Double Bass... two different mics or same?

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Hi. I have a D112 that I always use for kick drum miking which I'm
quite happy with. However, at times I find that one such mic isn't
enough for a kit with two kicks.. or if I'm recording two bass cabs,
etc. I'm thinking of purchasing another D112. Howere, the Shure Beta52
looks pretty interesting. I do like to have a variation of mics to
choose from. But should I use the same two mics for such applications
as double kick? I know that a variation in the sound of two kick drums
is desirable.. but I don't know if I should be getting that variation
solely from the playing and the sound of each kick.. or if a variation
in mic's affecting the sound is ok too.
8 answers Last reply
More about double bass mics same
  1. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    docgorpon@aol.com wrote:
    > Hi. I have a D112 that I always use for kick drum miking which I'm
    > quite happy with. However, at times I find that one such mic isn't
    > enough for a kit with two kicks.. or if I'm recording two bass cabs,
    > etc. I'm thinking of purchasing another D112. Howere, the Shure Beta52
    > looks pretty interesting. I do like to have a variation of mics to
    > choose from. But should I use the same two mics for such applications
    > as double kick? I know that a variation in the sound of two kick drums
    > is desirable.. but I don't know if I should be getting that variation
    > solely from the playing and the sound of each kick.. or if a variation
    > in mic's affecting the sound is ok too.
    >
    The simple answer is duplication, get another D112.

    However, something such as a Beta 52 or an AT AE2500 would be fine, too. The main thing you need to
    be concerned with, obviously, is capturing the sound properly to tape/HD.

    It really becomes a matter of choice, taste and what you're striving for. A 52 shouldn't be so
    different as to be "bad" for the session. And variety is a good thing, too.

    --fletch
  2. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    If the drummer uses the same heads and tunes them the same and they are the
    same size bass drum etc you will probably want identical mics. If the drums
    are different though it' not necessarily a requirement to use identical
    mics.

    You may want to get another mic for bass that is a lot different than your
    current one and then compare them for a while, then get a second of the one
    that is most versatile so you have a pair.

    I highly recommend the Audio Technica ATM25 for internal bass drum mic'ing.
    ( somewhere from 3 to 6 inches away from the head usually works for me )

    --
    John L Rice
    Drummer@ImJohn.com

    <docgorpon@aol.com> wrote in message
    news:1113240390.845956.251010@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
    > Hi. I have a D112 that I always use for kick drum miking which I'm
    > quite happy with. However, at times I find that one such mic isn't
    > enough for a kit with two kicks.. or if I'm recording two bass cabs,
    > etc. I'm thinking of purchasing another D112. Howere, the Shure Beta52
    > looks pretty interesting. I do like to have a variation of mics to
    > choose from. But should I use the same two mics for such applications
    > as double kick? I know that a variation in the sound of two kick drums
    > is desirable.. but I don't know if I should be getting that variation
    > solely from the playing and the sound of each kick.. or if a variation
    > in mic's affecting the sound is ok too.
    >
  3. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    In article <1113240390.845956.251010@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
    docgorpon@aol.com wrote:

    > I know that a variation in the sound of two kick drums
    > is desirable..

    Who decided that? What about (arguably more common currently) double
    pedal players? Must they use two different style beaters? It depends on
    the drummer, the song, and the intended vision. I'd usually choose the
    same mic for the typical identical drum double bass kit if possible, but
    it's been a while since I've personally seen two kick drums in a studio.

    Funny, when I saw the topic, I expected a question about a double bass,
    (an upright acoustic bass), not two bass drums.

    --
    Jay Frigoletto
    Mastersuite
    www.promastering.com
  4. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    "Jay-atldigi" <atldigi@aol.com> wrote in message news:atldigi-B4ECC9.00092612042005@news.verizon.net...
    > In article <1113240390.845956.251010@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
    > docgorpon@aol.com wrote:
    >
    > > I know that a variation in the sound of two kick drums
    > > is desirable..

    If it were rock and roll, I'd probably prefer to deal with the comfort of using
    a couple of mics that were the same... I'd expect the tuning of the drums
    to be the sound the drummer wanted and the difference you speak of.
    With a little drumming in my past, I venture that the most likely cause of
    variations in sound would be the technique & playing style of the drummer.
    Knowing that a couple of similar mics were used starting out, one could at
    least be certain of getting a balanced view of what's different about the two
    sounds.

    > Who decided that? What about (arguably more common currently) double
    > pedal players? Must they use two different style beaters? It depends on
    > the drummer, the song, and the intended vision. I'd usually choose the
    > same mic for the typical identical drum double bass kit if possible, but
    > it's been a while since I've personally seen two kick drums in a studio.
    >
    > Funny, when I saw the topic, I expected a question about a double bass,
    > (an upright acoustic bass), not two bass drums.

    Double pedals with single bass drums are just about all I've seen for the
    past several years... and yet there's almost *invariably* a tonal difference
    between notes struck from each of the pedals.

