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Dungeons and Dragons online

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Anonymous
April 3, 2005 9:48:10 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Turbine + mmorpg * 1999 = Asheron's Call = happy Grackle

and so it follows from the above that

Turbine + mmorpg * 2005 = Dungeon's and Dragons Online = ecstatic Grackle


The screenshots are very impressive. I still consider AC (my first exposure
to mmorpgs) the best one so far. I'm looking forward to DDO.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 3:46:10 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 17:48:10 -0400, "Grackle" <nobody@lalaland.ca>
wrote:

>Turbine + mmorpg * 1999 = Asheron's Call = happy Grackle
>
>and so it follows from the above that
>
>Turbine + mmorpg * 2005 = Dungeon's and Dragons Online = ecstatic Grackle
>
>
>The screenshots are very impressive. I still consider AC (my first exposure
>to mmorpgs) the best one so far. I'm looking forward to DDO.
>
Sounds like fun - but then, they ALL do. :) 

I'll probably get it, and try the first month, see how it goes.

I like how they treat rogues, but am not sure about the lack of
high-end solo content.

We'll see - sounds like the beta isn't too far off. Fingers crossed
for another Fileplanet exclusive, as I've had luck with them in the
past.

--

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 11:18:23 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

I like several things about the game but don't like some others.
The one thing I'm really liking is the 'no exp for killing monsters'.
Finally a MMORPG where camping/grinding shouldn't be there at all.
I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but I'll
have to test it before I can really comment on that.
Related resources
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 2:12:09 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Actually I didn't like AC1 either. So far for me it's been Turbine 0/2.
Maybe third time's the charm
April 4, 2005 3:36:01 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 2005-04-03, Grackle <nobody@lalaland.ca> wrote:
> Turbine + mmorpg * 1999 = Asheron's Call = happy Grackle
>
> and so it follows from the above that
>
> Turbine + mmorpg * 2005 = Dungeon's and Dragons Online = ecstatic Grackle

They screwed up AC2 big time.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 3:38:13 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

well of course if they are stupid enough to make all quests 'hack and
slash' then they didn't accomplish anything.
Basically, (and just like in D&D) you really don't get exp by killing
monsters, but by 'overcoming obstacles'. Basically, in 3rd edition, if
you need to get from point A to point B and there's a big troll in the
middle, you get the same exp if:
- You kill the troll
- You summon a kobold and make it taunt the troll into chasing him
while you cross
- You use a scroll of fly
- You pay the troll to let you pass
This is the idea they're implementing. How will they pull it off? I
don't know for sure, that's why I want to see it in action, but you can
be sure that camping a spot to kill the same mobs over and over *cough
EQ cough* will not be there, at least not for exp
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 3:41:03 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but
I'll
>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.

> It doesn't have to be any more twich based than NWN, which used 6
>second rounds

It doesn't have to be, but that's not what they decided. They're
making it twitch based, basically you can move in and out of combat and
make the opponent miss if you're not there. That's the part I don't
like, a hit or miss following D&D rules should depend entirely on your
character's abilities, not yours. But let's see how it goes.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 5:31:17 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:

>>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but
>
> I'll
>
>>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.
>
>
>> It doesn't have to be any more twich based than NWN, which used 6
>>second rounds
>
>
> It doesn't have to be, but that's not what they decided. They're
> making it twitch based, basically you can move in and out of combat and
> make the opponent miss if you're not there. That's the part I don't
> like, a hit or miss following D&D rules should depend entirely on your
> character's abilities, not yours. But let's see how it goes.

If they factor in AC and player ability, perhaps it could be done.
Gothic did it pretty well (although it was a little on the twitchy
side), but I can see it being really screwed up.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 9:09:35 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 4 Apr 2005 07:18:23 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:

>I like several things about the game but don't like some others.
>The one thing I'm really liking is the 'no exp for killing monsters'.
>Finally a MMORPG where camping/grinding shouldn't be there at all.

What makes you say that? Instead of gridning through monsters one
at a time you just grind them in groups to get your "quest" xp. Sure
they'll spout a lot of about being able to sneak or talk your way
though some encounters but there won't be anyone completing quests
without a significant amount of hack and slash, it would be too
unbalanced otherwise.

>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but I'll
>have to test it before I can really comment on that.

