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Is Apple Now Censoring Tom's Hardware?

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November 6, 2007 9:51:27 AM

Clicking on our links to Apple forums and evidence of customer dissatisfaction with Apple's OSX Leopard upgrade policy now yields nothing but error messages.

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/2007/11/06/is_apple_censoring_toms_hardware/index.html
November 6, 2007 10:24:26 AM

I don't really get what is going on, did Apple promise that if you bought a new iMac before the new OS is coming out that you'd get a discount or something, or is this something that Apple has done in the past and not done this time around. I'm not interested in any Apple products or the company itself, but I do want to know just how did this start.

just found this wikipedia (yeah, I know, not the best site for info.)
Quote:
When Leopard was initially released, buyers of new Macs in August and September 2007, including the 20 and 24-inch iMac models released in 2007-08-07, were denied of the $9.95 upgrade pricing. However, there were surprisingly few complaints over Apple's discussion boards. When asked why complaints about the upgrade pricing policy were being deleted, the official response was the questions were not "support oriented"; but when asked why posts praising Apple's upgrade policy, from customers that bought new Macs in October, were not also being deleted, as they also were not "support oriented", the posts were censored. In addition, threads for questions over OS X's validation scheme were censored.[54]


LOL.
November 6, 2007 12:03:10 PM

This has been brewing for some time IMHO. Apple likes to portray itself as the "Holier than thou" OS when compared to the evil M$FT.

Apple can't stand the heat but regularly plays with fire in the kitchen... evidence: watch TV mac ads /vs M$FT. Surely you've seen at least one by now.

As I've said in other posts Apple censors everything bad about them, they have too because they are so small compared to M$FT and they have to keep the "cult" hypnotized so they keep buying. This is what happens when you claim to be perfect and "just work".

It's also another reason or excuse if you will that "cultists" use if you bash their poor little iapple. They give you a list of bugs from vista / xp / me / 2000 that is enough to overwhelm the internet connection. Because M$FT doesn't censor as you might imagine, they have better things to do. Try to find an ounce of trouble with apple... you won't if apple has found it with their giant electronic eraser. [The may release it soon to other companies try to repair their image... dubbed the ieraser. :lol:  ]

M$FT doesn't ever say they are bug free it is always a work in progress, if you have 1000's of virus writers trying to destroy you I don't think you would worry to much about what people say about you.

For some reason Apple has a chip on it's shoulder.

If all else fails you can use timelines or paths or quotes of Steve Job's... IE fastest computer in the world, shortly thereafter switched to Intel. This is one no one can refute. Apple / Job lies all the time. If you pay attention you can catch them in it all the time. I really wouldn't have a reason to say anything about apple if it wasn't for this. I don't like liars and neither should you!

M$FT could care less what apple says or does, did they do anything to stop apple from bashing them? Have they retaliated in any way? Who is really evil here? M$FT is clearly not perfect, but they don't proclaim that anyway.

When choosing a computer it should be about freedom of choice. You have little choice if you choose apple. You can and will have problems no matter what you pick. Your chances may only be slightly less if you choose apple. :non: 

I choose M$FT thank you very much! :hello: 
Related resources
November 6, 2007 12:04:55 PM

Oh I almost forgot... you gize at THG rock for this article. They deserve ever little bit of this........ lol!
November 6, 2007 1:07:54 PM

Apple has has no right to censor, and it's definitely lame of them, but dude, your articles on Apple have been horribly biased and misleading and I don't think you should report on their stuff if you hate them that much. You've been on a crusade against them for awhile.

