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Sprint and Openwave

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Anonymous
May 27, 2005 10:59:37 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

When is Sprint going to get some handsets with Openwave?

VZW has them and you wouldn't believe how much better the internet web
page representation is compared to even the latest Sprint phones.

More about : sprint openwave

Anonymous
May 27, 2005 11:21:49 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

My 4050 has openwave which I think is discontinued now. There may be
newer phones with it.
Anonymous
May 28, 2005 11:32:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Fri, 27 May 2005 18:59:37 GMT, "Steevo@my-deja.com"
<steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:

>When is Sprint going to get some handsets with Openwave?

I believe 100% of the 2G Wireless Web browsers are/were Openwave...;-)
Oh, you meant NEW handsets, sorry.

>VZW has them and you wouldn't believe how much better the internet web
>page representation is compared to even the latest Sprint phones.

From what I hear, Openwave agrees with you that their browsers are a
cut above, and they've priced them accordingly, which is why so few
recent models included them. FWIW, when I switch back and forth
between OW and others, I'm not personally blown away by any
differences - in either direction. They all look pretty much alike to
me, which says just as much about Sprint's web gateway than it does
about the browsers themselves.

--
Paul Miner
Related resources
Anonymous
May 29, 2005 8:28:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Sat, 28 May 2005 19:32:11 GMT, Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid>
wrote:
>>VZW has them and you wouldn't believe how much better the internet web
>>page representation is compared to even the latest Sprint phones.
>
>From what I hear, Openwave agrees with you that their browsers are a
>cut above, and they've priced them accordingly, which is why so few
>recent models included them. FWIW, when I switch back and forth
>between OW and others, I'm not personally blown away by any
>differences - in either direction. They all look pretty much alike to
>me, which says just as much about Sprint's web gateway than it does
>about the browsers themselves.

You might be right. I bet something it being done on the VZW web
backend stuff that is helping alot.

IMHO the Sprint representation of the pages I want to access is
inadequate, the VZW though not perfect is much better.

The other thing I noticed at the VZW kiosk in the mall is that for
what I tested with the LG VX8000 (EV-DO) and the LG VX7000 (non EV-DO)
rendered at about the same speed. No advantage for EV-DO, except for
this: With VZW if you don't subscribe to EV-DO and have an EV-DO
capable handset they charge you like crazy for web usage. With EV-DO
it is $15 a month.

Take a look at any Ebay auction page you like on both a VZW phone and
any Sprint phone. The VZW does a *much* better job. Buttons are
clickable whereas on Sprint they might be the obscure looking 24
digit code you scroll by. Absolutely stupid on Sprint's part.
The only difference seems to be Openwave on VZW (I surmise) .

Maybe it's something else.
Anonymous
May 29, 2005 8:28:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Sun, 29 May 2005 16:28:47 GMT, "Steevo@my-deja.com"
<steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:
>Take a look at any Ebay auction page you like on both a VZW phone and
>any Sprint phone. The VZW does a *much* better job. Buttons are
>clickable whereas on Sprint they might be the obscure looking 24
>digit code you scroll by. Absolutely stupid on Sprint's part.
>The only difference seems to be Openwave on VZW (I surmise) .

With Vision, I've also run into ebay auction pages where confirming
the bid results in an error about mis-matched tags, and no bid is
placed. These pages happen to have a lot of fancy applets on them.
I'm guessing that Vision (or my phone) is rendering the page
improperly when it is stripping out those applets, but who knows.
I've reported the problem to Sprint.

Joe Huber
huber.joseph@comcast.net
Anonymous
May 31, 2005 12:28:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Sun, 29 May 2005 16:28:47 GMT, "Steevo@my-deja.com"
<steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:

>The other thing I noticed at the VZW kiosk in the mall is that for
>what I tested with the LG VX8000 (EV-DO) and the LG VX7000 (non EV-DO)
>rendered at about the same speed. No advantage for EV-DO, except for
>this: With VZW if you don't subscribe to EV-DO and have an EV-DO
>capable handset they charge you like crazy for web usage. With EV-DO
>it is $15 a month.

