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Gal Civ 2:- Has Brad finally given us MOO2.5?

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Anonymous
May 25, 2005 9:12:20 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

It seems like it, reading the blurb at The Wargamer and galciv2.com.
Customisable races and designable starships.

For me, the heart of MOO/MOO2 was always about deploying and fighting ships
I'd designed within the context of the strategic game. My biggest bitch
with MOO2 was that there was really only one tech route to take (missiles in
the early game, plasma cannon or disruptors at the end) if you wanted to
win. Sure, you could penalise yourself by only researching, say, fighter
techs but no one lasted long in multiplayer doing that sort of thing. You
could mod the game to make it more flexible but that was a lot of hassle.

I guess what I want to say is that, hopefully, Galciv2 will permit more than
one ship-design route to victory.

Cheers,

Andy
Anonymous
May 25, 2005 9:12:21 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

Andy Brown wrote:
> It seems like it, reading the blurb at The Wargamer and galciv2.com.
> Customisable races and designable starships.
<snip>

This post inspired me to startup Stardock Central, since I bought
Altarian Prophecy direct, I think I qualify for the beta of GalCiv 2

Big mistake. After almost half an hour of updating, now it simply
seems to be doing nothing

"Status: updating network and application information"

And of course, the ironic thing is, at the top of the screen it claims

"TotalGaming.net is the ultimate gaming network! No CDs, no hassles,
no nonsense."

No cds, maybe. But plenty of hassles and quite a bit of nonsense. For
some reason Stardock central screws up Windows, causing gibberish to
appear in my startup menu...
Anonymous
May 25, 2005 9:12:21 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

GalCiv2 will not be MOO2.5 in my book unless it has multiplayer.
Without the ability to test myself against other humans, I'm going to
pass on it.
Anonymous
May 25, 2005 9:12:22 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

In article <1198anafk6a8vf6@news.supernews.com>,
Jeremy Reaban <trancejeremy@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>No cds, maybe. But plenty of hassles and quite a bit of nonsense. For
>some reason Stardock central screws up Windows, causing gibberish to
>appear in my startup menu...

As far as I can tell, Stardock Central gobbles up Windows GUI
resources like Pac-Man on steroids - they appear to have a serious
resource management issue in there. On average, it used to take me 2-3
reboots to get anything new downloaded with that client (first 1-2
reboots to get the client updates, then 1-2 reboots to get the game).

Of course, once I had gone to the trouble, the games worked fine. It's
still not a very good first impression to leave people with.

(It's been several months though, perhaps they've fixed it ...)

Cheers
Bent D
--
Bent Dalager - bcd@pvv.org - http://www.pvv.org/~bcd
powered by emacs
Anonymous
May 26, 2005 1:08:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

On Wed, 25 May 2005 10:01:53 +0000 (UTC), bcd@pvv.ntnu.no (Bent C Dalager)
wrote:

>In article <1198anafk6a8vf6@news.supernews.com>,
>Jeremy Reaban <trancejeremy@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>No cds, maybe. But plenty of hassles and quite a bit of nonsense. For
>>some reason Stardock central screws up Windows, causing gibberish to
>>appear in my startup menu...
>
>As far as I can tell, Stardock Central gobbles up Windows GUI
>resources like Pac-Man on steroids - they appear to have a serious
>resource management issue in there. On average, it used to take me 2-3
>reboots to get anything new downloaded with that client (first 1-2
>reboots to get the client updates, then 1-2 reboots to get the game).

The workaround is using SC on WinNT or XP, which has a lot more GDI
resources.

The application seems like it is using stock GDI/Commctl resources. This
isn't a problem by itself, but the default config makes things difficult to
select text for cut-n-paste when refreshed frequently (e.g. in the IRC
module.)

>
>(It's been several months though, perhaps they've fixed it ...)

I should hope so... :) 

When I downloaded it to see if patches were available for the Political
Machine, it still felt as if some of the bugs were still present. I didn't
report them, since I felt that Stardock already knew about these problems.
Anonymous
May 26, 2005 10:12:01 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

"Bent C Dalager" <bcd@pvv.ntnu.no> wrote in message
news:D 71ieh$hbj$1@orkan.itea.ntnu.no...
> As far as I can tell, Stardock Central gobbles up Windows GUI
> resources like Pac-Man on steroids - they appear to have a serious
> resource management issue in there. On average, it used to take me 2-3
> reboots to get anything new downloaded with that client (first 1-2
> reboots to get the client updates, then 1-2 reboots to get the game).

