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Overhearing radio through monitors

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Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 9:54:00 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi All, greets to everyone and hope you all are well.
I just have one question/problem about my monitors, Behringer 2031a (
http://www.behringer.com/B2031A/index.cfm?lang=ENG ).

Somehow, when the monitors are powered on but no sound is going through
them, I can hear a very faint sound of something that sounds like a
radio station. It is definitely someone talking, but I can't confirm
that it's a radio station for 100 percent.

I guess I really don't care if it's a radio station or other
interference, but has anyone experienced this problem before? Do you
know anything I can do about this?

Thank you very much,

david
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 1:01:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1109170440.802573.170260@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
David M <davidsetagaya@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Hi All, greets to everyone and hope you all are well.
>I just have one question/problem about my monitors, Behringer 2031a (
>http://www.behringer.com/B2031A/index.cfm?lang=ENG ).
>
>Somehow, when the monitors are powered on but no sound is going through
>them, I can hear a very faint sound of something that sounds like a
>radio station. It is definitely someone talking, but I can't confirm
>that it's a radio station for 100 percent.
>
>I guess I really don't care if it's a radio station or other
>interference, but has anyone experienced this problem before? Do you
>know anything I can do about this?

Do you hear it with the input cables disconnected?

Shure makes some low-pass RF rejection gadgets in barrel connectors which
might be your first try, if it's coming in on the inputs.

Usually this is a sign of poor input circuit design, but it could be
something corroded or loose somewhere.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 2:46:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi Everyone, just an update because I originally wrote that message
when I was away from the studio.
Yes, the noise is the same whether or not there are inputs connected to
the speakers.
And the noise is the same from both speakers, as if they're picking up
the same signal.
Also, the 2031a's have mute switches on the back for each component
(woofer and tweeter? sorry don't know the english well). When I turn
ON the mute for the tweeter (hi frequency speaker of the monitor), the
noise gets significantly worse. When I turn on the mute for the
woofer, it gets a tiny bit better, but still not good.

thank you everyone for your help,
david in Chile
Related resources
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 4:18:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

I have the same problem with my Event TNR-8s. I was bitterly disappointed
when I moved my studio from one location to another, because in the first
location I didn't have a problem. Plus, they're great sounding monitors.

In my case, the radio signal is definitely coming through the AC (you can
hear two different radio stations - one in each monitor - before hooking
up any audio cables). I will certainly give the power conditioner a try.
It's nice to know that there is a reasonable fix, especially because I
love the sound of the monitors.

James
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 7:18:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Ah, David,
Did we sort out your 1/4" jacks and cable query last week?
Now, if all you have connected is the power amp, its mains cord, and l/s
cables to cabs, and you still get this interference, a poor solder joint in
the early amp stages can act as a radio demodulation diode! and pull in a
local station or a cab's mobile tx.
Short the inputs temporarily to determine if culprit is on-board or if
externally caused. Then we'll get the scenario better.
Jim
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 7:33:47 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

On 23 Feb 2005 06:54:00 -0800, "David M" <davidsetagaya@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>Hi All, greets to everyone and hope you all are well.
>I just have one question/problem about my monitors, Behringer 2031a (
>http://www.behringer.com/B2031A/index.cfm?lang=ENG ).
>
>Somehow, when the monitors are powered on but no sound is going through
>them, I can hear a very faint sound of something that sounds like a
>radio station. It is definitely someone talking, but I can't confirm
>that it's a radio station for 100 percent.
>
>I guess I really don't care if it's a radio station or other
>interference, but has anyone experienced this problem before? Do you
>know anything I can do about this?
>
>Thank you very much,
>
>david

This is a common problem in recording studios, especially if there are
nearby radio transmitters. Usually the radio signal is picked up by
studio wiring, which can act like a radio antenna if not well
shielded. The radio signal is conducted into some piece of equipment
(like your active monitors) where it is detected and converted to
audio ... which you hear.

So, follow Scott's advice and unplug the input cables to the monitors.
Does the radio signal go away?

If yes, then the radio signal is probably being picked up by your
audio wiring. There are several possible fixes, including the Shure RF
filters that Scott suggested.

Changing the input wiring may also help. The B2031A has a balanced
input. If you can connect it with a balanced cable to a balanced
output, and lift the shield at one end (only) of the cable, this might
help.

If the radio signal is still there with the input cables disconnected
from the monitors, then the signal is probably sneaking in on the AC
power line. Get a good power conditioner such as a Furman PL series or
Tripp-Lite Isobar; these include filters to remove radio-frequency
noise from the AC line. Beware of some of the cheap units. I have seen
a couple that claimed to have filters, but had no capacitors or
inductors in the box.

Good luck. It can take some work to cure these problems, but they are
curable ... unless you live next door to a large radio transmitter.