The "no advantage" thing can be very misleading when a person looks
for obvious differences in accessing normal web content. In that
scenario, latency has almost as much to do with perceived performance
as throughput capability because most web objects are relatively
small. Also, be sure EV-DO RF actually exists in that location before
deciding there is no advantage. I should also mention that there are
scenarios where EV-DO will actually provide worse performance than
1xRTT, but that's the exception rather than the norm.


>Take a look at any Ebay auction page you like on both a VZW phone and
>any Sprint phone. The VZW does a *much* better job. Buttons are
>clickable whereas on Sprint they might be the obscure looking 24
>digit code you scroll by. Absolutely stupid on Sprint's part.
>The only difference seems to be Openwave on VZW (I surmise) .

Thanks, I'll pass that on.

--
Paul Miner
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 9:35:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Mon, 30 May 2005 20:28:38 GMT, Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid>
wrote:
>On Sun, 29 May 2005 16:28:47 GMT, "Steevo@my-deja.com"
><steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
>>The other thing I noticed at the VZW kiosk in the mall is that for
>>what I tested with the LG VX8000 (EV-DO) and the LG VX7000 (non EV-DO)
>>rendered at about the same speed. No advantage for EV-DO, except for
>>this: With VZW if you don't subscribe to EV-DO and have an EV-DO
>>capable handset they charge you like crazy for web usage. With EV-DO
>>it is $15 a month.
>
>The "no advantage" thing can be very misleading when a person looks
>for obvious differences in accessing normal web content. In that
>scenario, latency has almost as much to do with perceived performance
>as throughput capability because most web objects are relatively
>small.
It was an ebay auction page. Minimal content, couple of pictures.
For that the EV-DO seemed to not help at all. Now if I wanted to
watch live video it might help. I cannot imagine my being interested
in watching live video on a cellphone.

>Also, be sure EV-DO RF actually exists in that location before
>deciding there is no advantage.
It does.
>I should also mention that there are
>scenarios where EV-DO will actually provide worse performance than
>1xRTT, but that's the exception rather than the norm.
>
>
>>Take a look at any Ebay auction page you like on both a VZW phone and
>>any Sprint phone. The VZW does a *much* better job. Buttons are
>>clickable whereas on Sprint they might be the obscure looking 24
>>digit code you scroll by. Absolutely stupid on Sprint's part.
>>The only difference seems to be Openwave on VZW (I surmise) .
>
>Thanks, I'll pass that on.
To whom?
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 10:16:09 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 17:35:40 GMT, "Steevo@my-deja.com"
<steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:

>On Mon, 30 May 2005 20:28:38 GMT, Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid>
>wrote:
>>On Sun, 29 May 2005 16:28:47 GMT, "Steevo@my-deja.com"
>><steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:
>>
>>>The other thing I noticed at the VZW kiosk in the mall is that for
>>>what I tested with the LG VX8000 (EV-DO) and the LG VX7000 (non EV-DO)
>>>rendered at about the same speed. No advantage for EV-DO, except for
>>>this: With VZW if you don't subscribe to EV-DO and have an EV-DO
>>>capable handset they charge you like crazy for web usage. With EV-DO
>>>it is $15 a month.
>>
>>The "no advantage" thing can be very misleading when a person looks
>>for obvious differences in accessing normal web content. In that
>>scenario, latency has almost as much to do with perceived performance
>>as throughput capability because most web objects are relatively
>>small.
>It was an ebay auction page. Minimal content, couple of pictures.
>For that the EV-DO seemed to not help at all.

That's understandable and expected, for the most part.

>Now if I wanted to
>watch live video it might help. I cannot imagine my being interested
>in watching live video on a cellphone.

Same here, but apparently there's interest out there. *shrug*

>>>Take a look at any Ebay auction page you like on both a VZW phone and
>>>any Sprint phone. The VZW does a *much* better job. Buttons are
>>>clickable whereas on Sprint they might be the obscure looking 24
>>>digit code you scroll by. Absolutely stupid on Sprint's part.
>>>The only difference seems to be Openwave on VZW (I surmise) .
>>
>>Thanks, I'll pass that on.
>To whom?

