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Hardwood or Ceramic?

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January 10, 2005 4:11:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a drum
riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous looking, much of
the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when grouted) leftover from a
house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming flutter echo isn't an issue
with the ceiling and room, would ceramic sound as good or better then
hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum sound.

Nick

More about : hardwood ceramic

Anonymous
January 10, 2005 2:37:55 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

John Hardy wrote:

> Whatever you do, please, oh please, do NOT use PERGO or any of its
> equivalents. I HATE that stuff. Drop a coin or a key on it and it
makes
> a terribly harsh and piercing sound due to the hardness of the
surface
> (I think). Did I say I HATE that stuff? I HATE IT.

What would you use John? Any cost efficient ideas?


Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy - Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 6:09:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

WillStG <willstg@aol.com> wrote:
>John Hardy wrote:
>
>> Whatever you do, please, oh please, do NOT use PERGO or any of its
>> equivalents. I HATE that stuff. Drop a coin or a key on it and it
>makes
>> a terribly harsh and piercing sound due to the hardness of the
>surface
>> (I think). Did I say I HATE that stuff? I HATE IT.
>
>What would you use John? Any cost efficient ideas?

That's another weird thing. The cheap rubberwood parquet sheets cost
less than Pergo, and they look and sound better. I don't know if they
wear as well.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Related resources
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 6:11:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

> I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a drum
> riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous looking, much
of
> the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when grouted) leftover from
a
> house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming flutter echo isn't an issue
> with the ceiling and room, would ceramic sound as good or better then
> hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum sound.

Well the first thing a drummer will do is put a rug down to keep the drums
from shifting around, and the uneven surface of tile doesn't help, so I
guess the hardwood would be the more practical of the given surfaces, both
of which are a waste of money.

I'd say you've got it back-asswards, carpet the drum riser and lay hardwood
throught the rest of the room, with some throw rugs handy to dampen as
required. You should probably also have dampening material above the drums
too. There's no joy to be had from close reflections in the overheads, and
ambience from room mics needn't be especially bright.

For risers I prefer two layers of 5/8" plywood sandwiching a layer of carpet
underlay with a tough dense carpet on top, and experiment with bracing and
holes in the front panel to see if there's any benefit to some riser
resonance. It's also important for rock to have enough space for a 2' kick
shell extension.
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 6:23:06 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

> John Hardy wrote:
>
>
>>> Whatever you do, please, oh please, do NOT use PERGO or any of its
>>> equivalents. I HATE that stuff. Drop a coin or a key on it and it
>
> makes
>
>>> a terribly harsh and piercing sound due to the hardness of the
>
> surface
>
>>> (I think). Did I say I HATE that stuff? I HATE IT.
>
>
> What would you use John? Any cost efficient ideas?
>
>
> Will Miho
> NY Music & TV Audio Guy - Fox News
> "The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom
>

Just ANYTHING BUT PERGO! Asphalt would be better.

It's a good question though - What would give the best sound
characteristics and be within budget. I don't like the prefinished wood
floors either. They look tacky to me with lots of short pieces. I would
rather use 3/4" thick oak or maple or whatever and finish it on site.
There are lots of alternatives in hardwoods these days. If that is what
you want, a quick reference site might be www.lumberliquidators.com to
see some of the stuff that is available. Ceramic tile might be too
bright as well. You can always add a rug when needed. Throw in some pillows.

Suragite made the point that the drummer may put a rug down anyway. Or
the hardwood may get trashed in a hurry with drum spikes and such. It's
a small enough area that you could always do it over. One more thing: I
hate Pergo.

John Hardy
The John Hardy Co.
www.johnhardyco.com
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 10:06:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

>From: "Nick" terzulli@optonline*spa/\/\blows.net
>Date: 1/10/05 1:11 A.M. Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <4apEd.131108$c8.8409@fe09.lga>
>
>I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a drum
>riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous looking, much of
>the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when grouted) leftover from a
>house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming flutter echo isn't an issue
>with the ceiling and room, would ceramic sound as good or better then
>hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum sound.

