Sign in with
Sign up | Sign in
Your question

How can I plug a turntable into a receiver with no PHONO...

Last response: in Home Audio
Share
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 2:41:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi,

My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers don't
have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit more to get
one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to convert the
phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these ready
made?

Thanks,

Alan
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 3:52:49 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

SA Dev <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote:
>
>My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers don't
>have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit more to get
>one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to convert the
>phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these ready
>made?

Yes, you can buy an outboard phono preamp. Adcom makes a decent one for
around $150 as long as you don't need anything fancy like moving coil inputs.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 3:59:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

SA Dev wrote:

> My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers don't
> have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit more to get
> one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to convert the
> phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these ready
> made?


Probably Radio Shack. It's a phono preamp. Glancing at their site, I saw
a turntable with a built-in preamp for $99.00.
Related resources
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 8:14:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
news:4164122c$1@news.tulsaconnect.com...
> Hi,
>
> My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers don't
> have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit more to
get
> one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to convert the
> phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these ready
> made?

What you want is a phono preamp. audioXpress magazine did technical and
listening tests on a variety of small, cheap phono preamps a year or so ago;
most of them tested out quite badly, and sounded pretty crummy too. The
Hagerman Bugle was the clear winner -- it had the closest thing to proper
RIAA compensation, a necessity for a phono preamp. It sells for about $50.
In second place, technically, was the Radio Shack preamp, at $25. The rest
had such high deviations from proper RIAA response and (in some cases) high
distortion levels that I wouldn't bother looking at them.

Peace,
Paul
Anonymous
October 6, 2004 10:20:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
news:4164122c$1@news.tulsaconnect.com
> Hi,
>
> My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers
> don't have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a
> bit more to get one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I
> can use to convert the phono input to line input? Any idea where I
> could buy one of these ready made?

Here's a number of alternatives

http://www.kabusa.com/frameset.htm?phonpre.htm
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 12:49:07 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Fry's has one that's inexpensive <25$ and doesn't sound horrible. If you
have a really nice turntable/stylus you might want to shop for a better one
via Froogle, etc...

good luck!





"SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
news:4164122c$1@news.tulsaconnect.com...
> Hi,
>
> My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers don't
> have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit more to
get
> one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to convert the
> phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these ready
> made?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Alan
>
>
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 12:57:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi guys,

This is the turntable I have:

http://tinyurl.com/7yh2y

It says it has a built-in phono pre-amp. Does this mean I still need to run
it through something like this:

http://tinyurl.com/2glt8

Before I can connect it to a generic (non phono) line input like aux in?

Thanks!

Alan
October 7, 2004 1:13:03 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <7TY8d.1061$iC4.191@fe2.texas.rr.com>,
"uber_lame" <bobo@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Fry's has one that's inexpensive <25$ and doesn't sound horrible. If you
> have a really nice turntable/stylus you might want to shop for a better one
> via Froogle, etc...
>
> good luck!
>
>
>
>
>
> "SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
> news:4164122c$1@news.tulsaconnect.com...
> > Hi,
> >
> > My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers don't
> > have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit more to
> get
> > one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to convert the
> > phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these ready
> > made?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Alan
> >
> >
>
>

Rats(radio) shack used to sell a riaa phono preamp
suitable for dance schools trying to put record players thru thier PA
systems
George
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 1:53:01 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

George <g.p.gleason@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:g.p.gleason-657957.17130406102004@netnews.worldnet.att.net:

> In article <7TY8d.1061$iC4.191@fe2.texas.rr.com>,
> "uber_lame" <bobo@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Fry's has one that's inexpensive <25$ and doesn't sound horrible. If
>> you have a really nice turntable/stylus you might want to shop for a
>> better one via Froogle, etc...
>>
>> good luck!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
>> news:4164122c$1@news.tulsaconnect.com...
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers
>> > don't have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a
>> > bit more to
>> get
>> > one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to
>> > convert the phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy
>> > one of these ready made?
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> >
>> > Alan
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> Rats(radio) shack used to sell a riaa phono preamp
> suitable for dance schools trying to put record players thru thier PA
> systems
> George
>

ART makes one called the "DeeJay Pre". I like it, but I haven't compared
it to anything. Got mine from Sweetwater.

Greg
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 1:57:49 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
news:4164a2a8$1@news.tulsaconnect.com...
> Hi guys,
>
> This is the turntable I have:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/7yh2y

[Sony PS-LX250H]

> It says it has a built-in phono pre-amp. Does this mean I still need to
> run
> it through something like this:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/2glt8

[Radio Shack RIAA phono preamp]

> Before I can connect it to a generic (non phono) line input like aux in?

It would appear that you do *not* need an external phono
preamp if Sony claims that the turntable has one built-in.

