Why Power Supply Died?

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Tech support is sending me a new power supply for my 700XL that won't power
up. I had a problem about a year ago and the Country Store had put in two
new hard drives and a new power supply.

I'm wondering what makes a power supply fail. The computer lives in a
compartment in a computer desk. The front of the compartment is open, as is
a 6x12 inch area on the side and a 3 inch round hole in the top of the desk.
Could it have overheated?

Thanks, Allen

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Allen;
Hopefully the back is also wide open.
Overheating can easily happen when a computer is enclosed.
Some furniture makers know how to make nice furniture but know nothing
of the needs of the computer for cooling.

--
Jupiter Jones
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/


"A. & C. Bredt" <abredt@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:MO2fc.484$Zi3.386@twister.socal.rr.com...
> Tech support is sending me a new power supply for my 700XL that
won't power
> up. I had a problem about a year ago and the Country Store had put
in two
> new hard drives and a new power supply.
>
> I'm wondering what makes a power supply fail. The computer lives in
a
> compartment in a computer desk. The front of the compartment is
open, as is
> a 6x12 inch area on the side and a 3 inch round hole in the top of
the desk.
> Could it have overheated?
>
> Thanks, Allen

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

A power supply can fail for a number of reasons.

Improper ventilation can cause overheating of the power supply and other parts
inside a computer. Heat is one of the worst enemies of electronics.

A poorly manufactured power supply can fail when one of its internal components
bites the dust.

An external power spike or surge can cause power supply failure. The typical
surge protector/extension cord provides inadequate protection to a computer from
external power fluctuations. An uninterruptable power supply with battery and
voltage regulation circuits provides 1000x more protection.

If the power supply innards become clogged with dust and dirt or the power
supply fan stops spinning (usually due to the same dust and dirt), the power
supply will inevitably overheat and fail. A regular cleaning of a computer
using compressed air (especially if the environment is dusty, smoky, dirty, or
full of animal hair) can add years of life to an entire computer... Ben Myers

On Wed, 14 Apr 2004 04:08:12 GMT, "A. & C. Bredt" <abredt@nospam.com> wrote:

>Tech support is sending me a new power supply for my 700XL that won't power
>up. I had a problem about a year ago and the Country Store had put in two
>new hard drives and a new power supply.
>
>I'm wondering what makes a power supply fail. The computer lives in a
>compartment in a computer desk. The front of the compartment is open, as is
>a 6x12 inch area on the side and a 3 inch round hole in the top of the desk.
>Could it have overheated?
>
>Thanks, Allen
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.

How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open it each
time to do it?

Thanks, Allen

<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:407d34c3.1942662@news.charter.net...
> A power supply can fail for a number of reasons.
>
> Improper ventilation can cause overheating of the power supply and other
parts
> inside a computer. Heat is one of the worst enemies of electronics.
>
> A poorly manufactured power supply can fail when one of its internal
components
> bites the dust.
>
> An external power spike or surge can cause power supply failure. The
typical
> surge protector/extension cord provides inadequate protection to a
computer from
> external power fluctuations. An uninterruptable power supply with battery
and
> voltage regulation circuits provides 1000x more protection.
>
> If the power supply innards become clogged with dust and dirt or the power
> supply fan stops spinning (usually due to the same dust and dirt), the
power
> supply will inevitably overheat and fail. A regular cleaning of a
computer
> using compressed air (especially if the environment is dusty, smoky,
dirty, or
> full of animal hair) can add years of life to an entire computer... Ben
Myers
>
> On Wed, 14 Apr 2004 04:08:12 GMT, "A. & C. Bredt" <abredt@nospam.com>
wrote:
>
> >Tech support is sending me a new power supply for my 700XL that won't
power
> >up. I had a problem about a year ago and the Country Store had put in two
> >new hard drives and a new power supply.
> >
> >I'm wondering what makes a power supply fail. The computer lives in a
> >compartment in a computer desk. The front of the compartment is open, as
is
> >a 6x12 inch area on the side and a 3 inch round hole in the top of the
desk.
> >Could it have overheated?
> >
> >Thanks, Allen
> >
> >
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

How dusty is the computer? The answer is relative. Start by estimating that
the amount of dust inside has accumulated since you last opened up the computer
or since you got the computer. If you are uncomfortable with the amount of dust
you see, clean it more often. Depending on the environment where the computer
is running, every 90 days may be necessary. Or maybe once every year.

