,
    Intel's Prescott system-architectural and marketing stupidity plus
    their arrogance with regard to the 64-bit roll-out, taken together
    with AMDs faultless 64-bit execution in both desk-top and X86-servers
    has made me ( like many others) actively consider the alternatives.

    And on the server-side, I note Anand's glowing review of the
    4x Opteron 3U-high baby-server from Sun --- into which
    4 dual-core Opterons can be instantly swapped when they
    are production-available.............hah !! At ~ $20,000
    a pop with instant dual-core upgrade potential, Sun should
    sell a whole lot of those..........

    John Lewis.
  25. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "Andrew" <spamtrap@localhost.> wrote in message
    news:2n962157uugv665f8h2fuqbilvhk7bn935@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:04:18 +0100, Mean_Chlorine
    > <mike_noren2002@NOSPAMyahoo.co.uk> wrote:
    >
    >>I use and recommend AMD. I just don't like their tendency for secrecy
    >>and the way they hinder upgrades by surprise-changing sockets at short
    >>intervals.
    >
    > I haven't owned an Intel based machine for ages, but from what I
    > remember they weren't any better on that front. I think every
    > processor upgrade I have made has always had a corresponding mobo
    > upgrade along with it, I just look at the prospective CPU price and
    > add 100 pounds socket tax to it.


    This will be my first AMD computer. I've been high on AMD for a long while,
    but never really had a chance to buy one til now.

    Jonah Falcon
  26. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    >
    > 939-pin PCIe SLI motherboard with nForce4 SLI chip-set, but
    > wait a few months for any silicon and BIOS changes to settle down
    > ( including any required for dual-core) and prices to start leveling
    > out (steeply ramping down at the moment) on all elements- CPU,
    > MB, and PCIe video cards. About mid-Summer 2005 would
    > probably be optimum to lay out the bucks for a new system.
    > ( AMD is due to be shipping dual-core beginning June 2005
    > and any system teething problems with single/dual-core MB
    > compatibility should have been ironed out

    Unfortunately, time is not an option. Right now, my other good computer is
    shot to hell, and the one I'm using right now is an ancient Pentium 3 600mhz
    computer that I use for email and writing scripts on Final Draft. Good for
    Civilization III and Diablo II, but not much else. (laugh) Actually, it's
    good enough to do City of Heroes and World of Warcraft on low res, but I no
    longer play either.

    Jonah Falcon
  27. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "turk" <turk96@comcast.net> wrote in message
    news:96Kdna615JDBo7_fRVn-jQ@comcast.com...
    > "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    > news:2nqUd.1544$wy3.881@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>
    >> "OldDog" <OldDog@city.pound> wrote in message
    >> news:QjpUd.66206$cW2.56583@fe2.texas.rr.com...
    >>>
    >>> "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    >>> news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>>> What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >>>> architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >>>> motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>>>
    >>>> Jonah Falcon
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> As others have pointed out, the 939 supports dual channel memory. Oh,
    >>> and
    >>> you did order a 939 cpu to go with that 939 mb?
    >>
    >> Of course. ;)
    >>
    >> 939-pin GigaByte GA-K8NS-939 nForce3 Ultra Chipset AGP8X
    >> w/LAN,USB2,&Audio on the motherboard, with the Athlon64 939-pin CPU. I
    >> got the 1024 MB (512MBx2) PC3200 400MHz Dual Channel DDR memory to go
    >> with it.
    >>
    >> To defray costs, I only got a Geforce-FX 5500 256MB DDR --- I have a
    >> better videocard, and just going to swap them between computers (the 5500
    >> goes to the older CPU, the Geforce 6800 GT 256MB AGP8X goes to the new
    >> one.)
    >
    > Isn't it a little late in the game to go with AGP on a new system? I took
    > the plunge with PCI-E and nForce 4. And what CPU speed did you get?