It doesn't have to be any more twich based than NWN, which used 6
second rounds.

--
"The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability
of the human mind to correlate all its contents." - H.P. Lovecraft
April 4, 2005 11:09:36 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Thus spake Mark Morrison <drdpikeuk@aol.com>, Sun, 03 Apr 2005 23:46:10
+0100, Anno Domini:

>On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 17:48:10 -0400, "Grackle" <nobody@lalaland.ca>
>wrote:
>
>>Turbine + mmorpg * 1999 = Asheron's Call = happy Grackle
>>
>>and so it follows from the above that
>>
>>Turbine + mmorpg * 2005 = Dungeon's and Dragons Online = ecstatic Grackle
>>
>>
>>The screenshots are very impressive. I still consider AC (my first exposure
>>to mmorpgs) the best one so far. I'm looking forward to DDO.
>>
>Sounds like fun - but then, they ALL do. :) 
>
>I'll probably get it, and try the first month, see how it goes.
>
>I like how they treat rogues, but am not sure about the lack of
>high-end solo content.
>
>We'll see - sounds like the beta isn't too far off. Fingers crossed
>for another Fileplanet exclusive, as I've had luck with them in the
>past.

What can a D&D mmorpg possibly offer that NWN hasn't tried already? I mean,
what's the incentive in having a whole lot of l33t boyz running around with
you compared to loss of cohesive storyline & complex quest structures? :-/

--
Replace 'spamfree' with the other word for 'maze' to reply via email.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 11:16:41 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Well, the part about it not really being D&D can't be argued. Besides
the changes to combat there will be changes to the magic system (I
seriously doubt that a level 1 wizard will only have two first level
spells available for the whole day). The end result will be a game
that uses D&D licensed terms for classes, items, monsters, etc but is
not D&D. Whether the game is good or not, and only time will tell us
this, the fact that it is not really D&D is going to drive off those
players who link how well a MMOG follows the PnP rules to how much they
enjoy the MMOG.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 11:46:23 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 4 Apr 2005 07:18:23 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:

>I like several things about the game but don't like some others.
>The one thing I'm really liking is the 'no exp for killing monsters'.
>Finally a MMORPG where camping/grinding shouldn't be there at all.
>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but I'll
>have to test it before I can really comment on that.

How do you gain XP then? I thought they were implementing 3ed rules
where monsters also have levels so the XP reward is based on that.

Lynley
April 4, 2005 11:46:24 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 2005-04-04, Lynley James <lynley.james@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 4 Apr 2005 07:18:23 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>>I like several things about the game but don't like some others.
>>The one thing I'm really liking is the 'no exp for killing monsters'.
>>Finally a MMORPG where camping/grinding shouldn't be there at all.
>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but I'll
>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.
>
> How do you gain XP then? I thought they were implementing 3ed rules
> where monsters also have levels so the XP reward is based on that.

I think like VTM: Bloodlines. You get XP by completing quests.
Anonymous
April 4, 2005 11:46:25 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

shadows wrote:
> On 2005-04-04, Lynley James <lynley.james@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On 4 Apr 2005 07:18:23 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I like several things about the game but don't like some others.
>>>The one thing I'm really liking is the 'no exp for killing monsters'.
>>>Finally a MMORPG where camping/grinding shouldn't be there at all.
>>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but I'll
>>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.
>>
>>How do you gain XP then? I thought they were implementing 3ed rules
>>where monsters also have levels so the XP reward is based on that.
>
>
> I think like VTM: Bloodlines. You get XP by completing quests.

While that was interesting, it also "forced*" some side quests on you
that you might not do (if you are role playing). I found that to be
somewhat annoying and frustrating.

*If you wanted enough XP to actually fight the boss(es) at the end.
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 12:31:12 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"shadows" <shadows@whitefang.com> wrote in message
news:slrnd52r84.1eeb.shadows@helena.whitefang.com...
> On 2005-04-03, Grackle <nobody@lalaland.ca> wrote:
>> Turbine + mmorpg * 1999 = Asheron's Call = happy Grackle
>>
>> and so it follows from the above that
>>
>> Turbine + mmorpg * 2005 = Dungeon's and Dragons Online = ecstatic Grackle
>
> They screwed up AC2 big time.