Yes, open up the chassis. Otherwise, compressed air will only swirl the dust
bunnies around inside and they may well land in a worse place than from where
they were dislodged. Make it easy on your lungs. Open the chassis, take it
outside, and blast out the dust there. Not in a driving rain or blizzard, tho.
... Ben Myers

On Wed, 14 Apr 2004 23:48:26 GMT, "A. & C. Bredt" <abredt@nospam.com> wrote:

>I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
>
>How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open it each
>time to do it?
>
>Thanks, Allen
>
><ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
>news:407d34c3.1942662@news.charter.net...
>> A power supply can fail for a number of reasons.
>>
>> Improper ventilation can cause overheating of the power supply and other
>parts
>> inside a computer. Heat is one of the worst enemies of electronics.
>>
>> A poorly manufactured power supply can fail when one of its internal
>components
>> bites the dust.
>>
>> An external power spike or surge can cause power supply failure. The
>typical
>> surge protector/extension cord provides inadequate protection to a
>computer from
>> external power fluctuations. An uninterruptable power supply with battery
>and
>> voltage regulation circuits provides 1000x more protection.
>>
>> If the power supply innards become clogged with dust and dirt or the power
>> supply fan stops spinning (usually due to the same dust and dirt), the
>power
>> supply will inevitably overheat and fail. A regular cleaning of a
>computer
>> using compressed air (especially if the environment is dusty, smoky,
>dirty, or
>> full of animal hair) can add years of life to an entire computer... Ben
>Myers
>>
>> On Wed, 14 Apr 2004 04:08:12 GMT, "A. & C. Bredt" <abredt@nospam.com>
>wrote:
>>
>> >Tech support is sending me a new power supply for my 700XL that won't
>power
>> >up. I had a problem about a year ago and the Country Store had put in two
>> >new hard drives and a new power supply.
>> >
>> >I'm wondering what makes a power supply fail. The computer lives in a
>> >compartment in a computer desk. The front of the compartment is open, as
>is
>> >a 6x12 inch area on the side and a 3 inch round hole in the top of the
>desk.
>> >Could it have overheated?
>> >
>> >Thanks, Allen
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
jumper setting. Computer would not operate.

At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.

Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
computer is properly designed and ventilated.

Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
removing dust is unnecessary.

I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.

"A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
> I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
>
> How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
> it each time to do it?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Hmm. Never ever had a problem with a computer getting into difficulty as a
result of my blasting it out with compressed air. Must be either dumb luck or
highly refined technique. Several dealers and resellers in my neighborhood with
whom I have a loose arrangement to exchange parts and repair/maintenance have
never had a problem either.

Admittedly a computer CAN survive with a lot of dust, dirt, dead mice, and
animal hair inside it. But the chances of survival are generally better if the
interior is somewhat clean, allowing clear and unimpeded air flow.

I've also serviced a proprietary computer (a custom printer RIP) never ever
cleaned by the so-called maintenance person. Opened up the chassis and found a
ball about the side of a baseball consisting of cat hair, paper chaff, dust,
dirt, and heaven knows what else. And that computer had a failed power supply.
Luckily for my client, a common personal computer power supply fit right in, so
there was no need for a service call from the other guy using parts paid via
extortion.

Factory environments are especially hard on personal computers, and some regular
cleaning out of the dirt prolongs the life of the machine.

That's my opinion, and you are just as free to have yours... Ben Myers

On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:03:21 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
>settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
>case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
>jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
>
> At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
>holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
>either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
>required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
>fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
>most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
>
> Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
>computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
>is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
>computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
>just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
>degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
>computer is properly designed and ventilated.
>
> Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
>necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
>this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
>because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
>ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
>removing dust is unnecessary.
>
> I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
>dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
>a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.
>
>"A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
>> I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
>>
>> How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
>> it each time to do it?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

I've used compressed air - from my compressor in the garage, not compressed air in a can - for more
than six years and on many computers, never had a problem/ although I don't hold the nozzle too
close to the case, unless I am cleaning out heat sinks and fans.
Make an opening in the back of the computer desk where the fan on the power supply exhausts, if you
have an additional fan in the back, make sure you have an opening for that one also. I clean mine
out everytime I change a component or add something, which on this machine is quite often. Just
added a NEC 2500A burner(nice unit) and because I have four case fans(thermo controlled)....but my
overclocked AthlonXP 2500 mobile likes to be cool.


