Temple of Elemental Evil Basic Q

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

I just bought TEE having found it for $9.98 at Half Price Books.
Downloaded and installed the patches. Got ready to play. Got my ass handed
to me in the friggin' tutorial.

Why?

Because, try as I might, I don't get it. I can have my main character walk
and swing and attack someone. No problem. What I can't do is figure out
how to use the radial dial/thingie to get the wizard to do anything but
get reamed.

How does one fight in this system? The manual is absolutely no help at
all as it seems to assume you already know what it's going to tell you, so
why tell you? Any help here or any referral to a site where I can get
help is so very, very much appreciated.

Best,


Velvet Elvis
12 answers Last reply
More about temple elemental evil basic
  1. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Sat, 07 May 2005 01:59:02 GMT, VelvetElvis <reallyNO@SPAM4me.xyz>
    wrote:

    >
    >I just bought TEE having found it for $9.98 at Half Price Books.
    >Downloaded and installed the patches. Got ready to play. Got my ass handed
    >to me in the friggin' tutorial.
    >
    >Why?
    >
    >Because, try as I might, I don't get it. I can have my main character walk
    >and swing and attack someone. No problem. What I can't do is figure out
    >how to use the radial dial/thingie to get the wizard to do anything but
    >get reamed.
    >
    >How does one fight in this system? The manual is absolutely no help at
    >all as it seems to assume you already know what it's going to tell you, so
    >why tell you? Any help here or any referral to a site where I can get
    >help is so very, very much appreciated.
    >
    >Best,
    >
    >
    >Velvet Elvis

    Dear Big E,

    It's all about the space bar. Hit it to pause the game. Issue a
    command to your wizard. Now hit the spacebar to resume play. As soon
    as a spell is cast, hit the space bar again to issue another command.
    Etc.
  2. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    Jim <> wrote in news:51bo7119tjiaomnsd4vqr4ad9ujkeh2gmb@4ax.com:

    > On Sat, 07 May 2005 01:59:02 GMT, VelvetElvis <reallyNO@SPAM4me.xyz>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>I just bought TEE having found it for $9.98 at Half Price Books.
    >>Downloaded and installed the patches. Got ready to play. Got my ass
    >>handed to me in the friggin' tutorial.
    >>
    >>Why?
    >>
    >>Because, try as I might, I don't get it. I can have my main character
    >>walk and swing and attack someone. No problem. What I can't do is
    >>figure out how to use the radial dial/thingie to get the wizard to do
    >>anything but get reamed.
    >>
    >>How does one fight in this system? The manual is absolutely no help
    >>at all as it seems to assume you already know what it's going to tell
    >>you, so why tell you? Any help here or any referral to a site where
    I
    >>can get help is so very, very much appreciated.
    >>
    >>Best,
    >>
    >>
    >>Velvet Elvis
    >
    > Dear Big E,
    >
    > It's all about the space bar. Hit it to pause the game. Issue a
    > command to your wizard. Now hit the spacebar to resume play. As
    soon
    > as a spell is cast, hit the space bar again to issue another command.
    > Etc.
    >


    Well, i was my usual idiotic self. As soon as I posted this, it occured
    to me (no help from the manual, of course) that I should let her rest
    -- so I rested her and then, after a moment, there was the Wiz option
    on the radial so I could actually do a spell.

    Victory! This is going to rock!

    Er ... no, not really. I've tried it many, many times in the tutorial
    and she dies every time. Quickly. And the number of spells she can use
    drops each time until she has to run back and rest, come back, try a
    few, and die.

    Went to try the start of a game and same thing. Five people creamed by
    a bear and a couple of idgets.

    I obviously don't get the breakdown of the turn itself. I'll attack
    with the warrior or shoot off a spell and end the turn. Not much reason
    to do anything else except walk toward someone now and then.

    Still, it's clunky for me and they're dead in a matter of seconds.
    Apparently I ain't the sharpest knife in the drawer and the design of
    this game capitalizes on that fact. :(

    Velvet Elvis
  3. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    <Jim> wrote in message news:51bo7119tjiaomnsd4vqr4ad9ujkeh2gmb@4ax.com...
    > On Sat, 07 May 2005 01:59:02 GMT, VelvetElvis <reallyNO@SPAM4me.xyz>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>I just bought TEE having found it for $9.98 at Half Price Books.
    >>Downloaded and installed the patches. Got ready to play. Got my ass handed
    >>to me in the friggin' tutorial.
    >>
    >>Why?
    >>
    >>Because, try as I might, I don't get it. I can have my main character walk
    >>and swing and attack someone. No problem. What I can't do is figure out
    >>how to use the radial dial/thingie to get the wizard to do anything but
    >>get reamed.
    >>
    >>How does one fight in this system? The manual is absolutely no help at
    >>all as it seems to assume you already know what it's going to tell you, so
    >>why tell you? Any help here or any referral to a site where I can get
    >>help is so very, very much appreciated.
    >>
    >>Best,
    >>
    >>
    >>Velvet Elvis
    >
    > Dear Big E,
    >
    > It's all about the space bar. Hit it to pause the game. Issue a
    > command to your wizard. Now hit the spacebar to resume play. As soon
    > as a spell is cast, hit the space bar again to issue another command.
    > Etc.

