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FYI, a real PDA virus found... for PPC

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Anonymous
August 6, 2004 7:40:38 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/05/pocketpc_trojan...

Trojan horse stalks PocketPC
By John Leyden
Published Thursday 5th August 2004 14:11 GMT

Russian virus hunters Kaspersky Labs have detected a Trojan horse
programme capable of infecting PDAs running Microsoft's PocketPC
operating system.

Although a very small number of PocketPC viruses have been located,
Brador-A is said to be the first backdoor program capable of infecting
handhelds running PocketPC. Previous PocketPC viruses have been written
as experiments in coding not for malicious intent. Brador-A breaks this
pattern by coming pre-loaded with a series of malicious routines.

--
Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

"Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we, They never
stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and
neither do we." - George W. Bush, Aug 5, 2004
Anonymous
August 7, 2004 6:09:55 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article
news:<0dd6h0d4v99tdf36tiqb88mnjk5om76h79@news20.forteinc.com>,
Jeffrey Kaplan wrote:
> Russian virus hunters Kaspersky Labs have detected a Trojan horse
> programme capable of infecting PDAs running Microsoft's PocketPC
> operating system.

So NOT a virus, then. Nor does the article in The Register call it
one (though it comes pretty close).

Please learn the difference.

Cheers,
Daniel.
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 5:09:00 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Daniel James said:

; So NOT a virus, then. Nor does the article in The Register call it
; one (though it comes pretty close).
;
; Please learn the difference.

The technical difference is lost on most people, and on some issues
where the technical difference makes no difference to what is
happening, I've stopped caring about making people learn. Instead, I
have adapted to putting it in terms that will be understood.

--
Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

"I also -- you know when I think UN, I mean, I also think of member
states within the UN. And, of course, we would like a larger role for
member states of the United Nations to participate in Iraq. I mean,
after all, we've got member states now, Great Britain and Poland,
leading multinational divisions to help make the country more secure."
- George W. Bush, 9/21/03 re: Iraq
Related resources
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Anonymous
August 8, 2004 3:34:23 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article
news:<v5dbh0pt23vndiiq977ohu2mqe6mku1pna@news20.forteinc.com>, Jeffrey
Kaplan wrote:
> ; So NOT a virus, then.
[snip]
> ; Please learn the difference.
>
> The technical difference is lost on most people, and on some issues
> where the technical difference makes no difference to what is
> happening, I've stopped caring about making people learn. Instead, I
> have adapted to putting it in terms that will be understood.

OK, so you're not ignorant of the correct usage of the terms "virus"
and "trojan horse" -- you just decided to use the wrong term on
purpose. That's worse than not knowing.

People would still have understood if you had called it a trojan horse,
and you would have avoided confusing the issue by incorrectly calling
it virus.

The difference is quite important, and your disinformation does not
help. It does not help us to understand what you mean, and it does not
help people to recognize the distinction between the terms.

Language matters. Getting it right *is* important.

Cheers,
Daniel.
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 9:20:38 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

"Daniel James" <wastebasket@nospam.aaisp.org> wrote in message
news:VA.00000806.05323f65@nospam.aaisp.org...
> In article
> news:<v5dbh0pt23vndiiq977ohu2mqe6mku1pna@news20.forteinc.com>, Jeffrey
> Kaplan wrote:
> > ; So NOT a virus, then.
> [snip]
> > ; Please learn the difference.
> >
> > The technical difference is lost on most people, and on some issues
> > where the technical difference makes no difference to what is
> > happening, I've stopped caring about making people learn. Instead, I
> > have adapted to putting it in terms that will be understood.
>
> OK, so you're not ignorant of the correct usage of the terms "virus"
> and "trojan horse" -- you just decided to use the wrong term on
> purpose. That's worse than not knowing.
>
> People would still have understood if you had called it a trojan horse,
> and you would have avoided confusing the issue by incorrectly calling
> it virus.
>
> The difference is quite important, and your disinformation does not
> help. It does not help us to understand what you mean, and it does not
> help people to recognize the distinction between the terms.
>
> Language matters. Getting it right *is* important.
>
> Cheers,
> Daniel.

I have to respectfully disagree here. What difference does it make if you
have a trojan horse or a virus? Either way you have unwanted code on your
computer or PDA. I think you're being overly hard on the poster. He did post
a link to the article so you can decide for yourself. No disinformation and
no disservice as far as I can see.

