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Dungeon Lords: First impressions

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Anonymous
May 10, 2005 12:38:50 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Having a blast with it so far. Performance wise it seems no better or worse
than the demo. Just having fun exploring the world as it should be seen rather
than using the tricks in the demo. But.......

Did they actually test this before they released it? I have noticed a few
problems already myself like missing features, no automap etc. but if you have
a look on the forums its almost like half the the features just don't work. As
much as I enjoy playing it I would have to say that for those that haven't
bought it yet, wait until they have released the patch this week and see what
they have fixed as at the moment its a bit of a mess. I'm a little worried
about playing too far and have the patch force me to play over. I have already
noticed one quest that doesn't disappear when you complete it. And also, when
changing classes a la W&W there are base requirements for you to
meet.....except you don't need to because that doesn't work either!! Still, I
am having fun with it so that's the important thing but just have to tread
carefully. And there was me weeks back saying how W&W was bug festival and
hoping that this would be different. <Shakes head>
May 10, 2005 7:39:27 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Memnoch <memnoch@nospampleaseimbritish.ntlworld.com> wrote:

>Having a blast with it so far. Performance wise it seems no better or worse
>than the demo. Just having fun exploring the world as it should be seen rather
>than using the tricks in the demo. But.......

Wait and see if DreamCatcher gets the game fixed or not. If you bought the
game you should call and chew on their butts. They have a reputation to
ruin.
Anonymous
May 10, 2005 3:07:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

.... there came a great James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> flying,
and he bore tidings beyond hope, crying:

>My questions is WHY did Dreamcatcher do this? If they knew it was in
>such a sad state, why release it? It was obvious from the demo the game
>needed at least another 2 months, why did they rush to release a game
>that could be good but is just another TOEE/POR2/<insert game here>

especially since it has been delayed more than once before!
--
"This is an extremely primitive and paranoid culture."
(James T. Kirk on 20th century America, Star Trek IV)
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Anonymous
May 10, 2005 11:52:45 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Tue, 10 May 2005 03:39:27 GMT, Susan <UCE@null.invalid> wrote:

>Memnoch <memnoch@nospampleaseimbritish.ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>>Having a blast with it so far. Performance wise it seems no better or worse
>>than the demo. Just having fun exploring the world as it should be seen rather
>>than using the tricks in the demo. But.......
>
>Wait and see if DreamCatcher gets the game fixed or not. If you bought the
>game you should call and chew on their butts. They have a reputation to
>ruin.

Read on the forums today that there might be some hope of getting a patch out
later on today. Doubt it but something needs to be done.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 12:01:10 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Tue, 10 May 2005 11:07:00 +0200, Cole Turner
<remove.cole.turner@liwest.at.spambotprotection> wrote:

>... there came a great James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> flying,
>and he bore tidings beyond hope, crying:
>
>>My questions is WHY did Dreamcatcher do this? If they knew it was in
>>such a sad state, why release it? It was obvious from the demo the game
>>needed at least another 2 months, why did they rush to release a game
>>that could be good but is just another TOEE/POR2/<insert game here>
>
>especially since it has been delayed more than once before!

Exactly. What they don't seem to realise, or perhaps care is this kind of
thing will drag a companies name through the mud. Let's just make sure we know
who to blame, and I very much doubt it is Heurstic Park. But a year or two
down the line when they are getting ready to announce another game people will
think "Hang on, didn't they release Dungeon Lords? You remember, the one that
had more bugs at release than a beta copy of Windows Longhorn.", and that
simply isn't fair. But Dreamcatcher will carry on regardless.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 12:01:11 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Memnoch wrote:
> On Tue, 10 May 2005 11:07:00 +0200, Cole Turner
> <remove.cole.turner@liwest.at.spambotprotection> wrote:
>
>
>>... there came a great James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> flying,
>>and he bore tidings beyond hope, crying:
>>
>>
>>>My questions is WHY did Dreamcatcher do this? If they knew it was in
>>>such a sad state, why release it? It was obvious from the demo the game
>>>needed at least another 2 months, why did they rush to release a game
>>>that could be good but is just another TOEE/POR2/<insert game here>
>>
>>especially since it has been delayed more than once before!
>
>
> Exactly. What they don't seem to realise, or perhaps care is this kind of
> thing will drag a companies name through the mud. Let's just make sure we know
> who to blame, and I very much doubt it is Heurstic Park. But a year or two
> down the line when they are getting ready to announce another game people will
> think "Hang on, didn't they release Dungeon Lords? You remember, the one that
> had more bugs at release than a beta copy of Windows Longhorn.", and that
> simply isn't fair. But Dreamcatcher will carry on regardless.

