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CTH   02-23-2003 at 06:46:56 AM

Has anyone heard of Fluid dynamic bearing being used in cooling fans yet?
Surely someones had the idea.

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svol   02-23-2003 at 12:56:31 PM
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In HDs yes... but I've never seen a fan with it. I think it will be pretty expensive too.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dimms when I turn it on :eek:

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lhgpoobaa   02-24-2003 at 04:42:00 AM
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heh. a nice idea, but waay to expensive for a simple fan.

probably the closest thing you could get to one is the panaflo fans that use a patented self lubricating slieve bearing. They are certainly quieter than ball bearing ones.


<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

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upec   02-24-2003 at 06:31:35 AM
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I have good experience with Panaflo fans. They are very quiet.

Reply to upec
lhgpoobaa   02-24-2003 at 06:54:11 AM
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Question: which panaflo's have you tried.
ive just got the 2000rpm 80mm ones and a 1700rpm 120mm one.
have you tried the faster spinning ones? im curious as to if they have any bearing noise.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-24-2003 at 10:06:05 PM
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actually I've got a little question to do with that too - I'm lookin to replacin my fans for either some panaflo or some Papst, but not too sure which way to go, since i've heard great about both... poobaa, you ever put 'em side by side ? also, i can put my hands on some fans manufactured by a company called "verax", which is located in germany (see: <A HREF="http://www.pcsilent.de/en/products/verax.asp" target="_new">http://www.pcsilent.de/en/products/verax.asp</A> and <A HREF="http://www.verax.de/produkte/FS_prod.html" target="_new">http://www.verax.de/produkte/FS_prod.html</A> <- though this one is in German only, you can kind-off weed out the info you need to know, heh, like db levels and cfm). Any opinions on those ?

Actually just found their product catalogue here: <A HREF="http://www.veraxfans.com/English Product-catalog online.pdf" target="_new">http://www.veraxfans.com/English Product-catalog online.pdf</A><P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1><EM>Edited by error_911 on 02/24/03 04:07 PM.</EM></FONT></P>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-25-2003 at 12:21:29 AM
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Both are good yes, and i have both panflo and pabst fans... but unfortunately they arnt of the same speed. my panaflo's are the quiet 2000rpm model, and the pabst was a 3600rpm model i got a long time ago.

sometime in the future i intend to get a low speed panaflo and sunon for comparitive purposes too.

Speaking VERY generally panaflo's come out on top due to their lack of ball bearings. All the ball bearing fans ive had experience the ball bearing buzz... though as the hub of the pabst 3600rpm is balanced i would expect it to be less noisy than equivalent non-balanced ball bearing fans.
NOTE: pabst also make a super slow sub 1500rpm fan too, but IMHO it doesnt move enough air to be considered worthy. especially as the 2000rpm panaflo's are virtually silent and move a whole lot more.


<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
lhgpoobaa   02-25-2003 at 12:28:36 AM
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i like the idea of the verax fan... though ideally the airoutflow should point inwards, removing the traditional central deadzone.

So i would imagine their claims for lower noise to be true, however airlow would be less too.
Besides, turbulance and air/blade noise is only one part of the equation. the other significant part is the fan bearings. If its a standard ball bearing fan then you will still get the buzz.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-25-2003 at 06:25:44 AM
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hmmm, true, true, didn't think about that on the whim. besides, you've gotta be nuts to buy those Verax fans... I know that I have a wholesale connection in the US for 'em and they STILL cost me $45 a piece... but if you're actually saying that the Panaflo 2000rpm is a good buy, maybe I'll take your advice on that... do they sound nice and quiet when you slow'em down too (i've got a rheobus) ? besides, Panaflo = 1/2 $ of Pabst ... Anyways, I'll be gettin mine soon enough and I'll post my opinions on 'em soon enough ;)

<b>Remember, being two-faced is like having two lives with just one set of taxes.</b>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-25-2003 at 06:39:09 AM
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good god! you want quieter than next to silent?
get a 2000rpm panaflo and just listen to it... they are damn near as close to silent as you can get!

and make sure to order the 3 pin or 4 pin connector as well.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-25-2003 at 07:12:28 AM
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why not !? ehehehehehe - basically, its not the ONE fan that I'm worried about, its the fact that once there are 4 or 5 or 6 in there that it all gets progressively louder, so yeah, i would be putting it on the rheobus. the way i'm thinkin about it right now is that i'm spending money on new fans anyways, so i might as well go for the best/quietest...

