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The Role of the New Producer/Engineer?

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Anonymous
February 12, 2005 6:28:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

The Role of The New Prod/Eng


Studio technology has developed drastically over the years and has
become ever more vital to the record prod/eng within the music
industry. Different prod/eng's make use of studio technology in
different ways, often depending on the style of music that they are
producing, their preferred method of recording and production and the
artist's preference of sound.

The development of recording technology has run parallel to a
reorientation in popular music production. The goal of getting a good
sound is no different now than it was when the first recordings were
made, but the idea of what a good sound is and how it should be
achieved are radically different. Fifty years ago a band was set up in
a studio with just a couple of mics and recorded to one channel and
then the singer would overdub their vocal to one track and "Bingo"
your production was finished, usually in a couple of hours. There were
three distinct roles, a producer, engineer and the artist. The Beatles
debut record was recorded and mixed in one day. Today the same process
may take months and hundreds of tracks to complete.

The role of the recording producer/engineer and artist has changed
dramatically especially in the early part of the process of making a
record. The distinctions between the 3 different roles in popular music
are still very important; but the lines are much more obscure now. Lack
of skill is the biggest problem in today's music production,
engineering and mixing. So many music industry schools are turning out
graduates that are simply dreadful. Some people simply buy cheap
DAW's and call themselves music prod/eng's. These unfortunates have
no idea how to record music that doesn't come out of a box.
Unfortunately they have never had the opportunity to watch a master at
work . Opportunities to watch a master at work are ceasing these days
for they are retired or simply 6 feet under. In Toronto there were over
40 great producers and engineers 20 years ago. Now there might be 3-5.
The new prod/eng's are far and few in between. The winners of the
last ten years of Juno and Grammy Awards for producing and engineering
were mostly done by people in their 40's and 50's now. I believe if
"The Torch" is to be passed to anyone under 30, that person will
possess a good idea on how to record music outside of the box. Not only
that, they will have learned the skills of excellent mixing. Today,
mixing is becoming a lost art form with not much hope on the horizon.
At the turn of this millennia the demands placed on music required
that that artist's become good producers who had to become good
engineers. With today's sampling and midi-technology it is easy to
fulfill at least 2 of these 3 roles. One is the artist/producer and the
other is the engineer/producer. In some circumstances a few have been
able to excel at all 3 disciplines. It is expected that producers be
able to know how to utilize sound processing and recording techniques.
The engineer has to have a good sense of pitch, harmonic balance and
rhythm and to be able to edit between takes dictated by a lead sheet.
The prod/eng plays a very big part in the realization of a composition
by deciding what technology should be used and how to use it. Interplay
between the artists is critical to the recording process. However, what
is eventually fixed to audio storage must first be composed around the
limitations of the available technology and how to maximize its
efficiency. Thus the most direct interactions between music and
technology occur during composition and production.

There are a number of artists, record producers and engineers who have
become famous for their distinctive sound and their particular
techniques and application of varied developments of studio technology.
Some producers take much advantage of the technology available to them,
whilst others seem to prefer to employ more classical techniques of
record production, tending to shy away from the increasing practice of
digital studio technology.

Some prod/eng desire to generate their own distinctive sound. Some
focus on capturing the soul and spirit of the music that they prod/eng.
They do this by resisting the use of digital technology on certain
instruments and processors and continuing use analogue, stating that
the digital realm is very trendy, too synthetic and not dimensional
sounding

Today's rock has a tendency to record everything dry, steering away
from the use of effects when recording. They would use quite a lot of
compression on vocals, guitars and drums so that the dynamics could be
harnessed and also to double track vocals and guitar's. They would
record the guitars in a very different way, with a great emphasis on
the use of synthetic distortion like guitar pedals that would create
over-drive and distortion along with an amp.

The major and independent record labels are giving way to a new
landscape of independent artists, many of who may never have seen the
interior of a conventional recording studio because of truncated
budgets.

