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Recording Opera and Classical singing with Portable digita..

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Anonymous
November 24, 2004 7:09:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

I need some help in choosing some recording gear for my uses. Correct
me if I'm wrong but it all boils down to three things when buying
recording gear:

1. what your budget is, 2. what type of music you are recording and 3.
the level of portablility desired.

As far as that is concerned here are my requirements:

1. My budget is 1000 $ to 1500$ for stereo/binaural mics and a mic
preamp/a-d converter (to be used with NJB3 or laptop). The NJB3 will
see much more frequent use due to its portability.

2. I am recording almost exclusively classical singing. Venues ranging
from a practice room with piano to a full 2000 seat house with
orchestra. The audio quality must be good enough to make acceptable
demo CDs, yet not necessarily be full-out professional.

3. I need good portability because of frequent rehearsals and voice
lessons (about 5-6 times a week). I record my own shows about twice a
month, which is the frequency at which I am performing at this time.

I have a few questions (ok, maybe quite a few) for you guys. Don't be
scared to get too technical with me. I don't own anything fancy yet,
but I have been doing my homework!

I was thinking of getting a really good preamp/d-a converter that might
have the option of P48. I don't think I'll be using a NJB3 for ever
but I think that the preamp might last me longer. Along with the mic,
isn't that the component that would make a significant difference?
I've seen the apogee minime and grace v3 they look interesting but are
a little too expensive for my almost everyday use (and therefore a
problem in ease of use and portability) in lessons and rehearsals.
Would the Denecke pre/a-d or mic2496 be a better choice? Does they
cause problems when their signals are truncated from 20 or 24 bit to 16
bits, or is it just a reduction in quality and dynamic range?

Or maybe I'm totally off track and I would be ok just using the line
input on the NJB3. I've looked at the pre-mic combos sold on ebay from
visivox technologies and church audio. It's a totally different price
range and I'm not sure that they have the flexibility needed to adapt
to the huge dynamic range of classical music and opera. I was looking
at the reactive sounds boost box which has total gain control, instead
of level control on top of gain pads (which are found on most low-end
portable preamps). It's kind of a headache.

As for mics, what would you reccomend? I really like the design of the
rode NT-4 because it gives me the option to switch from 9v to p48. I
like having the option of doing recordings with my laptop and P48 for
superior results when needed.
Binaurals are also interesting. Some of the ones that caught my eye
are the Mic Madness 'sennheiser driven' in-ear binaurals or the sound
pros in-ear binaurals. There's an ocean of possibilities and it's
driving me slightly crazy. I'm looking for anything between 150$ to
500$. Would it be worth it to consider the strong bias of the 300khz
to 6000khz of singing formants in choosing a mic? As long as it's
worth the money and that it sounds better than my sony ms907 plugged
into my minidisc (which has stopped recording lately, thank god) I'll
be happy.
Thanks in advance for your greatly needed input.

Pascal Charbonneau
Anonymous
November 24, 2004 8:38:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

p_charbonneau@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> I need some help in choosing some recording gear for my uses.
>
> 1. My budget is 1000 $ to 1500$ for stereo/binaural mics
>
> 2. I am recording almost exclusively classical singing

> 3. I need good portability

> As for mics, what would you reccomend?


Don't rule out the Crown SASS



TM
Anonymous
November 24, 2004 10:18:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

<p_charbonneau@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I need some help in choosing some recording gear for my uses. Correct
>me if I'm wrong but it all boils down to three things when buying
>recording gear:
>
>1. what your budget is, 2. what type of music you are recording and 3.
>the level of portablility desired.

Also personal tastes.

>As far as that is concerned here are my requirements:
>
>1. My budget is 1000 $ to 1500$ for stereo/binaural mics and a mic
>preamp/a-d converter (to be used with NJB3 or laptop). The NJB3 will
>see much more frequent use due to its portability.
>
>2. I am recording almost exclusively classical singing. Venues ranging
>from a practice room with piano to a full 2000 seat house with
>orchestra. The audio quality must be good enough to make acceptable
>demo CDs, yet not necessarily be full-out professional.

I would suggest a pair of the Josephson Series Four microphones, or
alternately the Audio-Technica AT4053. These are fairly neutral,
will run you around $1000 a pair, and can be used in ORTF stereo, which
is probably a good all-around miking method for doing classical work in
a wide variety of different acoustics. They are both reasonably narrow
patterns to help you deal with the occasional acoustical problem and
they are reasonably flat off-axis. Neither one is a Schoeps, but they
aren't priced like Schoeps either.

>3. I need good portability because of frequent rehearsals and voice
>lessons (about 5-6 times a week). I record my own shows about twice a
>month, which is the frequency at which I am performing at this time.