    wrong game, Jim. You're thinking BG and the like. TOEE is pure turn-based.
  4. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On 07/05/05 04:15, VelvetElvis wrote:
    > Victory! This is going to rock!
    >
    > Er ... no, not really. I've tried it many, many times in the tutorial
    > and she dies every time. Quickly. And the number of spells she can use
    > drops each time until she has to run back and rest, come back, try a
    > few, and die.
    >
    > Went to try the start of a game and same thing. Five people creamed by
    > a bear and a couple of idgets.

    Ok, let's start from the basics. Who's in your party? You should have
    two tanks (I prefer a fighter and a ranger, but barbarian or paladin
    also works), an aggressive spellcaster (if you're a beginner, this
    really should be a sorceror not a wizard), and a healer (cleric). This
    leaves a free slot for a rogue/bard. Your tanks do the melee combat,
    supported by the sorceror casting (at low level) things like magic
    missile. The others you should try to train up as ranged attackers, but
    they play a supporting role in combat.

    ToEE is a hard game - if a fight is too hard, you should leave it and
    come back when you've levelled up. However, the first fight that occurs
    as part of the opening vignette for your alignment ought to be trivial,
    and if you're having trouble there then you should open the manual and
    do some reading!
  5. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Sat, 07 May 2005 03:15:58 GMT, VelvetElvis <reallyNO@SPAM4me.xyz>
    wrote:


    >> Dear Big E,
    >>
    >> It's all about the space bar. Hit it to pause the game. Issue a
    >> command to your wizard. Now hit the spacebar to resume play. As
    >soon
    >> as a spell is cast, hit the space bar again to issue another command.
    >> Etc.
    >>
    >
    >
    >Well, i was my usual idiotic self. As soon as I posted this, it occured
    >to me (no help from the manual, of course) that I should let her rest
    >-- so I rested her and then, after a moment, there was the Wiz option
    >on the radial so I could actually do a spell.
    >
    >Victory! This is going to rock!
    >
    >Er ... no, not really. I've tried it many, many times in the tutorial
    >and she dies every time. Quickly. And the number of spells she can use
    >drops each time until she has to run back and rest, come back, try a
    >few, and die.
    >
    >Went to try the start of a game and same thing. Five people creamed by
    >a bear and a couple of idgets.
    >
    >I obviously don't get the breakdown of the turn itself. I'll attack
    >with the warrior or shoot off a spell and end the turn. Not much reason
    >to do anything else except walk toward someone now and then.
    >
    >Still, it's clunky for me and they're dead in a matter of seconds.
    >Apparently I ain't the sharpest knife in the drawer and the design of
    >this game capitalizes on that fact. :(

    That's what I hate most about D&D's magic system. I know it was done
    to balamce the mages, but having to memorize a spell for hours and
    hours before you can cast it is just stupid IMO.

    While reading a D&D novel, I just know that the mages described
    therein aren't using this stupid magic restriction. There's no way
    Raistlin would have beaten Takhisis otherwise. I mean can you imagine
    it??"

    Oh geez, I don't have anymore Chain Lightning spells Takhisis, hold
    on for a few hours while I go home and re-memorize them.

    Yah, right.
  6. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "Sine Nomine" <invalid@nospam.com> wrote in message
    news:d5ijkm$jfc$1@jura.cc.ic.ac.uk...
    > Ok, let's start from the basics. Who's in your party? You should have two
    > tanks (I prefer a fighter and a ranger, but barbarian or paladin also
    > works), an aggressive spellcaster (if you're a beginner, this really
    > should be a sorceror not a wizard), and a healer (cleric). This leaves a
    > free slot for a rogue/bard. Your tanks do the melee combat, supported by
    > the sorceror casting (at low level) things like magic missile. The others
    > you should try to train up as ranged attackers, but they play a supporting
    > role in combat.
    >
    > ToEE is a hard game - if a fight is too hard, you should leave it and come
    > back when you've levelled up. However, the first fight that occurs as part
    > of the opening vignette for your alignment ought to be trivial, and if
    > you're having trouble there then you should open the manual and do some
    > reading!