To the folks who might be able to do something about it. Sorry I can't
be more specific.

--
Paul Miner
Anonymous
June 3, 2005 12:29:08 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 18:16:09 GMT, Paul Miner <pminer@elrancho.invalid>
wrote:

>>>Thanks, I'll pass that on.
>>To whom?
>
>To the folks who might be able to do something about it. Sorry I can't
>be more specific.
Sprint is listed on the openwave.com website as a customer.
I wonder if it's paid for.
Hmm.
Anonymous
June 8, 2005 2:48:05 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Steevo@my-deja.com wrote:

>>To the folks who might be able to do something about it. Sorry I can't
>>be more specific.
>
> Sprint is listed on the openwave.com website as a customer.
> I wonder if it's paid for.
> Hmm.

FWIW, The LG PM325 is a current production model phone and uses OpenWave.


--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 4:55:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Steevo@my-deja.com wrote:

> Sprint was fine here but has been getting steadily worse in dropped
> calls, no service, etc. in the last couple years. Still not sure if
> the problem is the phone I still have or not but I don't have the guts
> to buy a new one to test. I am out of contract so I have no reason to
> buy a phone from Sprint for any amount of money since I can get a
> *free* phone in exchange for a shiny new contract at *any* carrier.

If I had any reason at all to be in Orange County I'd offer to test my
phone. My wife's phone (a Hitachi SH-P300) is pretty good reception-wise,
but my Samsung VGA-1000 is even better. If *my* phone doesn't work in your
area either, I'd say chances are very good that it's the network.

But while we're planning on visiting Disneyland sometime soon, we're not
sure when, and I'm not sure you're even close to Anaheim.

>>VZW has a lot to recommend them in the LA market, but there is that
>>potential problem and the fact that even though they are the most expensive
>>traditional cellular carrier in the US now, they have started
>>nickling-and-diming their customers...
>
> They sure have. A friend mentioned that, he just switched to VZW from
> Sprint. He is probably saving money in spite since his wife is on
> VZW. Silly for him to be on a different carrier than his wife.

I was on VZW and my wife on Sprint for four years. We got an old Sprint
phone from a friend that I activated for her. She liked the service and
ended up saving a lot of money by paying $5/month for PCS to PCS (over six
HUNDRED PCS to PCS minutes last month!). VZW worked for me so I didn't
bother switching.

> I wish Sprint would fix it. Maybe I should try to scare up some of
> their developers. Is it possible that they actually don't know how
> poorly it works? Nah. Impossible.

I'd suggest calling Tech Support, but I am guessing they probably don't have
the ability to route you to someone who'd be able to fix things. (And
haven't you already called them?)


--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 7:03:16 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

Where do you live in OC?


"Steve Sobol" <sjsobol@JustThe.net> wrote in message
news:D 8a6dd$a48$1@ratbert.glorb.com...
> Steevo@my-deja.com wrote:
>
>> Sprint was fine here but has been getting steadily worse in dropped
>> calls, no service, etc. in the last couple years. Still not sure if
>> the problem is the phone I still have or not but I don't have the guts
>> to buy a new one to test. I am out of contract so I have no reason to
>> buy a phone from Sprint for any amount of money since I can get a
>> *free* phone in exchange for a shiny new contract at *any* carrier.
>
> If I had any reason at all to be in Orange County I'd offer to test my
> phone. My wife's phone (a Hitachi SH-P300) is pretty good reception-wise,
> but my Samsung VGA-1000 is even better. If *my* phone doesn't work in your
> area either, I'd say chances are very good that it's the network.
>
> But while we're planning on visiting Disneyland sometime soon, we're not
> sure when, and I'm not sure you're even close to Anaheim.
>
>>>VZW has a lot to recommend them in the LA market, but there is that
>>>potential problem and the fact that even though they are the most
>>>expensive traditional cellular carrier in the US now, they have started
>>>nickling-and-diming their customers...
>>
>> They sure have. A friend mentioned that, he just switched to VZW from
>> Sprint. He is probably saving money in spite since his wife is on
>> VZW. Silly for him to be on a different carrier than his wife.
>
> I was on VZW and my wife on Sprint for four years. We got an old Sprint
> phone from a friend that I activated for her. She liked the service and
> ended up saving a lot of money by paying $5/month for PCS to PCS (over six
> HUNDRED PCS to PCS minutes last month!). VZW worked for me so I didn't
> bother switching.
>
>> I wish Sprint would fix it. Maybe I should try to scare up some of
>> their developers. Is it possible that they actually don't know how
>> poorly it works? Nah. Impossible.
>
> I'd suggest calling Tech Support, but I am guessing they probably don't
> have the ability to route you to someone who'd be able to fix things. (And
> haven't you already called them?)
>
>
> --
> JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
> Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
> temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)
>
> "Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 8:23:17 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Thu, 9 Jun 2005 08:53:38 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <mijadyaw@nospam.net>
wrote:

