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adding extra sends to a console?

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Anonymous
January 21, 2005 9:04:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi all
I have been using a 70's Chilton console (24-8) which I love, but it
only has 4 sends. What might be the best way of adding sends? I have
thought of getting a couple of rack mixers and going direct out of the
chilton into these and using the sends on those, but can't think of any
that might be suitable as most only have 1 or 2 sends and are probably
not great quality, or should I get the chilton modified and is this a
big job?
Cheers
David
Anonymous
January 21, 2005 12:13:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"davidmorley@gmx.net" <buchla300@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1106316253.330634.195120@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
> Hi all
> I have been using a 70's Chilton console (24-8) which I love, but it
> only has 4 sends. What might be the best way of adding sends? I have
> thought of getting a couple of rack mixers and going direct out of the
> chilton into these and using the sends on those, but can't think of
> any that might be suitable as most only have 1 or 2 sends and are
> probably not great quality, or should I get the chilton modified and
> is this a big job?

Your rack mixer idea seems to have more romance than the mods.

The next logical step would be to simply slave a second console and get even
more sends.

The final step shows the Chilton out of the loop and you using a new
console. ;-)
Anonymous
January 21, 2005 8:02:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Arny Krueger" <arnyk@hotpop.com> wrote in message
news:D KOdnRRUrLKQk2zcRVn-qg@comcast.com...
> "davidmorley@gmx.net" <buchla300@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1106316253.330634.195120@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
> > Hi all
> > I have been using a 70's Chilton console (24-8) which I love, but it
> > only has 4 sends. What might be the best way of adding sends? I have
> > thought of getting a couple of rack mixers and going direct out of the
> > chilton into these and using the sends on those, but can't think of
> > any that might be suitable as most only have 1 or 2 sends and are
> > probably not great quality, or should I get the chilton modified and
> > is this a big job?
>
> Your rack mixer idea seems to have more romance than the mods.
>
> The next logical step would be to simply slave a second console and get
even
> more sends.
>
> The final step shows the Chilton out of the loop and you using a new
> console. ;-)

.... which makes sense because even if you find the solution for additional
aux sends, chances are you'll soon hit the limit with something else. If you
already need more than four auxes you'll soon need more than 24 inputs. For
effect returns, if nothing.

It's a familiar issue to me, especially now that I sold my large console and
reverted back again to my beloved late 70's Soundcraft Series Two (24/8, 4
auxes). I've been solving the problem by restraining myself from using too
many effects. It spares me from spending money on effect units and it makes
me work harder on my mixes too. However, that's hardly a novel approach.

That said, the only suitable device that I know of would be MTA (Malcolm
Toft) Intermix series ix-five. It's a 19" 3HU unit with 16 channels, a total
of 8 aux sends per channel (mono/stereo, pre/post) complete with mixing
amplifiers (master aux busses) . It was designed as a part of their modular
mixing system, but could also be used as an expansion for aux send-deficient
consoles. I believe it's discontinued now, but it wouldn't hurt to contact
Malcolm Toft. He's a nice and very approachable person.

Other than that, any cheap mixer with enough channels and aux sends (yes,
Behringer) could be connected to your console's insert sends. With some
clever wiring you don't even have to sacrifice the inserts.

Predrag
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Anonymous
January 21, 2005 8:31:59 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"davidmorley@gmx.net" <buchla300@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1106316253.330634.195120@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> I have been using a 70's Chilton console (24-8) which I love, but it
> only has 4 sends. What might be the best way of adding sends? I have
> thought of getting a couple of rack mixers and going direct out of the
> chilton into these and using the sends on those, but can't think of any
> that might be suitable as most only have 1 or 2 sends and are probably
> not great quality, or should I get the chilton modified and is this a
> big job?

It depends how you are using the desk but...
If you have group outputs you can derive something a tiny bit like an aux
send from them that might be suitable in some circumstances. I've done it
for live stuff when the desk hasn't enough auxes.

Typical method would be:
Say you have an effect you only want to use on main vocal.
Route main vocal to main mix as normal, also route it to group 1. Route
nothing else to group 1. Ensure group 1 does not route to main mix. Use
output of group 1 as a send to your effect. You can use the group 1 fader as
a input level control.
Voila, an extra aux! (Well sort of)

Hope this is of help to someone at least.

Peter
Anonymous
January 22, 2005 4:53:10 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1106316253.330634.195120@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com> davidmorley@gmx.net writes:

> I have been using a 70's Chilton console (24-8) which I love, but it
> only has 4 sends. What might be the best way of adding sends?

Does the console have direct outputs? If you only need to send one
channel to an effect, why use a mixer to mix one channel? But if you
need to mix several channels to an effect or a feed like a headphone
mix, then you'll need a mixer. And you'll also need direct outputs to
mix.

Shure has a mixer that they developed out of the need for more
headphone mixes for in-ear monitoring. It doesn't have a lot of
inputs, 6 or 8 max, but a bunch of outputs. It's intended to be fed
from subgroup or matrix outputs of a console, and it might work for
your purpose. There was also a gadget from a dozen or so years back
that was intended exactly for your application, but it only stuck
around for a couple of years, probably because at that time everyone
who needed more sends probably also wanted a better console and
replaced what they had.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
January 22, 2005 3:08:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Thanks all!
The point about running out of channels is true, but I am actually
trying limit myself as I like keeping it simple. I have a Tactile
Technologies M4000 which has 48 inputs and an MCI JH600 but both need
servicing, but am just happy mixing with 24 channels of the chilton as
it sounds great (ps: it has has 4 fx returns and 16 tape monitors). The
desk has direct outs, so maybe the toft sollution is attractive....
The shure thing I think I saw, but it's pricey....
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 12:52:27 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"davidmorley" <buchla300@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1106424524.278787.132110@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Thanks all!
> The point about running out of channels is true, but I am actually
> trying limit myself as I like keeping it simple. I have a Tactile
> Technologies M4000 which has 48 inputs and an MCI JH600 but both need
> servicing, but am just happy mixing with 24 channels of the chilton as
> it sounds great (ps: it has has 4 fx returns and 16 tape monitors). The
> desk has direct outs, so maybe the toft sollution is attractive....
> The shure thing I think I saw, but it's pricey....


The MTA Intermix Series components weren't exactly cheap either, but if you
can find an ex-demo or second-hand ix-five...

Still, the cheapest solution is probably going to be a second-hand Behringer
Eurodesk MX2442. There are a lot of them floating around for little money.

You don't mind being called a console collector, do you?

Predrag
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 3:40:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

>I have a Tactile
>Technologies M4000 which has 48 inputs

I remember seeing those at the '93 (I think) AES show in NYC. Kind of like a
small Euphonix, no? How do you like it (when it's working properly)?


Joe Egan
EMP
Colchester, VT
www.eganmedia.com
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 7:37:07 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

The Tactile is cool. Very clean, but has a few things I would have
improved like 3 band EQ, 6 sends on 4 knobs etc, but overall for the
money they are these days, I think it's great. I like it for mixing.
Full auto on an analogue desk is still where it's at if you ask me!
As for being a console collector.....I guess so! The prices they are
these days means it's cheaper to buy a new console than a channel
strip...
!