Ohh- $29.95, opps- $39.95, argh- $49.95

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

So anyway. I discover "Tin Soldiers: Julius Caesar" at Matrix. The
home page says "Available now $29.95".

"Cool" I drool, clicking on the Buy Now like. Then I discover this is
only for the download version, the CD version is $39.95. Where I live,
my internet speed is limited by how fast I can bang on the morse-code
handle. 200+ meg downloads are not practical.

I groan, but figure I want the game bad enough to pay the extra $10
for them to burn it on a CD and mail it to me.

But when I finally get to the actual order page, I discover they are
charging ANOTHER $10 for 'shipping and handling'..

So, now I am thinking- "they are charging $10 to burn it on a CD, and
another $10 to stuff it in an envelope, a 66% price increase.

As much as I wanted the game, I would feel like a moron if I paid that
much- about as smart as those mysterious individuals that answer spam
e-mail.

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

On Sun, 15 May 2005 12:34:15 -0400, Giftzwerg
<giftzwerg999@NOSPAMZ.hotmail.com> wrote:


>Tell you what. Buy the game and set up the download, and I'll download
>it for you, burn it onto a CD, and mail it to you USPS for exactly what
>a CDR blank and the postage would cost you. All you need to do is say
>"yes" in this forum, and I'll provide you with an email to send the
>couple of bucks to.
>
>Still want the game? Or is this just another exercise in "let's bash
>digital downloads / bitch about postage?"


Do you take PayPal?

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

In article <1116168774.1874156bda5ba469eed1b8b2c7558840@1usenet>,
FourtyTwo@NoAddress.invalid says...
> So anyway. I discover "Tin Soldiers: Julius Caesar" at Matrix. The
> home page says "Available now $29.95".
>
> "Cool" I drool, clicking on the Buy Now like. Then I discover this is
> only for the download version, the CD version is $39.95. Where I live,
> my internet speed is limited by how fast I can bang on the morse-code
> handle. 200+ meg downloads are not practical.
>
> I groan, but figure I want the game bad enough to pay the extra $10
> for them to burn it on a CD and mail it to me.
>
> But when I finally get to the actual order page, I discover they are
> charging ANOTHER $10 for 'shipping and handling'..
>
> So, now I am thinking- "they are charging $10 to burn it on a CD, and
> another $10 to stuff it in an envelope, a 66% price increase.
>
> As much as I wanted the game, I would feel like a moron if I paid that
> much- about as smart as those mysterious individuals that answer spam
> e-mail.

That is a bit much extra. Perhaps they should look at that closer. I
think they can't control the burning cost. I think the download company
does that. Digital River. I guess it would be the same for shipping
then.
--

Epi

------------
Some people enjoy the things that money can buy.
Others just like the money itself.
------------
http://www.curlesneck.com

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Giftzwerg <giftzwerg999@NOSPAMZ.hotmail.com> wrote in
news:MPG.1cf19fd7b936f37098a321@news-east.giganews.com:


> [And I forget who said it, but it was certainly a brilliant
> observation; Matrix should start couching this as selling a $49 game -
> but they'll give you a $10 discount if you don't want the CD shipped
> to you, and another $10 discount if you don't want the CD at all.]

As far as I can tell that was me, but only being the corporate sock-puppet
that I am my observations don't count for much

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Giftzwerg <giftzwerg999@NOSPAMZ.hotmail.com> wrote in
news:MPG.1cf24698dafe606c98a324@news-east.giganews.com:

> In article <Xns96587F18E16FAeddysterckxhotmailco@216.143.170.21>,
> eddysterckx@hotmail.com says...
>
>> > [And I forget who said it, but it was certainly a brilliant
>> > observation; Matrix should start couching this as selling a $49
>> > game - but they'll give you a $10 discount if you don't want the CD
>> > shipped to you, and another $10 discount if you don't want the CD
>> > at all.]
>>
>> As far as I can tell that was me, but only being the corporate
>> sock-puppet that I am my observations don't count for much
>
> Even a broken clock is right twice a day, eh?

Not when you're a digital one

--
"Ceterum censeo Belgicam delendam."
(Cato, 'Pro Gerolphe')

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

We don't make any money on the shipping and handling, but I'm always
concerned when customers aren't happy. The digital download vs. boxed
copy is exactly why we offer both versions. The store clearly tells
you what the price is for each different version and the boxed copy is
always $10 more than the digital download. The sidebar on our front
page is the only area I know of that only lists the digital download
price.

