How's the english?

[Guest]

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No I'm not asking you to say whether my english is good or bad. But
sometimes when writing, I'm not quite sure whether the phrases I use are
correct, old-fashoned or just meaningless.

My point is: feel free to correct me whenever you spot
errors/peculiarities in my ckmnasdfmaskfd. I won't be hurt.

But, I will never succumb to the american way of writing 'flavor',
'honor', 'color'...!

pibbour
BTW1: If english is difficult sometimes, german is worse, because there
are so many norwegian words than looks like german.
BTW2:
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[Guest]

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pibbur wrote:

> My point is: feel free to correct me whenever you spot
> errors/peculiarities in my ckmnasdfmaskfd. I won't be hurt.

Usage.

--
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[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

On Sun, 22 May 2005 08:29:43 +0200, Cape Dweller <usenet@ciotog.net> wrote:

> pibbur wrote:
>
>> My point is: feel free to correct me whenever you spot
>> errors/peculiarities in my ckmnasdfmaskfd. I won't be hurt.
>
> Usage.
>
Thank you. I didn't spot that one.

pibbour


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pibbur wrote:

> Thank you. I didn't spot that one.

No problem! So that's kinda what you're looking for?

--
Cape Dweller Dragon
Remember, I've got a debt to pay. It's about quantity, not quality.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

pibbur wrote:
> No I'm not asking you to say whether my english is good or bad. But
> sometimes when writing, I'm not quite sure whether the phrases I use
> are correct, old-fashoned or just meaningless.
>
> But, I will never succumb to the american way of writing 'flavor',
> 'honor', 'color'...!
>
> pibbour
> BTW1: If english is difficult sometimes, german is worse, because there
> are so many norwegian words than looks like german.

Might that perhaps be because the languages have common ancestry?

Heck, ENGLISH has common ancestry with German, not that you'd know to
look at it; we've imported so much from Greek and Latin since then.

But it would probably be more apparent in older versions of the language.

-Lumina Dragon

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Words to the wise, Lumina Dragon <kewhitte@hotmail.com> wrote:

>> BTW1: If english is difficult sometimes, german is worse, because there
>> are so many norwegian words than looks like german.
>
>Might that perhaps be because the languages have common ancestry?
>
>Heck, ENGLISH has common ancestry with German, not that you'd know to
>look at it; we've imported so much from Greek and Latin since then.

Middle-Age German and Middle-Age English are very very similar.

The imports English has which are derived from Latin (which might be
derived from Greek), all come from French, or better said, the normans
who settled down in England after Hastings, 1066.

>But it would probably be more apparent in older versions of the language.

Yes, see above.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

On Sun, 05 Jun 2005 20:36:21 +0200, Lumina Dragon <kewhitte@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> pibbur wrote:
>> No I'm not asking you to say whether my english is good or bad. But
>> sometimes when writing, I'm not quite sure whether the phrases I use
>> are correct, old-fashoned or just meaningless.
>> But, I will never succumb to the american way of writing 'flavor',
>> 'honor', 'color'...!
>> pibbour
>> BTW1: If english is difficult sometimes, german is worse, because
>> there are so many norwegian words than looks like german.
>
> Might that perhaps be because the languages have common ancestry?
>
> Heck, ENGLISH has common ancestry with German, not that you'd know to
> look at it; we've imported so much from Greek and Latin since then.
>
> But it would probably be more apparent in older versions of the language.
>
> -Lumina Dragon

Consider for instance the old germaic word for our beloved planet:

'erthu'

which became:

'Erde' in german
'earth' in english
'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to 'jor'
is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.

pibbur

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Words to the wise, pibbur <dragon42@nomail.land> wrote:

>Consider for instance the old germaic word for our beloved planet:
>
>'erthu'
>
>which became:
>
>'Erde' in german
>'earth' in english
>'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to 'jor'
>is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.

Fjord?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Eek! Claus Dragon wrote:
<snip>
> Fjord?

No, fnord!

--
Ashikaga a27

 

[Guest]

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On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 23:54:42 +0200, Claus Dragon
<claus@ultima-dragons.org> wrote:

> Words to the wise, pibbur <dragon42@nomail.land> wrote:
>
>> Consider for instance the old germaic word for our beloved planet:
>>
>> 'erthu'
>>
>> which became:
>>
>> 'Erde' in german
>> 'earth' in english
>> 'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to
>> 'jor'
>> is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.
>
> Fjord?