They screwed it like a $2 crack whore.
But AC1 I loved, having nothing else to compare it with at the time.
Technically, I can't remember any problems with the game or their servers.
Having Microsoft to back them helped a lot, I'm sure.
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 2:29:45 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 19:09:36 +1000, Nostromo
<nostromo@spamfree.net.au> wrote:

>What can a D&D mmorpg possibly offer that NWN hasn't tried already?

A decent game out of the box, without waiting for third party missions
?

--

Bunnies aren't just cute like everybody supposes !
They got them hoppy legs and twitchy little noses !
And what's with all the carrots ?
What do they need such good eyesight for anyway ?
Bunnies ! Bunnies ! It must be BUNNIES !
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 3:19:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 4 Apr 2005 11:41:03 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:

>>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but
>I'll
>>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.
>
>> It doesn't have to be any more twich based than NWN, which used 6
>>second rounds
>
>It doesn't have to be, but that's not what they decided. They're
>making it twitch based, basically you can move in and out of combat and
>make the opponent miss if you're not there.

So it's not D&D at all then, just a lame RPG using the D&D license.
I'll give it a pass then.

--
"The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability
of the human mind to correlate all its contents." - H.P. Lovecraft
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 3:19:03 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Johnny Bravo" <baawa_knight@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:fri3519sjfea9olg78su7e51vcgfs6qdem@4ax.com...
> On 4 Apr 2005 11:41:03 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>>>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but
>>I'll
>>>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.
>>
>>> It doesn't have to be any more twich based than NWN, which used 6
>>>second rounds
>>
>>It doesn't have to be, but that's not what they decided. They're
>>making it twitch based, basically you can move in and out of combat and
>>make the opponent miss if you're not there.
>
> So it's not D&D at all then, just a lame RPG using the D&D license.
> I'll give it a pass then.
>

Wow, such foresight, can I have next week's lottery numbers too?
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 1:30:41 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

>Basically, in 3rd edition, if
> you need to get from point A to point B and there's a big
> troll in the middle, you get the same exp if:
> - You kill the troll
> - You summon a kobold and make it taunt the troll into
> chasing him while you cross
> - You use a scroll of fly
> - You pay the troll to let you pass
> This is the idea they're implementing.


Problem solving in an MMOG?? What fun is that??
See monster, kill monster! That's the name of the game!

-st
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 2:34:33 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

The problem D&DO will have is, basically, people thinking of it as a
MMORPG instead of D&D. People will want uber stuff, people will want
crafting, PvP, they'll want to carry 100000 gold pieces and 8 backpacks
full of armor and weapons. D&D has clear rules about that, a frail
mage can carry about 40 pounds, about the weight of one single two
handed sword. Will D&DO change D&D rules to go the MMORPG way?
Without dying, will people loose CON every time they're defeated? will
they loose levels?
What happens if there's PvP? Will a lucky lvl 1 mage be able to charm
a lvl 14 fighter?

So D&DO devs have a really tough road ahead, that of trying to make D&D
followers happy and trying to make MMORPG followers happy too, almost a
no win situation
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 4:13:48 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:

> The problem D&DO will have is, basically, people thinking of it as a
> MMORPG instead of D&D. People will want uber stuff, people will want
> crafting, PvP, they'll want to carry 100000 gold pieces and 8 backpacks
> full of armor and weapons. D&D has clear rules about that, a frail
> mage can carry about 40 pounds, about the weight of one single two
> handed sword. Will D&DO change D&D rules to go the MMORPG way?
> Without dying, will people loose CON every time they're defeated? will
> they loose levels?
> What happens if there's PvP? Will a lucky lvl 1 mage be able to charm
> a lvl 14 fighter?

The problem is that in D&D a mage after about level 12 you are so uber
that nothing can touch you.

A fighter maxes out about level 8 and a Ranger/Cleric is uber at 10 or
12. There are far too many classes that can make an uber character very
quickly.

> So D&DO devs have a really tough road ahead, that of trying to make D&D
> followers happy and trying to make MMORPG followers happy too, almost a
> no win situation

I think this will be a poor choice for a game. The casual game will not
be able to keep up and the phat loot means that everyone will have a
+289057475 Holy Avenger by the end of the first month.
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 4:18:32 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Alex Mars" <alexmars@aol.com> wrote in news:1112667401.379503.87020
@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com:

> Well, the part about it not really being D&D can't be argued. Besides
> the changes to combat there will be changes to the magic system (I
> seriously doubt that a level 1 wizard will only have two first level
> spells available for the whole day). The end result will be a game
> that uses D&D licensed terms for classes, items, monsters, etc but is
> not D&D. Whether the game is good or not, and only time will tell us
> this, the fact that it is not really D&D is going to drive off those
> players who link how well a MMOG follows the PnP rules to how much they
> enjoy the MMOG.

