looking for opinions on Dark Eldar.

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It's about that time that I'm looking to start a new army, and I have it
whittled down to Dark Eldar, Orks and Tyranids. I'm currently playing
marines.

I'm not looking for an all powerful force, rather something fun and
different. Of course, most of my mates play Marines and/or Chaos, so
something competetive would be nice too. I don't want me arse handed to me
every time.

any insights into these armies would be much appreciated.

Cheers!

 

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Melketh wrote:
> It's about that time that I'm looking to start a new army, and I have it
> whittled down to Dark Eldar, Orks and Tyranids. I'm currently playing
> marines.
>
> I'm not looking for an all powerful force, rather something fun and
> different. Of course, most of my mates play Marines and/or Chaos, so
> something competetive would be nice too. I don't want me arse handed to me
> every time.
>
> any insights into these armies would be much appreciated.
>

Dark Eldar are highly mobile, shoot well and have powerful weapons and
some of the best hand-to-hand fighters in the game. They are, however,
paper thin and get shot up easily. Just get into assault quick with the
stuff that needs to and sit back and shoot with the rest. This is a
finesse army but sounds like it could be what you are looking for.

Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play. I
suggest having a look at the Ork Klans lists in a recent White Dwarf (I
play Death Skullz).

Tyranids can be good at assault and have some of the cheapest basic foot
troops in the game. They also have a good bit of shooty stuff; in fact
I've had more luck with Shooty bugs than assaulty. Lack of anti-tank and
armor piercing will make Marines a challenge for you. Beware the
flamers and bolters with your bugs. Also, the ability of your opponents
to pick out anything they want to for shooting without leadership tests
penalizes you somewhat. Can be a frustrating army to pick up, IMHO.

 

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"Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...
> Melketh wrote:
> > It's about that time that I'm looking to start a new army, and I have it
> > whittled down to Dark Eldar, Orks and Tyranids. I'm currently playing
> > marines.
> >
> > I'm not looking for an all powerful force, rather something fun and
> > different. Of course, most of my mates play Marines and/or Chaos, so
> > something competetive would be nice too. I don't want me arse handed to
me
> > every time.
> >
> > any insights into these armies would be much appreciated.
> >
>
> Dark Eldar are highly mobile, shoot well and have powerful weapons and
> some of the best hand-to-hand fighters in the game. They are, however,
> paper thin and get shot up easily. Just get into assault quick with the
> stuff that needs to and sit back and shoot with the rest. This is a
> finesse army but sounds like it could be what you are looking for.
>
> Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
> shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
> Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
> precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
> transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
> they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play. I
> suggest having a look at the Ork Klans lists in a recent White Dwarf (I
> play Death Skullz).
>
> Tyranids can be good at assault and have some of the cheapest basic foot
> troops in the game. They also have a good bit of shooty stuff; in fact
> I've had more luck with Shooty bugs than assaulty. Lack of anti-tank and
> armor piercing will make Marines a challenge for you. Beware the
> flamers and bolters with your bugs. Also, the ability of your opponents
> to pick out anything they want to for shooting without leadership tests
> penalizes you somewhat. Can be a frustrating army to pick up, IMHO.

excellent, thank you. this is the kind of info I was looking for

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...
> Melketh wrote:
> > It's about that time that I'm looking to start a new army, and I have it
> > whittled down to Dark Eldar, Orks and Tyranids. I'm currently playing
> > marines.
> >
> > I'm not looking for an all powerful force, rather something fun and
> > different. Of course, most of my mates play Marines and/or Chaos, so
> > something competetive would be nice too. I don't want me arse handed to
me
> > every time.
> >
> > any insights into these armies would be much appreciated.
> >
>
> Dark Eldar are highly mobile, shoot well and have powerful weapons and
> some of the best hand-to-hand fighters in the game. They are, however,
> paper thin and get shot up easily. Just get into assault quick with the
> stuff that needs to and sit back and shoot with the rest. This is a
> finesse army but sounds like it could be what you are looking for.
>
> Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
> shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
> Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
> precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
> transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
> they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play. I
> suggest having a look at the Ork Klans lists in a recent White Dwarf (I
> play Death Skullz).
>
> Tyranids can be good at assault and have some of the cheapest basic foot
> troops in the game. They also have a good bit of shooty stuff; in fact
> I've had more luck with Shooty bugs than assaulty. Lack of anti-tank and
> armor piercing will make Marines a challenge for you. Beware the
> flamers and bolters with your bugs. Also, the ability of your opponents
> to pick out anything they want to for shooting without leadership tests
> penalizes you somewhat. Can be a frustrating army to pick up, IMHO.