On the other hand, they need a kick in the ass for those ridiculous Mac/PC commercials that have gone uncontested. The've been lying about their stuff for years on everything from the superior performance of PPC processors (then switching to intel processors a few months later and claiming they were 4-5x faster, that was a hoot) to having more fun on a Mac (sure, you have more fun on a platform that will see less than 2% of all games released!)
November 6, 2007 1:10:12 PM

many businesses use the ieraser

another one for example, best buy and circuit city and tiger direct

fine a product on their site that they are boastign about, then leave a review talking about a flaw in the product such as the bottom half of the screen being much brighter than the top half (lg monitor at best buy)

within a day your review will be deleted


but if you give it a bad review saying something like, "I don't really like the shape of the back of it, they will leave the review up

many of these companies will censor anything that lists negative facts about a product as negative facts reduce sales of the product

if you don't believe me, try looking up some reviews of different products, then fine a negative fact about the item then talk about that flaw in a review, it will most likely never wind up on the site or it will be posted on the page then removed shortly after

a while back I brought some blank cd-rw's made by memorex they never worked, when i burned them, the cd will be detected and show that data was on it but other than that, the disk was unreadable (happened on many all 3 of my computers, but my sony cd-rw's work just fine many people complained about this, including me, and all of the comments were removed)

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8488781&p...

many companies have the idea that you can say anything about them as long as it is something good about hem

microsoft doesnt need to cover up this crap because almost all software is designed for windows so your stuck with them especially if you work of a company that uses it
November 6, 2007 1:16:24 PM

Stemnin, that quote you posted from Wikipedia is by Tony Celeste, the same guy that wrote this article.
November 6, 2007 1:24:15 PM

Quote:
I choose M$FT thank you very much!


I choose both! I have Windows Vista on both my Macs! Seeker, I didn't read read your post before I posted what essentially echoed what you said about Apple, sorry.
November 6, 2007 1:33:44 PM

I'm an XP/Vista dual booter. I would've given Apple a try a long time ago but based on the camp's sheer snootiness and lack of game support, I loathed to do it.

Personally, I DO NOT like arguing over which OS is superior (ugh, don't get me started about open source "uberness"). However, for entertainment purposes, this article can't be beat. I'm forwarding this to my friends. HA!
November 6, 2007 1:53:21 PM

I'm really tired of TOMs flaming Apple, I never had an Apple product, and I never will. But every damn article on Toms is directed to flame Apple about everything.

Are you THAT mad at them that they don't give you samples that you have to insist on publising one article a day flaming?

Toms was really PRO, now it's becoming yellow press (and by yellow you know what I mean)

EDIT: Agree with user "inthere".
November 6, 2007 2:00:25 PM

Hey guys,

if there's any doubt that either Steve Jobs or Bill Gates are complete and unadulterated a-wholes see the movie The Pirates of Silicon Valley. i recently bought it after looking hard and deep just to prove to a few friends who look at these guys as intelligent and successful, how far off and w/o a clue they are. As they viewed in amazement, they finally learned what is really behind this 'technofobic' revolution. Just like any other. More crap only faster.

BTW, the movie opens with the shooting of the very commericial quoted in Tom's article!

Good luck and God bless
shiva d
November 6, 2007 2:11:09 PM

What I don't understand is why more Apple fans are not upset. They shelter their beloved Apple items from wind, rain, and criticism. You can bash MS all day long and everyone will agree with with much lamenting. But criticize Apple and you will be burned to the ground. What Apple idiots should understand is that if you tell Apple you're ok with exorbitant prices, flawed products, and shady business practices- why would they change? You're essentially saying, "I don't mind, keep on doing these things to me Apple". Thereby decreasing the incentives/reasons Apple would continue to improve their products. Essentially you're shooting yourselves in the foot, TELL Apple you're pissed! Even if you're not. You're like a bunch of socialists, but you forget- capitalism won the cold war! Putting your fanboyism ahead of improvement and legitimate criticism makes me call you a moron.
November 6, 2007 2:14:31 PM

How low can people go.
It seems M$ is just too big to censor everything.

Anyway, I give-up on Apple. If I need an alternative to Vista, I'll just use a new version of Linux. Again, linux is free, there is no reason anyone will want to censor anything about linux.