On the pricing, I did a quick check and found that I could have the
same title shipped US Priority Mail to my house for $8.95 (again, this
is entirely the online store, Digital River). I did a quick check of a
similar company and found a rate of $8.00 for the same shipping. So,
we're $0.95 over a similar competitor's shipping rate. For $0.40 more
you can get UPS Ground trackable shipping through our store as well as
faster delivery options. I've asked our store if we can get a rate for
our customers better than $8.95 - we'll see what they say.

In the meantime, you can expect to pay $7-$10 to ship a boxed game from
the vast majority small companies, not because it's a profit center but
because better rates are tough to get, by and large.

Regards,

- Erik

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

On Sun, 15 May 2005 19:05:44 -0400, Giftzwerg
<giftzwerg999@NOSPAMZ.hotmail.com> wrote:

>In article <1116192889.decc7415889163e4dedaf63ba8dd44cd@1usenet>,
>FourtyTwo@NoAddress.invalid says...
>
>> >Tell you what. Buy the game and set up the download, and I'll download
>> >it for you, burn it onto a CD, and mail it to you USPS for exactly what
>> >a CDR blank and the postage would cost you. All you need to do is say
>
....snip
>
>So. I'll cost you $5.00 or so to (maybe) get your CD from the Giftzwerg

a blank cd-r, envelope and postage would not cost over $2

>If it doesn't, well, that's life. I've got a nice Plextor burner and it
>doesn't make more than 10% coasters, so the odds are in your favor.

it should'nt make anywhere near 10% coasters

 

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AnnetteBrooks schreef:
> Hello Gentleman. This is my first post here although I have enjoyed
> reading your discussions for quite some time. I saw this topic and
hope
> you don't mind if I throw in my 2cents.

We prefer nickels

> With all due respect, Mr. Rutins, I don't think it's fully accurate
to set
> an expectation for our customers that they should pay shipping costs
of $7
> to $10 across the board for this type of merchandise.

Yes and no. $10 sounds about right for S&H from a true-cost
perspective, but a lot of companies on the 'net think (rightly) that
selling something for $20 and asking $10 S&H sounds worse than asking
for $30 and being able to print in bold : S&H FREE !!

It sounds silly, but people aren't turned-off by the cost of an item
they really want, but by what they consider overcharging on S&H.

I once made the observation that companies should not charge an extra
$10 for physically producing a cd versus the direct download version,
but that they should add this $10 to the regular price and give a $10
*discount* for those going the direct download way.

> But I disagree that our customers should "expect to pay $7-$10 to
ship a
> boxed game from the vast majority small companies..."

Well, the net result is that they will have paid that amount - even if
it says "S&H Free" on the invoice

There's no such thing as a free lunch.

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Hello Gentleman. This is my first post here although I have enjoyed
reading your discussions for quite some time. I saw this topic and hope
you don't mind if I throw in my 2cents.

With all due respect, Mr. Rutins, I don't think it's fully accurate to set
an expectation for our customers that they should pay shipping costs of $7
to $10 across the board for this type of merchandise. I also did a quick
check. After visiting three "wargame" publisher sites and three
independent retail game sites, I found USPS Priority Mail shipping offered
anywhere from FREE (at two of those 6) to $8.00.

We all have our reasons for charging what we charge (or don't charge), and
I don't think any of us pull these prices out of the air. There are very
real costs associated with shipping a product above and beyond what the
carrier charges us. All things are not equal. We must take into account
size and weight of package, destination, our own fulfillment costs, etc.
But I disagree that our customers should "expect to pay $7-$10 to ship a
boxed game from the vast majority small companies..."

Annette Brooks
www.ShrapnelGames.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Sorry folks. I must make a correction to my post. I should not have said
USPS Priority Mail. The shipping prices I refer to reflect a variety of
services ranging from USPS Media Mail to FedEx 2nd Day Air.

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

"Well, the net result is that they will have paid that amount - even if
it says "S&H Free" on the invoice "
(sorry, being new here I haven't mastered the quoting etiquette)

Absolutely! Which is why I don't think it's accurate to say our customers
should expect to pay $7 to $10 for shipping in addition to the advertised
retail price of a game from the vast majority of sellers. I'm not saying
the shipping fees each company charges are not legitimate, fair or real.
Some company's factor fulfillment costs into the price of the game; some
keep it completely separate. It would be easier for everyone if we all
presented it the same way, but unfortunately we don't. Perhaps I
misunderstood Eric's comment, and if so I apologize.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

"Well, the net result is that they will have paid that amount - even if
it says "S&H Free" on the invoice "
(sorry, being new here I haven't mastered the quoting etiquette)