ORKS!!! I have 3000+ points worth of Deathskullz that havent seen a game
yet! If you like doin conversions, no other game has as many possibilities.

 

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"Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...

> Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
> shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
> Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
> precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
> transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
> they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play. I
> suggest having a look at the Ork Klans lists in a recent White Dwarf (I
> play Death Skullz).

Orks can shoot pretty well, actually. Their BS2 is compensated for by the
staggering amount of Big Shootaz and/or Rokkit Launchas they can fit into a
list. Roll enough dice and it doesn't matter what your BS is.

They don't outshoot IG or Tau very often, but they can do well enough
against more all-rounder armies to catch people unawares, and have the
advantage that even boyz tooled for shooting have a pretty decent statline
for combat too.

Tim
--
----------------
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Helicon_One wrote:
> "Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
> news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...
>
>
>>Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
>>shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
>>Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
>>precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
>>transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
>>they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play. I
>>suggest having a look at the Ork Klans lists in a recent White Dwarf (I
>>play Death Skullz).
>
>
> Orks can shoot pretty well, actually. Their BS2 is compensated for by the
> staggering amount of Big Shootaz and/or Rokkit Launchas they can fit into a
> list. Roll enough dice and it doesn't matter what your BS is.

Point for point, Orks shoot awful.

Can you compensate for the worst BS in the game? Sure. Does it make them
shoot well? No. It makes them a gimmick army. You will have to
compromise on numbers to get the points to squeeze all those Big Shootas
and Rokkits into the army.

Compensating numbers for quality in a given area is a gimmee. I can take
a Tau army and throw enough troops at someone to make it a credible
assault force. Does this make Tau a good assault army? I don't think so.
You can take the same Tau army and put the points into firepower instead
of numbers and it becomes a much better army.

> They don't outshoot IG or Tau very often

Like never.

> against more all-rounder armies to catch people unawares, and have the
> advantage that even boyz tooled for shooting have a pretty decent statline
> for combat too.

Ah, here we have hit the key: Catch people unawares. That shooty Ork
army might catch someone with their pants down one or two times. Try
bringing that shooty tooled army against a shooty tooled Space Marine
army and see how long you last. My Chaos army will pick you apart like a
kid pulling wings off of flies.

My experience is people tend to make their armies strong in the strength
of the army to get the most bang for the point buck. Shooty Tau and IG,
Mixed SM/CSM, and Assaulty Ork and Tyranids.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@hatespam.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:iIqdna7Y0fLf4EDcRVn-rA@comcast.com...
> Helicon_One wrote:
> > "Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
> > news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...

> > Orks can shoot pretty well, actually. Their BS2 is compensated for by
the
> > staggering amount of Big Shootaz and/or Rokkit Launchas they can fit
into a
> > list. Roll enough dice and it doesn't matter what your BS is.
>
> Point for point, Orks shoot awful.
>
> Can you compensate for the worst BS in the game? Sure. Does it make them
> shoot well? No. It makes them a gimmick army. You will have to
> compromise on numbers to get the points to squeeze all those Big Shootas
> and Rokkits into the army.

A bit, but RLs are only 5pts each. I've put 15 of those into a 1000pt army
before, with a good lump of HTH ability thrown in as well.