    LOL - You will have replaced your mobo before you get to experience the
    "advantage" of PCI-E. BTW don't get me wrong. I really like people like you
    because you finance my inexpensive hardware purchases in a few months time
    by paying way too much now.
  28. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Thus spake "Fred At Home" <fredathome@fscans.cjb.net>, Mon, 28 Feb 2005
    20:02:05 +1100, Anno Domini:

    >
    >"turk" <turk96@comcast.net> wrote in message
    >news:96Kdna615JDBo7_fRVn-jQ@comcast.com...
    >> "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    >> news:2nqUd.1544$wy3.881@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>>
    >>> "OldDog" <OldDog@city.pound> wrote in message
    >>> news:QjpUd.66206$cW2.56583@fe2.texas.rr.com...
    >>>>
    >>>> "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    >>>> news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >>>>> What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    >>>>> architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    >>>>> motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Jonah Falcon
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> As others have pointed out, the 939 supports dual channel memory. Oh,
    >>>> and
    >>>> you did order a 939 cpu to go with that 939 mb?
    >>>
    >>> Of course. ;)
    >>>
    >>> 939-pin GigaByte GA-K8NS-939 nForce3 Ultra Chipset AGP8X
    >>> w/LAN,USB2,&Audio on the motherboard, with the Athlon64 939-pin CPU. I
    >>> got the 1024 MB (512MBx2) PC3200 400MHz Dual Channel DDR memory to go
    >>> with it.
    >>>
    >>> To defray costs, I only got a Geforce-FX 5500 256MB DDR --- I have a
    >>> better videocard, and just going to swap them between computers (the 5500
    >>> goes to the older CPU, the Geforce 6800 GT 256MB AGP8X goes to the new
    >>> one.)
    >>
    >> Isn't it a little late in the game to go with AGP on a new system? I took
    >> the plunge with PCI-E and nForce 4. And what CPU speed did you get?
    >
    >LOL - You will have replaced your mobo before you get to experience the
    >"advantage" of PCI-E. BTW don't get me wrong. I really like people like you
    >because you finance my inexpensive hardware purchases in a few months time
    >by paying way too much now.
    >

    Ditto :). I'm upgradin from a 1.4GHz 1600XP AMD (266MHz fsb) & a 9600 Pro to
    a 754 pin 3400+ AMD & a X800 Pro. Now *that's* a midrange->midrange
    sensible, value-for-money upgrade! Doesn't hurt that the company's footin
    the bill either >;-)

    --
    Replace 'spamfree' with the other word for 'maze' to reply via email.
  29. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Hi,

    Kroagnon <kroagnon@kroagnon.com> wrote:
    #AGP is not even being maxed out yet.

    True enough.

    #There is currently no benefit to PCIX except more revenue for Intel.
    #The video cards are also more expensive than AGP.

    If you're comparing PCI-X to AGP, sure, I guess they are more expensive,
    but only some UNIX workstations and servers user PCI-X.

    PCI-E cards of the new generation (NVIDIA 6xxx & ATi Xxxx) have been
    cheaper in PCI-E than AGP, mainly because they were designed for PCI-E
    from the beginning. There are also long-term production savings in using
    high speed serial instead of parallel circuitry.

    #You just can't change the standard overnight like Intel thinks they can do.

    Sure you can, it just involves spending money.

    Ken.
    --
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Mail: kmarsh at charm dot net | Just say "no" to liars SCO and Soyo
    WWW: http://www.charm.net/~kmarsh | Return services to local CIS offices!
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
  30. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "John Lewis" <john.dsl@verizon.net> wrote in message
    news:42234a12.3340715@news.verizon.net...

    > Have you observed Intel recently? Why shift from 478 to 775-pin at all
    > for the 32-bit single core, since they were planning for
    > near-simultaneous release of 64-bit and dual core. Why not delay
    > pin-out/MB gyrations until the full 64-bit release and architecture
    > full single-/dual-core/32-bit/64-bit compatibility into that
    > CPU-design, pin-out and associated chip-sets ?? Both the current
    > 775-pin 32-bit Prescott and their 915/925 motherboards are soon-to-be
    > orphans, after far less than a year of production. Compare with the
    > life-time of the 478-pin P4 family and the associated chip-sets.