Absolutely! Which is why I don't think it's accurate to say our customers
should expect to pay $7 to $10 for shipping in addition to the advertised
retail price of a game from the vast majority of sellers. I'm not saying
the shipping fees each company charges are not legitimate, fair or real.
Some company's factor fulfillment costs into the price of the game; some
keep it completely separate. It would be easier for everyone if we all
presented it the same way, but unfortunately we don't. Perhaps I
misunderstood Eric's comment, and if so I apologize.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Wow. I didn't mean to strike a nerve. I'm sorry if my post read as an
attempt to discuss shipping policies or marketing ploys. I believe
companies set policies according to what they've found enables them to
best serve their customers. I wouldn't presume to know what works best for
any company other than the one I work for.

But that's not the point of my earlier post. My intent was to voice my
opinion that the generalization about shipping charges from the vast
majority of small companies is inaccurate. Customers will find a wide
range of rates and policies in our industry.

(I apologize for my double post earlier and, yes, Raging Tiger is a $44.95
physical product with no option for download)

 

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"AnnetteBrooks" <annette@shrapnelgames.com> wrote in
news:bbac7fc566ca4eb62e2e13142dbe1389@localhost.talkaboutgaming.com:

> "Well, the net result is that they will have paid that amount - even
if
> it says "S&H Free" on the invoice "
> (sorry, being new here I haven't mastered the quoting etiquette)

It's not really etiquette, but bottom-posting is the norm here - makes
it easier to follow long threads as the normal reading order is
preserved.

> It would be easier for everyone if we all
> presented it the same way, but unfortunately we don't.

No big deal really - most of us can do the math, the rest uses Windows
Calculator

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx


--
"Ceterum censeo Belgicam delendam."
(Cato, 'Pro Gerolphe')

 

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"AnnetteBrooks" <annette@shrapnelgames.com> wrote in
news:bc469671fa5328113cf1e90a5e959687@localhost.talkaboutgaming.com:

> Wow. I didn't mean to strike a nerve. I'm sorry if my post read as an
> attempt to discuss shipping policies or marketing ploys.

uh, another bit of ng trivia : if you snip in a post, don't snip too
much because now no-one knows who you're actually replying to.

Another bit of advice would be : everything said in here is usually
voiced a little stronger than in a normal conversation. If you want to
get a point across you simplify and amplify. Don't take it too serious
and read some posts with a truckload of salt nearby.

And shipping policies and marketing ploys are a valid discussion point
in here afaik - that is, I hope so, because I've raised these points
before

> I believe
> companies set policies according to what they've found enables them to
> best serve their customers.

The reverse would be astonishing

> I wouldn't presume to know what works best
> for any company other than the one I work for.

The point is : we're more than pleased if someone from the inside
explains how it works for them as a base reference when we dream-up wild
schemes. We're the armchair generals, you're the professional.

> But that's not the point of my earlier post. My intent was to voice my
> opinion that the generalization about shipping charges from the vast
> majority of small companies is inaccurate.

Well, it came across as such for me.

> (I apologize for my double post earlier

Last bit of advise before somebody starts calling me names : never
apologize for trivial stuff. Not even for major stuff actually. This is
UseNet, the wild frontier of the digital civilization.

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

While taking a short break from the daily grind of enslavement and
world domination, Eddy Sterckx mentioned


(Snippage to go OT - thread drift)

>Last bit of advise before somebody starts calling me names : never
>apologize for trivial stuff. Not even for major stuff actually. This is
>UseNet, the wild frontier of the digital civilization.

Arrrr! There do be trolls and worse on Usenet, lassie, aaarrrr!

It's ten o'clock, do you know where your towel is?
-
-
Some days, it just isn't worth chewing through the straps.
-
-

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Annette,

"We all have our reasons for charging what we charge (or don't charge),
and
I don't think any of us pull these prices out of the air. There are
very
real costs associated with shipping a product above and beyond what the

carrier charges us. All things are not equal. We must take into
account
size and weight of package, destination, our own fulfillment costs,
etc."

Fair enough, I didn't have any intention of misleading, but it would
have been more accurate to say that the _cost_ of shipping for small
companies is in that ballpark, rather than to say the _price_ to the
customer, though it often ends up as the same thing.

Regards,

- Erik

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

AnnetteBrooks schreef:

> And Eddy, thanks for your tips. Next time I'll don my armor and load
up
> on one liners prior to entering!

That's the spirit !

> I'll also figure out why I continue to
> double post!

