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Recording "Good Musicians" sure makes it easier.

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Anonymous
June 1, 2005 10:19:18 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

It sure is a pleasure to record a good group of musicians. The good
ones have great ears, production awareness, great dynamics and band
chemistry. Once I get good levels I pretty much don't have to do
anything but enjoy what I'm recording. Good musicians know when play up
front or underneath. They have good awareness and react nicely to what
the other members of the group are doing. Mixdown and the whole
production goes a lot smoother too.

In contrast a not so good group makes the project more demanding.I
guess the bottom line is if the music is good and recording is half way
decent the good music will prevail. Having an excellent recording and
not so good music is not going to perk up very many ears.


Stan
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 2:00:10 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

> In contrast a not so good group makes the project more demanding.I
> guess the bottom line is if the music is good and recording is half way
> decent the good music will prevail. Having an excellent recording and
> not so good music is not going to perk up very many ears.

Good music will often shine through a mediocre recording. (And supurb
music will battle its way through a poor recording if that recording is
at least reasonably balanced, though that requires a more dedicated
listener.)

A good recording of a poor performance may actually expose more of the
flaws and make it worse... though one can argue that if that's the
situation, a technically inferior recording which masks those flaws is a
better example of the recordist's art.
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 10:12:49 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

The message not the medium...
Related resources
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 11:03:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

skingfong@yahoo.com wrote:
> It sure is a pleasure to record a good group of musicians. The good
> ones have great ears, production awareness, great dynamics and band
> chemistry. Once I get good levels I pretty much don't have to do
> anything but enjoy what I'm recording. Good musicians know when play up
> front or underneath. They have good awareness and react nicely to what
> the other members of the group are doing. Mixdown and the whole
> production goes a lot smoother too.
>
> In contrast a not so good group makes the project more demanding.I
> guess the bottom line is if the music is good and recording is half way
> decent the good music will prevail. Having an excellent recording and
> not so good music is not going to perk up very many ears.
>

This is the answer to the often-asked question on this and other NGs:
"how do I get the sound of the Beatles (or insert name of group here)?"

Karl Winkler
Lectrosonics, Inc.
http://www.lectrosonics.com
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 2:02:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1117675158.059595.106070@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com> skingfong@yahoo.com writes:

> It sure is a pleasure to record a good group of musicians. The good
> ones have great ears, production awareness, great dynamics and band
> chemistry. Once I get good levels I pretty much don't have to do
> anything but enjoy what I'm recording.

Isn't it nice? This is why I take clients by invitation only.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 3:15:15 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

skingfong@yahoo.com wrote:

> It sure is a pleasure to record a good group of musicians.
The good
> ones have great ears, production awareness, great dynamics
and band
> chemistry. Once I get good levels I pretty much don't have
to do
> anything but enjoy what I'm recording. Good musicians know
when play
> up front or underneath. They have good awareness and react
nicely to
> what the other members of the group are doing. Mixdown and
the whole
> production goes a lot smoother too.

Agreed.

It's nice not having problems like:

(1) This guy took a break during verses two and three so
should I dump his track for the whole song? What about the
spill of his singing into the the mics of the people
standing next to him?

(2) This girl is off-key whenever she goes above a certain
note, so what about her?

(3) It took a while for the singers to get in synch with the
instrumentalists...

(4) The pianist and the electonic keyboardist seemed to be
playing off different pages...

(5) These two guys started having a contest to see who could
sing the loudest...

(6) The guitarist seemed to get tired towards the end of the
set based on how he played...

> In contrast a not so good group makes the project more
demanding.I
> guess the bottom line is if the music is good and
recording is half
> way decent the good music will prevail. Having an
excellent recording
> and not so good music is not going to perk up very many
ears.

If you record live - there's an addition source of blessing
or pain: the room.

My daily driver venue is an acoustcal can of worms, which
is umm, character building.

Every once in a while I get to work in a room with good
acoustics and its almost like I have nothing to do.

Then there's the equipment. The longed-for 02R96 showed up,
which is going to be the end of the SR32 with bad ribbons.
But anybody who tells you that the learning curve for a
digital console is really short has to be part of the sales
staff...
Anonymous
June 2, 2005 5:39:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

>
> If you record live - there's an addition source of blessing
> or pain: the room.

