Steam Tank goodness for all!

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:

-----

A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (7 Replies). RickyDMMontoya[]. 3/1/2005
14:16 (3/1/2005 14:58)
Ok, I've gone through the Empire Steam Tank rules very carefully now,
gone through all the relevant FAQs and Erratas, and I've come to the
conclusion that any army in Warhammer may take a Steam Tank, not just
Empire.

The full name of the unit itself is "Empire Steam Tank" as shown in the
unit information box in its description. The only restrictions written
ANYWHERE in the rules for the damn thing are:

"Note that you may only include one Empire Steam Tank for every full
2,000 points in your army."

Nowhere does it say "The Empire Steam Tank may be taken in any Empire
Army as a Rare Unit selection", or "Only Empire Armies may take a Steam
Tank as a Rare Unit selection" It just says "Rare Unit" and the
"Note..." part, it's a completely unrestricted "Rare Unit" that can be
taken in ANY army of 2000+ points.

This is probably a blessing, as a lot of players just whine and
complain and bitch and moan and cry and get upset when someone uses a
Steam Tank, but now they can take one themselves! It's all fair when
they both have one.

If it wasn't your intention to allow any army to use them, maybe you
should get someone who knows how to thoroughly and correctly write
rules working for you, but too bad, it's completely legit until you
roll around to eventually FAQ it, the same way you fix all the unedited
stuff you spew out.
Reply
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ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will do...

--Chris

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Janet Quick wrote:
> On 3/1/05 3:08 PM, in article
> 1109707716.174118.43040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com, "Chris Valera"
> <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:
> >
> > -----
> >
> > A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (7 Replies). RickyDMMontoya[].
3/1/2005
> > 14:16 (3/1/2005 14:58)
> > Ok, I've gone through the Empire Steam Tank rules very carefully
now,
> > gone through all the relevant FAQs and Erratas, and I've come to
the
> > conclusion that any army in Warhammer may take a Steam Tank, not
just
> > Empire.
> <snip>
> > ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will
do...
>
> Huh? You build your army from the units listed in your army book.
The
> Steam tank isn't in any book but Empire. I sort of doubt any unit
> description bothers to point out that the unit is for the army being
> described in the army book - and not others. Why would the Steam
Tank
> require such a statement?

It's not in the army book, it's in an annual. So technically, the kid
is right!

--Chris

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

On 3/1/05 3:08 PM, in article
1109707716.174118.43040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com, "Chris Valera"
<grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:
>
> -----
>
> A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (7 Replies). RickyDMMontoya[]. 3/1/2005
> 14:16 (3/1/2005 14:58)
> Ok, I've gone through the Empire Steam Tank rules very carefully now,
> gone through all the relevant FAQs and Erratas, and I've come to the
> conclusion that any army in Warhammer may take a Steam Tank, not just
> Empire.
<snip>
> ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will do...

Huh? You build your army from the units listed in your army book. The
Steam tank isn't in any book but Empire. I sort of doubt any unit
description bothers to point out that the unit is for the army being
described in the army book - and not others. Why would the Steam Tank
require such a statement?

The Bretonnians aren't allowed to hire mercenaries, so I'm not up on those
rules but I seem to remember each army type has a list of which other armies
it can (and by omission cannot) hire units from.


janet
--
Readers are plentiful; thinkers are few.
Harriet Martineau

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Chris Valera wrote:
>
> It's not in the army book, it's in an annual. So technically, the kid
> is right!
>
> --Chris


From the very same forum:
RE: A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (5 Replies). ruppt[]. 3/1/2005 17:26
(3/1/2005 18:57)
Very first line about the Steam Tank in the Annual 2002 states that the
Empire Steam tank was a notable exemption form the Empire book. So it
clearly states it is an Empire only unit
http://us.games-workshop.com/community/forums/warforum.htm

The person who argued any army can take a Steam Tank is either an idiot
who thinks he's a genuis, or as is more likely, is a troll taking the
piss out of GW because he doesn't like the quality of their editing, or
maybe the increased minis' prices, or perhaps their paisely ties are
too gaudy, or what have you.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Ibn Tumart wrote:
> Chris Valera wrote:
>
>>
>> It's not in the army book, it's in an annual. So technically, the kid
>> is right!
>> --Chris
>
>
>
> From the very same forum:
> RE: A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (5 Replies). ruppt[]. 3/1/2005 17:26
> (3/1/2005 18:57)
> Very first line about the Steam Tank in the Annual 2002 states that the
> Empire Steam tank was a notable exemption form the Empire book. So it
> clearly states it is an Empire only unit
> http://us.games-workshop.com/community/forums/warforum.htm
>
> The person who argued any army can take a Steam Tank is either an idiot
> who thinks he's a genuis, or as is more likely, is a troll taking the
> piss out of GW because he doesn't like the quality of their editing, or
> maybe the increased minis' prices, or perhaps their paisely ties are
> too gaudy, or what have you.

