Where is all the action?

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It has been very quite here of late. Has all the activity moved to
forums on sites like Justadventure and Gameboomers?
 
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Robert Gault wrote:
> It has been very quite here of late. Has all the activity moved to
> forums on sites like Justadventure and Gameboomers?


This group actually has more action lately than it's seen in
quite a while, thanks to MaryJ and her Gobliiins adventure
with DOSBox.


Are there any new games you're looking forward to?
Currently this is a list of upcoming games that "Becky"
at GB put together:
("waiting" means she couldn't find a release date)


waiting 80 Days by Frogwares
waiting A Vampyre Story by Autumn Moon Entertainment
waiting Acalius by Arachnid Interactive
Fall 2005 Agatha Christie::And Then There Were None by AWE Games & TAC
Fall 2005 Agon 4: The Lost Sword of Toledo by Private Moon

Summer 2005 Al Emmo and the Lost Dutchman's Mine by Himalaya Studios
waiting Anacapri: The Dream by Gey & Silvio Savarese
October 2005 Ankh by Deck 13 Interactive & Rebel Games
Summer 2005 Barrow Hill by Matt Clark and Shadow Tor Studios
September 2005 Bone by Telltale Games

Summer 2005 Carte Blanche by Absurdus
waiting Dead Mountaineer's Hotel by akella
November 2005 Delaware St. John Vol. 2: The Town with No Name by
BigTime Games
2006 Destinies
Fall 2005 Dreamfall: The Longest Journey 2 by Funcom

waiting Eldoren: Book One - The Discovery by Eldoren Consulting
waiting Evolution by Ilios Production
September 2005 Fahrenheit (Indigo Prophecy) by Quantic Dream
waiting Juniper Crescent - Sapphire Claw
waiting Keepsake by Wicked Studios

Fall 2005 Law & Order: Criminal Intent by Legacy
waiting Loath Nolder by TBD
2006 The Lost Crown: A Warning to the Curious by Jonathan Boakes
waiting Lost Paradise by White Birds Productions
Fall 2005 Mayabin by Virtue Games

2006 Metronome
September 2005 Myst V: End of Ages by UbiSoft
September 2005 Nancy Drew: Last Train to Blue Moon Canyon
September 2005 Nibiru: Messenger of the Gods by Future Games & TAC
waiting Perplex City

Late summer 2005 Rhem 2 by Knut Mueller & Got Game Entertainment
waiting Runaway 2 by Pendulo
waiting Scratches by Nucleosys
Fall 2005 The Sacred Rings
August 2005 Shady Brook by Unimatrix Productions

waiting Theseis by Track Games
waiting Tony Tough: A Rake's Progress by Prograph
August 2005 Voyage (Journey to the Center of the Moon) by TAC


Anything there interest you?
 
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Jenny100 wrote:

> Robert Gault wrote:
>
>> It has been very quite here of late. Has all the activity moved to
>> forums on sites like Justadventure and Gameboomers?
>
>
>
> This group actually has more action lately than it's seen in
> quite a while, thanks to MaryJ and her Gobliiins adventure
> with DOSBox.
>
>
> Are there any new games you're looking forward to?
> Currently this is a list of upcoming games that "Becky"
> at GB put together:
> ("waiting" means she couldn't find a release date)
>
><snipped game list>
>
> Anything there interest you?

I'm happy to see just about any adventure game reach the stores in my
area where adventures get short shrift compared to action games.

Just had Echo reach the shelves. A short but nice educational game with
beautiful graphics. My only real objection to Echo is with some of the
puzzles where the solution is obvious but the workings of game engine
are unnecessarily obscure and complex. The final slider puzzle is a good
example.
 
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Robert Gault wrote:
>
> I'm happy to see just about any adventure game reach the stores in my
> area where adventures get short shrift compared to action games.

Same here. I've had to order almost everything online for some
years now.

> Just had Echo reach the shelves. A short but nice educational game with
> beautiful graphics. My only real objection to Echo is with some of the
> puzzles where the solution is obvious but the workings of game engine
> are unnecessarily obscure and complex. The final slider puzzle is a good
> example.


I wasn't too thrilled with Echo. If a game has characters, I like
them to be more interesting than the ones I saw in the game.
Some of the areas you see in the game were very pretty, but I'd
have preferred if there were more places to explore and that
the game was less linear. Once presented with a puzzle, you
pretty much were stuck solving it until you had a chance at
a different puzzle.