The recorder is the big issue here.

>I have a few questions (ok, maybe quite a few) for you guys. Don't be
>scared to get too technical with me. I don't own anything fancy yet,
>but I have been doing my homework!
>
>I was thinking of getting a really good preamp/d-a converter that might
>have the option of P48. I don't think I'll be using a NJB3 for ever
>but I think that the preamp might last me longer. Along with the mic,
>isn't that the component that would make a significant difference?
>I've seen the apogee minime and grace v3 they look interesting but are
>a little too expensive for my almost everyday use (and therefore a
>problem in ease of use and portability) in lessons and rehearsals.
>Would the Denecke pre/a-d or mic2496 be a better choice? Does they
>cause problems when their signals are truncated from 20 or 24 bit to 16
>bits, or is it just a reduction in quality and dynamic range?

Denecke says that it's not a problem because the noise floor of the preamp
provides sufficient dithering. That seems kind of a cop-out to me, but
the thing doesn't sound all that bad into a 16-bit input.

You also might look at a used Apogee AD-1000. These things are admittedly
selling for more than they should be, because of their extreme portability
and the fact that they haven't really been replaced in that regard. I
have never used the Mini-Me or the Grace.

>Or maybe I'm totally off track and I would be ok just using the line
>input on the NJB3. I've looked at the pre-mic combos sold on ebay from
>visivox technologies and church audio. It's a totally different price
>range and I'm not sure that they have the flexibility needed to adapt
>to the huge dynamic range of classical music and opera. I was looking
>at the reactive sounds boost box which has total gain control, instead
>of level control on top of gain pads (which are found on most low-end
>portable preamps). It's kind of a headache.

I don't know how the converters on the NJB3 are, but if you want a good
sounding portable preamp, you're also in trouble. Cooper makes a nice
one (which might be a relabelled Beyer).

I don't know any of the other preamps you mention there.

>As for mics, what would you reccomend? I really like the design of the
>rode NT-4 because it gives me the option to switch from 9v to p48. I
>like having the option of doing recordings with my laptop and P48 for
>superior results when needed.
>Binaurals are also interesting. Some of the ones that caught my eye
>are the Mic Madness 'sennheiser driven' in-ear binaurals or the sound
>pros in-ear binaurals. There's an ocean of possibilities and it's
>driving me slightly crazy. I'm looking for anything between 150$ to
>500$. Would it be worth it to consider the strong bias of the 300khz
>to 6000khz of singing formants in choosing a mic? As long as it's
>worth the money and that it sounds better than my sony ms907 plugged
>into my minidisc (which has stopped recording lately, thank god) I'll
>be happy.

Spend as much money as you can on the mikes. You can upgrade everything
else later, but money spent on mikes is going to be a real help to you
right off. You can do a lot better than the NT-4.

Binaural recording is a weird thing. The effect is absolutely uncanny,
and it is amazingly realistic even using very inexpensive omni capsules.
But, it just does not translate at _all_ to speakers, which is a deal breaker
for a lot of work.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
November 25, 2004 6:29:36 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

<p_charbonneau@yahoo.com> wrote:

>I need some help in choosing some recording gear for my uses. Correct
>me if I'm wrong but it all boils down to three things when buying
>recording gear:
>
>1. what your budget is, 2. what type of music you are recording and 3.
>the level of portablility desired.

Add in "what kind of halls will you be recording in" and that pretty
much summarizes it.

>1. My budget is 1000 $ to 1500$ for stereo/binaural mics and a mic
>preamp/a-d converter (to be used with NJB3 or laptop). The NJB3 will
>see much more frequent use due to its portability.

You might consider our Mic2496 and HEB mic set (using DPA 4060
capsules). That seems to becoming a popular setup among those who are
taping opera as you are. That comes at under $1400, within your budget.

The HEB/4060s are, in our opinion, the finest sounding miniature mics in
the world, bar none, and that includes Sennheisers, Countryman, Shure
and others.

And the Mic2496 is the smallest, fully portable (running on a single 9
Volt battery) dual-channel, 48V phantom power, mic pre/A-to-D available.

You can start with the JB3 but it'd be wise to allow for upgrade to
24-bit and better than 44.1 KS/s at some time in the future. Mic2496
will allow for that.

[Diclaimer: we manufacture the HEBs and Mic2496, and are DPA dealers.]

--
Len Moskowitz PDAudio, Binaural Mics, Cables, DPA, M-Audio
Core Sound http://www.stealthmicrophones.com
Teaneck, New Jersey USA http://www.core-sound.com
moskowit@core-sound.com Tel: 201-801-0812, FAX: 201-801-0912
!