Thats a bitch, would annoy be greatly, I haven't noticed any similiar
problems however so I'll count myself lucky :) 

Ceo-
Anonymous
May 26, 2005 10:13:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

"fizzy" <ewoh27@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1117052396.872542.192630@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> GalCiv2 will not be MOO2.5 in my book unless it has multiplayer.
> Without the ability to test myself against other humans, I'm going to
> pass on it.

You always get two parties fizzy, the one who doesn't like multi, the who
does. There are IMO far too many multi player dedicated games out now days,
us solo'ers enjoy the good single player game every now and then :) 

Ceo-
Anonymous
May 29, 2005 2:10:36 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

On my system, Stardock Central is using 9 megabytes of memory. And you
only need it when you actually download a new game.
Anonymous
May 29, 2005 2:16:13 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

In this case, different games will require different technology paths
to take.

That's because of the rock/paper/scissors system in combat.

Beam weapons are defeated by shield technologies

Mass drivers are defeated by armor technologies

Missiles defeated by point defense technologies

So depending on which routes the computer players take in technological
development, players will have to take on different tactics.

For example, in Galactic Civilizations I, you would research "Avatar"
tech and build avatar battleships which would wipe out the lesser
ships. In Galactic Civilizations II, you would research, for example,
"Tenorian Battle Carvers" (a beam weapon) which you could then refit
your existing capital ships with. You might then go after say the
Arcean Empire because they've only got Deflector Mark II shield
technology. But you would now have to think ahead -- the Arceans may
be vulnerable to beam weapons but their friends, the Torians, have
Phase Barrier Mark IX shield technology on their rather sizeable fleets
and come with a full load of Anti-Matter disruptor missiles which will
fry your ships.

In other words, some thought besides basic geography will have to go
into when and if you go to war with a given civilization.

Brad
--
Brad Wardell
Posting via Google
Stardock - http://www.stardock.com
Project Manager: Galactic Civilizations II (http://www.galciv2.com)
Anonymous
May 30, 2005 3:08:09 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

In article <1117386636.212320.326060@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
<draginol@gmail.com> wrote:
>On my system, Stardock Central is using 9 megabytes of memory. And you
>only need it when you actually download a new game.

I have only observed it munching up all my GUI resources, which
doesn't much affect memory usage. If it is as Raymond M said in a
different reply, then I probably only notice this because I'm running
W98 which has relatively few of these resources. If you're using some
recent Windows version (as I'm sure the developers must be doing), it
may work just fine for you.

Cheers
Bent D
--
Bent Dalager - bcd@pvv.org - http://www.pvv.org/~bcd
powered by emacs
Anonymous
June 1, 2005 3:03:53 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

Hi!
> In this case, different games will require different technology paths
> to take.
> ... snip ...
> Brad
There's not much news about GC-II in this newsgroup. I've also checked
the GC-II web site, but could't find the info regarding empire
spending sliders. Will there still be only one slider pane for the
whole empire, or will you allow each planet to have it's own, or at
least each governor its own.

I'm asking that because in GC-I I refrained to settle a new planet,
when my empire was mid-aged or older, because I could't rash-build
needed basic installations there, as my social spending slider at that
time was usually set really low, in order to not lose money on fully
developed planets (nothing usefull to build there). So basically I've
been growing only through invasion and developing existing planets.
I'd really like to have that peacefull option too.

Anyway, everything I've been reading about GC-II sounds really
promising. Even if you don't solve the slider problem you can count on
me to buy it. :-)
BR, Iztok
Anonymous
June 1, 2005 3:05:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

Iztok <iztok_bitenc@yahoo.com> wrote:

> There's not much news about GC-II in this newsgroup. I've also checked
> the GC-II web site, but could't find the info regarding empire
> spending sliders. Will there still be only one slider pane for the
> whole empire, or will you allow each planet to have it's own, or at
> least each governor its own.
>
> I'm asking that because in GC-I I refrained to settle a new planet,
> when my empire was mid-aged or older, because I could't rash-build
> needed basic installations there, as my social spending slider at that
> time was usually set really low, in order to not lose money on fully
> developed planets (nothing usefull to build there). So basically I've
> been growing only through invasion and developing existing planets.
> I'd really like to have that peacefull option too.

I fully agree here. Also, I think it would be cool if different planets
can specialise in different areas, so some planets will be shipyards,
while others focus on wonders or research.

My plans for if I ever decide to write my own 4X space game will include
food production, so fertile planets can also become farm worlds.

> Anyway, everything I've been reading about GC-II sounds really
> promising. Even if you don't solve the slider problem you can count on
> me to buy it. :-)

Again, I fully agree.


mcv.
Anonymous
June 1, 2005 4:51:52 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

In article <429d966f$0$23429$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>,
mcv <mcvmcv@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>I fully agree here. Also, I think it would be cool if different planets
>can specialise in different areas, so some planets will be shipyards,
>while others focus on wonders or research.