The changes to the magic system being used were necessary. There are some
basic assumptions in PnP D&D that are just *not* compatible with making a
MMORPG. The magic system is one of those. In PnP D&D, a party is expected
to rest every 3 or 4 encounters. Due to the fact that encounters,
travelling and numerous other things are resolved *much* faster on a
computer than it would be with PnP, it is not possinle to leave it the
same.

More detail can be seen here:
http://www.ddo.com/index.php?page_id=84


--
Marcel
http://mudbunny.blogspot.com/
April 5, 2005 10:26:48 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Thus spake Mark Morrison <drdpikeuk@aol.com>, Mon, 04 Apr 2005 22:29:45
+0100, Anno Domini:

>On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 19:09:36 +1000, Nostromo
><nostromo@spamfree.net.au> wrote:
>
>>What can a D&D mmorpg possibly offer that NWN hasn't tried already?
>
>A decent game out of the box, without waiting for third party missions
>?

Well, the wait was all of a month initially, & now it's not an issue. Don't
get me wrong, I just can't warm to NWN even though I 'struggled' through 2
chapters of the OC. I got HotU & played it for all of a half hour before it
fell by the wayside. There's just something 'dead' or sanitised about the
engine & game world that leaves me dry...now BG2 I can (re)play till the
cows come home!
Anyway, NWN was mentioned just to illustrate the point, not start a debate.
There have been a few persistent worlds that have also been set up that
worked reasonably well for under 100 players, given the engine was never
really designed nor optimised to take more than about 32(?)...

--
Replace 'spamfree' with the other word for 'maze' to reply via email.
Anonymous
April 5, 2005 10:26:49 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Reddogfive wrote:

>I think the name is the only thing that D&D Online will have in common with
>the RPG.
>
>

I ran D&D for 25 years, and had a really fanatical following of
players. When NWN came out I tried replicating the campaign and found
it just didn't work. They are not at all the same. D&DOL will likely
be no different in that respect.

To be what we gamemasters want it would have to ignore being playable in
single player or even persistant world. It would have to be a tool for
the GM, including all the spells and abilities that only a GM can
adjudicate. It would have to give total power to the GM. NWN falls way
short of that. I haven't even looked at D&DOL because I cannot imagine
it doing any better. Am I wrong?

>Is this a bad thing? Not if its a good game.
>
>Will it be a good game?
>
>

I doubt it. Every attempt to bring D&D to the computer has failed. I
designed one back in the 80's, and found myself having to depart majorly
from what made D&D what it was. Keep in mind, D&D is not so much a game
system as a way for people to interact. When they go programming it
they always focus on the game system, and ignore people interacting.
That is where they fail, and they don't even have the wit to ask about that.
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 12:19:54 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Mon, 4 Apr 2005 20:33:07 -0400, "Grackle" <nobody@lalaland.ca> wrote:

>"Johnny Bravo" <baawa_knight@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:fri3519sjfea9olg78su7e51vcgfs6qdem@4ax.com...
>> On 4 Apr 2005 11:41:03 -0700, wolfing1@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>>>>I don't like them going real time action twitch based combat, but
>>>I'll
>>>>>have to test it before I can really comment on that.
>>>
>>>> It doesn't have to be any more twich based than NWN, which used 6
>>>>second rounds
>>>
>>>It doesn't have to be, but that's not what they decided. They're
>>>making it twitch based, basically you can move in and out of combat and
>>>make the opponent miss if you're not there.
>>
>> So it's not D&D at all then, just a lame RPG using the D&D license.
>> I'll give it a pass then.
>>
>
>Wow, such foresight, can I have next week's lottery numbers too?

