dinkster9

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OKAY, i've just spent the last 4 hours reading post after post on here about ram. can't take it anymore...

Pretend that money was no object. Pretend i wanted to buy 256 x 2 megs of ram for my new (pretend) a7n8x delux mother board. Now lets just pretend that i want future upgradeablility so ram running at 400mhz ddr is at least necessary.

WHO WHAT WHY WHERE AND WHEN should i buy ram??? Corsiar seems to be the "consensus" for best, but they don't make xms 3500 in twin bank or in extremely low latency...and everyone claims that the pc3200 stuff was just overclocked pc2700 ram??? i know i need cl2.0 2,2,2 or whatever, but i'm totally lost. Can someone send me to a link to a store where i can buy 'THE BEST RAM' in the world for the a7n8x

"sixth sick sheik's sixth sheep's sick"
 

juin

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PC 3500 as been able to work only at 2.8 volt on a Nforce

in this case why bothers with a AMD and DDR the 2 are know for the low end produce

Just next to the lab and the bunker you will find the marketing departement.
 

DanW

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Your motherboard can take a maximum of 3GB of memory. Since it can take PC3200, get PC3200. Here's the catch: I've only seen PC3200 in 512MB sticks. (www.insightcomponents.com) So if you want the best of today, you can get three 512MB sticks of PC3200 for a total of 1.5GB of RAM. Or, you could just get one 512MB stick, and then purchase a couple 1GB sticks when they become available, for a total of 2.5GB. If you want to have the maximum amount of memory, you have two options:

1) Purchase a 512MB stick now. Once 1GB sticks become available, buy three 1GB sticks, and chuck the 512MB stick.

2) Purchase two 512MB sticks now. Once 2GB PC3200 sticks become available, buy one of those. Be advised that it may take a year or so for 2GB sticks to appear.

Ahhh... remember when 16MB was considered an ungodly amount of RAM?
 

ad_rach

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you can get pc 3200 in 256mb dimms.
go for 2X corsair 256mb pc 3500.remember you need two dimms for dual channel-1 or 3 dimms will be used in single channel

no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
 

dinkster9

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wait, that doesn't make any sense?!? i can get pc 3200, so i should buy pc 3500? Yes i'm going to do dual channel, and i want corsair pc3200 extremely low latency twin pack of 256mb at cas 2.0. My question is simply, i've been hearing some bad stuff about some of the pc3200 memory being just overclocked 2700, is this true for corisar?

"sixth sick sheik's sixth sheep's sick"
 

ad_rach

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no.corsair is top quality stuff-none of that messing about.i suggested pc 3500 because it's the same price as E.L.L. 3200 and it's tested to run at 434MHz so you can use that extra speed if you want to.i know it is not the extremely low latency stuff but is is still cas 2, though it is 2-3-3-3-7 rather than the E.L.L. 2-2-2-2-6.you don't need to get twin packs anyway for dual channel, the only advantage afaik of them is that they have been tested in dual channel as a pair.plenty of people,including myself, are using a pair of normal 'single' dimms for dual channel.
you just need to decide whether you want the extra speed or extra low latency.the 3500 will let you go further if you ever get a 400fsb processor and want to oc it but having said that, the 3200 will go pretty far too.

no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
 

DanW

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While it is true that a PC2700 chip is exactly the same as a PC3200 chip, the statement that PC3200 is overclocked PC2700 is not entirely accurate.

First, let me qualify the following statements by saying that I've worked in the Test department at Micron in Boise.

PC2100, PC2700, PC3200, PC3500. The chips are the same. The only difference is that the higher speed ones have been tested to work correctly at that speed.

Once a wafer has been fabricated, it goes through a process called "Probe". Here, all the individual dies on the wafer are given their first electrical test. They are then marked as either good, bad, or repairable. I won't mention how exactly the parts are repaired, as it might violate confidentiality.

The next step in the process is where all the individual dies are cut from the wafer with a diamond saw. The wafers then go to wire bond where gold wires are bonded from the pin substrate to the die itself. Then, the chips go to encapsulation where they recieve their hard candy-coated shell. Next, the chips go to burn-in. Here they recieve their second electrical test to ensure that they are all indeed working.

After passing burn-in, they then go to machines which do full functional checks. All the parts are tested at various speeds, and sorted accordingly. The parts that work correctly at the highest speeds are sorted into lots with other chips that also work at the highest speeds. Chips that do not work at the highest speed, but do work at lower speeds, are sorted into lots of parts that also work at lower speeds, but not at higher speeds. Thus, you can have PC2100, PC2700, and PC3200 all coming from the same wafer. The difference is that some work at high speeds, some do not.

Why don't all the parts work at the highest speed? There are any number of things that can go wrong during the fabrication process. Imperfections in the lenses used, in the various etch processes, etc.

The reason that we see speed increases in parts is because as time passes, the manufacturer gets better at making the parts. Every single step is recorded, and every single error is tracked. The longer a part is in production, the more time there is to track down problems in chip fabrication. As such, when a particular part starts production, the failure rate per wafer may be more than 50 percent of the total parts on the wafer. As time goes on, and the fabrication process gets better, the failure rate drops. This also explains why prices decrease once something is in production longer. More money is made when 90% of the parts per wafer are good, than when just 50% of the parts per wafer are good.

Interestingly, even parts that do not pass all functional tests can stil be used. These parts go to various manufacturers who don't need certain functions. For example, if a part won't correctly do some sort of error check, it might go to some toy manufacturer whose application does not use the function which does not work.

So, to sum it all up, yes, if you got a PC2700 and a PC3200 stick of RAM, you could very well have the same parts on each stick. The only difference is that one part will be marked with a number such as -8, while the other one is marked with -6 (which is slower than -8)

Some might argue that they have tried PC133 in systems running at PC66, and it didn't work. This is true in some cases. But the reason is not the speed. The reason is that you're probably using a stick of ram with parts of a density too great to be supported by the machine they are in. (See the memory FAQ)

In conclusion, the statement that PC3200 is simply overclocked PC2700 is both true and false. It's true in that the chips on a PC3200 stick may be the same as teh chips on the PC2700. It's false in that the chips on the PC3200 stick have been electrically tested to work correctly at the higher speed.
 

jlanka

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Mar 16, 2001
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excellent post. Thanks for stepping up to the plate. We need more participation from pros like youself.

<i>It's always the one thing you never suspected.</i>
 

ad_rach

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i wholeheartedly agree.i myself am used to going by hearsay and assumption so it's good to hear from someone who actually has experience of what they're talking about.

no matter how hard you try, you can't polish a turd. :]
 

dhlucke

Polypheme
Great post!

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