It is all too easy to overdo individual planet configuration. If a
player is to have more than a dozen planets, then allowing each planet
to be individually configurable easily leads to micromanagement hell,
endless frustration and month-long games.

In a game with as many planets as GalCiv had, a planet needs to some
extent to be "just another planet" for the game to be reasonably
playable. I think a better solution should be found than massively
multiplying the number of sliders in the game.

A solution _should_ be found though - one of the most frustrating
aspects of the game was in administrating the empire-wide resource
sliders.

Cheers
Bent D
--
Bent Dalager - bcd@pvv.org - http://www.pvv.org/~bcd
powered by emacs
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 5:12:05 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

Hi!
> In a game with as many planets as GalCiv had, a planet needs to some
> extent to be "just another planet" for the game to be reasonably
> playable. I think a better solution should be found than massively
> multiplying the number of sliders in the game.
Governors. Each with his own slider settings. You change setings for
governor, all planets he manages got that change. When a planet
matures, you simply change its governor.
BR, Iztok
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 12:36:34 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

Bent C Dalager wrote:
> In article <429d966f$0$23429$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>,
> mcv <mcvmcv@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>>I fully agree here. Also, I think it would be cool if different planets
>>can specialise in different areas, so some planets will be shipyards,
>>while others focus on wonders or research.
>
>
> It is all too easy to overdo individual planet configuration. If a
> player is to have more than a dozen planets, then allowing each planet
> to be individually configurable easily leads to micromanagement hell,
> endless frustration and month-long games.
>
> In a game with as many planets as GalCiv had, a planet needs to some
> extent to be "just another planet" for the game to be reasonably
> playable. I think a better solution should be found than massively
> multiplying the number of sliders in the game.
>
> A solution _should_ be found though - one of the most frustrating
> aspects of the game was in administrating the empire-wide resource
> sliders.

The situation you describe calls for templates. Players wouldn't need
to micromanage if we could set up templates first and turn control over
to each world's governor. All we'd have to do (after setting up our
templates) is click: turn this planet into an agricultural world; turn
this planet into an industrial world; turn this planet into a research
world; turn this planet into a military base; etc.
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 11:13:54 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

Bent C Dalager <bcd@pvv.ntnu.no> wrote:
> In article <429d966f$0$23429$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>,
> mcv <mcvmcv@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>
>>I fully agree here. Also, I think it would be cool if different planets
>>can specialise in different areas, so some planets will be shipyards,
>>while others focus on wonders or research.
>
> It is all too easy to overdo individual planet configuration. If a
> player is to have more than a dozen planets, then allowing each planet
> to be individually configurable easily leads to micromanagement hell,
> endless frustration and month-long games.

This is mainly a risk in games like Civ and GalCiv where you have lots
of very specific buildings to build. If I ever make my own 4X game
(ha! dream on), I'll take a more Stars!-like approach, where each planet
has a number of factories and mines (like in stars!) but also labs and
farms. The total number the population can operate is fixed so you'd have
to choose how many labs or factories to build. Obviously mineral rich
plnets would become mining planets, fertile planets get farms, and there
will probably some reason to differentiate between industrial and
research planets as well.

> In a game with as many planets as GalCiv had, a planet needs to some
> extent to be "just another planet" for the game to be reasonably
> playable.

In a way, you're right. On the other hand, conquering a planet is a
lot more fun if it's not "just another planet".

> I think a better solution should be found than massively
> multiplying the number of sliders in the game.
>
> A solution _should_ be found though - one of the most frustrating
> aspects of the game was in administrating the empire-wide resource
> sliders.

Tieing sliders to governors sounds like a good idea. That way, you
can have a governor for a developing research world (mostly production,
and research buildings in the queue) and one for a finished research world
(everything to research), etc.


mcv.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 8:20:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic (More info?)

<draginol@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118363581.892389.36050@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...

> That already happens. The mechanic is totally different in GalCiv II
> vs. the first one.
>
> Now, planet quality indicates how many useable tiles there are on the
> planet. A class 15 planet means it has 15 useable tiles.
>
> On these files players build things like farms (Which provide food
> which is required to feed the population), research buildings, factory
> buildings, and various special buildings. Each building uses up a
> single tile. So you have to really use some strategy in what your'e
> building.

And of course however, we can preset governors to do all this for us yes?
Maybe we can set a list for each governor, the AI then continues to build
all the buildings on that list until there is no more room or some such?
With perhaps the ability to destroy or even better (much better!) recycle a
building for some of its building cost to build another in its place?

Well, I'll cross my fingers anyway :) 

Ceo-
!