Alas, the writing of the "specifications" seems to be hijacked
by cluless marketing people. No mention of line-level (or ANY)
output, But "Fully-automatic operation" (whatever that means?)
is important enough to repeat twice in succession. :-(
Perhaps that is the difference between "Sonystyle" and "Sony"?
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 12:50:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

SA Dev <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote:
>Hi guys,
>
>This is the turntable I have:
>
>http://tinyurl.com/7yh2y

Yucch. I am sorry. These things are _not_ exactly accurate tracking
machines.
>
>It says it has a built-in phono pre-amp. Does this mean I still need to run
>it through something like this:
>
>http://tinyurl.com/2glt8
>
>Before I can connect it to a generic (non phono) line input like aux in?

No, these things have built-in preamplifiers so they have a line level
output. I suspect the preamplifier is probably as bad as the arm, though.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 3:18:13 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <4164a2a8$1@news.tulsaconnect.com> nospam38925@forme.com writes:

> This is the turntable I have:
> It says it has a built-in phono pre-amp. Does this mean I still need to run
> it through something like this:

To me, "phono preamp" means that the output is at line level, not at
phono cartridge level, and has the RIAA equalization built in. You
should not need (nor should not use) an outboard phono preamp.

However, you have the turntable, and presumably you have something
like a receiver, mixer, or amplifier that you intend to use with it.
What happens when you connect them in the logical manner?

I assume you wouldn't be asking unless it didn't work.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 4:04:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"SA Dev"
>
> This is the turntable I have:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/7yh2y
>
> It says it has a built-in phono pre-amp. Does this mean I still need to
> run
> it through something like this:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/2glt8
>
> Before I can connect it to a generic (non phono) line input like aux in?


** No.





........... Phil
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 4:04:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Phil Allison wrote:
> "SA Dev"
>
>> This is the turntable I have:
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/7yh2y
>>
>> It says it has a built-in phono pre-amp. Does this mean I still
>> need to run it through something like this:
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/2glt8
>>
>> Before I can connect it to a generic (non phono) line input like
>> aux in?
>
>
>
> ** No.



I love how the "specifications" page is an exact relisting of the
"features" page, but omitting the paragraph that mentions the built-in
RIAA preamp.
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 7:35:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Don Cooper" <dcooper28800@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:41641658.3D2541F7@comcast.net...

> Probably Radio Shack. It's a phono preamp. Glancing at their site, I saw
> a turntable with a built-in preamp for $99.00.

Would you play YOUR records on it?
I wouldn't want mine in the same room!

TonyP.
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 7:37:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"SA Dev" <nospam38925@forme.com> wrote in message
news:4164122c$1@news.tulsaconnect.com...
> Hi,
>
> My old receiver is dying, and I noticed that many new AV receivers
don't
> have a phono input anymore, unless you want to spend quite a bit
more to get
> one with it. Is there a small circuit or adapter I can use to
convert the
> phono input to line input? Any idea where I could buy one of these
ready
> made?

Buy one of the receivers that DOES have a phono input.

Norm Strong
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 7:44:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Paul Stamler" <pstamlerhell@pobox.com> wrote in message
news:p RU8d.670511$Gx4.207065@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> What you want is a phono preamp. audioXpress magazine did technical and
> listening tests on a variety of small, cheap phono preamps a year or so
ago;
> most of them tested out quite badly, and sounded pretty crummy too. The
> Hagerman Bugle was the clear winner -- it had the closest thing to proper
> RIAA compensation, a necessity for a phono preamp. It sells for about $50.
> In second place, technically, was the Radio Shack preamp, at $25. The rest
> had such high deviations from proper RIAA response and (in some cases)
high
> distortion levels that I wouldn't bother looking at them.

Considering the response variation of phono cartridges and records
themselves, I've always thought people who worry about <1dB RIAA deviation
are fooling themselves. The best pre-amp will still sound poor if not
properly matched to the cartridge in most cases. Also distortion levels in a
phono pre-amp higher than the records and cartridges available would
indicate something wrong.
Having said that, if you're going to play vinyl, you might as well do it
properly. $50 or more for a pre-amp will be the least of your costs.

TonyP.
Anonymous
October 7, 2004 7:44:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi,

Thanks to all for posting. After some more research I found that the record
player has a switch that turns on the built in preamp. This is certainly
the easiest solution as I won't have to buy anything extra.

Thanks,

Alan
Anonymous
October 8, 2004 10:10:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Paul Stamler" <pstamlerhell@pobox.com> wrote in message
news:fBe9d.504480$OB3.88394@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Tech Link TPA-2: Bass rising to a broad hump: +3.6dB centering around
80Hz.
> Treble: rises continuously from 2kHz on up, +13.1dB at 20kHz. This massive
> error results from the fact that the designer used the NAB tape EQ circuit
> from the data sheet for the opamp they used. Yes, really.

I see your point. I suppose it shouldn't amaze me, but you do wonder how
these things get into production.

> The ineptitude with which these preamps were designed is remarkable. The
> poor distortion performance might be understandable (many of the
> low-performing units run on a pair of 9V batteries -- but then, so does
the
> Hagerman).

Yes, a +/- 9V supply is quite sufficient if you have adjustable gain to
match the cartridge. The concept that you need 30v or more out of a pre-amp,
then feed it into a power amp with 1V or so input sensitivity has always
amazed me. It's only to give better looking specs.
And a battery supply does eliminate one potential source of hum at least.