<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:407f1a0a.13034374@news.charter.net...
> Hmm. Never ever had a problem with a computer getting into difficulty as a
> result of my blasting it out with compressed air. Must be either dumb luck or
> highly refined technique. Several dealers and resellers in my neighborhood with
> whom I have a loose arrangement to exchange parts and repair/maintenance have
> never had a problem either.
>
> Admittedly a computer CAN survive with a lot of dust, dirt, dead mice, and
> animal hair inside it. But the chances of survival are generally better if the
> interior is somewhat clean, allowing clear and unimpeded air flow.
>
> I've also serviced a proprietary computer (a custom printer RIP) never ever
> cleaned by the so-called maintenance person. Opened up the chassis and found a
> ball about the side of a baseball consisting of cat hair, paper chaff, dust,
> dirt, and heaven knows what else. And that computer had a failed power supply.
> Luckily for my client, a common personal computer power supply fit right in, so
> there was no need for a service call from the other guy using parts paid via
> extortion.
>
> Factory environments are especially hard on personal computers, and some regular
> cleaning out of the dirt prolongs the life of the machine.
>
> That's my opinion, and you are just as free to have yours... Ben Myers
>
> On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:03:21 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
> >settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
> >case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
> >jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
> >
> > At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
> >holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
> >either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
> >required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
> >fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
> >most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
> >
> > Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
> >computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
> >is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
> >computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
> >just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
> >degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
> >computer is properly designed and ventilated.
> >
> > Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
> >necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
> >this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
> >because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
> >ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
> >removing dust is unnecessary.
> >
> > I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
> >dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
> >a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.
> >
> >"A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
> >> I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
> >>
> >> How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
> >> it each time to do it?
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

what did you do with the mouse?

"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:407EF899.A463790C@hotmail.com...
> Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
> settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
> case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
> jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
>
> At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
> holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
> either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
> required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
> fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
> most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
>
> Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
> computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
> is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
> computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
> just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
> degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
> computer is properly designed and ventilated.
>
> Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
> necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
> this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
> because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
> ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
> removing dust is unnecessary.
>
> I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
> dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
> a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.
>
> "A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
> > I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
> >
> > How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
> > it each time to do it?

 

[lee]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Hi All

Just wanted to add my 2 cents worth, I use my air compressor, portable
type that I purchased to maintain my tires and have used it to blow out the
computer with negative problems. I am careful with it and don't get to
close. Surprised me how much dust came out of the computer. We vacuum
twice a week and over a period time it still accumulates quite a bit of
dust. Mainly in the exit fan area.

Lee

----- Original Message -----
From: "lazya" <lazya@email.com>

> I've used compressed air - from my compressor in the garage, not
>compressed air in >a can - for morethan six years and on many computers,
>never had a problem/ >although I don't hold the nozzle too close to the
>case, unless I am cleaning out heat >sinks and fans.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Was it a USB mouse, PS/2-style, serial, or one of the original Microsoft bus
mice with a special card? ... Ben Myers

On Fri, 16 Apr 2004 08:01:51 -0400, "news" <stingray_2010@hotmail.com> wrote:

>what did you do with the mouse?
>
>"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:407EF899.A463790C@hotmail.com...
>> Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
>> settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
>> case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
>> jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
>>
>> At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
>> holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
>> either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
>> required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
>> fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
>> most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
>>
>> Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
>> computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
>> is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
>> computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
>> just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
>> degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
>> computer is properly designed and ventilated.
>>
>> Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
>> necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
>> this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
>> because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
>> ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
>> removing dust is unnecessary.
>>
>> I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
>> dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
>> a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.
>>
>> "A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
>> > I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
>> >
>> > How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
>> > it each time to do it?
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Do you clean a mouse with anything other than a finger
nail? Why? There is nothing in a mouse that needs compressed
air or even a vacuum to clean out. Nothing. Just scrap away
the hardened dirt where mouse ball hits roller. Or buy an
optical mouse and clean nothing.