Mike T.
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 23, 2005 11:51:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi, this is a response mainly to Mike T.'s helpful comments above, and
thank you to everyone else who wrote in as well.
Since the audio signal seems to be sneaking through in the AC, I was
wondering if the problem could be arising because the speakers don't
seem to be getting much grounding (is this a valid term?)
What I mean is, the AC plug looks like it was designed for European
voltage, with two big circular prongs used to plug it in to the wall.
There is also a metal piece in the middle of these plugs, is this for
grounding it? In Chile we use three pronged plugs for grounded
connections, two pronged for just the current. The adapter I'm using
has only two prongs, so I assume there's no grounding going on from the
wall.....is this necessary for these powered monitors? will it help?
thanks guys,
david
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 24, 2005 10:08:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

David M wrote:
> Hi All, greets to everyone and hope you all are well.
> I just have one question/problem about my monitors, Behringer 2031a (
> http://www.behringer.com/B2031A/index.cfm?lang=ENG ).
>
> Somehow, when the monitors are powered on but no sound is going
through
> them, I can hear a very faint sound of something that sounds like a
> radio station. It is definitely someone talking, but I can't confirm
> that it's a radio station for 100 percent.
>
> I guess I really don't care if it's a radio station or other
> interference, but has anyone experienced this problem before? Do you
> know anything I can do about this?
>
> Thank you very much,
>
> david

Some folk will bamboozle you with technical guff to explain
your problem.In all probability your monitors are haunted and need
exorcizing.
For further info go to http://aaevp.com/

;-)

Steve Lane
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 24, 2005 12:26:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

David M <davidsetagaya@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Hi, this is a response mainly to Mike T.'s helpful comments above, and
>thank you to everyone else who wrote in as well.
>Since the audio signal seems to be sneaking through in the AC, I was
>wondering if the problem could be arising because the speakers don't
>seem to be getting much grounding (is this a valid term?)
>What I mean is, the AC plug looks like it was designed for European
>voltage, with two big circular prongs used to plug it in to the wall.
>There is also a metal piece in the middle of these plugs, is this for
>grounding it? In Chile we use three pronged plugs for grounded
>connections, two pronged for just the current. The adapter I'm using
>has only two prongs, so I assume there's no grounding going on from the
>wall.....is this necessary for these powered monitors? will it help?

Lifting ground is not only going to be an RF worry, it is also going to
be unsafe and in the US it's illegal.

Put proper power cables on them...
Sounds like what you have on the speakers is a CEE 7/7 "Europlug" and
what you have on the wall sounds like it could be anything.
With the Europlug, there is a male pin on the wall which mates with
the hole in the connector for grounding.

Go to your local computer guy and ask him for some proper power cables
with correct grounding. All computer gear comes with power cables and
everybody has a stack of them lying around in closets.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 24, 2005 1:33:50 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi Scott,
Thank you for the advice, yes, I will go to my local electronics store
and buy power cords that work directly from the speaker to the electric
outlet. This way they will be grounded.
I'm not sure why the music store sold me these speakers with these
power cords and didn't tell me about this. Maybe they expected me to
know already?

Thank you again. And yes, just to clarify, here are the types of plugs
I was referring to:
plug on cord that comes with Behringer 2031a monitors:
http://kropla.com/images/plug_e.gif
the adaptor I'm using:
http://kropla.com/images/plug_c.gif
this fits into this:
http://kropla.com/images/plug_l.gif

obviously the middle ground receptor isn't being used because my
adaptor doesn't use that, I'll go buy the other kind right away.....

just want to thank you and everyone else on this group, you're all very
knowledgeable and kind to new people like myself.
best of luck to everyone,
david
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 24, 2005 5:40:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

David M <davidsetagaya@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Thank you for the advice, yes, I will go to my local electronics store
>and buy power cords that work directly from the speaker to the electric
>outlet. This way they will be grounded.
>I'm not sure why the music store sold me these speakers with these
>power cords and didn't tell me about this. Maybe they expected me to
>know already?

I don't know. I've worked in places where people were not exactly careful
about grounding. Hell, I've worked in places where people just cut cords
off and stuck bare wires into plugs with matchsticks to hold them into place.
This is bad. Don't do this.

>obviously the middle ground receptor isn't being used because my
>adaptor doesn't use that, I'll go buy the other kind right away.....

Just get new cords. The monitors have IEC inputs on them like computers
use, right? Computer cords should be free for the asking in any office.

I'm not saying this will solve your problem, just that until you do it
you won't know what else is going on.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 25, 2005 12:30:08 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Scott Dorsey wrote:

> I don't know. I've worked in places where people were not exactly careful
> about grounding. Hell, I've worked in places where people just cut cords
> off and stuck bare wires into plugs with matchsticks to hold them into place.
> This is bad. Don't do this.

I'm putting some new gear into a church here. The folks who did the
previous install, maybe decades ago, ran the pulpit mic cable through a
wall by snipping it in two to get the XLR off, and then wire-nutting it
back together. They did the same for the choir mic. Geniuses for Jesus;
stand aside, ye heathens. Maybe they use Ghost power, instead of
Phantom. I'm trying to convince them that an intact shield is just part
of a different kind of holy trinity. But they like their XLRorcism. Mox
nix, as it will surrender to my soldering iron.