I liked some of the puzzles where you interact with the
paintings on the cave walls to cause something to happen
outside the painting. I didn't like the ones where you have
to click on certain parts of the painting to make the
animals run. The hotspots seemed to be in the wrong places
and the "puzzles" seemed to be a matter of trial and error
and remembering which hotspot was supposed to correspond
to which place. I had the same problem with the musical
stones puzzle.

Which slider are you talking about? the one with the sticks
in front of the cave entrance or the one with the rotating
squares that made up a cave painting? I was never able to
figure out the rotating squares puzzle. I'd get one square
out of place and not be able to get it right. My brother
eventually solved it after a lot of clicking, but he didn't
know how he did it.
 
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Jenny100 wrote:
><snip>
> Which slider are you talking about? the one with the sticks
> in front of the cave entrance or the one with the rotating
> squares that made up a cave painting? I was never able to
> figure out the rotating squares puzzle. I'd get one square
> out of place and not be able to get it right. My brother
> eventually solved it after a lot of clicking, but he didn't
> know how he did it.

The rotating squares. Actually it is an easy puzzle once you know how it
works. Learning how it works is something else however.

Start by looking closely at the wall. You will see that there are some
faint lines in the rock which have been emphasized in black by the
original artist. A good assumption then is that the painting should be
all in black. You may find out by accident that you can also click on
the squares as well as the "dot" intersections. The dots will shift the
squares clockwise around the dots. Clicking the squares themselves will
switch the patterns from brown to black and back again.

Knowing the above, make all the squares part of the black pattern. Move
as many squares into the correct locations a possible. I started with
the to row but it probably does not matter how you do it. Most likely
you will seem to reach a dead end where it seems the parity is wrong and
the puzzle can't be solved. Now comes the final trick.

With most of the pattern in place, find the square that needs to move
and click on the other three within the group around the intersection
dot. These clicked squares will not become a brown pattern but a blank.
If you rotate the set with the dot, you would expect that all the
squares move but they don't. Only the single square with the pattern
showing moves. When you click again on the other three, their correct
patterns return where they should be. As puzzles go this is ridiculous
and definitely magical intervention.

It should now be easy to shift the one or two squares to the correct
positions by turning off the squares in the correct spots, shifting, and
then turning back on the correct squares. This is the first time I've
seen this in any game. Clearly it is not something that can be
duplicated in the real world.

==========================

The moving stick puzzle is difficult but fair as there are no hidden
operations. You just need to rotate vertical sticks to get supports in
place for sliding the horizontal sticks. The only "trick" is that the
unique short horizontal piece with no branch ends slides in a unique
manner. It slide along a support rather than across a support. Therefore
you need to rotate one of the verticals to an unexpected position
compared to all the rest.
 
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Robert Gault wrote:
> Jenny100 wrote:
>
>> <snip>
>> Which slider are you talking about? the one with the sticks
>> in front of the cave entrance or the one with the rotating
>> squares that made up a cave painting? I was never able to
>> figure out the rotating squares puzzle. I'd get one square
>> out of place and not be able to get it right. My brother
>> eventually solved it after a lot of clicking, but he didn't
>> know how he did it.
>
>
> The rotating squares. Actually it is an easy puzzle once you know how it
> works. Learning how it works is something else however.
>
> Start by looking closely at the wall. You will see that there are some
> faint lines in the rock which have been emphasized in black by the
> original artist. A good assumption then is that the painting should be
> all in black. You may find out by accident that you can also click on
> the squares as well as the "dot" intersections. The dots will shift the
> squares clockwise around the dots. Clicking the squares themselves will
> switch the patterns from brown to black and back again.
>
> Knowing the above, make all the squares part of the black pattern. Move
> as many squares into the correct locations a possible. I started with
> the to row but it probably does not matter how you do it. Most likely
> you will seem to reach a dead end where it seems the parity is wrong and
> the puzzle can't be solved. Now comes the final trick.
>
> With most of the pattern in place, find the square that needs to move
> and click on the other three within the group around the intersection
> dot. These clicked squares will not become a brown pattern but a blank.
> If you rotate the set with the dot, you would expect that all the
> squares move but they don't. Only the single square with the pattern
> showing moves. When you click again on the other three, their correct
> patterns return where they should be. As puzzles go this is ridiculous
> and definitely magical intervention.
>
> It should now be easy to shift the one or two squares to the correct
> positions by turning off the squares in the correct spots, shifting, and
> then turning back on the correct squares. This is the first time I've
> seen this in any game. Clearly it is not something that can be
> duplicated in the real world.