For a nice live sound on percussion I'd say the whole room should be hardwood
flooring.
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 10:06:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

>>>From: "Nick" terzulli@optonline*spa/\/\blows.net
>>>Date: 1/10/05 1:11 A.M. Eastern Standard Time
>>>Message-id: <4apEd.131108$c8.8409@fe09.lga>
>>>
>>>I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a drum
>>>riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous looking, much of
>>>the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when grouted) leftover from a
>>>house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming flutter echo isn't an issue
>>>with the ceiling and room, would ceramic sound as good or better then
>>>hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum sound.
>
>
> For a nice live sound on percussion I'd say the whole room should be hardwood
> flooring.

Whatever you do, please, oh please, do NOT use PERGO or any of its
equivalents. I HATE that stuff. Drop a coin or a key on it and it makes
a terribly harsh and piercing sound due to the hardness of the surface
(I think). Did I say I HATE that stuff? I HATE IT.

John Hardy
The John Hardy Co.
www.johnhardyco.com
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 10:06:12 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 13:31:35 -0600, John Hardy
<johnwellshardy@comcast.net> wrote:

>>>>From: "Nick" terzulli@optonline*spa/\/\blows.net
>>>>Date: 1/10/05 1:11 A.M. Eastern Standard Time
>>>>Message-id: <4apEd.131108$c8.8409@fe09.lga>
>>>>
>>>>I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a drum
>>>>riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous looking, much of
>>>>the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when grouted) leftover from a
>>>>house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming flutter echo isn't an issue
>>>>with the ceiling and room, would ceramic sound as good or better then
>>>>hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum sound.
>>
>>
>> For a nice live sound on percussion I'd say the whole room should be hardwood
>> flooring.
>
>Whatever you do, please, oh please, do NOT use PERGO or any of its
>equivalents. I HATE that stuff. Drop a coin or a key on it and it makes
>a terribly harsh and piercing sound due to the hardness of the surface
>(I think). Did I say I HATE that stuff? I HATE IT.

Have you checked out the new flooring products made from bamboo?

Al
Anonymous
January 10, 2005 10:06:13 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

> On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 13:31:35 -0600, John Hardy
> <johnwellshardy@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>>>>>>>>>From: "Nick" terzulli@optonline*spa/\/\blows.net
>>>>>>>>>Date: 1/10/05 1:11 A.M. Eastern Standard Time
>>>>>>>>>Message-id: <4apEd.131108$c8.8409@fe09.lga>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a drum
>>>>>>>>>riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous looking, much of
>>>>>>>>>the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when grouted) leftover from a
>>>>>>>>>house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming flutter echo isn't an issue
>>>>>>>>>with the ceiling and room, would ceramic sound as good or better then
>>>>>>>>>hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum sound.
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> For a nice live sound on percussion I'd say the whole room should be hardwood
>>>>> flooring.
>>
>>>
>>>Whatever you do, please, oh please, do NOT use PERGO or any of its
>>>equivalents. I HATE that stuff. Drop a coin or a key on it and it makes
>>>a terribly harsh and piercing sound due to the hardness of the surface
>>>(I think). Did I say I HATE that stuff? I HATE IT.
>
>
> Have you checked out the new flooring products made from bamboo?
>
> Al

I've heard of it, but not seen it. Sounds interesting. My neighbor did
some remodeling and almost used it. Lots of possibilities.

John Hardy
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 4:52:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"John Hardy" <johnwellshardy@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:5qednfcVuNLbb3_cRVn-pQ@comcast.com...
>> John Hardy wrote:
> Just ANYTHING BUT PERGO! Asphalt would be better.

Would that be wet asphalt, or dry asphalt? :D 

> It's a good question though - What would give the best sound
> characteristics and be within budget.