    I was very dissappointed with how Intel killed socket 478 CPUs within a
    matter of weeks for the 775-pinless freak show. Had to upgrade a game server
    machine and had no choice but to get one of these. Wanted a 3.4 socket 478
    Northwood but had to get a 775 Prescott. Prescott is VERY hot. :(

    > BTW, up to this point I have only had Intel processors in all my
    > machines and systems that I have built for others. However,
    > Intel's Prescott system-architectural and marketing stupidity plus
    > their arrogance with regard to the 64-bit roll-out, taken together
    > with AMDs faultless 64-bit execution in both desk-top and X86-servers
    > has made me ( like many others) actively consider the alternatives.

    You should have considered the alternatives a long time ago: the Athlon64
    has been faster than Intel's comparable for quite a long time now. The only
    reason I didn't take the plunge when I upgraded last year was the lack of
    proper NForce chipset support for the socket 939 CPUs, otherwise I would
    have gone Athlon64. That is no longer an issue however.

    > And on the server-side, I note Anand's glowing review of the
    > 4x Opteron 3U-high baby-server from Sun --- into which
    > 4 dual-core Opterons can be instantly swapped when they
    > are production-available.............hah !! At ~ $20,000
    > a pop with instant dual-core upgrade potential, Sun should
    > sell a whole lot of those..........

    Indeed... I have been using Intel P4s (non Xenon) for game servers for
    awhile now but a dual core Opteron is making me take notice. Dual core AND
    64-bits. That is gonna rock!
  31. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "Ken Marsh" <kmarsh@fellspt.charm.net> wrote in message
    news:OwMUd.9$105.1269@news.abs.net...

    > #There is currently no benefit to PCIX except more revenue for Intel.
    > #The video cards are also more expensive than AGP.
    >
    > If you're comparing PCI-X to AGP, sure, I guess they are more expensive,
    > but only some UNIX workstations and servers user PCI-X.

    My mistake - the "X" I was referring to is just "Xpress". I had forgotton
    about the 64-bit PCI standard called "PCIX".

    > PCI-E cards of the new generation (NVIDIA 6xxx & ATi Xxxx) have been
    > cheaper in PCI-E than AGP, mainly because they were designed for PCI-E
    > from the beginning. There are also long-term production savings in using
    > high speed serial instead of parallel circuitry.

    No, PCI Express cards are much more expensive than their AGP counterparts.
    I'm comparing stuff like the NVidia 6800GT 256MB with GDDR3. Look it up for
    yourself. This will probably change in the future but for now is not the
    reality.

    The bottom line is that you can't just ignore the installed base of AGP.
    Well you can, but you're going to lose business. I don't have a problem
    upgrading my PC because I derive so much entertainment value from it but I
    just upgraded my PC last April and I'll be damned if I'm going to upgrade it
    again just because Intel wants to push PCIE. I think you'll find this to be
    a common statement. So they will need another generation of AGP cards.
  32. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "turk" <turk96@comcast.net> wrote in message
    news:YbudnebmqvvTNb7fRVn-1w@comcast.com...
    > > PCIX cheaper than AGP cards? Every price comparison I've seen has PCIX
    > > cards
    > > considerably more expensive than AGP cards.
    > What site? I'm going by newegg mostly, but I've seen a few more.

    Newegg seems to be fantastically overpriced on video cards right now. I'm
    comparing on Pricewatch.com.

    > > The transition from AGP to PCIX is terrible. There IS no transition, and
    > > those that have both are hack boards. You can't just take AGP slots off
    > > the
    > > boards overnight like they are trying to do.
    > You mean there is no transition as in PCIE now exists? Yeah, I guess,
    there
    > is no hybrid AGP/PCIE motherboard that takes both that I know of. And if
    > there is a motherboard that does, it seems kind of stupid to me. Remember
    > PCI graphics cards? AGP didn't exactly tip-toe in the door. Not many
    > people bought an AGP motherboard with intentions to put a PCI video card
    in
    > it.