It may be a similar phenomenon here. I can't find the germanic word for
"fjord", but we have the english word "firth" which according to
"Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow inlet of the sea.".

pibbur

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[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Words to the wise, pibbur <oopsREMOVETHISANDxx.xx000@tele2xx.xxno>
wrote:

>>> 'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to
>>> 'jor'
>>> is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.
>>
>> Fjord?
>
>It may be a similar phenomenon here. I can't find the germanic word for
>"fjord", but we have the english word "firth" which according to
>"Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow inlet of the sea.".

I was taking into account your transformation rule. This would create
"Ferd" out of "Fjord" which is rather close to the german word for
"Ford".

 

[Samurai]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Quoth pibbur <oopsREMOVETHISANDxx.xx000@tele2xx.xxno>:

> I can't find the germanic word for "fjord", but we
> have the english word "firth" which according to
> "Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow
> inlet of the sea.".

I think "firth" is more a Scottish word than a generic English one.
Certainly, no inlets I'm aware of have it in their name, other than on
the Scottish coast.

Of course, it's possible that both the Norwegian and Scottish words
have a common route.

--

___________________________________________________________
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On Thu, 09 Jun 2005 00:43:40 +0200, Samurai <nospam@dev.nul> wrote:

> Quoth pibbur <oopsREMOVETHISANDxx.xx000@tele2xx.xxno>:
>
>> I can't find the germanic word for "fjord", but we
>> have the english word "firth" which according to
>> "Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow
>> inlet of the sea.".
>
> I think "firth" is more a Scottish word than a generic English one.
> Certainly, no inlets I'm aware of have it in their name, other than on
> the Scottish coast.
>
> Of course, it's possible that both the Norwegian and Scottish words
> have a common route.
>
In old norwegian the word mostly used for fjord is 'angr', which remain in
then name of many fjords: "The Hardanger fjord". The observant reader will
noote the redundancy in the name, as words for fjord are used twice.

pibbur
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pibbur wrote:

> In old norwegian the word mostly used for fjord is 'angr', which remain in
> then name of many fjords: "The Hardanger fjord". The observant reader will
> noote the redundancy in the name, as words for fjord are used twice.

My mother's best friend from high school is Greek, and they still keep in
touch. In fact this friend is my sister's godmother (I don't have one).
Anyway, we were always told to call her "Tetta", but of course as kids we
added "Aunt" to the beginning (since she was like any other aunts we had),
leading to the appelation "Aunt Tetta".

Now Tetta in greek is "Aunt" so we were in fact calling her Aunt Aunt.

--
Cape Dweller Dragon
Remember, I've got a debt to pay. It's about quantity, not quality.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

on Thu, 09 Jun 2005 03:13:08 -0400, Cape Dweller <usenet@ciotog.net>
wrote:

>pibbur wrote:
>
>> In old norwegian the word mostly used for fjord is 'angr', which remain in
>> then name of many fjords: "The Hardanger fjord". The observant reader will
>> noote the redundancy in the name, as words for fjord are used twice.
>
>My mother's best friend from high school is Greek, and they still keep in
>touch. In fact this friend is my sister's godmother (I don't have one).
>Anyway, we were always told to call her "Tetta", but of course as kids we
>added "Aunt" to the beginning (since she was like any other aunts we had),
>leading to the appelation "Aunt Tetta".
>
>Now Tetta in greek is "Aunt" so we were in fact calling her Aunt Aunt.

Yeah, my mother called her grandma "Grandma Bestemor". Bestemor is
grandma in Danish.

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On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 09:49:19 +0200, Claus Dragon
<claus@ultima-dragons.org> wrote:

> Words to the wise, pibbur <oopsREMOVETHISANDxx.xx000@tele2xx.xxno>
> wrote:
>
>>>> 'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to
>>>> 'jor'
>>>> is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.
>>>
>>> Fjord?
>>
>> It may be a similar phenomenon here. I can't find the germanic word for
>> "fjord", but we have the english word "firth" which according to
>> "Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow inlet of the sea.".
>
> I was taking into account your transformation rule. This would create
> "Ferd" out of "Fjord" which is rather close to the german word for
> "Ford".