Parquet ain't bad - I've done drums plenty of times on parquet flooring, and
you can get that for about a buck per square foot usually.

> Suragite made the point that the drummer may put a rug down anyway. Or the
> hardwood may get trashed in a hurry with drum spikes and such. It's a
> small enough area that you could always do it over.

That's another advantage to parquet, too - if you need to refinish/patch a
small section, it usually doesn't show as apparently as it would if you had
to do the same thing to a nice floor of clear maple, for example.

>One more thing: I hate Pergo.

You can't refinish it, either... it's kinda difficult to sand sawdust & hope
for a good outcome at the same time.

Neil
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 4:59:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"playon" <playonAT@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:0vs5u0dm2uti3d4lernhj3ffnptevd5gvm@4ax.com...

> Have you checked out the new flooring products made from bamboo?

VERY expensive - at least the ones I've seen. Found anything for a
reasonable price? Say... less than $3 a square foot? It's supposed to be
very durable, anyway.

Here's a thought - if the giant Pandas are so rare because all they eat is
bamboo & all the bamboo is dying out because mankind is encroaching on the
Panda's territory, how is it that there's just recently been enough bamboo
to harvest for flooring purposes outside of third-world countries?

Another thought - bamboo is so low in nutrients that the Panda has to spend
almost all it's waking hours eating just to stay alive, and hence mating
becomes the last thing on it's mind... shouldn't said animal be allowed to
go extinct for being that stupid in the first place? :D 


Neil Henderson
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 4:59:53 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Neil Henderson <neil.henderson@sbcglobal.netNOSPAM> wrote:
>
>Here's a thought - if the giant Pandas are so rare because all they eat is
>bamboo & all the bamboo is dying out because mankind is encroaching on the
>Panda's territory, how is it that there's just recently been enough bamboo
>to harvest for flooring purposes outside of third-world countries?

I don't know, but I sure have enough white bamboo in my backyard for as
many pandas as you can send over. It _is_ good to eat, but only if you
get the shoots when they first come out, and I am usually too late.

>Another thought - bamboo is so low in nutrients that the Panda has to spend
>almost all it's waking hours eating just to stay alive, and hence mating
>becomes the last thing on it's mind... shouldn't said animal be allowed to
>go extinct for being that stupid in the first place? :D 

Bamboo shoots always had a slight bakelite taste to me. Maybe what happens
to pandas is phenolic poisoning of some kind? Hmm... I wonder what pandas
taste like...
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 4:59:53 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 01:59:52 GMT, "Neil Henderson"
<neil.henderson@sbcglobal.netNOSPAM> wrote:

>
>"playon" <playonAT@comcast.net> wrote in message
>news:0vs5u0dm2uti3d4lernhj3ffnptevd5gvm@4ax.com...
>
>> Have you checked out the new flooring products made from bamboo?
>
>VERY expensive - at least the ones I've seen. Found anything for a
>reasonable price? Say... less than $3 a square foot? It's supposed to be
>very durable, anyway.

There are different thicknesses and grades... but bamboo is farmed and
grows like crazy, you'd think if it becomes more popular prices would
come down. It's an easy resource to renew compared to growing a tree
for 50 or 100 years. Even at $3 a foot, isn't that a whole lot cheaper
than say oak or other hardwoods?

>Here's a thought - if the giant Pandas are so rare because all they eat is
>bamboo & all the bamboo is dying out because mankind is encroaching on the
>Panda's territory, how is it that there's just recently been enough bamboo
>to harvest for flooring purposes outside of third-world countries?

See the above.