TC
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 9:20:39 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 17:20:38 GMT, "Tony Clark"
<curiousgeorge1964@hotmail.com> was understood to have stated the
following:

>
>I have to respectfully disagree here. What difference does it make if you
>have a trojan horse or a virus? Either way you have unwanted code on your

It makes a *considerable* difference, as Daniel states. That the
difference is lost on the average Microsoft customer is irrelevant to
the prudence of a proper post.

>computer or PDA. I think you're being overly hard on the poster. He did post
>a link to the article so you can decide for yourself. No disinformation and
>no disservice as far as I can see.

viruses tend to be self-replication, whereas trojans do not. Viruses
also tend to have more destructive purposes than trojans. *Massive*
difference there, IMO.
August 8, 2004 9:24:35 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Daniel James <wastebasket@nospam.aaisp.org> wrote in message news:<VA.00000806.05323f65@nospam.aaisp.org>...
> In article
> news:<v5dbh0pt23vndiiq977ohu2mqe6mku1pna@news20.forteinc.com>, Jeffrey
> Kaplan wrote:
> > ; So NOT a virus, then.
> [snip]
> > ; Please learn the difference.
> >
> > The technical difference is lost on most people, and on some issues
> > where the technical difference makes no difference to what is
> > happening, I've stopped caring about making people learn. Instead, I
> > have adapted to putting it in terms that will be understood.
>
> OK, so you're not ignorant of the correct usage of the terms "virus"
> and "trojan horse" -- you just decided to use the wrong term on
> purpose. That's worse than not knowing.
>
> People would still have understood if you had called it a trojan horse,
> and you would have avoided confusing the issue by incorrectly calling
> it virus.
>
> The difference is quite important, and your disinformation does not
> help. It does not help us to understand what you mean, and it does not
> help people to recognize the distinction between the terms.
>
> Language matters. Getting it right *is* important.
>
> Cheers,
> Daniel.

Hey dickhead,

Instead of trolling Jeffrey Kaplan with your useless monotonous
babble, why not enlighten us about the differences between a virus and
a trojan horse? Your posts on usenet would be so much more meaningful.
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 10:41:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

I concur. Viruses, trogan horses, spyware, popups and adware are at some
level bundled under a single term "malware". Sometimes more detail adds
little added value to the average user.

On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 17:20:38 GMT, Tony Clark
<curiousgeorge1964@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> "Daniel James" <wastebasket@nospam.aaisp.org> wrote in message
> news:VA.00000806.05323f65@nospam.aaisp.org...
>> In article
>> news:<v5dbh0pt23vndiiq977ohu2mqe6mku1pna@news20.forteinc.com>, Jeffrey
>> Kaplan wrote:
>> > ; So NOT a virus, then.
>> [snip]
>> > ; Please learn the difference.
>> >
>> > The technical difference is lost on most people, and on some issues
>> > where the technical difference makes no difference to what is
>> > happening, I've stopped caring about making people learn. Instead, I
>> > have adapted to putting it in terms that will be understood.
>>
>> OK, so you're not ignorant of the correct usage of the terms "virus"
>> and "trojan horse" -- you just decided to use the wrong term on
>> purpose. That's worse than not knowing.
>>
>> People would still have understood if you had called it a trojan horse,
>> and you would have avoided confusing the issue by incorrectly calling
>> it virus.
>>
>> The difference is quite important, and your disinformation does not
>> help. It does not help us to understand what you mean, and it does not
>> help people to recognize the distinction between the terms.
>>
>> Language matters. Getting it right *is* important.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Daniel.
>
> I have to respectfully disagree here. What difference does it make if you
> have a trojan horse or a virus? Either way you have unwanted code on your
> computer or PDA. I think you're being overly hard on the poster. He did
> post
> a link to the article so you can decide for yourself. No disinformation
> and
> no disservice as far as I can see.
>
> TC
>
>



--
_____________
Thank a veteran
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 10:41:01 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 18:41:00 GMT, "George Fragos"
<fragos@earthlink.net> was understood to have stated the following:

>I concur. Viruses, trogan horses, spyware, popups and adware are at some
>level bundled under a single term "malware". Sometimes more detail adds
>little added value to the average user.

Then wouldn't it be more appropriate to write "FRI, a real PDA malware
app found.. for PPC" as opposed to "FRI, a real PDA virus found.. for
PPC?" Not that it matters, but I believe that as much accuracy as
possible should be present in a post. Intentional mislabeling of
something will increase confusion, not reduce it.