Many prod/eng's use studio technology as an add-on to the
instruments, and this affects the way in which songs are written and
laid down. This way they can work in the studio where someone can bring
in a loop or a sample, and the band can jam for a couple of hours, find
one bar that's kind of cool, load it into samplers, jam on top of
that.... and then take that home, come back, jam on it some more,
record some more things, add and subtract. This kind of prod/eng is
like working on a song in process that can be best served in the studio
as long as it's not expensive or better yet a home studio. Once this
process is finished the prod/eng will have something to build on and
elevate to the next level. The band U2 has worked in a manner where
Edge will compose a riff around a programmed beat at home and then
bring it into the studio and play to the riff with the drummer and bass
player, with the goal of developing the riff into a song. Once this is
established, Bono will add lyrical and melodic ideas.

Today, systems like Pro-Tools and Logic are the primary tools and an
increasingly popular method of production and composition in early song
development. I myself will sketch a song out which will indicate
harmonic structure to be performed by musicians, with feel. I will play
this to the musicians just before the track is to be recorded to give
them an indication of what is needed, even though I am prepared to have
everything that was programmed replaced. In a lot of situations I have
often used some of the program in my final mix. E.G. Adding in the drum
loop in the breakdown of a song* Recording and sampling in some sounds
into the song. This technology plays a great part in the creative
process of compositions, which you can develop to create tracks and
utilize the randomness of the sounds that are produced.

Recording trends in today's music industry tend to lean towards the
use of digital studio technology. This has meant that many artists are
capable of producing their own material, and have resulted in the
growth of the home studio, especially since digital technology is much
more compact than the old analogue equipment. These days, some of the
best studios have consoles no bigger than a coffee table and home
studios often feature similar consoles. Digital mixers have changed the
way we work and are changing the way we view the traditional recording
studio. The role of analog will still be around for a while, for the
sound character and level of quality of digital is still very limited.
I predict that in the next ten years you will see a lot of analog
equipment for the recording, mixing and sound processing stages (EQ &
Comp/limit) and be limited to the higher end studios. (Analog consoles
like SSL's and Neve's). I call these the "A" list studios that
will also use Pro-Tools but will give you the option to record to
multi-track analogue. In the "B" studios they will be completely
digital but will give you a lot of analogue technology as outboard
gear. In the "C" or home studios it will all be completely digital.


Despite the continuing growth of the use of digital studio technology
by artists and their own production, the role of the record prod/eng
still remains vital in the context of both the creative and commercial
concerns of today's music industry, whether the prod/eng is
independent or are the artist themselves. The record prod/eng may be
thought of as the "Ring Leader" of the music production chain.
Prod/eng's have a lot of control over the entire recording project
including creative decision-making based on the experience and vision
of the prod/eng. The selection of songs used in a project as well as
the responsibility of the final product still belongs to the prod/eng.
A record prod/eng is able to give an independent view of an artist's
work and how it should sound. They are also more likely to know what
technologies are available and which would be best suited to the style
of the artist. Also, many prod/eng may have affiliations with a
particular record company, this relationship is vital in ensuring that
an artist can obtain a deal with the record company in question and the
prod/eng will be able to conceive what kind of sound the record label
is looking for.

In the creative context of the role of the prod/eng, the prod/eng
often aids the composition and development of an artist's work.
Sometimes the artist does very little work compared to the prod/eng and
there may be times when all the artist has to do is turn up and sing.
The prod/eng helps to decide the arrangement, how tracks should be laid
down and what instruments should be included in the production of the
song. Production is about coming up with, and organizing, all the ideas
that will comprise the finished record.

As stated earlier with the introduction of computer software such as
Pro Tools, Cubase and Logic, many artists are becoming their own
producers. Artists are able to produce music single-handedly through
these programs, using them to create multi-track recordings all through
a MIDI keyboard, as well as being able to record and arrange audio.
This allows artists to concentrate on the creative process, while the
computer does the rest of the work. However this process has its
limits. Getting the artist to recognize these limits is a role
prod/eng's have to learn and communicate to the artist with the goal
in mind that the production has the potential to get better.

