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Lav mic recording: Senn MKE2, DPA4060, Countryman B3, AT89..

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Anonymous
April 6, 2005 10:36:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

I would like to experiment with binaural recording of acoustic/folk music.
I will be recording in a reasonably quiet room with no PA.

Does anyone have any comments on the noise level, and sound quality/clarity of
various lav mic? I'm looking at (in order of increasing price...):

AT899, Countryman B3, Senn MKE2-GOLD, DPA 4060

I know these are all good for voice, but I'm wondering how they compare for
music recording.

I've got prices (without phantom power adapter) of roughly $100 for the AT899
(supposedly on sale), $200 for the Countryman and Sennheiser, and $350-400 for
the DPA. Should I expect peformance on par with these prices? Some people
told me that the Sennheiser sounds better than the Countryman B3. Is that
true? How much difference do people report between the Sennheiser and the
DPA?

Thanks for any help,
Richard
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 6:03:11 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Richard <Mannr@uwaterloo.ca> wrote:

>I would like to experiment with binaural recording of acoustic/folk music.
>I will be recording in a reasonably quiet room with no PA.
>
>Does anyone have any comments on the noise level, and sound quality/clarity of
>various lav mic? I'm looking at (in order of increasing price...):
>
> AT899, Countryman B3, Senn MKE2-GOLD, DPA 4060

Over the years we've listened to all of them and none are as flat or
natural sounding as the DPAs. (We became DPA dealers as a result.)

On the Broadway stage, you'll find that while the Sennheiser were the
old standard, DPA is taking more of the market share now, mostly due to
sound quality (durability is another strong point).

If price is an issue, our CS Binaural mics ($230 to $260 per matched
pair) are a good second to the DPAs.

--
Len Moskowitz PDAudio, Binaural Mics, Cables, DPA, M-Audio
Core Sound http://www.stealthmicrophones.com
Teaneck, New Jersey USA http://www.core-sound.com
moskowit@core-sound.com Tel: 201-801-0812, FAX: 201-801-0912
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 6:03:12 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

moskowit@panix.com (Len Moskowitz) writes:

> Richard <Mannr@uwaterloo.ca> wrote:
>
> >I would like to experiment with binaural recording of acoustic/folk music.
> >I will be recording in a reasonably quiet room with no PA.
> >
> >Does anyone have any comments on the noise level, and sound quality/clarity of
> >various lav mic? I'm looking at (in order of increasing price...):
> >
> > AT899, Countryman B3, Senn MKE2-GOLD, DPA 4060
>
> Over the years we've listened to all of them and none are as flat or
> natural sounding as the DPAs. (We became DPA dealers as a result.)
>
> On the Broadway stage, you'll find that while the Sennheiser were the
> old standard, DPA is taking more of the market share now, mostly due to
> sound quality (durability is another strong point).
>
> If price is an issue, our CS Binaural mics ($230 to $260 per matched
> pair) are a good second to the DPAs.
>
> --
> Len Moskowitz PDAudio, Binaural Mics, Cables, DPA, M-Audio
> Core Sound http://www.stealthmicrophones.com
> Teaneck, New Jersey USA http://www.core-sound.com
> moskowit@core-sound.com Tel: 201-801-0812, FAX: 201-801-0912

Thanks for the suggestions.

But, are you saying that your CSB are better than Sennheiser MKE2, etc? I
find that hard to believe. They're (modified) Panasonic capsules, right? If
that is the case, wouldn't they have more self noise? But I would love to be
proved wrong with some side-by-side comparisons.

Unfortunately I don't have access to most of these mics. So far I've
only heard Panasonic WM-60, WM-61A, and AT853 (omni, card, and hyper), and
AT831 (card). AT853 sound fine, but they're a bit too big to get in my ears
:) .

Richard
Anonymous
April 7, 2005 6:03:12 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Mannr@uwaterloo.ca wrote:
> But, are you saying that your CSB are better than Sennheiser MKE2,
etc? I
> find that hard to believe. They're (modified) Panasonic capsules,
right? If
> that is the case, wouldn't they have more self noise? But I would
love to be
> proved wrong with some side-by-side comparisons.
>
> Unfortunately I don't have access to most of these mics. So far I've
> only heard Panasonic WM-60, WM-61A, and AT853 (omni, card, and
hyper), and
> AT831 (card). AT853 sound fine, but they're a bit too big to get in
my ears

Personally I prefer the Sennheiser ME102 omni's over the Senn
MKE2's, they sound bigger and are less peaky I think.