    Yea, there are hybrid AGP and PCIE boards, but the one I saw had a warning
    that said that AGP cards will have a "lesser life span" due to the voltage
    issues. That raises a red flag for me. Clearly there is no support in the
    standard to support AGP.

    I mean these PCI Express boards support the original 32-bit PCI, so why not
    support AGP? Just like PCI boards supported ISA for the longest time.
  33. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    I'm changing the subject title because this has gone waaaaaaay beyond AMD
    pin configs. lol

    Jonah Falcon
  34. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    Hi,

    Kroagnon <kroagnon@kroagnon.com> wrote:
    #No, PCI Express cards are much more expensive than their AGP counterparts.
    #I'm comparing stuff like the NVidia 6800GT 256MB with GDDR3. Look it up for
    #yourself. This will probably change in the future but for now is not the
    #reality.

    Now compare 6600GT AGP prices (about $210) to 6600GT PCI-E prices (about
    $180). Then compare ATi 9600 series AGP boards with X600-X700 boards, an
    even larger price difference. This is the price range most people will
    be buying in, hardly seems unfair to me, the lower cost PCI-E board
    makes buying the motherboard easier.

    #The bottom line is that you can't just ignore the installed base of AGP.
    #Well you can, but you're going to lose business. I don't have a problem
    #upgrading my PC because I derive so much entertainment value from it but I
    #just upgraded my PC last April and I'll be damned if I'm going to upgrade it
    #again just because Intel wants to push PCIE. I think you'll find this to be
    #a common statement. So they will need another generation of AGP cards.

    And we *have* the new generation of AGP cards, they were just introduced
    over the past few months by both NVIDIA and ATi. Or, did you mean yet
    another generation of AGP, introduced in a year or two? Don't hold your
    breath.

    Ken.
    --
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Mail: kmarsh at charm dot net | Just say "no" to liars SCO and Soyo
    WWW: http://www.charm.net/~kmarsh | Return services to local CIS offices!
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
  35. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    "turk" <turk96@comcast.net> looked up from reading the entrails of the
    porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:
    >"Kroagnon" <kroagnon@kroagnon.com> wrote in message
    >news:1126e9j4deduq95@news.supernews.com...
    <snip>
    >>> system. Pretty soon, AGP video cards will be rarer and much more
    >>
    >> The transition from AGP to PCIX is terrible. There IS no transition, and
    >> those that have both are hack boards. You can't just take AGP slots off
    >> the
    >> boards overnight like they are trying to do.
    >
    >You mean there is no transition as in PCIE now exists? Yeah, I guess, there
    >is no hybrid AGP/PCIE motherboard that takes both that I know of. And if
    >there is a motherboard that does, it seems kind of stupid to me. Remember
    >PCI graphics cards? AGP didn't exactly tip-toe in the door. Not many
    >people bought an AGP motherboard with intentions to put a PCI video card in
    >it.

    Everyone who was upgrading their system but couldn't afford a new video
    card at the same time did.

    When I built a Duron system, my Voodoo3 was still good enough to run
    everything currently out.
    The increase in system speed more than offset any slowness of the
    slightly aged video.
    Morrowind was the first game I ran into that just plain would not work
    without a 32bit color card.

    Xocyll
    --
    I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
    a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
    Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
    FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
  36. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action (More info?)

    754 mobo's have hypertransport too. It's just the interface between CPU and
    memory.
    939 boards have more features like dual channel memory and PCI-Express.
    Probably worth the extra dough.
    "Jonah Falcon" <jonahnynla@mindspring.com> wrote in message
    news:_ldUd.8203$Ba3.6553@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    > What's the difference between the Athlon 754-pin and 939-pin CPUs (ie.
    > architecture)? I just ordered a computer and spent extra for a 939-pin
    > motherboard to have "Hyper Transport Technology".
    >
    > Jonah Falcon
    >
    >
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