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Cheap alternative to GW spray primer?

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Anonymous
February 9, 2005 1:40:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Anybody know of/used one available in the USA that gives the same
strong coat, but for a more reasonable price? Ive tried Krylon Matte
Black in the past, and it proceeded to eat away at my plastic marines.
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 12:57:15 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

drgrbek wrote:
> Anybody know of/used one available in the USA that gives the same
> strong coat, but for a more reasonable price?

GW Black is a very good primer. It doesn't eat GW plastic, it coats
well, thinly, and smoothly. It is a bit better than most alternatives.

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 4:47:25 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"drgrbek" <jsb372002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1107974432.336840.56180@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Anybody know of/used one available in the USA that gives the same
> strong coat, but for a more reasonable price? Ive tried Krylon Matte
> Black in the past, and it proceeded to eat away at my plastic marines.
>

You're going to get brutalized for not following the "rules", but that's
neither here nor there for the moment.

If you check around the newsgroup, you should find a website which has a
great variety of painting suggestions. One of those is in the vein of a "low
cost" substitute to GW spray primer. Overall, it is suggested to stay with a
hobby primer which is made to handle the fine detail and won't attack
plastics. I use Armory primer. Not as expensive (5.99 as compared to 9.00
for GW primers), I tried it out and found it suitable - I haven't used GW
primer myself, so I can't offer a comparasion.
Related resources
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 6:43:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Eric A. Johnson" <vze1mx2h@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:N2zOd.30722$QS5.26526@trndny06...
>
> "drgrbek" <jsb372002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1107974432.336840.56180@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>> Anybody know of/used one available in the USA that gives the same
>> strong coat, but for a more reasonable price? Ive tried Krylon Matte
>> Black in the past, and it proceeded to eat away at my plastic marines.
>>
>
> You're going to get brutalized for not following the "rules", but that's
> neither here nor there for the moment.

What rule is being violated here??
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 10:53:19 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

It's also nine bucks a can...

--Chris
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 10:56:25 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

It's also nine bucks a can...

--Chris
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 10:36:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Out from under a rock popped Myrmidon and said

> Eric A. Johnson Varfed out the following in Timo speak...
[snip]
>> You're going to get brutalized for not following the "rules", but
>> that's neither here nor there for the moment.
>
> He's not posting untagged for sale ads, and a paint question is
> pretty 'game system neutral' so he's not to likely to get to abused -
> unless of course Al's in the mood. ;) 

Although "Eric A Johnson" is almost a freudian demand for brutalizing
around here. Good thing Sam's busy :-)

--
Rob Singers RGMW FAQ Maintainer. See it @ http://www.rgmw.org
Send submissions to submissions at rgmw dot org changing the obvious.
"I present to RGMW....the real life model for StrongBad." (c) Inc 2003
Credo Elvem ipsum etiam vivere
Anonymous
February 10, 2005 11:33:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

I use matt car paint

have done for 25 years and it's great

Simonitz is particularly good
Anonymous
February 11, 2005 1:23:04 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere wrote:
> I use matt car paint

I've found Automotive Primer to be a bit too hot for GW plastic, with
some tendency to pit, etch, or otherwise mar the surface.

> have done for 25 years and it's great
>
> Simonitz is particularly good

I may look into this after I run out of the primer I currently have.

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
February 11, 2005 1:30:07 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Chris Valera wrote:
> It's also nine bucks a can...

Indeed it is. But for the price, it's not so bad. From my experience,
Armoury Primer isn't quite as good of a value, but is good enough to
pass as a substitute.

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
February 11, 2005 3:20:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"John Hwang" <JohnHwangCSI@cs.com.no.com> wrote in message
news:3731i5F58mkdmU1@individual.net...
> Ancient Gamer wrote:
>> Insane Ranter enteredsaid...
>
>>>>>Anybody know of/used one available in the USA that gives the same
>>>>>strong coat, but for a more reasonable price?
>>>>
>>>>GW Black is a very good primer. It doesn't eat GW plastic, it coats
>>>>well, thinly, and smoothly. It is a bit better than most alternatives.
>
> Clarification for those to dense to comprehend the above:
>
> Yes, there are cheaper primers, but they will NOT work as universally well
> as GW Black Primer.
>
> Yes, there are other primers that are just as good, if not better, but
> they are NOT cheaper.
>
> Thus, GW Black Primer has NO viable alternative that is cheaper.

Odd that this can of black that I use works well and isn't GW and I get it
at wal-mart
Anonymous
February 11, 2005 5:54:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

It's the propellant.....


you MUST regardless of paint shake well and spray into space first

I just did that with a load of stuff, like a schmuck... picked up the wrong
can

Moral : NEVER have 3 identical cans lined up with only one thats been shaken
Anonymous
February 12, 2005 12:34:53 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

John Hwang <JohnHwangCSI@cs.com.no.com> wrote:
> Chris Valera wrote:
> > It's also nine bucks a can...