Al
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 4:59:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On 10 Jan 2005 22:14:05 -0500, kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

>Neil Henderson <neil.henderson@sbcglobal.netNOSPAM> wrote:
>>
>>Here's a thought - if the giant Pandas are so rare because all they eat is
>>bamboo & all the bamboo is dying out because mankind is encroaching on the
>>Panda's territory, how is it that there's just recently been enough bamboo
>>to harvest for flooring purposes outside of third-world countries?
>
>I don't know, but I sure have enough white bamboo in my backyard for as
>many pandas as you can send over. It _is_ good to eat, but only if you
>get the shoots when they first come out, and I am usually too late.
>
>>Another thought - bamboo is so low in nutrients that the Panda has to spend
>>almost all it's waking hours eating just to stay alive, and hence mating
>>becomes the last thing on it's mind... shouldn't said animal be allowed to
>>go extinct for being that stupid in the first place? :D 
>
>Bamboo shoots always had a slight bakelite taste to me. Maybe what happens
>to pandas is phenolic poisoning of some kind?

Eating bamboo shoots certainly doesn't seem to have affected the
fertility of the Chinese.

Al
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 5:34:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On 10 Jan 2005 22:14:05 -0500, kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote:


> Hmm... I wonder what pandas
>taste like...

Taste like chicken, of course....



====================
Tracy Wintermute
arrgh@greenapple.com
Rushcreek Ranch
====================
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 5:41:40 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On 1/10/05 7:59 PM, in article sqGEd.565$2e7.400@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com,
"Neil Henderson" <neil.henderson@sbcglobal.netNOSPAM> wrote:

>> Have you checked out the new flooring products made from bamboo?
>
> VERY expensive - at least the ones I've seen. Found anything for a
> reasonable price? Say... less than $3 a square foot?

Well, www.Ifloor.com has it from $2.19 to $2.79!

> It's supposed to be very durable, anyway.

Bamboo is harder than maple, so I think it would hold up very well. Also,
bamboo is a grass, not a wood. It re-grows to it's full size in about four
years, making it a better renewable resource than traditional wood.

The other day I saw some cutting boards made from bamboo. Very cool looking
with the "boards" running flat, on their sides, and even on end. They were
on the pricey side, though.

I think the price will come down as more products are made from bamboo, and
more people buy them.

Allen
--
Allen Corneau
Mastering Engineer
Essential Sound Mastering
Houston, TX
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 6:00:58 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Neil Henderson> wrote:

> "playon" wrote...
>
> > Have you checked out the new flooring products made from bamboo?

> VERY expensive - at least the ones I've seen. Found anything for a
> reasonable price? Say... less than $3 a square foot? It's supposed to be
> very durable, anyway.

My mom-in-law just had a floor done in bamboo in a remodel. The place
isn't ready for movin' into yet, so I can't comment on its esthetic
appeal or acoustic properties, but firstly, she is a skinflint, so she
must have found a deal; secondly, she's no spring chicken so if she can
find a deal, so could you; and thirdly, the stuff is so hard it makes
rock maple seem like balsa wood. I look forward to tromping over it on
the way to one of her amazing meals. <g>

> Here's a thought - if the giant Pandas are so rare because all they eat is
> bamboo & all the bamboo is dying out because mankind is encroaching on the
> Panda's territory, how is it that there's just recently been enough bamboo
> to harvest for flooring purposes outside of third-world countries?

Bamboo grows in many more places than just where Pandas hang out and up.
It'll prove to be a major crop oneday, even in the US. Mark my words.
The stuff is far too productive to be ignored.

> Another thought - bamboo is so low in nutrients that the Panda has to spend
> almost all it's waking hours eating just to stay alive, and hence mating
> becomes the last thing on it's mind... shouldn't said animal be allowed to
> go extinct for being that stupid in the first place? :D 

It's probably higher in nutrients than coffee or Krispy Kreme, and there
is a least one species that will eat that kind of stuff. As for
stupidity, we work all day to get stuff to eat; a panda just eats all
day. You do the math. <g>

--
ha
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 6:00:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 03:00:58 GMT, walkinay@thegrid.net (hank alrich)
wrote:

>My mom-in-law just had a floor done in bamboo in a remodel. The place
>isn't ready for movin' into yet, so I can't comment on its esthetic
>appeal or acoustic properties, but firstly, she is a skinflint, so she
>must have found a deal; secondly, she's no spring chicken so if she can
>find a deal, so could you; and thirdly, the stuff is so hard it makes
>rock maple seem like balsa wood.