Hell, you could just take a Warboss and blow the rest of your points on
20-strong slugga mobz with a Nob and 3 rokkit launchas each, however many
you can afford. They're not compromised in numbers, they'll take on
anything in combat, they'll pour out credible shooting ability at the same
time, and because the rokkitz are assault weapons they don't lose out on
shooting as they advance like they would in other armies. For kicks, throw a
Warbike mob or two up a flank and watch what twin linked big shootas do to
anything not in power armour (and sometimes to power armour as well!) or
light vehicles.

You can't build an Ork army purely around shooting everything dead before
they do the same to you, clearly. A Shooty Ork army works by pouring out
fire as it advances, softening everything up with massed Rokkitz and/or Big
Shootaz before you get into HTH to finish them off.

> Compensating numbers for quality in a given area is a gimmee. I can take
> a Tau army and throw enough troops at someone to make it a credible
> assault force. Does this make Tau a good assault army? I don't think so.
> You can take the same Tau army and put the points into firepower instead
> of numbers and it becomes a much better army.

No, it becomes one-dimensional, viciously effective in shooting but limited
at everything else. Obviously that's the whole point of the Tau army, so
fair enough, but the beauty of Shooty Orks is they can shoot decently, and
being Orks they're nasty in assault too.

> > They don't outshoot IG or Tau very often
>
> Like never.

*Sigh*.... you just don't get British understatement, do you? ;-)

> > against more all-rounder armies to catch people unawares, and have the
> > advantage that even boyz tooled for shooting have a pretty decent
statline
> > for combat too.
>
> Ah, here we have hit the key: Catch people unawares. That shooty Ork
> army might catch someone with their pants down one or two times. Try
> bringing that shooty tooled army against a shooty tooled Space Marine
> army and see how long you last. My Chaos army will pick you apart like a
> kid pulling wings off of flies.

Against all-rounder armies, I said. Obviously Orks are never going to plonk
down anything to outshoot a SAFH, except perhaps for the 1500pt KoS list
with 47 Warbikes in it (someday, I *will* build that army...). but they can
be given enough firepower to cover all eventualities.

> My experience is people tend to make their armies strong in the strength
> of the army to get the most bang for the point buck. Shooty Tau and IG,
> Mixed SM/CSM, and Assaulty Ork and Tyranids.

Well, unless you take a grot army, Orks are good in assault by default.
Giving them some shooting ability doesn't really hurt them.

Tim
--
----------------
Criticizing the current administration is a treasonable offence!
The dept of "Homeland Security" has been informed of your
activities and will arrive shortly to pick you up. Please wrap
a towel around your head and stand out in front of your home
with a burning US flag so they can find you.
- smithdoer - Usenet out-take

www.rgmw.org - the RGMW FAQ, ignore at your peril!

Currently listening to: 'Godzilla' - Feeder

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

On Thu, 06 Jan 2005 13:02:43 -0500, Hive Tyrant
<richbusby@hatespam.comcast.net> wrote:

>Helicon_One wrote:
>> "Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
>> news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...
>>
>>>Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
>>>shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
>>>Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
>>>precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
>>>transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
>>>they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play.

Certainly. But I had gotten a little out of my game with Orks, so I
tried to put them on the back burner. Fortunately for me, I got a
sign from God that I should get back to playing them. Mind you, I'm
not making this up. I went to a local Chinese buffet, and my fortune
cookie read:

"Keep on charging the enemy so long as there is life."

I have never seen a fortune cookie without some kind of sappy
"inspirational" comment on it, so that struck me as being pretty odd.
Then I flipped over the slip of paper to see what the Chinese word
was. It was "Mushroom".

I nearly fell out of my chair laughing.

And I can provide a scan of the slip if you need it. I keep the thing
in my pocket so I can show people that even God wants me to keep
playing Orks.

> I
>>>suggest having a look at the Ork Klans lists in a recent White Dwarf (I
>>>play Death Skullz).

Anyone know where I can get this article? I missed that WD and have
had no luck finding it since.

