Problem with ATA Serial article

[xxsk8er101xx]

"all storage devices still have to share the 133 Mbps bandwidth of the PCI bus."

*clears throat*

ok first of all all Intel computers have 266MBps bandwidth. MegaBytes! not Megabits! if it was 133Mbps (which says 133 MegaBits per second) it would only be 16.625MBps bandwidth! You wouldn't be able to run anything! Everything would be slow! And there would be no way in hell you would even get 30MBps harddisk drive speed let alone 16 which is the old PIO 4 standard!

WHoever wrote this article clearly has no clue the difference between MBps and Mbps. there is a HUGE difference between the two! HUGE! it's a factor of 8!

I want tomshardware to edit the article and update it and clearly mark the difference! this is misleading! newbies are gonna think that the pci bus is only 16MBps! when it's 133MBps or in todays world 266MBps. WHich is clearly fast enough to run serial ATA 150 hard drives.

Once again tomshardware releases a confusing misleading POS article!

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[Ncogneto]

ok first of all all Intel computers have 266MBps bandwidth.

Perhaps before you go bashing someone on what may be a simple typo perhaps you need to go get a clue. The only computers that have more than 133MB/s peak bandwith are those with 66 mhz/64 bit slots. Intel has absolutely no 32 bit 33 mhz pci slots that can sustain anymore than 133 MB/s. Its impossible. Now, run along and go do your homework!

It's not what they tell you, its what they don't tell you!

 

[xxsk8er101xx]

ok ... what is the total bandwidth of the PCI bus? I don't care about the individual slots! because the hard drive shares the pci bus, the pci slots share the bus, the USB devices share the pci bus ... basicly everything has a bus but the AGP PORT. it's called a port for a reason.

just so you know you do not know me. Show some respect jackass!

good god ... you don't even know my name and here you are offending me ... no wonder why humanity is going strait to hell!

if your plugging your hard drive to a pci slot then you got some series mental retardation going on!

*roles eyes*

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[Crashman]

SETTLE DOWN NOW!!! I'm sure it was a typo with the small b. Now, the controller card he was using was PCI. In order for the controller to be faster on a standard PC, it would have to be integrated into the chipset!

<font color=blue>You're posting in a forum with class. It may be third class, but it's still class!</font color=blue>

 

[Crashman]

My term to nit pick! Don't you think the term AGP Port is a little repetitive. AGP stands for...you know.

<font color=blue>You're posting in a forum with class. It may be third class, but it's still class!</font color=blue>

 

[lhgpoobaa]

hehehe like anti skid ABS or an ATM machine

still, the article was NOT very clear regarding multiple drives on one cable. at one point it seems you can have two drives on one cable as the article talked about the pci card with 2 slots but supporting 4 drives. grrrr. wish they would explain it.

<b>Before visiting THG i was a clueless noob. Now im still clueless, but look at my nice title!<b>

 

[xxsk8er101xx]

? If we did that on a test we would get tortured. This guy is a professional. as far as a typo he did it a lot more times then once. infact it's throughout his entire article. Small typo? The terminology states, b stands for bits and B stands for Bytes. It's a rule we learn in our intro to computer courses. And yes it's a rule.

ahhh a controller card. gotchya. i thought it was on the motherboard. He still should have stated that if it was integrated in the chipset speed wouldn't be a problem.

either way i'm more annoyed about misusing the terminology. We have it for a reason! We shouldn't make exceptions for the purpose that newbies will become overly confused and start believing that b and B are interchangable or something. They mean completely different things. Just like Internet and internet mean different things. It's basic terminology that every computer guru follows as rules. And this author broke a rule. Get it? He should go back and make his corrections.

It's completely arrogant to think you are above the rules and that using proper terminology doesn't apply to you.



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[TopperTheCopper]

The article indeed looked more like a first-sample-test setup, and not informative as it comes to the S-ATA basics. I only read about the possible transfer speeds, and all the other benefits it has, but I didn't see anything about the S-ATA standard EIA-644. Maybe they could have included more about that, and about the techniques that are needed to reach higher speeds. E.g. the 0,6 micron-technology for 150 Mbps transfers, and 0,25 micron for approx. 400 Mbps transfer. Also, the EIA-644 standard includes more information on what to expect from power supply to the drives. The signaling is done at 250 mV differential signaling, and the maximum voltage range for current LVDS chips, which is only 2,4 V. (LVDS=Low Voltage Differential Signaling).
Alltogether, one could say there's a lot missing in this article if it is meant as an 'S-ATA technology overview'...