Bottom line from one who worked where reliability had to be
100%. Never use compressed air to clean any electronics.
This has been that well known for so many decades. Any
properly trained repairman knows - never use compressed air.
Unfortunately, too many computer 'experts' today never have
such education or real world experience. Instead they have
learned like too many auto mechanics have learned. Hearsay.

Do the numbers - something little understood by computer
people. Blowing out the dust makes an improvement so trivial
as to be irrelevant. How many degrees cooler is that
computer? If not at least 10 degrees C, then it really does
not matter. Margin of error in the design makes all that
cleaning irrelevant.

Then we get to why people clean. Less heat means longer
life. Yes. And when we apply numbers, that increased life
expectancy is near zero. In fact the compressed air is more
likely to reduce life expectancy than the dust. As long as
the ventilation holes are clear, then the computer has more
than sufficient cooling. No dust nor a cabinet should block
those cooling holes. Clean dust only when it is convenient -
and never use compressed air. Better to leave a coating (not
to be confused with globs) of dust inside. Dust coating does
not adversely effect anything - except those with a cleaning
fetish.

news wrote:
> what did you do with the mouse?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Keep up.

"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:40808D6E.AB1DBD55@hotmail.com...
> Do you clean a mouse with anything other than a finger
> nail? Why? There is nothing in a mouse that needs compressed
> air or even a vacuum to clean out. Nothing. Just scrap away
> the hardened dirt where mouse ball hits roller. Or buy an
> optical mouse and clean nothing.
>
> Bottom line from one who worked where reliability had to be
> 100%. Never use compressed air to clean any electronics.
> This has been that well known for so many decades. Any
> properly trained repairman knows - never use compressed air.
> Unfortunately, too many computer 'experts' today never have
> such education or real world experience. Instead they have
> learned like too many auto mechanics have learned. Hearsay.
>
> Do the numbers - something little understood by computer
> people. Blowing out the dust makes an improvement so trivial
> as to be irrelevant. How many degrees cooler is that
> computer? If not at least 10 degrees C, then it really does
> not matter. Margin of error in the design makes all that
> cleaning irrelevant.
>
> Then we get to why people clean. Less heat means longer
> life. Yes. And when we apply numbers, that increased life
> expectancy is near zero. In fact the compressed air is more
> likely to reduce life expectancy than the dust. As long as
> the ventilation holes are clear, then the computer has more
> than sufficient cooling. No dust nor a cabinet should block
> those cooling holes. Clean dust only when it is convenient -
> and never use compressed air. Better to leave a coating (not
> to be confused with globs) of dust inside. Dust coating does
> not adversely effect anything - except those with a cleaning
> fetish.
>
> news wrote:
> > what did you do with the mouse?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Let me know when the dust and dirt in your computer builds up enough to cause a
critical fan to stop spinning, with one or more components burning up as a
result... Ben Myers

On Fri, 16 Apr 2004 21:50:38 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Do you clean a mouse with anything other than a finger
>nail? Why? There is nothing in a mouse that needs compressed
>air or even a vacuum to clean out. Nothing. Just scrap away
>the hardened dirt where mouse ball hits roller. Or buy an
>optical mouse and clean nothing.
>
> Bottom line from one who worked where reliability had to be
>100%. Never use compressed air to clean any electronics.
>This has been that well known for so many decades. Any
>properly trained repairman knows - never use compressed air.
>Unfortunately, too many computer 'experts' today never have
>such education or real world experience. Instead they have
>learned like too many auto mechanics have learned. Hearsay.
>
> Do the numbers - something little understood by computer
>people. Blowing out the dust makes an improvement so trivial
>as to be irrelevant. How many degrees cooler is that
>computer? If not at least 10 degrees C, then it really does
>not matter. Margin of error in the design makes all that
>cleaning irrelevant.
>
> Then we get to why people clean. Less heat means longer
>life. Yes. And when we apply numbers, that increased life
>expectancy is near zero. In fact the compressed air is more
>likely to reduce life expectancy than the dust. As long as
>the ventilation holes are clear, then the computer has more
>than sufficient cooling. No dust nor a cabinet should block
>those cooling holes. Clean dust only when it is convenient -
>and never use compressed air. Better to leave a coating (not
>to be confused with globs) of dust inside. Dust coating does
>not adversely effect anything - except those with a cleaning
>fetish.
>
>news wrote:
>> what did you do with the mouse?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