I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
acoustic properties.

Al
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 6:00:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 03:00:58 GMT, walkinay@thegrid.net (hank alrich)
wrote:

>Bamboo grows in many more places than just where Pandas hang out and up.
>It'll prove to be a major crop oneday, even in the US. Mark my words.
>The stuff is far too productive to be ignored.

Oh yeah. Before I moved here, at my old micro-farm there was a stand
of bamboo about 40 years old. When I first moved there, I could hardly
believe the stuff grew around here. The stuff is nearly uncontrollable
once it is established (OK, that's almost an exaggeration, because you
can mow the shoots as they come up... but they'll keep trying.)
Spreads via rhizomes, and ultimately completely takes over all
vegetation within its stand. And, it is almost an 'evergreen' in that
even though the leaves will somewhat brown-up during the winter, it is
not deciduous.

The old man who sold me the place told me that, for giggles, he had
planted a chunk of root he brought back from (I forget where, in Asia)
just to see what would happen. He said that for the first three or
four years it just kind of grew a little bit, and didn't spread at
all... then, after that, it started to spread like crazy.

The stuff makes a wonderful four-season 'screen' after the stand
thickens up. Really cuts down the dust clouds from a dirt road,
eventually completely blocks visibility and somewhat reduces noise as
well. Wish I'd brought some with me when I moved.

Thanks for reminding me of one of my big woulda, shoulda, couldas..
;-)


====================
Tracy Wintermute
arrgh@greenapple.com
Rushcreek Ranch
====================
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 6:42:04 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On 2005-01-10 01:11:59 -0500, "Nick"
<terzulli@optonline*spa/\/\blows.net> said:

> I have a home studio with floors covered in carpet. I am building a
> drum riser and can either cover it in ceramic/stone (very porous
> looking, much of the tile is covered in holes, which are filled when
> grouted) leftover from a house project, or just buy hardwood. Presuming
> flutter echo isn't an issue with the ceiling and room, would ceramic
> sound as good or better then hardwood? The usual close mic'ed rock drum
> sound.
>
> Nick

Wow... this discussion has gotten way off topic with no answer for this
poor guy.

Bottom line - Carpet it.
1) It will make life much easier for the drummers in your life. (think
of kick-drum slide etc.)
2) Having a 'live' drum sound is great, but achieve it with the other
surfaces in the room.
3) Any sort of hard and flat surface that close to your mics will give
you quick initial reflections, even in your close mics.

-Tak
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:58:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

playon wrote:

> (hank alrich) wrote:

> >My mom-in-law just had a floor done in bamboo in a remodel. The place
> >isn't ready for movin' into yet, so I can't comment on its esthetic
> >appeal or acoustic properties, but firstly, she is a skinflint, so she
> >must have found a deal; secondly, she's no spring chicken so if she can
> >find a deal, so could you; and thirdly, the stuff is so hard it makes
> >rock maple seem like balsa wood.

> I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
> acoustic properties.

Now that's an interesting angle, though I'm not well enough informed
about the mechanics of air particle interaction at a boundary to make a
sensible remark. But I'm led to wonder whether at some degree of surface
smoothness the overall acoustic result could depend more upon the
rigidity of the surface as determined by that which supports it than on
the hardness of the surface itself.

Ethan? Anybody? (Being a dumbass guitar player presents limits...)