--

The last song I started on my PC was: Dracula Moon-Joan Osborne-Relish
This is track 39 of 1023 in the current playlist.
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 10:41:02 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

David W. Poole, Jr. rose quietly and spake the following:

> On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 18:41:00 GMT, "George Fragos"
> <fragos@earthlink.net> was understood to have stated the following:
>
>>I concur. Viruses, trogan horses, spyware, popups and adware are at some
>>level bundled under a single term "malware". Sometimes more detail adds
>>little added value to the average user.
>
> Then wouldn't it be more appropriate to write "FRI, a real PDA malware
> app found.. for PPC" as opposed to "FRI, a real PDA virus found.. for
> PPC?" Not that it matters, but I believe that as much accuracy as
> possible should be present in a post. Intentional mislabeling of
> something will increase confusion, not reduce it.

If you believe in accuracy, than you should be quoting "FYI" not "FRI." ;) 

--
Derek

"Congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of sXXXch, or the right
of the people peaceably to XXXemble, and to peXXXion the government for a
redress of grievances."
--but your ISP might.
Anonymous
August 8, 2004 11:34:03 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Sun, 8 Aug 2004 17:24:03 -0500, Derek <news@gwinn.us> was
understood to have stated the following:

>If you believe in accuracy, than you should be quoting "FYI" not "FRI." ;) 

That *might* help. :-D


--

The last song I started on my PC was: Lead My Follow-Brother Cane-Wishpool
This is track 61 of 1023 in the current playlist.
Anonymous
August 9, 2004 12:43:19 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On 8 Aug 2004 17:24:35 -0700, darkcomet@att.net (Sceptre) was
understood to have stated the following:

>
>Hey dickhead,
>
>Instead of trolling Jeffrey Kaplan with your useless monotonous
>babble, why not enlighten us about the differences between a virus and
>a trojan horse? Your posts on usenet would be so much more meaningful.

While I'm not the poster you're replying too, I'll offer:

Virus and Trojans have differing delivery methods, and typically have
different payloads.


--

The last song I started on my PC was: Mic Check-Rage Against the Machine-The Battle of Los Angeles
This is track 74 of 1023 in the current playlist.
Anonymous
August 9, 2004 5:26:49 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

David W. Poole, Jr.
<LauraBushMurderedHerBoyfriendIsATroll.20.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com>
wrote:
> On 8 Aug 2004 17:24:35 -0700, darkcomet@att.net (Sceptre) was
> understood to have stated the following:
>
>> Hey dickhead,
>>
>> Instead of trolling Jeffrey Kaplan with your useless monotonous
>> babble, why not enlighten us about the differences between a virus
>> and a trojan horse? Your posts on usenet would be so much more
>> meaningful.
>
> While I'm not the poster you're replying too, I'll offer:
>
> Virus and Trojans have differing delivery methods, and typically have
> different payloads.

It's quite simple to understand the difference -- a trojan, like the Trojan
horse it was named after, is something that pretends to be innocent, causing
the user to download and/or run it, while a virus is a parasite that you
catch without knowing it, and which spreads itself.

The difference between a worm and a virus can be harder to see, but just
like real life viruses and worms, the virus is a parasite on other programs
or media, while a worm is a full and independent creature, that might need
other parts for sustenance, but moves around on its own.

I don't hold it against people if they don't see the difference between a
worm and a virus, but the very *name* "Trojan" should make anyone understand
the basics of how it works, and that it's always spread through the
ignorance and/or stupidity of the recepient.
An indication that computers may now be smarter than people is that the
Trojans outnumber the worms and viruses by quite a margin. :-)

Regards,
--
*Art
Anonymous
August 9, 2004 4:49:10 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

In article news:<GhtRc.13118$9Y6.13033@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
Tony Clark wrote:
> I have to respectfully disagree here. What difference does it make if you
> have a trojan horse or a virus?

It matters because viruses and trojans operate in completely different ways,
and so quite different steps are required to prevent them.

> I think you're being overly hard on the poster. He did post a link to
> the article so you can decide for yourself. No disinformation and
> no disservice as far as I can see.

The disinformation is in the subject line. I'm only being hard on him because
he compounded his error by making a half-baked attempt to defend the mistake
when I first corrected him.

Cheers,
Daniel.
Anonymous
August 9, 2004 4:53:25 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Daniel James said:

; The disinformation is in the subject line. I'm only being hard on him because
; he compounded his error by making a half-baked attempt to defend the mistake
; when I first corrected him.