I have seen components compromised by small amounts dust particles.
Some dust particles are conductive to some extent and as you know it
does not always take much to damage electronics.
Periodically blowing out a computer is potentially a very good thing
and recommended.

As long as you focus on just the dust-heat issue, you miss many other
possibilities.
More advanced technology requires we think outside of very narrow
terms as a problem such as dust has the potential to cause other
issues than just overheating.

So while you suggest not blowing out because there is negligible
temperature improvement, I suggest blowing out the dust to improve air
circulation as well as remove potentially damaging contaminants.

--
Jupiter Jones
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/


"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:407EF899.A463790C@hotmail.com...
> Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
> settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
> case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
> jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
>
> At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
> holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
> either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
> required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
> fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
> most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
>
> Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
> computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
> is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
> computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
> just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
> degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
> computer is properly designed and ventilated.
>
> Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
> necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
> this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
> because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
> ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
> removing dust is unnecessary.
>
> I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
> dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
> a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

If you remove all the jumpers (hint:they are about a dollar for 100,
buy a bag full...)and loose items you may vacuum away. Provided you do
not have an ESD issue. Static discharges are the main cause of
component failures on motherboards. Only vacuum with the humidity over
40%, and the vacuum cleaner, the computer chassis,the technician, and
the hose and nozzle must all be grounded. The computer should be
hooked to ground through its power cord (or use a jumper) and the
hose/nozzle must be a conductive ESD type. They are conductors, but
not good ones: they have a designed high resistance that lets static
charges bleed off rather than arc.

A "toner vac" is ideal, but expensive. The Kirby will work, use the
ESD wand and brush from the toner vac-available separately. Ground the
Kirby case with a jumper. A conductive brush-again, not metal, but
designated ESD safe-wielded by a tech who is properly grounded-through
a 10-megohm resistor, as are used in commercial ESD leashes-is
probably better.

If the humidity is low, _lightly_ splash water around on the carpet
first. Wipe the case with a slightly damp rag. No puddles, a little
damp. Let thoroughly dry before plugging in. You can spray the carpet
with a little diluted Downy, but don't get it on the machine anywhere.
Only Downy has the high dollar anti-static ingredient in $100/gallon
ESD spray used in all ISO-9000 electronics plants (as far as I know).
Sta-Puf and Suavitel don't.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

You already have the list of every time dust has caused
failures - including computers before PC existed. Dust
problems are myths often associated with a tech who is
'reaching' to solve a problem he never understood.

Fans don't fail due to dust. They fail due to internal
failures such as seized bearing, misplaced rotation sensor, or
failed transistor. Been doing this for too many decades to
fall for the 'too much dust' myth. No reason to use
compressed air on electronics. Dust may create a marginal
problem if ventilation holes are obstructed and computer
operates in a 100 degree F room. Even a soft paint brush
solves that problem.

Ben Myers wrote:
> Let me know when the dust and dirt in your computer builds up
> enough to cause a critical fan to stop spinning, with one or
> more components burning up as a result... Ben Myers

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Well, you do it your way, I'll do it mine. Never the twain shall meet. Live
and let live. And I won't take your remarks personally... Ben Myers

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 21:13:26 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:

> You already have the list of every time dust has caused
>failures - including computers before PC existed. Dust
>problems are myths often associated with a tech who is
>'reaching' to solve a problem he never understood.
>
> Fans don't fail due to dust. They fail due to internal
>failures such as seized bearing, misplaced rotation sensor, or
>failed transistor. Been doing this for too many decades to
>fall for the 'too much dust' myth. No reason to use
>compressed air on electronics. Dust may create a marginal
>problem if ventilation holes are obstructed and computer
>operates in a 100 degree F room. Even a soft paint brush
>solves that problem.
>
>Ben Myers wrote:
>> Let me know when the dust and dirt in your computer builds up
>> enough to cause a critical fan to stop spinning, with one or
>> more components burning up as a result... Ben Myers

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Jim;
If you are pulling jumpers off with a vacuum, you already have at
least one of the below issues:
1. Too powerful a vacuum for the job.
2. Jumpers way to loose...will eventually be a problem otherwise.