I don't believe THG is an Apple flamer. I remember reading some very favorable articels about iPods for example.
November 6, 2007 2:20:45 PM

iampowerslave- has it occurred to you that Toms reports on the tech news? Perhaps more legitimately that Apple is rarely criticized and thus any more than 1 articles on them seems overboard? There's a pervasive notion that Apple is perfect and can do no wrong. I've got news for you- especially Apple users! This is BAD. What happens to the Patriots if they finally believe they can go 16-0? There's a good chance they start looking past opponents, and not trying to improve like Billicheck is trying to impress on them. Being the best is fine, thinking you're the best is potentially dangerous.
November 6, 2007 2:27:09 PM

Anyone who thinks that Tom's is unfair to Apple needs to take another look at the site. When is the last time they gave an unfair review to an Apple product? I remember a number of favorable articles regarding Apple over the past few months, discussing the various products and what their strengths and weaknesses are... exactly what the site should be doing.

The only time they say anything bad about Apple is when they're reporting news which is about bad crap Apple does. And... it's really all Apple's doing. When they choose to do things like iPhone price drops and offering Leopard updates to very few people, it's their choice, and they have to live with the press.

Apple can try to censor "unrelated" threads on their own site, which it seems they're doing... that only makes fair and honest reporting that much more important for tech news websites.
November 6, 2007 2:40:21 PM

inthere said:
Stemnin, that quote you posted from Wikipedia is by Tony Celeste, the same guy that wrote this article.


LMAO, I never checked the source! Thanks for pointing that out.
November 6, 2007 2:58:01 PM

Why do people blame toms....they even have mac users.....it was news....thats just like the...apple osx cracked for pc article.....all they said was that it was a surprise that it was made to run on PC so quick....they did not say....ohhhh look apple sucks only a few days to hack it.....

There review for Iphone was extremely favorable of apple and there review of the new airport was also favourable...even placing near(if not at) the top of the router charts.....

There was no bias, only news....its a FACT that the new OS-X was made to work on PC.....and just because you say its quicker then expected..... freedom of speech....

As for apple censoring THG......WTF is with that....After they play a series of commercials claiming things such as macs are better for listening to music and blogging("crying myself to sleep mode"). Come on i can do that on windows 98....hell even 95....

If apple(and its fanboys) can't take it...don't try to dish it out....

For the fact i have used both OS's and i am happy with the piles of software i can use on windows....i did not find the same software(for both platforms) on mac any better....
November 6, 2007 3:11:19 PM

I support Tom's quest for fairness. Apple's image does not reflect its practices. People bash Microsoft for real and perceived issues, now Apple is acting just like unreputable sources, in order to fool their customers and forge a different reality. I remember Nvidia censoring their forums, now that practice has stopped somewhat since people start complaining and sites like Tom's divulging it. Who wins? The buying public, as always!

I applaud this site innitiative, keep up with the good work, guys, and keep posting stories like that untill Apple change its ways and fix the links!
November 6, 2007 3:39:30 PM

Quote:
I'm really tired of TOMs flaming Apple, I never had an Apple product, and I never will. But every damn article on Toms is directed to flame Apple about everything.


Naaaa, it's not THG, it's just that guy Tony Celeste. I don't see THG going out their way to flame Apple.
November 6, 2007 5:14:50 PM

This is EXACTLY why I don't trust the album/song ratings in iTunes. It is too easy for someone from apple to censor the bad reviews with one swift *delete* click and leave behind the good ones. Do they do it? Who knows, but I doubt that anyone is there to ensure it doesn't happen. I don't fully trust other sites as well. I gave a bad rating for something on Amazon and they denied my comment. There was nothing unprofessional in my text. I think it comes down to good ratings/good comments = good sales, so do what is necessary to boost sales. Makes you wonder a bit if sites weed out comments or not on purpose.
November 6, 2007 5:32:28 PM

This article is more than fair for Apple. It is titled with a question? THG is asking the hard question and give you the proof for you to make the educated guess.

I'm not sure why some people take this as a flame when M$FT deals with worse things than this on a daily basis.

Apple has put themselve's in this position, they are responsible for changing their ways.

THG is and always will be reporting the news as it develops. If you don't like to be informed, or only want to see the rosy picture without the thorns, then you don't live in the real world...only a world of what certain people want to to see /hear.