Stop doubleclicking the "send" button

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

"Fair enough, I didn't have any intention of misleading, but it would
have been more accurate to say that the _cost_ of shipping for small
companies is in that ballpark, rather than to say the _price_ to the
customer, though it often ends up as the same thing."

Thanks for that, Erik.

"Speaking for myself, I've come to adopt the viewpoint I first heard from

Major H, and now just look at the *total* cost of getting the software
onto my system. If you charge $5 for the software and $40 for shipping,
it's precisely the same as charging $25 for the game and $20 for
shipping, or selling the game for $45 and shipping it free."

Exactly. It's not as simple as Price of Game + $7 or $10.

We have yet to embrace direct download for our titles across the board (we
meaning Shrapnel Games) although we have tested this distribution method
with a few titles. But we do listen to customers' feedback and take it
under advisement.

And Eddy, thanks for your tips. Next time I'll don my armor and load up
on one liners prior to entering! I'll also figure out why I continue to
double post!

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

Giftzwerg schreef:

> I'm just making the point that you *do* get something for your $20

You could als observe that the simple fact of Matrix Games pushing hard
for Direct Download suggests that they're not making any money on
physically producing the cd + S&H.

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

On Wed, 18 May 2005 07:25:15 -0400, Giftzwerg wrote:

>or inflating the thingie's cost by the amount of profit desired from
>shipping and handling, and then asserting that S&H is "free."

In what way is this a scam? You know you are paying $X for the product
delivered to your door. What do you care how it is allocated between
product price and shipping? (This method of pricing actually makes the
product seem to cost more to most consumers, as the tendency in making
buying decisions is to just look at product prices, and ignore the
shipping until final checkout.)

John

 

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

John Smith <reply@this.newsgroup.com> wrote in
news:qrup81pkh4rnl2rb0bg4vtfcb2ghskmgds@4ax.com:

> On Wed, 18 May 2005 07:25:15 -0400, Giftzwerg wrote:
>
>>or inflating the thingie's cost by the amount of profit desired from
>>shipping and handling, and then asserting that S&H is "free."
>
> In what way is this a scam?

Nobody's saying it is. On the contrary : I think it's pretty smart as I
find that for entertainment / hobby purchases price is not an issue for
many people - but a feeling of getting "scammed" on S&H will result in
people cancelling their online checkout cart.

The thing is that most people will compare S&H costs with the price of a
stamp and all too easily conclude they're getting scammed on S&H even
when they aren't.

Another thing is the psychological angle - you've already more or less
decided to buy the thing and then this internal decision is reinforced
when you notice that S&H is "free". There's no way you're *not* going to
buy that thing now - such a good deal.

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx


--
"Ceterum censeo Belgicam delendam."
(Cato, 'Pro Gerolphe')

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.war-historical (More info?)

In article <Xns965BEF419D320eddysterckxhotmailco@67.98.68.38>,
eddysterckx@hotmail.com says...
> John Smith <reply@this.newsgroup.com> wrote in
> news:qrup81pkh4rnl2rb0bg4vtfcb2ghskmgds@4ax.com:
>
> > On Wed, 18 May 2005 07:25:15 -0400, Giftzwerg wrote:
> >
> >>or inflating the thingie's cost by the amount of profit desired from
> >>shipping and handling, and then asserting that S&H is "free."
> >
> > In what way is this a scam?
>
> Nobody's saying it is. On the contrary : I think it's pretty smart as I
> find that for entertainment / hobby purchases price is not an issue for
> many people - but a feeling of getting "scammed" on S&H will result in
> people cancelling their online checkout cart.
>
> The thing is that most people will compare S&H costs with the price of a
> stamp and all too easily conclude they're getting scammed on S&H even
> when they aren't.
>
> Another thing is the psychological angle - you've already more or less
> decided to buy the thing and then this internal decision is reinforced
> when you notice that S&H is "free". There's no way you're *not* going to
> buy that thing now - such a good deal.
>
> Greetz,
>
> Eddy Sterckx

Have you ever checked out the S&H for soda. Soda's heavy you know. I
have a reason for wanting to order it. I don't though. S&H is the
reason.
--

Epi

------------
Things I think about throughout the day:

"Play that funky music white boy"
"Play that donkey music farm boy"
"Play that monkey music Tarzan" (this one is a little different)
"Play that junkie music bong boy"
"Play that lunky music loy boy" (I don't really understand this one)
"Play that crunchy music cap'n" (this one is a little different too)

I think everyone should take a little time each day to contemplate the
weighty issues that affect our lives.
------------
http://www.curlesneck.com