The point of my post is cooling issues caused by dust is only one
issue.
If the focus is that narrow, other issues may result because of
ignorance.

I was not addressing ESD because that is beyond the scope of this
thread.

--
Jupiter Jones
Check the following link for some great problem solving newsgroups.
http://support.microsoft.com/newsgroups/default.aspx
http://www3.telus.net/dandemar/


"Jim-Ed Browne" <jimedbrowne@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:65228e33.0404171529.645aa4b5@posting.google.com...
> If you remove all the jumpers (hint:they are about a dollar for 100,
> buy a bag full...)and loose items you may vacuum away. Provided you
do
> not have an ESD issue. Static discharges are the main cause of
> component failures on motherboards. Only vacuum with the humidity
over
> 40%, and the vacuum cleaner, the computer chassis,the technician,
and
> the hose and nozzle must all be grounded. The computer should be
> hooked to ground through its power cord (or use a jumper) and the
> hose/nozzle must be a conductive ESD type. They are conductors, but
> not good ones: they have a designed high resistance that lets static
> charges bleed off rather than arc.
>
> A "toner vac" is ideal, but expensive. The Kirby will work, use the
> ESD wand and brush from the toner vac-available separately. Ground
the
> Kirby case with a jumper. A conductive brush-again, not metal, but
> designated ESD safe-wielded by a tech who is properly
grounded-through
> a 10-megohm resistor, as are used in commercial ESD leashes-is
> probably better.
>
> If the humidity is low, _lightly_ splash water around on the carpet
> first. Wipe the case with a slightly damp rag. No puddles, a little
> damp. Let thoroughly dry before plugging in. You can spray the
carpet
> with a little diluted Downy, but don't get it on the machine
anywhere.
> Only Downy has the high dollar anti-static ingredient in $100/gallon
> ESD spray used in all ISO-9000 electronics plants (as far as I
know).
> Sta-Puf and Suavitel don't.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Do you think he was talking about the industrial-type compressed air that
contains oil/water? I can see how that might be bad for electronics. The
junk in the can you buy at Staples is probably OK.
<ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
news:407f1a0a.13034374@news.charter.net...
> Hmm. Never ever had a problem with a computer getting into difficulty as
a
> result of my blasting it out with compressed air. Must be either dumb
luck or
> highly refined technique. Several dealers and resellers in my
neighborhood with
> whom I have a loose arrangement to exchange parts and repair/maintenance
have
> never had a problem either.
>
> Admittedly a computer CAN survive with a lot of dust, dirt, dead mice, and
> animal hair inside it. But the chances of survival are generally better
if the
> interior is somewhat clean, allowing clear and unimpeded air flow.
>
> I've also serviced a proprietary computer (a custom printer RIP) never
ever
> cleaned by the so-called maintenance person. Opened up the chassis and
found a
> ball about the side of a baseball consisting of cat hair, paper chaff,
dust,
> dirt, and heaven knows what else. And that computer had a failed power
supply.
> Luckily for my client, a common personal computer power supply fit right
in, so
> there was no need for a service call from the other guy using parts paid
via
> extortion.
>
> Factory environments are especially hard on personal computers, and some
regular
> cleaning out of the dirt prolongs the life of the machine.
>
> That's my opinion, and you are just as free to have yours... Ben Myers
>
> On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:03:21 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
> >settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
> >case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
> >jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
> >
> > At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
> >holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
> >either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
> >required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
> >fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
> >most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
> >
> > Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
> >computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
> >is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
> >computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
> >just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
> >degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
> >computer is properly designed and ventilated.
> >
> > Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
> >necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
> >this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
> >because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
> >ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
> >removing dust is unnecessary.
> >
> > I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
> >dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
> >a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.
> >
> >"A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
> >> I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
> >>
> >> How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
> >> it each time to do it?
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