These days, the widespread use of digital technology allows
prod/eng's to manipulate recorded sound in unprecedented ways.
Prod/eng's can also sample a perfect note or riff, and insert it into
the accompanying music as many times as necessary to create an
instrumental back up that's completely error-free. In "Lose My
Breath" by Destiny's Child the chorus line is sung only once but
used in an additional 40+ places in the song. Why should they sing it
over when you can just get them to perform the line once and copy and
paste it for the remainder of the song? It is also possible to achieve
the perfect pitches on vocals, meaning that anyone lacking all musical
talent could sing and be made to sound as though they have a perfectly
tuned voice. In Maroon 5's song "She will be loved", Auto-tune is
used quite extensively and to the point that the lead vocal sounds
robotic and unnatural*

The new record prod/eng should be able to work with studio technology
that will help a band or artist develop a particular style.
Prod/eng's know what kind of sounds are commercially viable, if that
is the direction that a band or artist wishes to take. Prod/eng's,
along with studio technology, play a significant role in the creative
and commercial process within the music industry, allowing bands and
artists to develop their individual sounds, as well as helping them to
produce a sound which will be appealing to their specific audience. The
development of studio technology has allowed prod/eng's to create
more unique sounds for the bands which they produce, separating them
from other bands. With the right ingredients, prod/eng's are able to
aid an artist or band toward commercial success.


Requirements of the New Prod/Eng:

1) Play a harmonic instrument
2) Can easily detect pitch and rhythm problems
3) Can record acoustic instruments
4) Program music software
5) Operate a DAW
6) Business skills
7) Excellent mixing skills
8) Understand human behavior
9) Be able to motivate self and others
10) Write and read a basic lead sheet

More about : role producer engineer

Anonymous
February 12, 2005 7:32:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

>>>I predict that in the next ten years you will see a lot of analog
>>>equipment for the recording, mixing and sound processing stages (EQ &
Comp/limit) and be limited to the higher end studios. >>>>

I am willing to bet by 2015 we will see no tape based studios at all and
digital may even sound good...