> Indeed it is. But for the price, it's not so bad. From my experience,
> Armoury Primer isn't quite as good of a value, but is good enough to
> pass as a substitute.

I used to have very good results with Armoury Primer, but the lastest that I
purchased (after being out of the hobby for quite a few years) is horrible!
Have they changed their formula or manufacturer?

Zane
Anonymous
February 12, 2005 12:34:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

healyzh@aracnet.com wrote:
> John Hwang <JohnHwangCSI@cs.com.no.com> wrote:

>>From my experience, Armoury Primer isn't quite as good
>>of a value, but is good enough to pass as a substitute.
>
> I used to have very good results with Armoury Primer, but the lastest that I
> purchased (after being out of the hobby for quite a few years) is horrible!
> Have they changed their formula or manufacturer?

It's been quite a few years since I used Armoury, so that's entirely
possible.

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
February 12, 2005 7:41:24 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

John Hwang entered the world pub known as rec.games.miniatures.warhammer and
said...

> > He also said a reasonable price which excludes all of Citadel/GW paints...
>
> Please note that he was talking about primer, not paint. GW Black
> Primer is pretty good, good enough to justify its price.
>
>
So explain how GW primer can be a cheap alternative to GW primer? Which is
what the original poster was asking about.

Not to mention the fact that their are viable primers available for about
six dollars a can that are better then GW primer. perhaps you would care to
explain why it was that the GW "Black Primer" was identical in texture and
feel to the old GW "Chaos Black" spray paint when it was released about five
years ago, or the fact that the sku was the same for both?

--
Jim M
posted on this day, the 4,181st of September 1993

"Look alive. Here comes a buzzard." -- Walt Kelly (Pogo)
"I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I
go into the other room and read a book." -- Groucho Marx

http://jimac.tripod.com
Anonymous
February 12, 2005 2:52:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Out from under a rock popped Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere and said

> It's the propellant.....

What's the propellant? Snarf do you realise that when you snip context
it's hard to work out what you're talking about? Your newsreader might
make it obvious but not everyone is likely to either get all the posts or
have their newsreader configured like yours. Have a read of this
http://nnqweb.tripod.com/nquote.html.

--
Rob Singers RGMW FAQ Maintainer. See it @ http://www.rgmw.org
Send submissions to submissions at rgmw dot org changing the obvious.
"I present to RGMW....the real life model for StrongBad." (c) Inc 2003
Credo Elvem ipsum etiam vivere
Anonymous
February 12, 2005 2:52:49 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Robert Singers" <rsingers@finger.hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95FB78D9E6753rsingers@IP-Hidden...
> Out from under a rock popped Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere and said
>
>> It's the propellant.....
>
> What's the propellant?

A propellant is that thing on the top of a beanie hat that spins around.


--

-smithdoerr
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 1:16:37 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Out from under a rock popped smithdoerr and said

> "Robert Singers" wrote
>> Out from under a rock popped Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere and
>> said
>>
>>> It's the propellant.....
>>
>> What's the propellant?
>
> A propellant is that thing on the top of a beanie hat that spins
> around.

I thought it was Cecil who was the spinner.

--
Rob Singers RGMW FAQ Maintainer. See it @ http://www.rgmw.org
Send submissions to submissions at rgmw dot org changing the obvious.
"I present to RGMW....the real life model for StrongBad." (c) Inc 2003
Credo Elvem ipsum etiam vivere
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 1:16:38 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Robert Singers" <rsingers@finger.hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95FBE29D32C25rsingers@IP-Hidden...
> Out from under a rock popped smithdoerr and said
>
>> "Robert Singers" wrote
>>> Out from under a rock popped Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere and
>>> said
>>>
>>>> It's the propellant.....
>>>
>>> What's the propellant?
>>
>> A propellant is that thing on the top of a beanie hat that spins
>> around.
>
> I thought it was Cecil who was the spinner.

Only when someone flushes his bucket.


--

-smithdoerr
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 4:16:21 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"drgrbek" <jsb372002@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1107974432.336840.56180@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Anybody know of/used one available in the USA that gives the same
> strong coat, but for a more reasonable price? Ive tried Krylon Matte
> Black in the past, and it proceeded to eat away at my plastic marines.

Do you know anyone with a decent airbrush that you can borrow?, if so then
any matt acrylic will do at a fraction of the cost of an aerosol and you'll
get a much finer finish too. I use an Aztek with the black nozzle and 'Model
Paints' primer (a UK brand) but it will handle any acrylic including the GW
pots.