>The browser in my Sanyo 7400 performs exceptionally fast. It is much faster
>than a friends LG 6100 on Verizon.

It's not the speed.

It's the representation of the website on Sprint compared to the new
VZW phones with Openwave. Not that there aren't likely websites that
Sprint does represent OK, just that I haven't seen them. The Sprint
browser technology needs work.
Anonymous
June 9, 2005 11:47:23 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

In article <m2oga1tku7b2hvp9836jse7o33opjiseeo@4ax.com>,
Steevo@my-deja.com <steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
>Sometime if convenient, at the mall or whatever, do what I did. Go
>to a verizon kiosk or store, try looking at an ebay page on an
>LGVX8000 or LGVX7000. Openwave browser. It simplified the page,
>rendered it pretty well for a tiny screen. Pictures were tiny but it
>made an attempt to put them there.
>
>Take a look at the same page on any Sprint phone, doesn't matter
>which. Basically screwed up if you can get it at all. Links (buttons)
>are represented as 24 digit incomprehensible numbers. The VZW stuff
>makes an attempt at least to represent that stuff so it can actually
>be used. You really have to be able to read the buttons, or you don't
>know which is submit, cancel, etc. Sprint just left that all out if
>it works at all.

In my experience with Sanyo 8200, some sites that used to work fine
with the old Wireless Web, don't render properly any more (same url).
American Airlines http://www.aa2go.com/ is one of them. Looks to me
that the site is sniffing if it's being accessed from a phone or regular
PC, and returns different pages based on that. And it's not detecting
PM-8200's browser as a phone, and returns the regular page instead.
The same could be happening in your case. Not exactly Sprint's fault.

If that's indeed the problem, you should contact the webmaster of the
site that didn't render properly on Sprint's phone. If I were the
webmaster and got a report like that, I'd setup a simple test page
that I'd ask you to visit, then looked at the information passed by
the browser, and adjusted the sniffing code accordingly.

Oleg


--
oleg | The "From" address is temporary.
@ | <---- If expired, use this one.
sashos |
.com | "Can you count to 1023 on your fingers?"
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 9:15:37 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Thu, 9 Jun 2005 19:47:23 +0000 (UTC), Oleg O. <un-jan05@sashos.com>
wrote:

>In my experience with Sanyo 8200, some sites that used to work fine
>with the old Wireless Web, don't render properly any more (same url).
>American Airlines http://www.aa2go.com/ is one of them. Looks to me
>that the site is sniffing if it's being accessed from a phone or regular
>PC, and returns different pages based on that. And it's not detecting
>PM-8200's browser as a phone, and returns the regular page instead.
>The same could be happening in your case. Not exactly Sprint's fault.

Well, not really. I am not going to give Sprint a pass on this.
I looked at the exact same site on several VZW phones and several
Sprint phones, even one Sprint phone that does have the Openwave
browser. The Sprint representation of the site I looked at (an ebay
auction page) was defective so much as to be unuseable to me. Maybe
others have lower standards, but I doubt it. I am sure the streaming
video works, but I don't care about that on either carrier.