--
Steven Sena
XS Sound Recording
www.xssound.com

"kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:1108250915.227513.270300@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> The Role of The New Prod/Eng
>
>
> Studio technology has developed drastically over the years and has
> become ever more vital to the record prod/eng within the music
> industry. Different prod/eng's make use of studio technology in
> different ways, often depending on the style of music that they are
> producing, their preferred method of recording and production and the
> artist's preference of sound.
>
> The development of recording technology has run parallel to a
> reorientation in popular music production. The goal of getting a good
> sound is no different now than it was when the first recordings were
> made, but the idea of what a good sound is and how it should be
> achieved are radically different. Fifty years ago a band was set up in
> a studio with just a couple of mics and recorded to one channel and
> then the singer would overdub their vocal to one track and "Bingo"
> your production was finished, usually in a couple of hours. There were
> three distinct roles, a producer, engineer and the artist. The Beatles
> debut record was recorded and mixed in one day. Today the same process
> may take months and hundreds of tracks to complete.
>
> The role of the recording producer/engineer and artist has changed
> dramatically especially in the early part of the process of making a
> record. The distinctions between the 3 different roles in popular music
> are still very important; but the lines are much more obscure now. Lack
> of skill is the biggest problem in today's music production,
> engineering and mixing. So many music industry schools are turning out
> graduates that are simply dreadful. Some people simply buy cheap
> DAW's and call themselves music prod/eng's. These unfortunates have
> no idea how to record music that doesn't come out of a box.
> Unfortunately they have never had the opportunity to watch a master at
> work . Opportunities to watch a master at work are ceasing these days
> for they are retired or simply 6 feet under. In Toronto there were over
> 40 great producers and engineers 20 years ago. Now there might be 3-5.
> The new prod/eng's are far and few in between. The winners of the
> last ten years of Juno and Grammy Awards for producing and engineering
> were mostly done by people in their 40's and 50's now. I believe if
> "The Torch" is to be passed to anyone under 30, that person will
> possess a good idea on how to record music outside of the box. Not only
> that, they will have learned the skills of excellent mixing. Today,
> mixing is becoming a lost art form with not much hope on the horizon.
> At the turn of this millennia the demands placed on music required
> that that artist's become good producers who had to become good
> engineers. With today's sampling and midi-technology it is easy to
> fulfill at least 2 of these 3 roles. One is the artist/producer and the
> other is the engineer/producer. In some circumstances a few have been
> able to excel at all 3 disciplines. It is expected that producers be
> able to know how to utilize sound processing and recording techniques.
> The engineer has to have a good sense of pitch, harmonic balance and
> rhythm and to be able to edit between takes dictated by a lead sheet.
> The prod/eng plays a very big part in the realization of a composition
> by deciding what technology should be used and how to use it. Interplay
> between the artists is critical to the recording process. However, what
> is eventually fixed to audio storage must first be composed around the
> limitations of the available technology and how to maximize its
> efficiency. Thus the most direct interactions between music and
> technology occur during composition and production.
>
> There are a number of artists, record producers and engineers who have
> become famous for their distinctive sound and their particular
> techniques and application of varied developments of studio technology.
> Some producers take much advantage of the technology available to them,
> whilst others seem to prefer to employ more classical techniques of
> record production, tending to shy away from the increasing practice of
> digital studio technology.
>
> Some prod/eng desire to generate their own distinctive sound. Some
> focus on capturing the soul and spirit of the music that they prod/eng.
> They do this by resisting the use of digital technology on certain
> instruments and processors and continuing use analogue, stating that
> the digital realm is very trendy, too synthetic and not dimensional
> sounding
>
> Today's rock has a tendency to record everything dry, steering away
> from the use of effects when recording. They would use quite a lot of
> compression on vocals, guitars and drums so that the dynamics could be
> harnessed and also to double track vocals and guitar's. They would
> record the guitars in a very different way, with a great emphasis on
> the use of synthetic distortion like guitar pedals that would create
> over-drive and distortion along with an amp.
>
> The major and independent record labels are giving way to a new
> landscape of independent artists, many of who may never have seen the
> interior of a conventional recording studio because of truncated
> budgets.
>
> Many prod/eng's use studio technology as an add-on to the
> instruments, and this affects the way in which songs are written and
> laid down. This way they can work in the studio where someone can bring
> in a loop or a sample, and the band can jam for a couple of hours, find
> one bar that's kind of cool, load it into samplers, jam on top of
> that.... and then take that home, come back, jam on it some more,
> record some more things, add and subtract. This kind of prod/eng is
> like working on a song in process that can be best served in the studio
> as long as it's not expensive or better yet a home studio. Once this
> process is finished the prod/eng will have something to build on and
> elevate to the next level. The band U2 has worked in a manner where
> Edge will compose a riff around a programmed beat at home and then
> bring it into the studio and play to the riff with the drummer and bass
> player, with the goal of developing the riff into a song. Once this is
> established, Bono will add lyrical and melodic ideas.
>
> Today, systems like Pro-Tools and Logic are the primary tools and an
> increasingly popular method of production and composition in early song