IMHO Dreamcatcher = Troika = Obsidian
May 11, 2005 3:39:47 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Memnoch <memnoch@nospampleaseimbritish.ntlworld.com> wrote:

>Exactly. What they don't seem to realize, or perhaps care is this kind of
>thing will drag a companies name through the mud. Let's just make sure we know
>who to blame, and I very much doubt it is Heurstic Park. But a year or two
>down the line when they are getting ready to announce another game people will
>think "Hang on, didn't they release Dungeon Lords? You remember, the one that
>had more bugs at release than a beta copy of Windows Longhorn.", and that
>simply isn't fair. But Dreamcatcher will carry on regardless.

Maybe people in this newsgroup think but that is the problem... People in
general _don't_ think. I'll bet DreamCatcher took a calculated risk and
has come up short now and wishes they hadn't. Next month they'll be other
games out and maybe this one's mistakes won't have any effect? And I blame
the developer wanting to get their money out of their effort as much as
DreamCatcher wanting to get the game on the shelves. It is a lousy
business that has screwed buyers so many many times.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 7:11:24 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> once tried to test me with:

> IMHO Dreamcatcher = Troika = Obsidian

Except that Troika and Obsidian are developers, and Dreamcatcher is a
publisher. The developer of DL is Heuristic Park, the people responsible
for Wizards & Warriors (another game released about 3 months too early).

I can't judge DL yet, I haven't played it (soon, soon) but I have to say
these reports were not unexpected.


--

Knight37 - http://knightgames.blogspot.com

Once a Gamer, Always a Gamer.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 7:13:23 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Memnoch <memnoch@nospampleaseimbritish.ntlworld.com> once tried to test
me with:

> Money. Pure and simple. The line we were sold was the demo was early
> but things would be alright come release. In fact they aren't and if
> you don't do anything mad there are no show stoppers, at least that I
> have come across so far. I think the biggest insult is that they have
> tried to clarify a point about the missing auto map feature saying
> that they never said it would be included. This is an UTTER lie. They
> said that it would be included when the demo was released. If you look
> in the install folder there is a folder called maps. In there there is
> an overhead map of Fargrove and there are also some screenshots
> floating around the 'Net showing the map in use. It was probably
> pulled before release due to time constraints but the fact they have
> back peddled on this is nothing short of insulting. Their current line
> is that it will be released in a patch but I very much doubt if it
> will be in this first one. If anyone is curious about what bugs there
> are before they buy, head on over to the forums. It truly is mind
> boggling, and I would have paid good money to sit in on their QA
> testing sessions.

The press build demo had an automap, but it only worked in town.

--

Knight37 - http://knightgames.blogspot.com

Once a Gamer, Always a Gamer.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 7:13:24 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 11 May 2005 03:13:23 GMT, Knight37 <knight37m@email.com> wrote:

>The press build demo had an automap, but it only worked in town.

The \maps folder only has a town map as well. Perhaps that was all that
was intended?

--
Michael Cecil
http://home.comcast.net/~macecil/
http://home.comcast.net/~safehex/
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 11:16:42 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 11 May 2005 03:11:24 GMT, Knight37 <knight37m@email.com> wrote:

>James Garvin <jgarvin2004@comcast.net> once tried to test me with:
>
>> IMHO Dreamcatcher = Troika = Obsidian
>
>Except that Troika and Obsidian are developers, and Dreamcatcher is a
>publisher. The developer of DL is Heuristic Park, the people responsible
>for Wizards & Warriors (another game released about 3 months too early).

Which also had the sell items bug. Makes you wonder doesn't it: did the same
programmers make the same mistakes or did they reuse chunks of code from W&W
without testing?

>I can't judge DL yet, I haven't played it (soon, soon) but I have to say
>these reports were not unexpected.

But highly disappointing.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 11:17:56 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On 11 May 2005 03:13:23 GMT, Knight37 <knight37m@email.com> wrote:

>Memnoch <memnoch@nospampleaseimbritish.ntlworld.com> once tried to test
>me with:
>
>> Money. Pure and simple. The line we were sold was the demo was early
>> but things would be alright come release. In fact they aren't and if
>> you don't do anything mad there are no show stoppers, at least that I
>> have come across so far. I think the biggest insult is that they have
>> tried to clarify a point about the missing auto map feature saying
>> that they never said it would be included. This is an UTTER lie. They
>> said that it would be included when the demo was released. If you look
>> in the install folder there is a folder called maps. In there there is
>> an overhead map of Fargrove and there are also some screenshots
>> floating around the 'Net showing the map in use. It was probably
>> pulled before release due to time constraints but the fact they have
>> back peddled on this is nothing short of insulting. Their current line
>> is that it will be released in a patch but I very much doubt if it
>> will be in this first one. If anyone is curious about what bugs there
>> are before they buy, head on over to the forums. It truly is mind
>> boggling, and I would have paid good money to sit in on their QA
>> testing sessions.
>
>The press build demo had an automap, but it only worked in town.