One of the factories I sell for had an old 286 PC a few years ago that
stayed on 24/7 for about 3 years (all it did was operate a bridge between an
ancient IBM card-based data collection system and an A/S400 computer). It
died one day, and I opened it up for them. It looked just like the inside of
a vacuum cleaner bag. Dust killed that one. On the positive side, we got
another old 386 computer at a yard sale for 5.00 and replaced it!
"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4081D636.A231CAAE@hotmail.com...
> You already have the list of every time dust has caused
> failures - including computers before PC existed. Dust
> problems are myths often associated with a tech who is
> 'reaching' to solve a problem he never understood.
>
> Fans don't fail due to dust. They fail due to internal
> failures such as seized bearing, misplaced rotation sensor, or
> failed transistor. Been doing this for too many decades to
> fall for the 'too much dust' myth. No reason to use
> compressed air on electronics. Dust may create a marginal
> problem if ventilation holes are obstructed and computer
> operates in a 100 degree F room. Even a soft paint brush
> solves that problem.
>
> Ben Myers wrote:
> > Let me know when the dust and dirt in your computer builds up
> > enough to cause a critical fan to stop spinning, with one or
> > more components burning up as a result... Ben Myers

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Beats me what he was talking about. I buy cartons of "Blow Off" in small
quantities for my own use. I've also run into other brands with similar
product. Nothing but air. Nothing but net? Using this stuff is a slam-dunk
for me... Ben Myers

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 09:39:47 -0400, "Prilosec" <purple@nni.net> wrote:

>Do you think he was talking about the industrial-type compressed air that
>contains oil/water? I can see how that might be bad for electronics. The
>junk in the can you buy at Staples is probably OK.
><ben_myers_spam_me_not @ charter.net (Ben Myers)> wrote in message
>news:407f1a0a.13034374@news.charter.net...
>> Hmm. Never ever had a problem with a computer getting into difficulty as
>a
>> result of my blasting it out with compressed air. Must be either dumb
>luck or
>> highly refined technique. Several dealers and resellers in my
>neighborhood with
>> whom I have a loose arrangement to exchange parts and repair/maintenance
>have
>> never had a problem either.
>>
>> Admittedly a computer CAN survive with a lot of dust, dirt, dead mice, and
>> animal hair inside it. But the chances of survival are generally better
>if the
>> interior is somewhat clean, allowing clear and unimpeded air flow.
>>
>> I've also serviced a proprietary computer (a custom printer RIP) never
>ever
>> cleaned by the so-called maintenance person. Opened up the chassis and
>found a
>> ball about the side of a baseball consisting of cat hair, paper chaff,
>dust,
>> dirt, and heaven knows what else. And that computer had a failed power
>supply.
>> Luckily for my client, a common personal computer power supply fit right
>in, so
>> there was no need for a service call from the other guy using parts paid
>via
>> extortion.
>>
>> Factory environments are especially hard on personal computers, and some
>regular
>> cleaning out of the dirt prolongs the life of the machine.
>>
>> That's my opinion, and you are just as free to have yours... Ben Myers
>>
>> On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 17:03:21 -0400, w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Compressed air can even change critical dip switch
>> >settings. Never use compressed air on electronics. In on
>> >case, a user vacuumed the computer and therefore removed a
>> >jumper setting. Computer would not operate.
>> >
>> > At most, gently vacuum or blow dust off of ventilation
>> >holes. Nothing more. If a dust problem is that large, then
>> >either an industrial grade computer for a harsh environment is
>> >required, or some silly person installed too many fans. Five
>> >fans inside a case does create dust problems especially since
>> >most every computer works just fine with only one 80mm fan.
>> >
>> > Why did power supply die? Air that is exhausted from
>> >computer must not be air that reenters computer. Ventilation
>> >is why holes must be properly cut in a cabinet that holds a
>> >computer - so that heat does not recycle. Computers must work
>> >just fine when room air is 100 degree F. A computer in a 70
>> >degree room just will never have failures due to dust - if
>> >computer is properly designed and ventilated.
>> >
>> > Do not use compressed air on electronics. First it is not
>> >necessary. Second it can cause other failures. Too many have
>> >this 'clean' fetish. They always want to cure something only
>> >because it looks dirty. Short of large globs of dust on
>> >ventilation holes or large dust balls inside the case -
>> >removing dust is unnecessary.
>> >
>> > I only remove dust because I don't like getting my hands
>> >dirty if I happen to be inside the machine. Once even found
>> >a death mouse. But computer worked just fine.
>> >
>> >"A. & C. Bredt" wrote:
>> >> I have it on a UPS, but I see that it is very dusty inside.
>> >>
>> >> How often would you use compressed air to clean it? Should I open
>> >> it each time to do it?
>>
>
>