> development. I myself will sketch a song out which will indicate
> harmonic structure to be performed by musicians, with feel. I will play
> this to the musicians just before the track is to be recorded to give
> them an indication of what is needed, even though I am prepared to have
> everything that was programmed replaced. In a lot of situations I have
> often used some of the program in my final mix. E.G. Adding in the drum
> loop in the breakdown of a song* Recording and sampling in some sounds
> into the song. This technology plays a great part in the creative
> process of compositions, which you can develop to create tracks and
> utilize the randomness of the sounds that are produced.
>
> Recording trends in today's music industry tend to lean towards the
> use of digital studio technology. This has meant that many artists are
> capable of producing their own material, and have resulted in the
> growth of the home studio, especially since digital technology is much
> more compact than the old analogue equipment. These days, some of the
> best studios have consoles no bigger than a coffee table and home
> studios often feature similar consoles. Digital mixers have changed the
> way we work and are changing the way we view the traditional recording
> studio. The role of analog will still be around for a while, for the
> sound character and level of quality of digital is still very limited.
> I predict that in the next ten years you will see a lot of analog
> equipment for the recording, mixing and sound processing stages (EQ &
> Comp/limit) and be limited to the higher end studios. (Analog consoles
> like SSL's and Neve's). I call these the "A" list studios that
> will also use Pro-Tools but will give you the option to record to
> multi-track analogue. In the "B" studios they will be completely
> digital but will give you a lot of analogue technology as outboard
> gear. In the "C" or home studios it will all be completely digital.
>
>
> Despite the continuing growth of the use of digital studio technology
> by artists and their own production, the role of the record prod/eng
> still remains vital in the context of both the creative and commercial
> concerns of today's music industry, whether the prod/eng is
> independent or are the artist themselves. The record prod/eng may be
> thought of as the "Ring Leader" of the music production chain.
> Prod/eng's have a lot of control over the entire recording project
> including creative decision-making based on the experience and vision
> of the prod/eng. The selection of songs used in a project as well as
> the responsibility of the final product still belongs to the prod/eng.
> A record prod/eng is able to give an independent view of an artist's
> work and how it should sound. They are also more likely to know what
> technologies are available and which would be best suited to the style
> of the artist. Also, many prod/eng may have affiliations with a
> particular record company, this relationship is vital in ensuring that
> an artist can obtain a deal with the record company in question and the
> prod/eng will be able to conceive what kind of sound the record label
> is looking for.
>
> In the creative context of the role of the prod/eng, the prod/eng
> often aids the composition and development of an artist's work.
> Sometimes the artist does very little work compared to the prod/eng and
> there may be times when all the artist has to do is turn up and sing.
> The prod/eng helps to decide the arrangement, how tracks should be laid
> down and what instruments should be included in the production of the
> song. Production is about coming up with, and organizing, all the ideas
> that will comprise the finished record.
>
> As stated earlier with the introduction of computer software such as
> Pro Tools, Cubase and Logic, many artists are becoming their own
> producers. Artists are able to produce music single-handedly through
> these programs, using them to create multi-track recordings all through
> a MIDI keyboard, as well as being able to record and arrange audio.
> This allows artists to concentrate on the creative process, while the
> computer does the rest of the work. However this process has its
> limits. Getting the artist to recognize these limits is a role
> prod/eng's have to learn and communicate to the artist with the goal
> in mind that the production has the potential to get better.
>
> These days, the widespread use of digital technology allows
> prod/eng's to manipulate recorded sound in unprecedented ways.
> Prod/eng's can also sample a perfect note or riff, and insert it into
> the accompanying music as many times as necessary to create an
> instrumental back up that's completely error-free. In "Lose My
> Breath" by Destiny's Child the chorus line is sung only once but
> used in an additional 40+ places in the song. Why should they sing it
> over when you can just get them to perform the line once and copy and
> paste it for the remainder of the song? It is also possible to achieve
> the perfect pitches on vocals, meaning that anyone lacking all musical
> talent could sing and be made to sound as though they have a perfectly
> tuned voice. In Maroon 5's song "She will be loved", Auto-tune is
> used quite extensively and to the point that the lead vocal sounds
> robotic and unnatural*
>
> The new record prod/eng should be able to work with studio technology
> that will help a band or artist develop a particular style.
> Prod/eng's know what kind of sounds are commercially viable, if that
> is the direction that a band or artist wishes to take. Prod/eng's,
> along with studio technology, play a significant role in the creative
> and commercial process within the music industry, allowing bands and
> artists to develop their individual sounds, as well as helping them to
> produce a sound which will be appealing to their specific audience. The
> development of studio technology has allowed prod/eng's to create
> more unique sounds for the bands which they produce, separating them
> from other bands. With the right ingredients, prod/eng's are able to
> aid an artist or band toward commercial success.
>
>
> Requirements of the New Prod/Eng:
>
> 1) Play a harmonic instrument
> 2) Can easily detect pitch and rhythm problems
> 3) Can record acoustic instruments
> 4) Program music software
> 5) Operate a DAW
> 6) Business skills
> 7) Excellent mixing skills
> 8) Understand human behavior
> 9) Be able to motivate self and others
> 10) Write and read a basic lead sheet
>
Anonymous
February 12, 2005 10:21:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