--
ha
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:58:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 04:58:41 GMT, walkinay@thegrid.net (hank alrich)
wrote:

>playon wrote:
>
>> (hank alrich) wrote:
>
>> >My mom-in-law just had a floor done in bamboo in a remodel. The place
>> >isn't ready for movin' into yet, so I can't comment on its esthetic
>> >appeal or acoustic properties, but firstly, she is a skinflint, so she
>> >must have found a deal; secondly, she's no spring chicken so if she can
>> >find a deal, so could you; and thirdly, the stuff is so hard it makes
>> >rock maple seem like balsa wood.
>
>> I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
>> acoustic properties.
>
>Now that's an interesting angle, though I'm not well enough informed
>about the mechanics of air particle interaction at a boundary to make a
>sensible remark. But I'm led to wonder whether at some degree of surface
>smoothness the overall acoustic result could depend more upon the
>rigidity of the surface as determined by that which supports it than on
>the hardness of the surface itself.

Yeah the flex factor...

>
>Ethan? Anybody? (Being a dumbass guitar player presents limits...)

Hey I resemble that remark!

Al
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 8:25:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"hank alrich" <walkinay@thegrid.net> wrote in message
news:1gq6xkk.pugjnz1alofcsN%walkinay@thegrid.net...
> playon wrote:
>
>> (hank alrich) wrote:
>
>> >My mom-in-law just had a floor done in bamboo in a remodel. The place
>> >isn't ready for movin' into yet, so I can't comment on its esthetic
>> >appeal or acoustic properties, but firstly, she is a skinflint, so she
>> >must have found a deal; secondly, she's no spring chicken so if she can
>> >find a deal, so could you; and thirdly, the stuff is so hard it makes
>> >rock maple seem like balsa wood.
>
>> I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
>> acoustic properties.
>
> Now that's an interesting angle, though I'm not well enough informed
> about the mechanics of air particle interaction at a boundary to make a
> sensible remark.

Yeah you are... does it sound "better" or "worse" to you than some other
surface? That's all you need to know.

>But I'm led to wonder whether at some degree of surface
> smoothness the overall acoustic result could depend more upon the
> rigidity of the surface as determined by that which supports it than on
> the hardness of the surface itself.

My completely subjective guess it that it's a combination of all those
things. A maple floor with no finish on concrete with a vapor barrier will
sound different than a maple floor with a hard acrylic finish on concrete
with a vapor barrier, which will sound different than a maple floor with no
finish on 3/4" plywood base, which will sound different than a maple floor
with a hard acrylic finish on a 3/4" plywood base.

It would be pretty impractical to re-floor the same room four times in order
to measure this effect, but my money's on "different".

Neil Henderson
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 8:37:38 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 05:25:54 GMT, "Neil Henderson"
<neil.henderson@sbcglobal.netNOSPAM> wrote:

>"hank alrich" <walkinay@thegrid.net> wrote in message
>news:1gq6xkk.pugjnz1alofcsN%walkinay@thegrid.net...

>>But I'm led to wonder whether at some degree of surface
>> smoothness the overall acoustic result could depend more upon the
>> rigidity of the surface as determined by that which supports it than on
>> the hardness of the surface itself.
>
>My completely subjective guess it that it's a combination of all those
>things. A maple floor with no finish on concrete with a vapor barrier will
>sound different than a maple floor with a hard acrylic finish on concrete
>with a vapor barrier, which will sound different than a maple floor with no
>finish on 3/4" plywood base, which will sound different than a maple floor
>with a hard acrylic finish on a 3/4" plywood base.

I know From Nothing about floors, and just wanted to comment about
how amazing it is that we can hear them so well. Walking across one
gives us extra clues, but we hear ceilings really well too.

It's a beautiful and mysterious world.

Chris Hornbeck
"Conscious that we must have sprung from somewhere, we are
lured to the riddle of our origins." -Malcolm W. Browne
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:18:55 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

<< I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
acoustic properties. >>




I doubt it. We have a stained concrete floor in one of our studios and it
sounds great.