Maybe so but I'd put money on him being right!
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 2:41:49 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Reddogfive" <reddogfivenospam@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:nbmdnQ5YVc5uC8_fRVn-gg@rogers.com...
>I think the name is the only thing that D&D Online will have in common with
>the RPG.
>
> Is this a bad thing? Not if its a good game.
>
> Will it be a good game?
>
> I beta tested AC and played AC2 and though both had some decent elements
> of a online game, they were not my cup of tea. And since D7D online is the
> same developers I am not encouraged...
>

Let me stress that AC2 was not an evolution of AC, they took a good game and
then removed all the NPCs through some brilliant inspiration of utter
stupidity, among other things. I played AC for nearly two years, and AC2
for nearly two weeks before canning it. My enthusiasm for D&D online is
just that I want a good game, something from the creators of AC, but with
updated technology, the refinement of D&D, and hopefully, something that
takes account of everything that has been learned in the industry during
these long years of mmorpg hit and misses. I consider WoW the best success
in this respect, although it is designed so that even people with head
trauma can get by without too much mental strain. Something more along the
lines of Baldur's Gate in mmorpg form would be nice, but I certainly ain't
holding my breath with D&D online.
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 3:04:44 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

I guess this quote from an interview with the game's exec. producer answers
some questions about whether it's an rpg with the D&D label, or more of an
online version of D&D (if such a thing is possible):


"At the same time, we're making the first ever D&D online role-playing game,
and this is both a tremendous opportunity and a huge responsibility. We're
making this game with the D&D fan in mind, and we're taking pains to
implement the 3.5 edition rules wherever possible."
April 6, 2005 3:57:29 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 2005-04-06, Grackle <nobody@lalaland.ca> wrote:

> Let me stress that AC2 was not an evolution of AC, they took a good game and
> then removed all the NPCs through some brilliant inspiration of utter
> stupidity, among other things.

Quite true, I think they eventually relented. Their problem is
they wanted a player run economy but didn't provide the tools
necessary to do this. No NPC co-signers or vendors players could
put down. I remember a year into launch reading that they would
change this but I never bothered keeping track.

I quit around the time Microsoft dropped the game and gave it
back to Turbine.
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 3:58:58 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Grackle wrote:

>I guess this quote from an interview with the game's exec. producer answers
>some questions about whether it's an rpg with the D&D label, or more of an
>online version of D&D (if such a thing is possible):
>
>
>"At the same time, we're making the first ever D&D online role-playing game,
>and this is both a tremendous opportunity and a huge responsibility.
>

It's also a lie. NWN was that.

>We're
>making this game with the D&D fan in mind, and we're taking pains to
>implement the 3.5 edition rules wherever possible."
>

Even NWN was touted as intending to implement the entire game.
"Wherever possible?"
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 7:41:44 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Grackle" <nobody@lalaland.ca> wrote in message
news:hlI4e.10024$Fy3.854812@news20.bellglobal.com...
> I guess this quote from an interview with the game's exec. producer
answers
> some questions about whether it's an rpg with the D&D label, or more of an
> online version of D&D (if such a thing is possible):
>
>
> "At the same time, we're making the first ever D&D online role-playing
game,
> and this is both a tremendous opportunity and a huge responsibility. We're
> making this game with the D&D fan in mind, and we're taking pains to
> implement the 3.5 edition rules wherever possible."

"Whenever possible", is key here. Most of time it isn't gonna be possible.
Thee will be monsters, loot, charaters, that gonne be DnD like. But not the
same. DnD is not a massively multi player role playing game. Compromises
must me be made. And they will be made. Doesn't mean it won't be a good
game. I hope it is.

PS -- I also love AC1, played it foe about 2.4 years. I hope this one is
great too.



Grotnar
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 1:37:07 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Grackle wrote:

> I guess this quote from an interview with the game's exec. producer answers
> some questions about whether it's an rpg with the D&D label, or more of an
> online version of D&D (if such a thing is possible):
>
>
> "At the same time, we're making the first ever D&D online role-playing game,
> and this is both a tremendous opportunity and a huge responsibility. We're
> making this game with the D&D fan in mind, and we're taking pains to
> implement the 3.5 edition rules wherever possible."
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

HUH!!??? Wherever possible!!??? I fear for this game. It means that
the only 3.5 rules we'll see is in combat.
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 3:07:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Combat is exactly where you wont see the 3.5 rules, DDO is using a real
time/twitch based system.
Anonymous
April 6, 2005 10:41:22 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

In terms of recreating D&D I don't like it either, however having a
combat system that mixes level and player reflexes has been at the
heart of this project from the beginning so there is little point to
complaining. I'll make up my mind about DDO gameplay if/when I get
into the beta and play it. The fact that is is loosely based on D&D is
irrelevant to me, to me it's just another MMOG to check out if it ever
is released.