The minute we stop wanting the full unbiased story, is the minute we fall to the ranks of other less well informed news sites. Censorship should not be allowed. Everyone has a right to the truth, for the truth shall set you free.

THG should be applauded for such efforts.
November 6, 2007 5:38:36 PM

Once again people talking about how THG is bias and only writes negative stuff. Well the guy who wrote the aritcal might have something againced apple who knows i sure dont, But does that really change any of the facts? Hell most people already knew apple was just as evil as MS from the get go. Everyone complains about how MS supposidly rips off ideas( they probably do ) but hell steve jobs i think is his name said in a tv enterview a good idea is worth steeling and he says apples has stolen alot of ideas and put them in the apple os. Here is the question.. WTF do you even care? makes the os you want to use "better" relativly doesnt mean those ideas are good for everyone.

Im pretty much sick of the apple vs windows os they both have something they are good at. Windows just happens to have something no other OS has. Software support out the wazoo.

I dont personaly care what OS i use as long as it has that support. If it doesnt its not a mainstream home OS IMO.

Im not surprised one bit a company would sensor these types of things it only shows they really do have something to hide. M$ for the most part is pretty open with thier bending you over. Apple bends you over just as hard if not harder on some things and everyone is ok with that because they think apple is perfect. Its no more prefect then the whole IBM MS thing please open your eyes and get over it. Dont be blind to reality ffs.

November 6, 2007 6:13:31 PM

Quote:
This article is more than fair for Apple. It is titled with a question? THG is asking the hard question and give you the proof for you to make the educated guess.


I'm not talking about this article, I'm talking about the previous 2 that this guy Tony Celeste wrote about Apple.
November 6, 2007 7:35:24 PM

Crappy article, what's the point?
November 6, 2007 7:40:29 PM

This is getting way too much attention. First of all, people crying for an upgrade are babies and are no different than the iPhone whiners. And this article isn't fair. The question asks whether or not Apple is censoring this specific site. As if they did it JUST because of this site. They have the right to censor their boards. It's not uncommon. Especially when they're whining about something like this. People think they're entitled to anything and they're not. You can't buy something and be mad when a better deal comes along. Maybe if I actually sympathized with the posters then I'd care.
November 6, 2007 8:17:03 PM

Apple = Communists

They can't take the good with the bad.
November 6, 2007 8:51:04 PM

iampowerslave said:
I'm really tired of TOMs flaming Apple, I never had an Apple product, and I never will. But every damn article on Toms is directed to flame Apple about everything.

Whenever a Corporate-logo-management-company claims it's outsourced designer-plastic design-over-function gadgets will walk on water, you bet there will be flaming.

:) 
November 6, 2007 8:57:20 PM

Maxor127- the discussion has left the upgrade issue, you seem unable to look at the larger picture, at the trend that Apple seems to be setting- there is every reason to complain. If we as consumers don't complain and rail for change in a capitalist society then we should just become socialists altogether and run around spouting Marxism. Censoring is not ok, I have no idea why you would say that. Perhaps it is within their legal right to do so, but why would you as a consumer be ok with it? We have the right to tell Apple what we think, and so we should. Hell I'm no Apple customer but I know what makes our economy strong, I do the same with any product I buy. Being complacent is bad for yourself, and everyone else for that matter.
November 6, 2007 9:20:55 PM

Apple fans are so trusting. Apple sells a phone for $600, but that's not enough - they need the AT&T kickback too, or they'll kill your phone with its next update. If Microsoft released Vista so that it only ran on Dells, Windows using would be screaming!

Still laughing over the "("crying myself to sleep mode" )" comment Nukemaster!
November 6, 2007 9:44:02 PM

There has always been censorship in forums. Web forums are not a democracy. Mods have always censored content on forums. I've seen it on all kinds of sites. Every forum has a set of rules and guidelines and every company has the right to moderate it however they want. I wouldn't want a pointless flame war on my forum either.

I don't see Apple as bringing down democracy. And you said it yourself, it's a capitalist society. Apple is making money like any other business. Microsoft is no better or different. I'd say they're even worse. Their upgrades are more than OS X's full license and it doesn't have excessive activation requirements. And there's only one version of OS X instead of 5 versions of Vista with no difference between them except deliberately disabled features.