Especially when you're competing with the house PA.

Stan
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 1:43:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

Trying to save money by hiring amateur musicians is one of the most
common and costly mistakes that gets made by amateur producers.
Fortunately, they often learn not to after doing it approximately once.

The commonest and most tempting element in this disaster-in-the-making
is hiring the musical equivalent of "my cousin Vinnie" (who plays the
bass, or keyboards or whetever) who will "save us a lot of money"
because he'll play for free. Vinnie's a great guy and all, and has a
decent instrument, but it turns out he can't cut it in the studio for
beans. So five times as much studio time is paid for while Vinnie and
other "not ready for prime time players" struggle mightily to make a
recording that is doomed to inferiority before it starts.

Spending much more on professional (or at least *highly* skilled)
musicians makes for an easy, efficient session with vastly better
results, and costs less (in dollars as well as mental wear and tear)
than the "cheaper" approach. It's also, as you mentioned, much easier
to record and mix well.

Been there (both places)...
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 8:03:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1117903404.806285.235230@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com> prestokid@aol.com writes:

> "my cousin Vinnie" (who plays the
> bass, or keyboards or whetever) who will "save us a lot of money"
> because he'll play for free. Vinnie's a great guy and all, and has a
> decent instrument, but it turns out he can't cut it in the studio for
> beans. So five times as much studio time is paid for while Vinnie and
> other "not ready for prime time players" struggle mightily to make a
> recording that is doomed to inferiority before it starts.

Much of this sort of thing happens in personal studios, however, so
dollars-per-hour for studio time isn't a concern. (This is the primary
reason for owning a studio, it seems) It takes more time to complete
the project, however, and often it never gets completed.

> Spending much more on professional (or at least *highly* skilled)
> musicians makes for an easy, efficient session with vastly better
> results, and costs less (in dollars as well as mental wear and tear)
> than the "cheaper" approach.

We try to say that about hiring a studio to do the recording tasks,
too, but it usually doesn't work, because "Cousin Vinnie" will need a
lot of time to get his parts down.

And so the circle closes.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mrivers@d-and-d.com)
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo
Anonymous
June 4, 2005 11:07:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

In article <1117903404.806285.235230@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
prestokid@aol.com wrote:

> Trying to save money by hiring amateur musicians is one of the most
> common and costly mistakes that gets made by amateur producers.
> Fortunately, they often learn not to after doing it approximately once.
>
> The commonest and most tempting element in this disaster-in-the-making
> is hiring the musical equivalent of "my cousin Vinnie" (who plays the
> bass, or keyboards or whetever) who will "save us a lot of money"
> because he'll play for free. Vinnie's a great guy and all, and has a
> decent instrument, but it turns out he can't cut it in the studio for
> beans. So five times as much studio time is paid for while Vinnie and
> other "not ready for prime time players" struggle mightily to make a
> recording that is doomed to inferiority before it starts.
>
> Spending much more on professional (or at least *highly* skilled)
> musicians makes for an easy, efficient session with vastly better
> results, and costs less (in dollars as well as mental wear and tear)
> than the "cheaper" approach. It's also, as you mentioned, much easier
> to record and mix well.
>
> Been there (both places)...


Funny thing is that on an unlimited no of productions there is that
flute unbelievably bad played (probably by saxophone player friend) or
that violin played by who? (sounds like your average subway musician)

Why is it that really big artists like Brian Wilson or Sara K (enter
almost ANY name) performs with string ensembles that are only
professionals in the sense that they probably get paid? Why?

One thought, a better musician might want to do takes until he/she is
happy which takes more time? But the higher level will do multiple good
takes that you can choose from...

This bothers me anyhow...

--
Joakim Wendel
Remove obvious mail JUNK block for mail reply.

My homepage : http://violinist.nu
Anonymous
June 6, 2005 10:23:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.audio.pro (More info?)

skingfong@yahoo.com wrote:
>> If you record live - there's an addition source of
blessing
>> or pain: the room.
>
> Especially when you're competing with the house PA.

Our room is so reverberent that turning off the PA hardly
helps.
!