<b>Remember, being two-faced is like having two lives with just one set of taxes.</b>

Reply to error_911
Crashman   02-25-2003 at 11:03:42 PM
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I once had a case with a bunch of panaflows. You couldn't hear them over the noise of the hard drives, but when I closed my case, that "giant sucking sound" wasn't American jobs lost to Mexico following NAFTA, it was the air getting sucked through the front of the case! LOL, I had to leave the case OPEN to make the thing quiet!

<font color=blue>Watts mean squat if you don't have quality!</font color=blue>

Reply to Crashman
error_911   02-26-2003 at 12:17:58 AM
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But you know what - you get that sucking sound from all the other case fans too ;) ... And besides, that sucking sound is from the Canadian economy heading down to the U.S. BECAUSE OF the empty space caused by the Mexico job market and NAFTA, hehehehe.

<b>Remember, being two-faced is like having two lives with just one set of taxes.</b>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-26-2003 at 01:05:38 AM
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Yeah... all you get from panaflo's is the sucking sound.

Unfortunately thats not all the noise one gets from one's girlfried :lol:

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-26-2003 at 01:43:25 AM
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unless she really likes vaccuming ;) LOL!!

<b>Remember, being two-faced is like having two lives with just one set of taxes.</b>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-26-2003 at 01:57:32 AM
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Dunno... must ask her.

on an associated fan noise related topic, i just read a nice and easy mod to slow your fans down doing the 12v-5v trick to get 7v.

What you have is the 4 pin fan connector, usually with only two wires and it plugs into a molec connector.
one goes to the yellow 12v line, and the other goes to the black line next to it.

All one ahs to do is use some pliers and move the black line from the second hole to the 4th so it connects with the 5v line.

Thus the fan see's 5v as neutral and 12v - 5v = 7v... and a slower fan.
I have sone annoying 50mm fans for my geforce2pro that i think ill mod this way.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-26-2003 at 03:44:42 AM
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hey, thats a pretty cool trick - think i'm gonna try that for the time being on my Tornados

<b>Remember, being two-faced is like having two lives with just one set of taxes.</b>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-26-2003 at 03:52:47 AM
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You can go one step further too!
leave the ground wire colnnected to the ground, and connect the 12v to the 5v.. dontknow how many fans run on 5v though...

if u want to see the actual site, go here:
<A HREF="http://www.viperlair.com/articles/howto/7vmod.shtml" target="_new">http://www.viperlair.com/articles/howto/7vmod.shtml</A>

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-26-2003 at 07:49:11 AM
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actually dude, most fans start at 5V, so you might be surprised, but thanks for the link.

<b>"Feminism is the radical notion that women are people"<b>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-26-2003 at 08:24:16 AM
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hehe... im lookin at my 50mm fan right now... it has a passthru connector, so it should make the wiring up even easier. just cut and splice.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
error_911   02-26-2003 at 08:52:42 AM
- 0 +

thats the spirit ! be a good poobaa a try out the mod for us all ! hehehehe

<b>"Feminism is the radical notion that women are people"<b>

Reply to error_911
lhgpoobaa   02-26-2003 at 11:02:13 AM
- 0 +

done. just rearranged the molex pins... didnt even need to rewire.

And yes, it works GREAT. turned my buzzy 50mm fan into a nice docile and QUIET fan.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
svol   02-27-2003 at 06:20:52 PM
- 0 +

I've done that tons of times... works great!

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on :eek:

Reply to svol
svol   02-27-2003 at 06:21:40 PM
- 0 +

Well the cause of that sucking noice could be to tight openings in front of the fan so the air gets in difficult.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on :eek:

Reply to svol
svol   02-27-2003 at 06:23:29 PM
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Oh and if the 12-5V trick results in a to low airflow but 12V makes to much noice you can connect the black wire to the 3.3V line. That is pretty simple if you have a P4 approved PSU with aux cable (orange=3.3V).

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on :eek:

Reply to svol
lhgpoobaa   02-28-2003 at 02:02:12 AM
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somoene on OCAU forum said that this mod can be dangerous if your fan shorts out, sending 12v thrut he 5v line... but i imagine tat would be no worse than 12v surging thru a ground line!

well it works for me. so im a happy camper.

<i>"Revenues were less than robust"</i> - QWEST
<i>"The company applied its accounting policies incorrectly"</i> - WORLDCOM
<i>"Certian financial adjustments may be required"</i> - AOL+TW.

Reply to lhgpoobaa
svol   03-02-2003 at 01:27:15 PM
- 0 +

Well it is a little more dangerous because it can destroy both the 12V as 5V line. But a shorting fan will always be dangerous.

And I think decent qualiity PSUs have a overload protection.

My dual-PSU PC is so powerfull that the neighbourhood dims when I turn it on :eek:

Reply to svol
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