Read some of the thread and you will see my comments. And I tested
pretty thoroughly.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 10:17:31 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

In article <s08ia1513agcs5u52p64osqctpoptgppkc@4ax.com>,
Steevo@my-deja.com <steevo@my-deja.com> wrote:
>On Thu, 9 Jun 2005 19:47:23 +0000 (UTC), Oleg O. <un-jan05@sashos.com>
>wrote:
>
>>In my experience with Sanyo 8200, some sites that used to work fine
>>with the old Wireless Web, don't render properly any more (same url).
>>American Airlines http://www.aa2go.com/ is one of them. Looks to me
>>that the site is sniffing if it's being accessed from a phone or regular
>>PC, and returns different pages based on that. And it's not detecting
>>PM-8200's browser as a phone, and returns the regular page instead.
>>The same could be happening in your case. Not exactly Sprint's fault.
>
>Well, not really. I am not going to give Sprint a pass on this.
>I looked at the exact same site on several VZW phones and several
>Sprint phones, even one Sprint phone that does have the Openwave
>browser. The Sprint representation of the site I looked at (an ebay
>auction page) was defective so much as to be unuseable to me. Maybe
>others have lower standards, but I doubt it. I am sure the streaming
>video works, but I don't care about that on either carrier.
>
>Read some of the thread and you will see my comments. And I tested
>pretty thoroughly.

I've read the thread, thank you. How do you know that the web site is
not returning different pages to different phones? It could be doing
the sniffing by anything, including the IP address, and not getting it
right for Sprint. If that's the case, what do you propose Sprint should
do? (And I know for sure that that was the case with several sites
that were messed up on my phone. And the symptoms you described are
consistent with that.)

By the way, I just tried the eBay Mobile http://mmm.ebay.com from my
Sprint phone, and it's very usable, with pictures and all. Not perfect,
there are still pieces of script visible here and there, but mostly
pretty nice. And all actions are simple text links. How were you
getting to eBay?

Oleg

--
oleg | The "From" address is temporary.
@ | <---- If expired, use this one.
sashos |
.com | "Can you count to 1023 on your fingers?"
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 4:48:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

I just went to the ebay site. It looked good on my phone. But,
without a mouse and a real keyboard, going to web sites is a pain. And
the screen is too small.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 10:32:42 PM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

On Fri, 10 Jun 2005 06:17:31 +0000 (UTC), Oleg O.
<un-jan05@sashos.com> wrote:
>By the way, I just tried the eBay Mobile http://mmm.ebay.com from my
>Sprint phone, and it's very usable, with pictures and all. Not perfect,
>there are still pieces of script visible here and there, but mostly
>pretty nice. And all actions are simple text links. How were you
>getting to eBay?

My experience with ebay on the MM7400 is mixed. I'm generally able to
view all auction pages. Straightforward auction pages work the best.
Many auction pages have fancy applets on them, which don't work in the
browser, and many times seem to inhibiting critical buttons like "bid"
from working. I've reported a few of these bugs to both Sprint and
ebay. Sprint says ebay's fault, ebay says its Sprint's fault (I'm
sure this response surprises very few).

If you plan to use ebay over Vision and you expect to be bidding on
something, I'd recommend puttng in a test bid from your phone early in
the auction.

Joe Huber
huber.joseph@comcast.net
Anonymous
June 11, 2005 5:23:43 AM

Archived from groups: alt.cellular.sprintpcs (More info?)

I don't know if this will help you, but you can try or buy ($20) a
java-app HTML browser for your phone. Take a look at
http://www.reqwireless.com/webviewer.html
I bought it and have used it on a few sites. Haven't tried eBay.

Steevo@my-deja.com wrote:
> On Thu, 9 Jun 2005 08:53:38 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <mijadyaw@nospam.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>The browser in my Sanyo 7400 performs exceptionally fast. It is much faster
>>than a friends LG 6100 on Verizon.
>
>
> It's not the speed.
>
> It's the representation of the website on Sprint compared to the new
> VZW phones with Openwave. Not that there aren't likely websites that
> Sprint does represent OK, just that I haven't seen them. The Sprint
> browser technology needs work.
>

--
Frank Harris in San Francisco with an A680
!