Ehh?? What is the german worf for "Ford"?

der Pibbur

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[Guest]

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Claus Dragon wrote:
> Words to the wise, Lumina Dragon <kewhitte@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Heck, ENGLISH has common ancestry with German, not that you'd know to
>>look at it; we've imported so much from Greek and Latin since then.
>
> Middle-Age German and Middle-Age English are very very similar.
>
> The imports English has which are derived from Latin (which might be
> derived from Greek), all come from French, or better said, the normans
> who settled down in England after Hastings, 1066.
>
>>But it would probably be more apparent in older versions of the language.
>
> Yes, see above.

Thought so. And the William connection makes a lot of sense.

-Lumina Dragon

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

pibbur wrote:
>
> Consider for instance the old germaic word for our beloved planet:
>
> 'erthu'
>
> which became:
>
> 'Erde' in german

You know, that explains a term I saw in a video game. Amazing the
tidbits I pick up here.

> 'earth' in english
> 'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to
> 'jor' is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.

Etymology is fun, isn't it? I may not have done well in my attempt to
take German, but I do like learnign tidbits like these. Seeing the
connections.

-Lumina Dragon

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

pibbur wrote:
> On Wed, 08 Jun 2005 09:49:19 +0200, Claus Dragon
> <claus@ultima-dragons.org> wrote:
>>
>> I was taking into account your transformation rule. This would create
>> "Ferd" out of "Fjord" which is rather close to the german word for
>> "Ford".
>
> Ehh?? What is the german worf for "Ford"?

Volkswagen.

-Lumina Dragon

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Samurai wrote:
> Quoth pibbur <oopsREMOVETHISANDxx.xx000@tele2xx.xxno>:
>
>
>>I can't find the germanic word for "fjord", but we
>>have the english word "firth" which according to
>>"Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow
>>inlet of the sea.".
>
>
> I think "firth" is more a Scottish word than a generic English one.
> Certainly, no inlets I'm aware of have it in their name, other than on
> the Scottish coast.
>
> Of course, it's possible that both the Norwegian and Scottish words
> have a common route.

But Scottish isn't derived from the Germanic family, is it? Hmm.
lessee.... *pulls up a site with the I-E tree on it*

I was right. The Celtic languages have their own primary branch from
Indo-European. Separate from the Romance (called Italic here) and
Germanic branches, and all the others irrelevant to this particular tangent.

So if William the Conqueror brought in the Latin aspects to the
close-to-German version of English, who was it that rboguht English into
the Celtic region in the first place? (Were I to guess, I'd say the
Angles (assuming I recall the right name - looks gemoetric to me), what
with them being who English is named after, but lacking certain
knowledge, that's only a guess.)

-Lumina Dragon

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Polychromic wrote:
> on Thu, 09 Jun 2005 03:13:08 -0400, Cape Dweller <usenet@ciotog.net>
> wrote:
>
>>pibbur wrote:
>>
>>>In old norwegian the word mostly used for fjord is 'angr', which remain in
>>>then name of many fjords: "The Hardanger fjord". The observant reader will
>>>noote the redundancy in the name, as words for fjord are used twice.
>>
>>My mother's best friend from high school is Greek, and they still keep in
>>touch. In fact this friend is my sister's godmother (I don't have one).
>>Anyway, we were always told to call her "Tetta", but of course as kids we
>>added "Aunt" to the beginning (since she was like any other aunts we had),
>>leading to the appelation "Aunt Tetta".
>>
>>Now Tetta in greek is "Aunt" so we were in fact calling her Aunt Aunt.
>
> Yeah, my mother called her grandma "Grandma Bestemor". Bestemor is
> grandma in Danish.

And this all reminds me of the time WizNameless on the Weyrmount
mentioned how funny he always found the term "shrimp scampi", saying
that it means "shrimp shrimp".

Someone oughtta report these guys to the DRD.

-Lumina Dragon

P.S. Before you ask: Department of Reduncancy Department.

 

[Samurai]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

Quoth Lumina Dragon <kewhitte@hotmail.com>:
....
> But Scottish isn't derived from the Germanic family, is it? Hmm.
> lessee.... *pulls up a site with the I-E tree on it*
>
> I was right. The Celtic languages have their own primary branch
> from Indo-European. Separate from the Romance (called Italic here)
^^^
The Mediterranean countries taught people to write with the parchment
at a funny angle, clearly.

> and Germanic branches, and all the others irrelevant to this
> particular tangent.
>
> So if William the Conqueror brought in the Latin aspects to the
> close-to-German version of English, who was it that rboguht
> English into the Celtic region in the first place? (Were I to
> guess, I'd say the Angles (assuming I recall the right name -
> looks gemoetric to me), what with them being who English is named
> after, but lacking certain knowledge, that's only a guess.)