Yes, and that same map is still in the game if you look for it. I think this
is going to be a little way off to be honest. How are they going to map the
wilderness? Can the engine even generate an overhead view of your current area
in realtime?
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 11:18:28 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

On Tue, 10 May 2005 22:29:20 -0500, Michael Cecil <macecil@comcast.net> wrote:

>On 11 May 2005 03:13:23 GMT, Knight37 <knight37m@email.com> wrote:
>
>>The press build demo had an automap, but it only worked in town.
>
>The \maps folder only has a town map as well. Perhaps that was all that
>was intended?

I hope not. Its for the wilderness that it would be handy. At least we have a
compass now.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 3:30:33 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Knight37:

k37> The developer of DL is Heuristic Park, the people
k37> responsible for Wizards & Warriors (another game released about 3
k37> months too early).

Interesting. It is starting to look as if no great injustice is done by
blaming the developer then. I know it's customary to think of publishers as
"the suites" who force the poor code slaves to dump unfinished products on
an unsuspecting public, all in the name of Mammon. But it's conceivable
that a publisher gets stuck with a bunch of Cleves and voila, we've got
deja Outpost all over again.

k37> I can't judge DL yet, I haven't played it (soon, soon) but I have
k37> to say these reports were not unexpected.

I'm not in a rush. These guys were lucky that there is a single-player RPG
drought right now. Maybe that suggested to the publisher to get it out
at this time, cutting their losses.

k37> Once a Gamer, Always a Gamer.

Regards, Hartmut "don't my wife know it" Schmider
--
Hartmut Schmider, Queen's University

We are capable of sacrificing ourselves for sentiment.
Sentimentality exacts the sacrifice of others.
Yoritomo-Tashi
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 7:44:53 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Hartmut Schmider <hs7@post.queensu.ca> once tried to test me with:

> I'm not in a rush. These guys were lucky that there is a single-player
> RPG drought right now. Maybe that suggested to the publisher to get it
> out at this time, cutting their losses.

I should be getting the game soonish for review. Eventually the review will
go up on Game Chronicles.

--

Knight37 - http://knightgames.blogspot.com

Once a Gamer, Always a Gamer.
May 12, 2005 12:48:21 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"Knight37" <knight37m@email.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9653E767C6B91knight37m@130.133.1.4...
> Hartmut Schmider <hs7@post.queensu.ca> once tried to test me with:
>
>> I'm not in a rush. These guys were lucky that there is a single-player
>> RPG drought right now. Maybe that suggested to the publisher to get it
>> out at this time, cutting their losses.
>
> I should be getting the game soonish for review. Eventually the review
> will
> go up on Game Chronicles.
>

Would your review be different one way or the other if you actually had to
pay your own $$$ for it? My apo-olo-gies if you did pay, but still...

I wanted this game to be good. Good thing I was out of town when it came
out, hence I got to read the rave reviews from the beta testers before
buying it...

-eric



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Anonymous
May 12, 2005 12:53:02 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Knight37:

k37> I should be getting the game soonish for review. Eventually the
k37> review will go up on Game Chronicles.

I'll be checking it out. By that time the dust will have settled and I can
decide if it's worth buying or not. My guess is it's not.

Regards, Hartmut "cheap" Schmider

--
Hartmut Schmider, Queen's University

We are capable of sacrificing ourselves for sentiment.
Sentimentality exacts the sacrifice of others.
Yoritomo-Tashi
Anonymous
May 17, 2005 6:48:33 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

"eric" <ecantrel@msn.com> once tried to test me with:

> Would your review be different one way or the other if you actually
> had to pay your own $$$ for it? My apo-olo-gies if you did pay, but
> still...

You actually expect a response to this? My apo-olo-gies if you did.

--

Knight37 - http://knightgames.blogspot.com

Once a Gamer, Always a Gamer.
Anonymous
May 17, 2005 6:50:31 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg (More info?)

Hartmut Schmider <hs7@post.queensu.ca> once tried to test me with:

> I'll be checking it out. By that time the dust will have settled and I
> can decide if it's worth buying or not. My guess is it's not.

Well I got the game. Game doesn't seem extremely polished but it still has
that "just 5 more minutes" addictiveness that the press demo had. So far I
haven't encountered anything game-killer, but I've only put in an hour or
two. I tried getting in on multiplayer, that would be awesome with 8 people
going co-op through the dungeons but I didn't manage to get into a game
yet, lobby is kind of empty ish.

--

Knight37 - http://knightgames.blogspot.com

Once a Gamer, Always a Gamer.
!