You are right on Steven
Quantagy just filed for banruptcy protection last week
kevin
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 12:31:05 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:1108264884.056488.289650@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> You are right on Steven
> Quantagy just filed for banruptcy protection last week
> kevin

Again? Once, back in January, wasn't enough?

John LeBlanc
Houston, TX
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 1:27:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1108264884.056488.289650@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> kevindoylemusic@rogers.com writes:

> Quantagy just filed for banruptcy protection last week

I think you're a little behind times. They have a list of bidders now,
and there's at least one new US company who expects to be making tape
by June, plus numerous rumors of new plants in Europe and Asia that
are probably false.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 2:17:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <znr1108299181k@trad>, Mike Rivers <mrivers@d-and-d.com> wrote:
>In article <1108264884.056488.289650@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> kevindoylemusic@rogers.com writes:
>
>> Quantagy just filed for banruptcy protection last week
>
>I think you're a little behind times. They have a list of bidders now,
>and there's at least one new US company who expects to be making tape
>by June, plus numerous rumors of new plants in Europe and Asia that
>are probably false.

The rumor of the plant in the Netherlands is true, as is the rumor of the
plant in Pennsylvania (although the latter has get to get any equipment yet).
The rumor of the plant in Australia is sadly false. Any other rumors I have
not heard yet. The only Asian manufacturer is JAI, which does indeed make
1/4" tape, but probably not well enough to make Fletcher happy.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 5:58:46 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

oops
kevn
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 5:59:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

I am actually a BASF guy
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 8:08:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <cunuj7$sfm$1@panix2.panix.com> kludge@panix.com writes:

> The rumor of the plant in the Netherlands is true

I read a press release about that on the Ampex list, followed by a
posting from a large tape distributor who called the plant and was
told that they knew nothing about that press release and didn't have
studio tape in the pipeline. So I wouldn't count on this any time
soon. But it's true that there's a tape plant over there.

> as is the rumor of the
> plant in Pennsylvania (although the latter has get to get any equipment yet).

I'd trust the information that we're getting in dribs and drabs
directly from Mike Spitz (the horse).


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 11:53:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message news:1108264884.056488.289650@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> You are right on Steven
> Quantagy just filed for banruptcy protection last week
> kevin



Old news... I think they will be bailed out by demand for their product.

Are you publishing parts of your audio class theses here Kevin?

DM
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 1:02:57 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

kevindoylemusic wrote:

> Quantagy

You're right on this stuff...

--
ha
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 1:02:58 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

hank alrich wrote:

> kevindoylemusic wrote:
>
>
>>Quantagy
>
>
> You're right on this stuff...


Someone who's writing a book on recording should have at least looked at
a box of tape to find out how to spell it.
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 1:28:40 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

S O'Neill wrote:

> hank alrich wrote:

> > kevindoylemusic wrote:

> >>Quantagy

> > You're right on this stuff...

> Someone who's writing a book on recording should have at least looked at
> a box of tape to find out how to spell it.

"Curad"

--
ha
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 2:02:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message news:1108335566.745828.218550@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...

> I am actually a BASF guy


They've been out of business for a couple of years. Bought by EMTEC
and eventually closed down last year. (IIRC)
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 7:44:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

David Morgan (MAMS) wrote:
> "kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:1108335566.745828.218550@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > I am actually a BASF guy
>
>
> They've been out of business for a couple of years. Bought by EMTEC
> and eventually closed down last year. (IIRC)

Anybody else notice the irony of this when the guy's article was about
how the
new breed don't know anything?
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 9:56:22 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1108335566.745828.218550@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> kevindoylemusic@rogers.com writes:

> I am actually a BASF guy

You record on cassettes? Or video? Or old tape stock?

--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 12:30:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <znr1108324119k@trad>, Mike Rivers <mrivers@d-and-d.com> wrote:
>In article <cunuj7$sfm$1@panix2.panix.com> kludge@panix.com writes:
>
>> The rumor of the plant in the Netherlands is true
>
>I read a press release about that on the Ampex list, followed by a
>posting from a large tape distributor who called the plant and was
>told that they knew nothing about that press release and didn't have
>studio tape in the pipeline. So I wouldn't count on this any time
>soon. But it's true that there's a tape plant over there.

Yes, and I talked to one of the managers there, who said that they were
basically having trouble getting base material, and that as soon as they
had a reliable source of good base material they'd be striping tape.

>> as is the rumor of the
>> plant in Pennsylvania (although the latter has get to get any equipment yet).
>
>I'd trust the information that we're getting in dribs and drabs
>directly from Mike Spitz (the horse).

Yes, I think if anybody can make a small production operation work, it's
going to be him. I am very much looking forward to seeing his product.
And, with the dollar so low that Colombian drug cartels are demanding
payment in Euros, I think he'll have no problem competing with the Europeans
on price.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 12:36:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

kevindoylemusic <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote:
>I am actually a BASF guy

Not any more.
Sadly.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 3:15:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <cuqcla$71e$1@panix2.panix.com> kludge@panix.com writes:

> >> The rumor of the plant in the Netherlands is true

> Yes, and I talked to one of the managers there, who said that they were
> basically having trouble getting base material, and that as soon as they
> had a reliable source of good base material they'd be striping tape.

As I recall, one of the issues with Quantegy was that they had only
one supplier of the base material left, and that supplier decided not
to make 1.5 mil material any longer (but apparently were still making
1 mil).