    You can leave combat?? IIRC, you couldn't break combat. Have they fixed
    this?
  7. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "JWB" <jwb3333_spamtrap_@excite.com> wrote in
    news:GQ5fe.6016$yl6.3182577@twister.nyc.rr.com:

    > "Sine Nomine" <invalid@nospam.com> wrote in message
    > news:d5ijkm$jfc$1@jura.cc.ic.ac.uk...
    >> Ok, let's start from the basics. Who's in your party? You should
    have
    >> two tanks (I prefer a fighter and a ranger, but barbarian or paladin
    >> also works), an aggressive spellcaster (if you're a beginner, this
    >> really should be a sorceror not a wizard), and a healer (cleric).
    >> This leaves a free slot for a rogue/bard. Your tanks do the melee
    >> combat, supported by the sorceror casting (at low level) things like
    >> magic missile. The others you should try to train up as ranged
    >> attackers, but they play a supporting role in combat.
    >>
    >> ToEE is a hard game - if a fight is too hard, you should leave it
    and
    >> come back when you've levelled up. However, the first fight that
    >> occurs as part of the opening vignette for your alignment ought to
    be
    >> trivial, and if you're having trouble there then you should open the
    >> manual and do some reading!
    >
    > You can leave combat?? IIRC, you couldn't break combat. Have they
    > fixed this?
    >
    >
    >

    Well, I've tried and will go back today and do a bit more. The problem
    seems to be that I don't understand the entire combat system in toto. I
    do understand there are two divisions -- I could walk, for instance,
    and then attack within the same turn or, more correctly, that would
    constitute a turn.

    Obviously what I"m doing is smooth in the least -- it's got a jerky
    feel to it like I'm making things happen, but perhaps skipping a step
    here and there.

    I've read the manual, thanks to the person suggesting, but the section
    on combat lacks a basic overview of the process to which you can plug
    in the small bits and pieces. It also lacks concrete examples of what a
    particular round of combat might be.

    I like the graphics. I like the concept of a system of choosing a fight
    (I liked the same turn based part of Wizard 8, for instance, very
    much), but don't quite have the outline in my head to do the practical
    parts.

    All help past and coming is appreciated!

    Velvet Elvis
  8. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    VelvetElvis wrote:
    > I like the graphics. I like the concept of a system of choosing a
    > fight (I liked the same turn based part of Wizard 8, for instance,
    > very much), but don't quite have the outline in my head to do the
    > practical parts.
    > All help past and coming is appreciated!

    I can't really help you there because it's been a while since I played this
    game, but it was pretty much unplayable out of the box so make sure you
    patch it first and foremost:

    http://www.atari.com/us/support/dl.php?file=ftp://ftp.infogrames.net/patches
    /toee/TOEE_ANY-PATCH3.EXE

    It won't fix all of the issues (there are too many to mention) but sure
    helps.

    So long Troika, RIP.
  9. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    BuckFush wrote:
    > I can't really help you there because it's been a while since I
    > played this game, but it was pretty much unplayable out of the box so
    > make sure you patch it first and foremost:

    Sorry, but it looks like I gave you bad advice according to this post:

    http://www.co8.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1666

    There's also a very good starting out guide right there, hope this helps.
  10. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    "BuckFush" <notmyre@laddress.com> wrote in
    news:zrdfe.16551$n93.7331@twister.nyc.rr.com:

    > VelvetElvis wrote:
    >> I like the graphics. I like the concept of a system of choosing a
    >> fight (I liked the same turn based part of Wizard 8, for instance,
    >> very much), but don't quite have the outline in my head to do the
    >> practical parts.
    >> All help past and coming is appreciated!
    >
    > I can't really help you there because it's been a while since I
    played
    > this game, but it was pretty much unplayable out of the box so make
    > sure you patch it first and foremost:
    >
    > http://www.atari.com/us/support/dl.php?
    file=ftp://ftp.infogrames.net/pa
    > tches /toee/TOEE_ANY-PATCH3.EXE
    >
    > It won't fix all of the issues (there are too many to mention) but
    > sure helps.
    >
    > So long Troika, RIP.
    >
    >


    Well, I blew it off. I found that no matter what I did in the blasted
    turorial (1) somebody died immediately because they couldn't respond
    fast enough or often enough to defeat 7 opponents and (2) Way too slow
    and worthless and (3) The one halfway decent spell the wizard has means
    you have to rest twice to get it to stick and can use only 1 time
    before it vanishes, leaving you a few spells as good as spitting on a
    monster and then, alas, you're back to 1.