There are better things to complain about than this.
November 6, 2007 9:58:37 PM

lets play a little game..

lets say the point is a mars rover

and then lets say you are.. well you standing out side..

The mars rover went flying over and beyond your head so fast you never even saw it let alone knew it was there.
November 6, 2007 10:18:41 PM

Hmmm...

Apple is so irrelevant. So, who cares?
November 6, 2007 10:20:44 PM

hell i agree apple is irrelavent but he missed the point lol
November 6, 2007 10:40:52 PM

sons of putas!!!!!! i really really really hate censorship and more from a company that thinks that it's the king of software, not enough market share... the iPods and the "iPhone" are the ones bringing income to that cogedora de madres company and that people... that sucks.... they can't stop hackers, HELL NO!!! they cant stop me!! hell no
November 6, 2007 10:41:42 PM

smlong said:
Hmmm...

Apple is so irrelevant. So, who cares?


let me tell you who cares... YOUR MOM!!!! :lol:  no seriously your mom :sol: 
November 6, 2007 10:42:26 PM

lay off the drugs.
November 6, 2007 10:44:00 PM

enforcer22 said:
lay off the drugs.


who me??? im hyper... that's different and besides im a microsoft fan :lol:  and i've never done drugs... well yeah(alcohol) but that's the only thing and no im not drunk, yet :whistle: 
November 6, 2007 11:22:31 PM

Ok I think that the editor of this article is gettin' pretty annoying. Stop your senseless crusade againt Apple! This doesn't make any sense! Seriously, nobody here really cares about it but you! Ok, I'll try to make it simple. What is this site about? Yeah, that's right, computer hardware. So, why are the readers interested in computer hardware you ask? Right on again man! Modding their computers. Can you mod a Mac? No. Bottom line is, not many people here care about Macs related stuff. I don't know for you guys, but when I'm interested in Mac-stuff, I go to Mac websites like macrumors or 9to5mac, not Tomshardware. My point is, "Muk", the only person interested by the MACWARS in your last series of articles are, well, yourself. Maybe we'll just start getting tired of your rants and go somewhere else where we don't have biased editors, who put more of their time on computer-related content than just dissing...
November 6, 2007 11:39:10 PM

I disagree NCC..etc. Most true tech guys worth their salt will know what is going on in most sectors. Apples innovations and moves are of concern and worth noting. It's called Tom's hardware, its about pretty much everything tech related- who would make the claim that that doesn't include Apple? You made too much of an extrapolation that we only care about modding. A few articles does not a crusade make. Clearly you are mistaken about people not caring as there is a busy thread on the matter. As far as not liking the articles- you can go ahead and stick your head further in the sand and not read.

You'd go to Mac websites to get accurate info? Those guys are crazy fanboys.
November 6, 2007 11:42:24 PM

NCC-1701-J,

I believe some people may have been interested in a Apple to PC hack and the OS X upgrade to Leopard woes article.

This article itself was started because some things that were posted in the original article seemed to some how strangely start disappearing around the web.

You think THG has a hidden agenda? So while you're right this is a PC hardware site, there are people who are interested in other things.

It's like if you read the newspaper and you hate sports do you tell the news paper to stop printing sports?

Um no, you just don't read what you don't want to. Novel idea isn't it?
November 6, 2007 11:52:21 PM

LoL after seeing what mac does on thier websites i dont think i would goto one to see how macs are doing personaly. Seems like a waste of time to me! All i really have to do like most people is goto that friends house and run thier mac for a bit (or for those of us that requier what the mac IS or WAS good at im not sure anymore they can turn thier macs on.)