Greg
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 4:24:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Begging the pardon of the illuminati in these parts :)  :)  :)  :)  :





With regards to 'pitting' on plastics caused by 'car' paints

It's the propellant that causes this 'syndrome'


you MUST regardless of paint shake well and spray into space first

I just did that with a load of stuff, like a schmuck... picked up the wrong
can
Anonymous
February 13, 2005 4:24:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere wrote:
> With regards to 'pitting' on plastics caused by 'car' paints
>
> It's the propellant that causes this 'syndrome'

Actually, it's the solvent / thinner that's mixed in with the propellant
and primer. With sufficient solvent, it would be trivial to could get
the same kind of pitting with an airbrush that uses Nitrogen or inert
gas for the propellant.

> you MUST regardless of paint shake well and spray into space first

Oh, believe me, I shake and swirl the can for several minutes before
spraying, then clear the can. I even keep hot water ready between sets,
to counteract the cooling caused by spraying. And I sorely doubt that
Myr and the other painters are ignorant of how to properly use spray
primer.

That doesn't change the fact that automotive primers are "hotter" than
hobby primers. Nor does it change the fact that GW plastic is
relatively more sensitive to the amount of solvent in the primer.

Now, perhaps you've found some other techniques that are suitable for
using hot primer on sensitive plastic, and simply aren't aware of what
you've been doing to get it right.

But I can tell you for certain that if one is primarily experienced with
using hobby primer, automotive primer does require different spraying
techniques to avoid pitting of GW plastic above and beyond merely
shaking and clearing the spray can.


--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 1:06:06 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

However it pales in the face of the time I had a lemsip in one glass and a
gold wash in the other and to this day I wretch when I open gold acrylic.

:( 
Anonymous
February 14, 2005 1:09:06 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

I use 6 litres of undercoat per week on average.......... 60% on plastics
and detail grade resin....... yes I undercoat a LOT of stuff

Most (not all) auto undercoats and the metallics are acrylic the same as
so called
hobby paints. In the Uk at least a lot are made by the same companies :) 

The propellant in some paints at a close range or when the spray erupts out
to dissipate sufficiently and reacts with the plastic


Hycote, Halfords and Simonitz are the best and dry MATTE

Red oxide is one of the worst for pitting as its a different formulation
Anonymous
February 15, 2005 12:52:14 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere wrote:
> I use 6 litres of undercoat per week on average.......... 60% on plastics
> and detail grade resin....... yes I undercoat a LOT of stuff

How much GW plastic do you spray? Resin and metal are both much more
forgiving of high solvents.

> Most (not all) auto undercoats and the metallics are acrylic the same as
> so called hobby paints. In the Uk at least a lot are made by the same
> companies :) 

Same here. The difference is the formuation.

Someone commented on microbrews using mass brewer plants as being
similar to having a 4-star chef use the kitchen of the local diner. I
believe that analogy may also hold for hobby primer vs home primer.

> The propellant in some paints at a close range or when the spray erupts out
> to dissipate sufficiently and reacts with the plastic

OTOH, at longer range, the paint may start to dry before reaching the
plastic, producing "fuzz". I wonder if, perhaps, it's just a question
of priming faster.

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
February 16, 2005 1:22:09 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

I would say that 60% of my plastic spraying is GW

EG this week its 10 Rhinos and a few dozen Marines

................ Did some tests and you will find that distance to target IS
a factor

'fuzzing' is also due to propellent / bad mixing......

I use it as a tool to create oxidised armour on larger stuff deliberately
Anonymous
February 16, 2005 1:57:17 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere entered the world pub known as
rec.games.miniatures.warhammer and said...

> I would say that 60% of my plastic spraying is GW
>
> EG this week its 10 Rhinos and a few dozen Marines
>
> ............... Did some tests and you will find that distance to target IS
> a factor
>
> 'fuzzing' is also due to propellent / bad mixing......
>
> I use it as a tool to create oxidised armour on larger stuff deliberately
>
OH YEAH! A spray from about 12" with light dry brush of silver and a
red/brown wash, nothing does rust better...

--
Jim M
posted on this day, the 4,184th of September 1993

"Look alive. Here comes a buzzard." -- Walt Kelly (Pogo)
"I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I
go into the other room and read a book." -- Groucho Marx

http://jimac.tripod.com
Anonymous
February 16, 2005 3:52:58 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Try dusting with brown chalk pastel and then spray sealing........... thats
rust parfait :) 
Anonymous
February 16, 2005 4:43:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Snarfgargle the 43rd The Condottiere entered the world pub known as
rec.games.miniatures.warhammer and said...

> Try dusting with brown chalk pastel and then spray sealing........... thats
> rust parfait :) 
>

I always keep a variety of colors of chalk dust around. Graphite dust is
another must have, take a light tan and rub it lightly with graphite dust
and you get an instant worn leather look.

--
Jim M
posted on this day, the 4,185th of September 1993

"Look alive. Here comes a buzzard." -- Walt Kelly (Pogo)
"I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I
go into the other room and read a book." -- Groucho Marx

http://jimac.tripod.com
!