    > --
    > Jay Frigoletto
    > Mastersuite
    > www.promastering.com

    PS: I've been looking for what one or two different microphones people
    would favor on the upright acoustic double bass. <g>

    --
    David Morgan (MAMS)
    http://www.m-a-m-s DOT com
    Morgan Audio Media Service
    Dallas, Texas (214) 662-9901
    _______________________________________
    http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com
  5. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    I guess I forgot to mention that I'm dealing mostly with metal or
    hardcore type bands. My idea that kick drums shouldn't sound the same
    is, I guess, from hearing such bands as Slayer in which you can hear
    the two different kicks going back and forth (almost sounds like
    they're different sizes or tuned differently sometimes). That's how I
    like it to sound, as opposed to some other people that have the exact
    same sound for each kick, almost sounding like a trigger or something..
    so that the double bass ends up being this continuous, annoying,
    headache inducing sound throughout the song.
  6. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    In article <1113320165.189809.229380@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
    <docgorpon@aol.com> wrote:
    >I guess I forgot to mention that I'm dealing mostly with metal or
    >hardcore type bands. My idea that kick drums shouldn't sound the same
    >is, I guess, from hearing such bands as Slayer in which you can hear
    >the two different kicks going back and forth (almost sounds like
    >they're different sizes or tuned differently sometimes). That's how I
    >like it to sound, as opposed to some other people that have the exact
    >same sound for each kick, almost sounding like a trigger or something..
    >so that the double bass ends up being this continuous, annoying,
    >headache inducing sound throughout the song.

    My issue is that you can basically get only one kick drum sound out
    of the D112. With something like an SM-7 or an RE-20 or even a 421,
    you can do a lot of heavy equalization to get different drum sounds,
    but the D112 is already so peaky there isn't much you can do with it.
    Either you like the sound you get from it, or you use another mike, you
    can't do much else.

    With an RE-20 and a parametric you can make it sound a lot like a D112.
    With a D112, you can only make it sound like a D112.
    --scott

    --
    "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  7. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    "Scott Dorsey" <kludge@panix.com> wrote in message
    news:d3gqt6$sr7$1@panix2.panix.com...
    > In article <1113320165.189809.229380@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
    > <docgorpon@aol.com> wrote:
    >>I guess I forgot to mention that I'm dealing mostly with metal or
    >>hardcore type bands. My idea that kick drums shouldn't sound the same
    >>is, I guess, from hearing such bands as Slayer in which you can hear
    >>the two different kicks going back and forth (almost sounds like
    >>they're different sizes or tuned differently sometimes). That's how I
    >>like it to sound, as opposed to some other people that have the exact
    >>same sound for each kick, almost sounding like a trigger or something..
    >>so that the double bass ends up being this continuous, annoying,
    >>headache inducing sound throughout the song.
    >
    > My issue is that you can basically get only one kick drum sound out
    > of the D112. With something like an SM-7 or an RE-20 or even a 421,
    > you can do a lot of heavy equalization to get different drum sounds,
    > but the D112 is already so peaky there isn't much you can do with it.
    > Either you like the sound you get from it, or you use another mike, you
    > can't do much else.
    >
    > With an RE-20 and a parametric you can make it sound a lot like a D112.
    > With a D112, you can only make it sound like a D112.
    > --scott
    >
    > --
    > "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

    And while I don't own any of the mics Scott mentioned, ( definitely someday
    though ), I agree with wanting to have a versatile mic and the ATM25 has
    worked out very similarly for me as it seems to be easy to dial in a lot of
    different sounds with EQ (click, boom and punch are all there if you need
    them )

    --
    John L Rice
    Drummer@ImJohn.com
  8. Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

    docgorpon@aol.com wrote:
    > Hi. I have a D112 that I always use for kick drum miking which I'm
    > quite happy with. However, at times I find that one such mic isn't
    > enough for a kit with two kicks.. or if I'm recording two bass cabs,
    > etc. I'm thinking of purchasing another D112. Howere, the Shure Beta52
    > looks pretty interesting. I do like to have a variation of mics to
    > choose from. But should I use the same two mics for such applications
    > as double kick? I know that a variation in the sound of two kick drums
    > is desirable.. but I don't know if I should be getting that variation
    > solely from the playing and the sound of each kick.. or if a variation
    > in mic's affecting the sound is ok too.
    >

    If you WANT both drums to sound different then, sure, go with different
    mics, but keep in the mind that the Beta52 and the D112 are very
    different beasts. The 52 is very deep sounding with a crisper high end
    than the D112. The D112 will deliver much more attack and smack of the
    bass drum, but not quite as much in thumpy low end. This may be the
    effect that you want (i.e. one bass drum as a nice low main kick and the
    other as accent).

    The 52 is my main kick mic and i love it. It takes a little time to
    figure out what it likes in terms of positioning, but once you're
    familiar with it you'll love it.

    Roach
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