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
February 15, 2005 12:42:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Who cares? The writing is on the wall, but obviously not on 1.5 mil tape
anymore. I almost cried when I sent my 8 tract RTR off to it's new owner.
Now I'm glad I did send it off, but I wouldn't want to be in his shoes right
now. So I feel bad again.

Is there no end to the misery?

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio

"Mike Rivers" <mrivers@d-and-d.com> wrote in message
news:znr1108392982k@trad...
>
> In article <cuqcla$71e$1@panix2.panix.com> kludge@panix.com writes:
>
> > >> The rumor of the plant in the Netherlands is true
>
> > Yes, and I talked to one of the managers there, who said that they were
> > basically having trouble getting base material, and that as soon as they
> > had a reliable source of good base material they'd be striping tape.
>
> As I recall, one of the issues with Quantegy was that they had only
> one supplier of the base material left, and that supplier decided not
> to make 1.5 mil material any longer (but apparently were still making
> 1 mil).
>
>
> --
> I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
> However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
> lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
> you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
> and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
February 15, 2005 11:38:01 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Roger W. Norman <rnorman@starpower.net> wrote:
>Who cares? The writing is on the wall, but obviously not on 1.5 mil tape
>anymore. I almost cried when I sent my 8 tract RTR off to it's new owner.
>Now I'm glad I did send it off, but I wouldn't want to be in his shoes right
>now. So I feel bad again.
>
>Is there no end to the misery?

Nahh, stay tuned. I think we'll have something usable by the end of the
year. After all, JAI is still making 1.5 mil tape. It's not _good_ 1.5
mil tape, but clearly someone out there is making the base rolls.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
February 15, 2005 11:52:01 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <HtSdnYuf_IEV_IzfRVn-2A@rcn.net> rnorman@starpower.net writes:

> Who cares? The writing is on the wall, but obviously not on 1.5 mil tape
> anymore. I almost cried when I sent my 8 tract RTR off to it's new owner.
> Now I'm glad I did send it off, but I wouldn't want to be in his shoes right
> now. So I feel bad again.
>
> Is there no end to the misery?

Nope. And you're really going to feel miserable when you know you had
a project backed up on CD somewhere but you can't find that pesky
little disk, or one of a set of many. Or when you've ignored
refreshing your backups for too long and find that you no longer have
a working CD drive, or computer that will talk to an IDE hard drive.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
March 6, 2005 10:35:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:1108250915.227513.270300@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Requirements of the New Prod/Eng:
>
> 1) Play a harmonic instrument
> 2) Can easily detect pitch and rhythm problems
> 3) Can record acoustic instruments
> 4) Program music software
> 5) Operate a DAW
> 6) Business skills
> 7) Excellent mixing skills
> 8) Understand human behavior
> 9) Be able to motivate self and others
> 10) Write and read a basic lead sheet

Most of arguably the world's greatest recordings were produced and
engineered by people having almost none of those skills except for a good
healthy dose of #9. Of course they were recording performers who were highly
skilled in 1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10,

What's wrong with this picture?

--
Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery, Nashville TN
Mastering, Audio for Picture, Mix Evaluation and Quality Control
Over 40 years making people sound better than they ever imagined!
615.385.8051 http://www.hyperback.com
Anonymous
March 6, 2005 10:35:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Bob Olhsson <olh@hyperback.com> wrote:
>"kevindoylemusic" <kevindoylemusic@rogers.com> wrote in message
>> Requirements of the New Prod/Eng:
>>
>> 1) Play a harmonic instrument
>> 2) Can easily detect pitch and rhythm problems
>> 3) Can record acoustic instruments
>> 4) Program music software
>> 5) Operate a DAW
>> 6) Business skills
>> 7) Excellent mixing skills
>> 8) Understand human behavior
>> 9) Be able to motivate self and others
>> 10) Write and read a basic lead sheet
>
>Most of arguably the world's greatest recordings were produced and
>engineered by people having almost none of those skills except for a good
>healthy dose of #9. Of course they were recording performers who were highly
>skilled in 1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 8, 9 and 10,
>
>What's wrong with this picture?

What is wrong with the picture is that the current economics no longer allow
you to hire people skilled in 1 through 10. This puts a lot more pressure on
one.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
!