 

[Snoopy]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

I've cleaned some fan fins that had caked dust/lint/hair on them to the
point that they added a small beaded effect to the edge of the fan. Now I'm
no ventilation/fan expert but I would think that the added weight of all
that crud would accelerate the demise of that fan. Also wouldn't those
altered fan blade edges alter the efficiency of the fan? Fan outages can
indeed croak a system, CPU or component.

In the systems I've seen, the motherboard is usually mounted vertically and
thus doesn't tend to be a dust collection point. Other components and areas
tend to gather dust/hair/crud and I can't see that they'd be very
susceptible to a short blast of compressed air.


"w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4081D636.A231CAAE@hotmail.com...
> You already have the list of every time dust has caused
> failures - including computers before PC existed. Dust
> problems are myths often associated with a tech who is
> 'reaching' to solve a problem he never understood.
>
> Fans don't fail due to dust. They fail due to internal
> failures such as seized bearing, misplaced rotation sensor, or
> failed transistor. Been doing this for too many decades to
> fall for the 'too much dust' myth. No reason to use
> compressed air on electronics. Dust may create a marginal
> problem if ventilation holes are obstructed and computer
> operates in a 100 degree F room. Even a soft paint brush
> solves that problem.
>
> Ben Myers wrote:
> > Let me know when the dust and dirt in your computer builds up
> > enough to cause a critical fan to stop spinning, with one or
> > more components burning up as a result... Ben Myers

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.gateway2000 (More info?)

Two fan problems involve bearing wear and location of the
hall effect sensor. Bearing wear creates far more stress on
fan. The hall effect sensor, if not perfectly flat on printed
circuit board (inside fan) can create insufficient torque (fan
stalls). These are manufacturing defects. Dust on fan blades
is not significant. In fact, if dust was significant, then
fan was defective when it left the factory.

If fan suffers an early demise, then suspect power supply
manufacturer or computer assembler is again selecting
components only on price - quality and manufacturer integrity
be damned.

One reason why some clone assembler recommend annual
cleaning - they install too many fans. One 80 mm fan is
typically enough cooling for most every computer. Too many
case fans create significant dust buildup problems. Do the
numbers. Theoretical numbers confirmed by experimentation
says the computer works just fine even in a 100 degree F
room. Too many fans create dust problems.

snoopy wrote:
> I've cleaned some fan fins that had caked dust/lint/hair on them
> to the point that they added a small beaded effect to the edge
> of the fan. Now I'm no ventilation/fan expert but I would think
> that the added weight of all that crud would accelerate the
> demise of that fan. Also wouldn't those altered fan blade edges
> alter the efficiency of the fan? Fan outages can
> indeed croak a system, CPU or component.
>
> In the systems I've seen, the motherboard is usually mounted
> vertically and thus doesn't tend to be a dust collection point.
> Other components and areas tend to gather dust/hair/crud and
> I can't see that they'd be very susceptible to a short blast
> of compressed air.

 

[fixguy]

Why Do PSU’s Fail?

Well, power supplies just fail. Failures can be instigated, and other times they simply give up. Below is a list of common factors that lead a power supply to it’s grave.

* Age
* Electric Interference (Lightning, Power Spikes, Etc.)
* Dirt/Foreign Substance (Cigarette Smoke, House Dust, Etc.)
* Brown Outs
* Overheating and/or Ventilation Failures

From the list above, the most common of all them is overheating and lightning. If you are a cigarette smoker or the computer is in a dusty environment, rest assure you will be replacing your PSU sooner than not.



http://richard291990.blogs.linkbucks.com/archives/15