pre-amp

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

I run my mics through a mackie vlz pro with xdr ports. This is supposed to
be the next best thing to pre-amps. However, I am anxious to add a mic pre
to my setup. I think with the Avalon 2022 I will be able to accomplish
almost anything as far as vocals,guitars, bass, and stereo overheads for my
drums, as it is a 2-channel mic pre. This is a solid-state unit, to those
who don't know, and according to Avalon they recommend solid-state over tube
pre's, because they say there is a better signal-noise ratio. I guess my
question is, "How much better is a class A pre like the 2022 (runs about
$2699) than say a low end Art pre-amp(<$100)?" Would it even be worth my
while to pick up a $200 mic pre. Or should I just start saving for one of
the big dawgs and deal with what i have for now. Obviously there are middle
of the road units, and maybe even low costing models that sound good, or
decent, but I'm looking for top notch quality. Anyway, if someone has a
2022 and wants to tell me how good it is. Or suggest a few other pre's,
feel free. Sometimes "You get what you pay for" and sometimes there are
bargains. Then sometimes you get burned.

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Paul Kurtyka wrote:
> I run my mics through a mackie vlz pro with xdr ports. This is
> supposed to

I use my soundcraft Delta and (slightly modified) Venue II
channels with direct outs.

> be the next best thing to pre-amps. However, I am anxious to add a
> mic pre to my setup. I think with the Avalon 2022 I will be able
> to accomplish almost anything as far as vocals, guitars, bass, and
> stereo overheads for my
> drums, as it is a 2-channel mic pre. This is a solid-state unit, to
> those who don't know, and according to Avalon they recommend
> solid-state over tube pre's, because they say there is a better
> signal-noise ratio.

Why would they say that ? Their best unit is the 737
tubed pre. Maybe the 2022 is just a little cleaner than
the 737. Oh, I get it ... the 737 is only one channel
so the 2022 is twice as good.
Mercenary's version of the 737 is the coolest
looking, except for those horrible knobs ;-]

> I guess my
> question is, "How much better is a class A pre like the 2022 (runs
about
> $2699) than say a low end Art pre-amp(<$100)?"

Is it 27 times better ? Maybe not. Is it enough better
that you should consider it ? Certainly.
This is a case where something is alot more costly
to achieve a 'state-of-the-art' level of performance.
I happen to have one of the ART dualMP preamps.
It wouldn't ever get used on a vocal but at times
has been OK on a distorted guitar and even a bass.
It is what it is ... a flavor. What kind of taste
do you have ?

> Would it even be worth my
> while to pick up a $200 mic pre.

Probably not, if you're looking at Avalons.
But then again maybe something like an Ashly DP200
or a used Symetrix 528 might give you something
new to play with for a while till you save up
for what you are really after.

> Or should I just start saving for one of
> the big dawgs and deal with what i have for now.

The easy answer here is get the RNP ...
Your Mackie channels are fine for now.

> Obviously there are middle
> of the road units, and maybe even low costing models that sound good,
or
> decent, but I'm looking for top notch quality. Anyway, if someone
has a
> 2022 and wants to tell me how good it is. Or suggest a few other
pre's,
> feel free. Sometimes "You get what you pay for" and sometimes there
are
> bargains. Then sometimes you get burned.

You might just find something used on eBay to add some
character for a couple hundred bucks and continue to
save for a Hardy or Avalon or (?)

DISCLAIMER: I use some oddball techniques and equipment
at times to get different sounds. What I like for adding
a little 'grundge' might sound like junk to many folks
and probably does.

rd

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"Paul Kurtyka" <pkurtyka@cox.net> wrote in message
news:LKVWd.52638$7z6.35536@lakeread04...
> I run my mics through a mackie vlz pro with xdr ports. This is supposed
to
> be the next best thing to pre-amps. However, I am anxious to add a mic
pre
> to my setup. I think with the Avalon 2022 I will be able to accomplish
> almost anything as far as vocals,guitars, bass, and stereo overheads for
my
> drums, as it is a 2-channel mic pre. This is a solid-state unit, to those
> who don't know, and according to Avalon they recommend solid-state over
tube
> pre's, because they say there is a better signal-noise ratio. I guess my
> question is, "How much better is a class A pre like the 2022 (runs about
> $2699) than say a low end Art pre-amp(<$100)?"

The Avalon is a mic preamp of high quality which produces high-quality
recordings. The Art is a toy which produces painfully poor recordings.

> Would it even be worth my
> while to pick up a $200 mic pre. Or should I just start saving for one of
> the big dawgs and deal with what i have for now. Obviously there are
middle
> of the road units, and maybe even low costing models that sound good, or
> decent, but I'm looking for top notch quality. Anyway, if someone has a
> 2022 and wants to tell me how good it is. Or suggest a few other pre's,
> feel free. Sometimes "You get what you pay for" and sometimes there are
> bargains. Then sometimes you get burned.

There are indeed bargains. The Real Nice Preamp, the Peavey VMP2, the Sytek
preamp are all very good-sounding preamps under $1000, sometimes well-under.
All different, but professional quality. The Groove Tubes Brick may be a
good 'un at low price too; haven't heard it yet. And there are
intermediate-priced units such as the Great River that are very, very good
indeed. All have different flavors, but all can produce professional
results. I haven't heard a $200-and-under preamp that does.

Peace,
Paul

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Paul, I hope it's clear that the expression "class A" isn't a statement
of quality about a component such as a preamp. Rather, it's a technical
classification in terms of a fairly arcane aspect of the component's
circuitry--how the active elements of that circuit, such as transistors
or tubes, are "biased".

If you have blood type "A" versus type "AB" or type "O," they're all
pretty much equivalent, as long as you have enough and it's flowing
properly, no? It's better if the blood is mostly inside your body
rather than outside it, for example. And pretty much the same is true
of "class A" circuits versus the other classes that exist. Of course
someone who's trying to sell you a component may be tempted to make it
sound as if "class A" is the most desirable class, and indeed for some
people it is. Those people may well like to imagine that they know
something that the rest of us don't. But there can be lousy-sounding,
overpriced class A circuits as well as excellent-sounding, reasonably
priced circuitry that doesn't happen to be class A.

Just making sure that's clear, is all.

--best regards

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <jecXd.113309$Th1.39187@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net> pstamlerhell@pobox.com writes:

> A sentence like "Is it tubed or Class-A?" is about as
> meaningful as "Are you a Republican, or is there grapefruit?"

Not at all. I ride a unicycle to church.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <znr1110287442k@trad>, Mike Rivers <mrivers@d-and-d.com> wrote:
>
>In article <jecXd.113309$Th1.39187@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net> pstamlerhell@pobox.com writes:
>
>> A sentence like "Is it tubed or Class-A?" is about as
>> meaningful as "Are you a Republican, or is there grapefruit?"
>
>Not at all. I ride a unicycle to church.

Please take this to alt.non-sequitur.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Drily Lit Raga wrote:

> Mike Rivers wrote:

> pstamlerhell

> > > A sentence like "Is it tubed or Class-A?" is about as
> > > meaningful as "Are you a Republican, or is there grapefruit?"

> > Not at all. I ride a unicycle to church.

> How do you get the water in your washing machine so dark?

Just keep reusing it, kind of like old analog tape.

--
ha