>But with the formulas for calculating accurate RIAA response
> having been published some 30 years ago, there's no excuse for not doing
> that right -- and Tech Link's using an NAB tape network instead of RIAA,
as
> a friend of mine used to say, buggers the imagination.

Sure does. :-)

TonyP.
Anonymous
October 8, 2004 10:10:25 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"TonyP" <TonyP@optus.net.com.au> wrote in message
news:41664b9f$0$23897$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

> > The ineptitude with which these preamps were designed is remarkable. The
> > poor distortion performance might be understandable (many of the
> > low-performing units run on a pair of 9V batteries -- but then, so does
> the
> > Hagerman).
>
> Yes, a +/- 9V supply is quite sufficient if you have adjustable gain to
> match the cartridge. The concept that you need 30v or more out of a
pre-amp,
> then feed it into a power amp with 1V or so input sensitivity has always
> amazed me. It's only to give better looking specs.
> And a battery supply does eliminate one potential source of hum at least.

Interestingly enough, some of the worst-performing preamps had less gain
than the Hagerman. They're simple two-transistor circuits that were badly
designed. The Hagerman has very clever design; gain is spread over three
opamps, with passive networks between them.

Most of the op-amp-based designs in the test scored very well on distortion
performance (and one that didn't was the one that used an NAB EQ curve; it
overloaded in the non-rolled-off treble). The two-transistor jobs scored
very badly. It's possible to make a two-transistor, single-supply circuit
that performs well. Unfortunately, these designers didn't.

Peace,
Paul
Anonymous
October 9, 2004 8:49:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Paul Stamler" <pstamlerhell@pobox.com> wrote in message
news:WEy9d.510347$OB3.462916@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Interestingly enough, some of the worst-performing preamps had less gain
> than the Hagerman. They're simple two-transistor circuits that were badly
> designed. The Hagerman has very clever design; gain is spread over three
> opamps, with passive networks between them.
>
> Most of the op-amp-based designs in the test scored very well on
distortion
> performance (and one that didn't was the one that used an NAB EQ curve; it
> overloaded in the non-rolled-off treble). The two-transistor jobs scored
> very badly. It's possible to make a two-transistor, single-supply circuit
> that performs well. Unfortunately, these designers didn't.

The first I ever designed and built was a 3 transistor per channel job
which worked OK, but not great. Then I made one using 2 * 5534's per
channel, not long after they came out. Never found a record that was better.
The worst I ever heard used a single 741 per channel.

It's amazing that they are still getting it badly wrong, but not so
surprising that you can get satisfactory performance at an acceptable price,
if you look hard enough.

TonyP.
Anonymous
October 9, 2004 8:49:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"TonyP" <TonyP@optus.net.com.au> wrote in message
news:41678a7e$0$20128$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au...

> The first I ever designed and built was a 3 transistor per channel job
> which worked OK, but not great. Then I made one using 2 * 5534's per
> channel, not long after they came out. Never found a record that was
better.
> The worst I ever heard used a single 741 per channel.
>
> It's amazing that they are still getting it badly wrong, but not so
> surprising that you can get satisfactory performance at an acceptable
price,
> if you look hard enough.

Indeed. They get away with it by using battery power rather than having you
spend the money on a power supply (the hidden cost, of course, is that you
have to supply the batteries), and by not furnishing a box, just a circuit
board. You supply the box too. So it winds up being a $70 preamp rather than
$50, taking into account box, batteries and shipping. Still a hell of a
deal.

Incidentally, it's based around Burr-Brown 2134 dual opamps.

Peace,
Paul
Anonymous
October 9, 2004 11:44:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Paul Stamler" <pstamlerhell@pobox.com> wrote in message
news:AjM9d.679659$Gx4.658532@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Indeed. They get away with it by using battery power rather than having
you
> spend the money on a power supply (the hidden cost, of course, is that you
> have to supply the batteries),

That's my preferred set up now for transferring to CDR. which is all most
people do with vinyl these days anyway.
For batteries, use NiMH rechargeables.

>and by not furnishing a box, just a circuit
> board. You supply the box too. So it winds up being a $70 preamp rather
than
> $50, taking into account box, batteries and shipping. Still a hell of a
> deal.

I guess that does leave out the mechanically challenged though. Pretty fair
deal for the rest it seems.

TonyP.
Anonymous
October 10, 2004 3:57:01 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

TonyP wrote:

> > Probably Radio Shack. It's a phono preamp. Glancing at their site, I saw
> > a turntable with a built-in preamp for $99.00.
>
> Would you play YOUR records on it?
> I wouldn't want mine in the same room!


No, no I wouldn't. But savings seemed to be a goal of OP.
Anonymous
October 10, 2004 3:58:19 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

SA Dev wrote:

> Thanks to all for posting. After some more research I found that the record
> player has a switch that turns on the built in preamp. This is certainly
> the easiest solution as I won't have to buy anything extra.


I hope that works for you.
!