 

[Ncogneto]

ok ... what is the total bandwidth of the PCI bus? I don't care about the individual slots! because the hard drive shares the pci bus, the pci slots share the bus, the USB devices share the pci bus ... basicly everything has a bus but the AGP PORT. it's called a port for a reason.

The TOTAL bandwith of the pci bus (theoritical) is 133MB/s. All your pci slots share this bandwith. Integrated IDE controllers today are connected to the pci bus as well. In practice the actual maximum is more around 110 to 90 MB/s do to overhead. Motherboards that have special 64 bit slots or 66 mhz slots ( only found on dual or greater mobo's to date) can double ( 66mhz/32 bit) or quadruple ( 66mhz,64 bit) the bandwith.

It's not what they tell you, its what they don't tell you!

 

[xxsk8er101xx]

umm it's terminology.

Small typo? He did it through out his entire article! And you call that small?

Lets go in the real world for a moment. Lets say i wrote up a set of instructions on how to go about a problem. Launching a missle ok?

And i wrote as an example,

"Allocate 16Mb of data for storage"

You being a computer guru know that means 16 Megabits. So you set up storage for 16Mb, which is 2MB. And you get the program running and you lunch the missle ok. The missle malfunctions and hits a small village killing a few people and injury many more. You go back and find out you needed at least 16MB's of storage and the missle malfunctioned because it didn't have enough space.

Ya it's an extreme example. The point is still there.
There is a huge difference between Mb and MB. It's confusing enough for most newbies to remember which is what. Including managers! So lets stick with the rules and terminology ok!? He better go back and fix it!

The wonderful thing about the digital age is that he can go back and edit it and correct the mistakes! It would be completely arrogant not to! That he's above the rules and doesn't have to following proper terminology! It's there for a reason!

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[Ncogneto]

just so you know you do not know me. Show some respect jackass!

good god ... you don't even know my name and here you are offending me ... no wonder why humanity is going strait to hell!

First of all those that live in glass houses should not throw stones. I would be more than happy to apologize if you were to do the same to the author. I found it rather ironic that you choose to ridicule him about some typos and in the same breath spout some misinformation yourself. And to make matters worse your mistakes could not be passed off as an easy typo.

Admittedly the article was lacking in some detail, however you do not teach one calculus before you teach him basic arithmetic. You have to take into account the majority of THG's readership into account.


It's not what they tell you, its what they don't tell you!

 

[xxsk8er101xx]

Ok then what is this 266MB PCI bandwidth all about? Smoke and mirrors?



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[xxsk8er101xx]

Ok then what is this 266MB PCI bandwidth all about? Smoke and mirrors?



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[xxsk8er101xx]

there is a difference bewteen saying AGP Port and 300MB Bytes. It's a simple redundency. Everyone does it.

But there is a huge difference between saying you have a 30GB hard drive and a 30Gb hard drive! Clearly this is misleading. Which one is it? is it a 30GB hard drive or a 30Gb hard drive? Obviously the 30Gb hard drive is 8 times smaller!

see the difference yet?

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[xxsk8er101xx]

hey if you didn't offend me in the first place there would be no reason too apologize.

If i'm spreading such misinformation then correct me like a present civilized human being! Not some barbaric moron!

For starters, can you explain to me what this 266MBps pci bandwidth is all about? I believe VIA's kt400A is 533MBps PCI bandwidth. Not the PCI slot bandwidth.

My understanding is that's the PCI bandwidth for the BUS. The slots are obviusly limited to 133MBps (notice how i'm capatilizing the B).

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[casiowatch]

You have got to learn to shut up. Read the articles defined by the Serial-ATA standards group. I respect THG, maybe if they did a typo (don't really care, I like seeing what is new).

Gigabytes, gigabits, god damn, just let it go. Nobody's out to fool you, just yourself.

 

[xxsk8er101xx]

hey if you didn't offend me in the first place there would be no reason too apologize.

If i'm spreading such misinformation then correct me like a present civilized human being! Not some barbaric moron!

For starters, can you explain to me what this 266MBps pci bandwidth is all about? I believe VIA's kt400A is 533MBps PCI bandwidth. Not the PCI slot.

My understanding is that's the PCI bandwidth for the BUS. The slots are obviusly limited to 133MBps (notice how i'm capatilizing the B for proper terminology)


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[Ncogneto]

For starters, can you explain to me what this 266MBps pci bandwidth is all about? I believe VIA's kt400A is 533MBps PCI bandwidth. Not the PCI slot.

Your confusing the bandwith from the north bridge to the south bridge with the bandwith of the pci bus. It would be very easy to explain if I could do a block diagram.

It's not what they tell you, its what they don't tell you!<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by ncogneto on 08/13/02 07:47 PM.</EM></FONT></P>