So that's how it works. I'll have to try that sometime.
How did you ever figure that out? I never saw anything
like that in a slider before.


>
> ==========================
>
> The moving stick puzzle is difficult but fair as there are no hidden
> operations. You just need to rotate vertical sticks to get supports in
> place for sliding the horizontal sticks. The only "trick" is that the
> unique short horizontal piece with no branch ends slides in a unique
> manner. It slide along a support rather than across a support. Therefore
> you need to rotate one of the verticals to an unexpected position
> compared to all the rest.

That one I was able to do after a bit of fiddling.
 
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Jenny100 wrote:

><snip of slider techniques?
>
>
> So that's how it works. I'll have to try that sometime.
> How did you ever figure that out? I never saw anything
> like that in a slider before.
>
><snip>

I've long been aware of the parity issue with slider puzzles and was
getting upset when I thought the puzzle in question was unsolvable.
(There is at least one other game that has a slider which solves at
random 50% of the time.) In frustration when clicking wildly for a
solution, I must have found that blank squares "protect" the alternate
content. I just happened to observe and understand the results of my
accidental discovery.
 
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Robert Gault wrote:
> Jenny100 wrote:
>
>> <snip of slider techniques?
>>
>>
>> So that's how it works. I'll have to try that sometime.
>> How did you ever figure that out? I never saw anything
>> like that in a slider before.
>>
> ><snip>
>
> I've long been aware of the parity issue with slider puzzles and was
> getting upset when I thought the puzzle in question was unsolvable.
> (There is at least one other game that has a slider which solves at
> random 50% of the time.) In frustration when clicking wildly for a
> solution, I must have found that blank squares "protect" the alternate
> content. I just happened to observe and understand the results of my
> accidental discovery.


What's strange is that MaGtRo's walkthrough gives a solution which
doesn't involve turning any of the squares over.
http://www.gameboomers.com/wtcheats/pcEe/ECHO.htm
So at what point in my solving it do I always get it out of synch
with the wrong parity.
 
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Jenny100 wrote:

><snip>
>
> What's strange is that MaGtRo's walkthrough gives a solution which
> doesn't involve turning any of the squares over.
> http://www.gameboomers.com/wtcheats/pcEe/ECHO.htm
> So at what point in my solving it do I always get it out of synch
> with the wrong parity.

That walkthrough turns all the squares over to get black outlines in
step 1). It is possible that then the rotations given go straight to the
correct answer; I've not tried this solution. It is possible that the
method given does not work or that a step is missing.

What is clear about slider puzzles is that it is not possible to change
parity by sliding pieces. A famous puzzle by Sam Loyd is one of the
first examples of this. He had a square box 4 by 4 with 15 tiles. The
tiles were placed in the box as:
1 2 3 4
5 6 7 8
9 10 11 12
13 15 14 --

Loyd offered $1000 (in 1870's dollars) to anyone who could get 14 & 15
in the correct order by sliding tiles. The tiles could not be removed
from the box and replaced to change parity. Of course it can't be done
so the $1000 bet was safe.
 
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Robert Gault wrote:
> Jenny100 wrote:
>
>> <snip>
>>
>> What's strange is that MaGtRo's walkthrough gives a solution which
>> doesn't involve turning any of the squares over.
>> http://www.gameboomers.com/wtcheats/pcEe/ECHO.htm
>> So at what point in my solving it do I always get it out of synch
>> with the wrong parity.
>
>
> That walkthrough turns all the squares over to get black outlines in
> step 1). It is possible that then the rotations given go straight to the
> correct answer; I've not tried this solution. It is possible that the
> method given does not work or that a step is missing.


They don't. I always turned the tiles over before trying
to solve it. I still got the parity problem.
I also tried turned them over the other way, so only brown was
showing and tried to solve for a brown picture, which didn't
work either.


> What is clear about slider puzzles is that it is not possible to change
> parity by sliding pieces. A famous puzzle by Sam Loyd is one of the
> first examples of this. He had a square box 4 by 4 with 15 tiles. The
> tiles were placed in the box as:
> 1 2 3 4
> 5 6 7 8
> 9 10 11 12
> 13 15 14 --
>
> Loyd offered $1000 (in 1870's dollars) to anyone who could get 14 & 15
> in the correct order by sliding tiles. The tiles could not be removed
> from the box and replaced to change parity. Of course it can't be done
> so the $1000 bet was safe.