I like twitch based shooters, but IMO twitch based melee ends up with
the characters apparently in the Special Olympics Slam Dance
competition, it just looks stupid with all the hopping and lurching
about.
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 12:41:57 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Alex Mars" <alexmars@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1112810836.940515.301840@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> Combat is exactly where you wont see the 3.5 rules, DDO is using a real
> time/twitch based system.
>

This decision is a mistake, in my opinion. What happens in combat between
equal opponents, the one with the faster ping gets to twitch faster?
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 1:32:04 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Grackle wrote:

> "Alex Mars" <alexmars@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:1112810836.940515.301840@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>
>>Combat is exactly where you wont see the 3.5 rules, DDO is using a real
>>time/twitch based system.
>>
>
>
> This decision is a mistake, in my opinion. What happens in combat between
> equal opponents, the one with the faster ping gets to twitch faster?

I didn't see the OP. So it is all twitch bases? Your attributes, AC,
etc have really nothing to do with combat??? Hell, I might as well
stick to Counter-Strike.
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 1:33:58 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Alex Mars wrote:

> I like twitch based shooters, but IMO twitch based melee ends up with
> the characters apparently in the Special Olympics Slam Dance
> competition, it just looks stupid with all the hopping and lurching
> about.

LOL. Too true. If they implement "special" moves it will get even
worse. Melee and twitch don't get along very well...

I would like to see a melee system similar to Gothics, but I doubt that...
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 6:55:35 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

The developers have said that they are aiming at a balance of twitch
and character stats. I can see how weapon damage can be easily
influenced by the capabilities of the character via STR and magic on
the weapon, it is the "to hit" that leaves me wondering. Perhaps they
will do something like Neocron, where hitting an opponent requires the
player to actively keep the cursor on the enemy so that they can then
engage it via the usual RPG style rules. The last dev comment I read
on this really had no substance, only the "vision".
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 11:48:41 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Alex Mars" <alexmars@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1112838082.438679.15020@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> In terms of recreating D&D I don't like it either, however having a
> combat system that mixes level and player reflexes has been at the
> heart of this project from the beginning so there is little point to
> complaining. I'll make up my mind about DDO gameplay if/when I get
> into the beta and play it. The fact that is is loosely based on D&D is
> irrelevant to me, to me it's just another MMOG to check out if it ever
> is released.
>
> I like twitch based shooters, but IMO twitch based melee ends up with
> the characters apparently in the Special Olympics Slam Dance
> competition, it just looks stupid with all the hopping and lurching
> about.
>

And really, I drink enough coffee during the day at work, now I'm going to
have to drink even more before logging on to D&D so I can raise my twitch
factor high enough to be competitive in combat. :) 
Anonymous
April 8, 2005 4:26:40 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Alex Mars wrote:

> The developers have said that they are aiming at a balance of twitch
> and character stats. I can see how weapon damage can be easily
> influenced by the capabilities of the character via STR and magic on
> the weapon, it is the "to hit" that leaves me wondering. Perhaps they
> will do something like Neocron, where hitting an opponent requires the
> player to actively keep the cursor on the enemy so that they can then
> engage it via the usual RPG style rules. The last dev comment I read
> on this really had no substance, only the "vision".

Oh god...I see this being melee Counter-Strike more and more. I also
see ranged character (archers esp) being uber pretty fast.

There are going to be a ton of balance problems....
Anonymous
April 8, 2005 3:03:50 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

>Alex Mars wrote:
>
>> I like twitch based shooters, but IMO twitch based melee ends up with
>> the characters apparently in the Special Olympics Slam Dance
>> competition, it just looks stupid with all the hopping and lurching
>> about.
>
>LOL. Too true. If they implement "special" moves it will get even
>worse. Melee and twitch don't get along very well...

Blade of Darkness did it relatively well I thought.
Barring of course the need to always use the special character or
weapons moves to accomplish anything, since the basic weapon damages
were pretty low in comparison.

Xocyll
--
I don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of
a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably,
Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So
FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr
!