    Not sure how anyone can find a bit of pleasure in this mess.

    Thanks for the help, though .... I did try, but life's tooooooo short
    for the intense bullshit of this game. All dressed up, but nothing to
    play.

    Velvet Elvis
  11. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    VelvetElvis <reallyNO@spam4me.xyz> wrote:
    > Went to try the start of a game and same thing. Five people creamed by
    > a bear and a couple of idgets.

    That bear next to the giant in the mumble meadows is actually quite
    difficult for a first-level party.

    Here's some metagame information that you should consider.

    Mages and sorcerers are much weaker in ToEE than they are in
    pencil-and-paper D&D because ToEE is continuous combat without the
    possibility of creative thinking (e.g., using spells like alter self or
    levitation or whatnot to change the odds). As you've noticed, your fighter
    can swing forever while your wizard is limited to a few spells per day. The
    nature of the CRPG format makes most spellcasters weak.

    Solution: don't play with wizards. You can get away without any in this
    game. Have one if you must. Have a priest or two instead. They can actually
    fight. If you must have a wizard or sorcerer (and you probably want the
    sorcerer), be an Elf or take Martial Weapon: Bow or somesuch so that you
    can actually do something useful in combat.

    ToEE doesn't implement D&D reach weapons (and, arguably, moving through
    threatened areas) "by the book", with the result that longspears (and
    whatnot) are strongly overpowered. You can attack people far away *and*
    people right next to you. The "munchkin" fighter build in ToEE involves a
    fighter with max STR and DEX plus Combat Reflexes. Work your way up to
    Cleave. Basically, all of the enemies will die walking towards or around
    you. Give every fighter in your party a polearm in the early game if you
    possibly can. The yellow "threat circle" around you fighter will get bigger
    when you've done this correctly. You'll find a fight or two in the
    gatehouse where it's not unreasonable to kill a dozen opponents in one
    round with six party members (e.g., because in ToEE you can cleave off of
    every attack of opporunity that downs a foe -- this is the best way of
    getting multiple attacks per round before sixth level).

    The strongest party build (up to the first half of the Temple, say) would
    involve five warriors with polearms (as above) and one guy with dodge and
    expertise (on max) and a big shield and the elven chainmail out front to
    give the enemies somthing to swing at uselessly. With such a build you
    should easily be able to clear the moathouse and the bandit town and
    the swamp and the meadows and the first level of the temple without
    reloading. Take some levels in Barbarian or whatnot so that you don't lose
    your DEX bonus to AC. Low on the roleplaying, but if you wanted that you'd
    be playing BG2 or PST. You don't actually need a rogue.

    The other really big hint is the "charge" command. Loosely, this allows you
    to make an attack on someone that is more than half of your maximum
    movement away. It also gives you a bonus to hit. You should be able to win
    all early combats by having your defense guy walk/charge up to the enemies
    and then having the polearm guys charge the enemies. They'll end their
    charge a step or two behind the defense guy, so they'll never get attacked.
    Enemies that try to walk around the defense will get killed by attacks of
    opportunity from all of your polearm guys who threaten the entire area.
    Enemies that foolishly try to attack you with ranged weapons (e.g.,
    crossbows) because you aren't actually standing next to them will take
    attacks of opportunity from the longspears. Never walk if you can charge or
    five-foot step -- the bonus to hit from charging is key at low-levels.
    Also, don't turn on Power Attack. The way the numbers work out, early game
    opponents have low hit points but decent AC.

    > I obviously don't get the breakdown of the turn itself. I'll attack with
    > the warrior or shoot off a spell and end the turn. Not much reason to do
    > anything else except walk toward someone now and then.

    Don't bother with the mage. The only combat options you should really need
    to understand are "full attack", "charge", "five foot step", "turn
    undead" and "rapid shot".

    > Still, it's clunky for me and they're dead in a matter of seconds.

    ToEE is clunky for everyone.

    > Apparently I ain't the sharpest knife in the drawer and the design of
    > this game capitalizes on that fact. :(

    It's not just you.

    - Wes
  12. Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

    On Sun, 08 May 2005 16:48:24 GMT, VelvetElvis <reallyNO@SPAM4me.xyz>
    wrote:

    >
    >Well, I blew it off.

    You did the right thing. Even once you get the combat, and can make
    it through a battle or two, you still spend an arseload of time
    reloading savegames, and refighting battles. And there just doesn't
    seem to be any payoff in story.

    Troika made a perfect interpretation of 3 (.5?) edition rules. And a
    tedious game.

    I stopped playing after a werewolf came out of secret door for no
    discernible reason and mauled my party on the 2nd level of the temple.
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