--
ha
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 25, 2005 12:30:09 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1gshm9f.ii1oyvkj8am8N%walkinay@thegrid.net> walkinay@thegrid.net writes:

> I'm putting some new gear into a church here. The folks who did the
> previous install, maybe decades ago, ran the pulpit mic cable through a
> wall by snipping it in two to get the XLR off, and then wire-nutting it
> back together. They did the same for the choir mic.

Probably cut it in the middle, too, so they would only have to run
each piece half way.

> I'm trying to convince them that an intact shield is just part
> of a different kind of holy trinity. But they like their XLRorcism. Mox
> nix, as it will surrender to my soldering iron.

If the wire nuts hold, I'd suggest using it as a "messenger" to pull a
new piece of cable, even if you have to pay for the cable. You'll
thank me when they call you back five years from now.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 25, 2005 12:30:09 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"hank alrich" <walkinay@thegrid.net> wrote in message
news:1gshm9f.ii1oyvkj8am8N%walkinay@thegrid.net
> Scott Dorsey wrote:
>
>> I don't know. I've worked in places where people were not exactly
>> careful about grounding. Hell, I've worked in places where people
>> just cut cords off and stuck bare wires into plugs with matchsticks
>> to hold them into place. This is bad. Don't do this.
>
> I'm putting some new gear into a church here. The folks who did the
> previous install, maybe decades ago, ran the pulpit mic cable through
> a wall by snipping it in two to get the XLR off, and then
> wire-nutting it back together. They did the same for the choir mic.

It sounds crude, but as ugly as it is, I'm not surprised that it worked for
years.

> Geniuses for Jesus; stand aside, ye heathens. Maybe they use Ghost
> power, instead of Phantom. I'm trying to convince them that an intact
> shield is just part of a different kind of holy trinity.

Balanced lines are pretty strong mojo. Whoops, wrong religion, I'll bet. ;-)

> But they
> like their XLRorcism. Mox nix, as it will surrender to my soldering
> iron.

I find the idea of wirenuts to be quite attractive and workmanlike compared
to the system I inherited at my church. Think wire finger-twisted together
and taped by folding the electrical tape over once on itself.

Think about a mixer's balanced aux outputs driving an amp's balanced input
over abotu 100' of shielded twisted pair hooked up unbalanced - yup just one
of the two signal wires hooked up at each end.

Then there was the big video projector hooked up to a PC, via powered by a 2
prong extension cord. Would you believe that the video was noisy? ;-)

Letsee, then there was the Shure PZM lost in a box in a closet when the
piano needed it desperately.

Then there were 6 inputs of the console tied up with tape and CD channel
outputs, when a NOS Rane SM-26 line mixer was sitting in another box, same
closet.
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 25, 2005 2:39:34 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hello everyone,
I went to my local Casa Royal (like Radioshack in the states) and
bought some of those power cords for computers. (yes, the monitors have
IEC inputs on them for the power cords. These new cords I bought do
have the grounding connection appropriate for Chile on them, so they
are fully grounded now....
Unfortunately, it didn't work! Still can hear the radio through the
monitors.....Not really sure what to do. Do you guys think this is a
defect in the monitors? or is it something that will happen with all
of them?
thanks everyone,
david
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 25, 2005 3:24:03 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

It also may be wise at this point to be sure the outlet is actually
grounded, as well.

You can get a tester from the hardware store for about ten bux that will
tell. If it is connected, the quality of the ground could still be
suspect, but if it's not connected, it needs to be.
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 25, 2005 11:12:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <576dnQk9Isz5FILfRVn-jQ@omsoft.com> nopsam@nospam.net writes:

> It also may be wise at this point to be sure the outlet is actually
> grounded, as well.

This is good for safety purposes, but grounding doesn't solve all EMI
problems. It could be that a filter is in order, or perhaps some good
bypassing that the speaker manufactuer should have done.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
a b C Monitor
February 26, 2005 3:45:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Scott Dorsey wrote:

> It's probably a design problem.... but first, you say the problem happens
> with nothing plugged into the inputs as well. Not even a cable hanging
> loose on the input. That makes me think it's coming in on the power
> line.

Could be something in the box doing the antenna thing.

--
ha
December 27, 2010 3:38:56 AM

Hi everyone

I know it´s been a lot since someone answered this topic, but i´m having the same problem of david and i wanted to know if someone found the key to solve it

thanks
gonzalo

December 27, 2010 7:09:49 AM

Quote:
Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi All, greets to everyone and hope you all are well.
I just have one question/problem about my monitors, Behringer 2031a (
http://www.behringer.com/B2031A/index.cfm?lang=ENG ).

Somehow, when the monitors are powered on but no sound is going through
them, I can hear a very faint sound of something that sounds like a
radio station. It is definitely someone talking, but I can't confirm
that it's a radio station for 100 percent.

I guess I really don't care if it's a radio station or other
interference, but has anyone experienced this problem before? Do you
know anything I can do about this?

Thank you very much,

david


Hello David welcome to tomshardware

So about your problem - the monitor will take an analog (AM frequency) input from a computer, but if there are designed flaws (I assumed their was) - the shielding which will take out the interference from a nearby radio station was not designed well that's why you hear them in your monitor. Well you can re locate your monitor or ask someone to check the house grounding in your house.
!