Taking it to the larger market of the PC for a moment. How many
"anti-trojan" applications are there? How many "anti-virus"
applications? How many of the AVs also scan and remove trojans?
Everyone knows what a computer virus is, but I have had people ask me
what I meant when I mentioned a trojan.

When you get to the nitty gritty, yes, they are different. But I stand
by my previous statement that it is a difference that makes no
difference to the effected end user.

--
Jeffrey Kaplan www.gordol.org
The from userid is killfiled Send personal mail to gordol

"You cannot be president of the United States if you don't have faith.
Remember Lincoln, going to his knees in times of trial and the Civil
War and all that stuff. You can't be. And we are blessed. So don't
feel sorry for George W. Bush, don't cry for me, Argentina." - George
W. Bush
Anonymous
August 11, 2004 12:37:13 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

Jeffrey Kaplan <cspp@gordol.org> wrote in message news:<chafh0dll670112rhgk3ms2sjem9c5jrqh@news20.forteinc.com>...
> Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Daniel James said:
>
> ; The disinformation is in the subject line. I'm only being hard on him because
> ; he compounded his error by making a half-baked attempt to defend the mistake
> ; when I first corrected him.
>
> Taking it to the larger market of the PC for a moment. How many
> "anti-trojan" applications are there? How many "anti-virus"
> applications? How many of the AVs also scan and remove trojans?
> Everyone knows what a computer virus is, but I have had people ask me
> what I meant when I mentioned a trojan.
>
> When you get to the nitty gritty, yes, they are different. But I stand
> by my previous statement that it is a difference that makes no
> difference to the effected end user.

As long as you continue to use the wrong terminology, you perpetuate
the ignorance. Where does it end?!?!?!
Anonymous
August 11, 2004 1:25:46 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On 10 Aug 2004 20:37:13 -0700,
DieSpammersDie.20.dwpj65@spamgourmet.com (David W. Poole, Jr.) wrote:

>Jeffrey Kaplan <cspp@gordol.org> wrote in message news:<chafh0dll670112rhgk3ms2sjem9c5jrqh@news20.forteinc.com>...
>> Previously on comp.sys.palmtops.pilot, Daniel James said:
>>
>> ; The disinformation is in the subject line. I'm only being hard on him because
>> ; he compounded his error by making a half-baked attempt to defend the mistake
>> ; when I first corrected him.
>>
>> Taking it to the larger market of the PC for a moment. How many
>> "anti-trojan" applications are there? How many "anti-virus"
>> applications? How many of the AVs also scan and remove trojans?
>> Everyone knows what a computer virus is, but I have had people ask me
>> what I meant when I mentioned a trojan.
>>
>> When you get to the nitty gritty, yes, they are different. But I stand
>> by my previous statement that it is a difference that makes no
>> difference to the effected end user.
>
>As long as you continue to use the wrong terminology, you perpetuate
>the ignorance. Where does it end?!?!?!

When you guys quit perpetuating the thread by beating the horse to
death. Let it go please.. first and final comment...
Anonymous
August 11, 2004 9:38:48 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

"krewl" <krewl@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:7s7jh0hbica1focdpfeje3l76km3m3bvtl@4ax.com...
> On 10 Aug 2004 20:37:13 -0700,
SNIP

> >
> >As long as you continue to use the wrong terminology, you perpetuate
> >the ignorance. Where does it end?!?!?!
>
> When you guys quit perpetuating the thread by beating the horse to
> death. Let it go please.. first and final comment...

Whoa there big fella. This is NOT a Dead Horse, this is a Moot Point. You
see the difference is that a Dead Horse is an issue that we all agree has
been resolved whereas a Moot Point is an issue that has no relevance. I
think you can see where I am going with this....


LOL

Cheers
TC
Anonymous
August 11, 2004 9:38:49 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.palmtops.pilot (More info?)

On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 05:38:48 GMT, "Tony Clark"
<curiousgeorge1964@hotmail.com> was understood to have stated the
following:

>> When you guys quit perpetuating the thread by beating the horse to
>> death. Let it go please.. first and final comment...
>
>Whoa there big fella. This is NOT a Dead Horse, this is a Moot Point. You
>see the difference is that a Dead Horse is an issue that we all agree has
>been resolved whereas a Moot Point is an issue that has no relevance. I
>think you can see where I am going with this....

I don't think it's a Moot Point in the least! If we continue to dumb
it down, before long, there will be *nothing* but Microsoft
customers.....
!