>> Orks can shoot pretty well, actually. Their BS2 is compensated for by the
>> staggering amount of Big Shootaz and/or Rokkit Launchas they can fit into a
>> list. Roll enough dice and it doesn't matter what your BS is.
>
>Point for point, Orks shoot awful.
>
>Can you compensate for the worst BS in the game? Sure. Does it make them
>shoot well? No. It makes them a gimmick army. You will have to
>compromise on numbers to get the points to squeeze all those Big Shootas
>and Rokkits into the army.

Beg to differ, but I've never been short on Orks and I've always got a
ton of big shootas. They are definitely useful weapons, since they
are Assault 3. With the new rules, that means you can let rip with
these boys to soften up a target and then charge right in.

>> They don't outshoot IG or Tau very often
>
>Like never.

Oh, don't say that! I tore up an IG army with big shootas once.
Wasn't much left to charge when I got into HTH, so I mopped that army
up good.

>> against more all-rounder armies to catch people unawares, and have the
>> advantage that even boyz tooled for shooting have a pretty decent statline
>> for combat too.
>
>Ah, here we have hit the key: Catch people unawares. That shooty Ork
>army might catch someone with their pants down one or two times. Try
>bringing that shooty tooled army against a shooty tooled Space Marine
>army and see how long you last. My Chaos army will pick you apart like a
>kid pulling wings off of flies.
>
>My experience is people tend to make their armies strong in the strength
>of the army to get the most bang for the point buck. Shooty Tau and IG,
>Mixed SM/CSM, and Assaulty Ork and Tyranids.

My Orks are filled with Slugga Boy mobs of 16 Orks that have 3 big
shootas in the mob, and the Nob leading them also has a big shoota.
You can focus on assault while still being able to provide supporting
fire.

If you're making the point that Orks cannot be a shooty army in the
sense that they can't stand and shoot it out with another army, I
agree wholeheartedly. However, you'll never convince me to leave my
big shootas at home, because so often that extra firepower has made
the difference in an assault by weakening up a unit before I charged
it. The Ork army can include a lot of firepower while still being an
assault army, the key is to remember to use that firepower to
emphasise your strengths.
-Erik
"There's a lot to be said for just letting go. It also helps to keep in mind that that bastard Grim Reaper is loose in the room and moving targets are harder to hit."
-Randy Wayne White

RGMW FAQ @ http://www.rgmw.org
Read it for your own good!

 

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Erik Setzer wrote:
> On Thu, 06 Jan 2005 13:02:43 -0500, Hive Tyrant
> <richbusby@hatespam.comcast.net> wrote:
>>Helicon_One wrote:
>>>"Hive Tyrant" <richbusby@comcast.hatespam.net> wrote in message
>>>news:1PpCd.72112$k25.49365@attbi_s53...
>>>
>>>>Orks are not the most mobile but have good toughness and assault. They
>>>>shoot awfully with the worst ballistic skill in the game. The 4th
>>>>Edition rules have hampered their effectiveness considerably since what
>>>>precious few Orks that could ride in a transport die like dogs when the
>>>>transport is shot out from under them. This happens all too often since
>>>>they have light, open topped vehicles. Still, they are fun to play.
>
> Certainly. But I had gotten a little out of my game with Orks, so I
> tried to put them on the back burner. Fortunately for me, I got a
> sign from God that I should get back to playing them. Mind you, I'm
> not making this up. I went to a local Chinese buffet, and my fortune
> cookie read:
>
> "Keep on charging the enemy so long as there is life."
>
> I have never seen a fortune cookie without some kind of sappy
> "inspirational" comment on it, so that struck me as being pretty odd.
> Then I flipped over the slip of paper to see what the Chinese word
> was. It was "Mushroom".
>
> I nearly fell out of my chair laughing.
>
> And I can provide a scan of the slip if you need it. I keep the thing
> in my pocket so I can show people that even God wants me to keep
> playing Orks.

In this case, presumably Gork and/or Mork?

--
=/\= Lt. Cmdr. Jim =/\=
By our chocolate, shall they know us.
Not on behalf of any committee, real or imaginary, in this or any other
universe.