My knowledge of pre-1066 British history is very vague, but
basically, after the Romans pulled out of Britain, the Saxons, Angles
and (to a lesser extent) Jutes began to invade from the Germanic
areas of continental Europe. The Arthurian legends stem in large
measure from the (ultimately unsuccessful) battles by the native
Celts to keep them out.

The Saxons and Angles ended up settling in most of what is modern-day
England, but Cornwall, along with Scotland and Wales, remained rather
more Celtic. Bear in mind, Wales was a separate country from Britain
until the reign of Edward I (13th century), and Scotland until James
I (early 17th century). As a result, the Gaelic languages would
probably have been more in use until the 1600s.

(Disclaimer: that last bit is supposition -- I simply don't know for
sure.)

--

___________________________________________________________
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[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.computer.ultima.dragons (More info?)

On Sun, 12 Jun 2005 22:52:45 +0200, Lumina Dragon <kewhitte@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> pibbur wrote:
>> Consider for instance the old germaic word for our beloved planet:
>> 'erthu'
>> which became:
>> 'Erde' in german
>
> You know, that explains a term I saw in a video game. Amazing the
> tidbits I pick up here.
>
>> 'earth' in english
>> 'jord' in the scandinavian languages. The transformation of 'er' to
>> 'jor' is not uncommon in germanic derived languages.
>
> Etymology is fun, isn't it? I may not have done well in my attempt to
> take German, but I do like learnign tidbits like these. Seeing the
> connections.
>
> -Lumina Dragon
Yes it's fun.

I'll give you another one for free.

In ur-nordic, the language spoken in the nordic countries between 200 and
500 AD the word for "raven" is "harabanar". Between 500 and 700 lots of
vowels disappeard in the language, and in old norwegian the word is
shortened to "hrafn". Which again developed into "ravn" in modern
norwegian. A very similar word developed into "Raven" in english (And I
think it's the same word in gereman).

Typically words in the ur-nordic and old germanic languages are very long,
and my personal theory, for which I have no hard evidence, is that they
started as descriptive terms:
thingy-who-is-black-and-flies-and-has-an-ugly-voice, and as time passed
they were shortened.

A similar phenomenon can be observed in the development of programming
languages from COBOL to C. In the process COBOL looses 4 characters from
it's name and quite a lot of characters in the language structures as
well. (OK, I know C weasn't derived from COBOL)

pibbur

 

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On Sun, 12 Jun 2005 23:01:58 +0200, Lumina Dragon <kewhitte@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> Samurai wrote:
>> Quoth pibbur <oopsREMOVETHISANDxx.xx000@tele2xx.xxno>:
>>
>>> I can't find the germanic word for "fjord", but we
>>> have the english word "firth" which according to "Answers.com"(I had
>>> to check) means "A long, narrow
>>> inlet of the sea.".
>> I think "firth" is more a Scottish word than a generic English one.
>> Certainly, no inlets I'm aware of have it in their name, other than on
>> the Scottish coast.
>> Of course, it's possible that both the Norwegian and Scottish words
>> have a common route.
>
> But Scottish isn't derived from the Germanic family, is it? Hmm.
> lessee.... *pulls up a site with the I-E tree on it*
>
> I was right. The Celtic languages have their own primary branch from
> Indo-European. Separate from the Romance (called Italic here) and
> Germanic branches, and all the others irrelevant to this particular
> tangent.
>

Still, "firth" is according to
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=firth a development from
'fjordr'. No surprise really. there has been quite a lot of exchange of
words between languages.

pibbur

 

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Words to the wise, pibbur <dragon42@nomail.land> wrote:

>>>> Fjord?
>>>
>>> It may be a similar phenomenon here. I can't find the germanic word for
>>> "fjord", but we have the english word "firth" which according to
>>> "Answers.com"(I had to check) means "A long, narrow inlet of the sea.".
>>
>> I was taking into account your transformation rule. This would create
>> "Ferd" out of "Fjord" which is rather close to the german word for
>> "Ford".
>
>Ehh?? What is the german worf for "Ford"?

Furt(h) it is.

But what I was really wondering about is taking the word for "earth"
(jord) and just add a consonant at the front and use it for "long,
narrow inlet of the sea", this strikes me as rather odd.