Will Miho
NY Music and TV Audio Guy
Staff Audio / Fox News / M-AES
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits
Anonymous
April 15, 2005 4:30:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Len Moskowitz wrote:
> There are other considerations for binaural recording. The MKE2's
have
> a 6 dB peak at 12 KHz. The CSBs are dead flat as are our HEBs using
the
> DPA capsules.

I don't know why people always compare to the Senn ME2's. While
the Sennheiser ME102 omni capsules are 2db down @ 100 hz/5db down @
40Hz and have a 4db peak between 8-10k, that's often pretty useful in a
live situation and a mild eq boost, and they sound almost the same off
axis as on axis. (Although I'm sure Len's mics are well worth the
money.)

Anyway I think they're good if you see them around. You can check
out the frequency response/noise spec/spl info for the ME102 capsules
on the pdf here.

http://www.sennheiserusa.com/newsite/pdfs/me102.pdf

Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Staff Audio/Fox News/M-AES
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits
Anonymous
April 15, 2005 7:42:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

<Mannr@uwaterloo.ca> wrote:

>> If price is an issue, our CS Binaural mics ($230 to $260 per matched
>> pair) are a good second to the DPAs.
>
>Thanks for the suggestions.
>
>But, are you saying that your CSB are better than Sennheiser MKE2, etc? I
>find that hard to believe. They're (modified) Panasonic capsules, right? If
>that is the case, wouldn't they have more self noise? But I would love to be
>proved wrong with some side-by-side comparisons.

The CSBs have slightly more noise while the DPAs have slightly less
noise.

There are other considerations for binaural recording. The MKE2's have
a 6 dB peak at 12 KHz. The CSBs are dead flat as are our HEBs using the
DPA capsules.

>Unfortunately I don't have access to most of these mics. So far I've
>only heard Panasonic WM-60, WM-61A, and AT853 (omni, card, and hyper), and
>AT831 (card). AT853 sound fine, but they're a bit too big to get in my ears
>:) .

The AT853 is a cardioid (maybe you're thinking of the AT933?), and
that's the last thing you want for binaural recording. Besides the
increased handling and wind noise, a cardioid polar pattern won't give
you a realistic binaural recording. Try it and see.

--
Len Moskowitz PDAudio, Binaural Mics, Cables, DPA, M-Audio
Core Sound http://www.stealthmicrophones.com
Teaneck, New Jersey USA http://www.core-sound.com
moskowit@core-sound.com Tel: 201-801-0812, FAX: 201-801-0912
Anonymous
April 15, 2005 8:16:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

"WillStG" <willstg@aol.com> writes:

> Len Moskowitz wrote:
> > There are other considerations for binaural recording. The MKE2's
> have
> > a 6 dB peak at 12 KHz. The CSBs are dead flat as are our HEBs using
> the
> > DPA capsules.
>
> I don't know why people always compare to the Senn ME2's. While
> the Sennheiser ME102 omni capsules are 2db down @ 100 hz/5db down @
> 40Hz and have a 4db peak between 8-10k, that's often pretty useful in a
> live situation and a mild eq boost, and they sound almost the same off
> axis as on axis. (Although I'm sure Len's mics are well worth the
> money.)
>
> Anyway I think they're good if you see them around. You can check
> out the frequency response/noise spec/spl info for the ME102 capsules
> on the pdf here.
>
> http://www.sennheiserusa.com/newsite/pdfs/me102.pdf
>
> Will Miho
> NY Music & TV Audio Guy
> Staff Audio/Fox News/M-AES
> "The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

Thanks for the tips on frequency response.

I'm also curious about the clarity or distortion of the mics. Anyway, I've
got a pair of MKE2's now (damn Ebay!), so I'll give them a try. I'm going to
AB them against a pair of Panasonic WM61A capsules.

Richard
!