Joe Egan
EMP
Colchester, VT
www.eganmedia.com
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:18:56 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"EganMedia" <eganmedia@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20050111111855.11044.00000105@mb-m02.aol.com...
> << I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
> acoustic properties. >>


>
>
> I doubt it. We have a stained concrete floor in one of our studios and it
> sounds great.
>
>

What kind of stain? What color? Oops. Lost my mind there for a moment.

Steve King
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:18:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Steve King" <steve@REMOVETHISSPAMBLOCKsteveking.net> wrote in message
news:HradndKGUfXDn3ncRVn-pg@comcast.com
> "EganMedia" <eganmedia@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20050111111855.11044.00000105@mb-m02.aol.com...
>> << I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
>> acoustic properties. >>


>>
>>
>> I doubt it. We have a stained concrete floor in one of our studios
>> and it sounds great.
>>
>>
>
> What kind of stain? What color? Oops. Lost my mind there for a
> moment.

I heard about stained concrete about a month ago and searched google. I
found some very cool-looking stuff.
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:18:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Arny Krueger <arnyk@hotpop.com> wrote:
>"Steve King" <steve@REMOVETHISSPAMBLOCKsteveking.net> wrote in message
>news:HradndKGUfXDn3ncRVn-pg@comcast.com
>> "EganMedia" <eganmedia@aol.com> wrote in message
>> news:20050111111855.11044.00000105@mb-m02.aol.com...
>>> << I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
>>> acoustic properties. >>


>>>
>>>
>>> I doubt it. We have a stained concrete floor in one of our studios
>>> and it sounds great.
>>
>> What kind of stain? What color? Oops. Lost my mind there for a
>> moment.
>
>I heard about stained concrete about a month ago and searched google. I
>found some very cool-looking stuff.

Mine has been stained for years. Mostly with motor oil.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
January 11, 2005 7:58:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 10:44:20 -0600, "Steve King"
<steve@REMOVETHISSPAMBLOCKsteveking.net> wrote:

>"EganMedia" <eganmedia@aol.com> wrote in message
>news:20050111111855.11044.00000105@mb-m02.aol.com...
>> << I'm wondering if it might be *too* hard & reflective as far as
>> acoustic properties. >>


>>
>>
>> I doubt it. We have a stained concrete floor in one of our studios and it
>> sounds great.
>>
>>
>
>What kind of stain? What color? Oops. Lost my mind there for a moment.

More importantly, was it stained by anyone famous?

Al
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 12:27:35 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

<< > What kind of stain? What color? Oops. Lost my mind there for a
> moment.

I heard about stained concrete about a month ago and searched google. I
found some very cool-looking stuff. >>




The stuff we used is made by Kemiko. It's tan/brown with a bit of red. I think
they call it Cola. It's not as dark as I had originally thought it would be,
but I think I like it better as it turned out. Check out Fran Manzella's
studio design portfolio (www.fmdesign.com) for shots of my floor as well as
Trillium Lane's, Blue Jay's and some others.


Joe Egan
EMP
Colchester, VT
www.eganmedia.com
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 1:28:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

<< >Here's a thought - if the giant Pandas are so rare because all they eat is
>>bamboo & all the bamboo is dying out because mankind is encroaching on the
>>Panda's territory, how is it that there's just recently been enough bamboo
>>to harvest for flooring purposes outside of third-world countries?
> >>



Bamboo grows like a weed. There is absolutely no danger of it ever becoming
endangered or rare. It does not require a tropical climate. A large stand of it
is growing on a north-facing (i.e. non-sunny) hillside just a few hundred feet
from me here in Los Angeles. No worries, there is an endless supply available.

Scott Fraser
January 12, 2005 2:54:10 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Sugarite" <nobody@home.com> wrote in message
news:BiBEd.16302$Y_4.1918257@read2.cgocable.net...
<snip>

>There's no joy to be had from close reflections in the overheads, and
> ambience from room mics needn't be especially bright.

Thanks, I get what everyone is saying. I just figured I'd try and get some
sort of real reverb/reflections in there as the room is totally dead.
!