But seriously if they do that on thier site people will be totaly missled into thinking there are absolutly no problems with macs, And people are for a majority ignorant of these things. They just buy things with familier names and if some of them want to look up to see if they will have any problems chances are thier sources when it comes to mac will be totaly uncredible. I think thats the point that was missed earlyer. At least part of it anyways.
November 7, 2007 12:17:48 AM

Very funny how "The Aberration" guy gets all excited on me and calls me a fanboy when i've almost never used a mac. Maybe u should lay off the steroids big guy. To me, u sound like the fanboy. My point is, because u obviously missed it, that lastly the kind of articles presented on THG against Apple are pointless. The editor looks like some 13 years old boy complaining that he got kicked out of some forum. Bou-frakkin-ouh, i got my post deleted! Of course, u got ur post deleted, all u do is complaining. If ur really a "tech-savy-salty-guy" like u pretend to be, u can only agree with me that those articles could be replaced by more interesting ones on the pros and cons of Apple products, and not about they deleting some frustrated guys posts...
November 7, 2007 12:37:37 AM

bravo pip_seeker!! bravo lmao
November 7, 2007 12:43:11 AM

pip_seeker said:
NCC-1701-J,

I believe some people may have been interested in a Apple to PC hack and the OS X upgrade to Leopard woes article.

This article itself was started because some things that were posted in the original article seemed to some how strangely start disappearing around the web.

You think THG has a hidden agenda? So while you're right this is a PC hardware site, there are people who are interested in other things.

It's like if you read the newspaper and you hate sports do you tell the news paper to stop printing sports?

Um no, you just don't read what you don't want to. Novel idea isn't it?


seriously, i mean we can just go over things we don't like? Ah, and me who's been reading the newspaper entirely for all these years. God am I lucky I meet you, smart-ass!
November 7, 2007 12:47:29 AM

Did you make a new account to see how long it would take to get banned or a post deleted to prove a point? or are you from the said mac site trying to be what you believe the person who made the artical is?

Im not sure i understand your motive to act like the people your "bashing".
November 7, 2007 1:15:01 AM

Well maybe u just like having somebody bash you and do nothing about it enforcer, and you know what, ur well entitled to it! And you know what would be really funny? Yeah that's right, it would be having my posts deleted! Now that would the greatest irony!

Anyway I'm done with u losers, trying to make a point with kids like you seems to be out of the question

PS: can u make more typos, please?
November 7, 2007 1:20:57 AM

You're a good man Tony, a good man. I love seeing manufacturers get blasted or caught out doing something they shouldn't. Still, all they need to do is fire a few CEOs and send the blame with them and hire some new ones, problem solved.
November 7, 2007 1:25:11 AM

NCC-1701-J said:
Well maybe u just like having somebody bash you and do nothing about it enforcer, and you know what, ur well entitled to it! And you know what would be really funny? Yeah that's right, it would be having my posts deleted! Now that would the greatest irony!

Anyway I'm done with u losers, trying to make a point with kids like you seems to be out of the question

PS: can u make more typos, please?


:sarcastic:  i would delete your account personaly jsut so i dont have to deal with children but thats just me.

No one attacked you, You however attacked other people (or bash if you preffer) Though if you act like a idiot you should expect to have someone attack you.

Um nice try taking jabs at typos im so sorry you dont approve.

Yeah that's right, it would be having my posts deleted! Now that would the greatest irony! said:
Yeah that's right, it would be having my posts deleted! Now that would the greatest irony!


No that would be justice.
November 7, 2007 2:03:53 AM

You know, Tom's Hardware being a primarily PC oriented (due to hardware + games) site, I'd of course expect a little bias towards the Mac camp. I'm no fanboi, and I hate the sometimes near rabid fanaticism displayed by the Macboi's. No system is perfect, and Apple really needs to drop its "we always work and PCs suk" attitude.

I think censorship is the biggest issue, and Apple is only a fragment of it. Just so happens that since it gets alot more press than say Tigerdirect or other companies it's easier to point our crosshairs at them. Censoring forum posts in general is just bad.

What I don't get is e-tailers censoring posts...I mean it's not like Tigerdirect manufactures all of the products that it sells, so it's not exactly like the reviews are emburdening. In that regard, I swear by Newegg, since they don't give a damn about what people say (at least I've never noticed them censoring things)
November 7, 2007 2:09:09 AM

Funny thing is M$ own a share of Apple. :lol: 
!