Er, only the bit above the URL is from the GW forum message... the rest
is my own opinion.

 

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Janet Quick wrote:
> "Chris Valera" <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:

Why are you trawling there???

>>A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (7 Replies). RickyDMMontoya[]. 3/1/2005
>>14:16 (3/1/2005 14:58)
>>Ok, I've gone through the Empire Steam Tank rules very carefully now,
>>gone through all the relevant FAQs and Erratas, and I've come to the
>>conclusion that any army in Warhammer may take a Steam Tank, not just
>>Empire.

???

>>ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right.

I presume the problem is that the rules don't specify which armies can
take it, only that it is strongly inferred that GW intends for Empire
only to take it.

> Huh? You build your army from the units listed in your army book. The
> Steam tank isn't in any book but Empire.

Um, no, it isn't. The Empire book never included it, and the Steam Tank
rules were released afterwards in WD, then Warhammer 2002, then
Warhammer 2004, etc.

> Why would the Steam Tank
> require such a statement?

Because it is good practice to specify clearly which lists may (or may
not) take a particular unit.

> The Bretonnians aren't allowed to hire mercenaries,

This is stated explictly, whereas the EST is implicit.


--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Janet Quick" <janetq@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:BE4A740A.11E7E%janetq@hotmail.com...
> On 3/1/05 3:08 PM, in article
> 1109707716.174118.43040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com, "Chris Valera"
> <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:
> >
> > -----
> >
> > A Steam Tank for Everybody! . (7 Replies). RickyDMMontoya[].
3/1/2005
> > 14:16 (3/1/2005 14:58)
> > Ok, I've gone through the Empire Steam Tank rules very carefully
now,
> > gone through all the relevant FAQs and Erratas, and I've come to the
> > conclusion that any army in Warhammer may take a Steam Tank, not
just
> > Empire.
> <snip>
> > ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will
do...
>
> Huh? You build your army from the units listed in your army book.
The
> Steam tank isn't in any book but Empire. I sort of doubt any unit
> description bothers to point out that the unit is for the army being
> described in the army book - and not others. Why would the Steam Tank
> require such a statement?

He's just pointing out the difference between:

1 - "The Empire Steam Tank is a Rare choice in your Army" and
2 - "The Steam Tank is a Rare choice in your Empire Army"

The first (which is what he's saying the rules are) is typical of GW and
their woolly rules writing, and is a potential exploit. I don't think
for a minute anyone will get away with it though . . . .

Cheers, Martyn

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Ya'no? Being obtuse isn't being clever. If someone reads/writes English at
about a 5th grade level and they have played wargames before ... I would
have to decide they are being intentionally dense (deceptive, lying, trying
to manipulate) or they are an idiot. Perhaps I would have to put an age too
- say...10 or older.

(Did this annual mention which army book it was left out of? Perhaps the
global units army book?)

Just my opinion, of course. This certainly doesn't include anyone in this
newsgroup.

Janet
Mumbling something about a single line of night goblins swinging way out to
release fanatics <taunt taunt>

 

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Karyth Teel wrote:
> "Chris Valera" <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1109707716.174118.43040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:
> >
>
> >
> > ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will
do...
> >
> > --Chris
>
> Hmm, I guess the only defence would be to simply ask "but where does
it say
> YOU can take it?" As long as your empire army is lacking in Steam
Tankness,
> the entry does not state if any armies can actually take them, just
that no
> army can take more than one per 1k.

So, by your own definition, can an Empire army take one? ;-P

--Chris

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

If someone reads and writes English at about a 5th grade level and they
have played wargames before ... they wouldn't have made such a rookie
mistake to begin with.

--Chris

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Chris Valera" <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1109707716.174118.43040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:
>

>
> ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will do...
>
> --Chris

Hmm, I guess the only defence would be to simply ask "but where does it say
YOU can take it?" As long as your empire army is lacking in Steam Tankness,
the entry does not state if any armies can actually take them, just that no
army can take more than one per 1k.

Karyth Teel

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"Chris Valera" <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1109824888.931182.184180@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> Karyth Teel wrote:
> > "Chris Valera" <grimdarkness@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1109707716.174118.43040@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> > >
> > > Found this on the GW message boards, it's great:
> > >
> >
> > >
> > > ROFLMAO! The sad thing is, he's right. Wonder what the mods will
> do...
> > >
> > > --Chris
> >
> > Hmm, I guess the only defence would be to simply ask "but where does
> it say
> > YOU can take it?" As long as your empire army is lacking in Steam
> Tankness,
> > the entry does not state if any armies can actually take them, just
> that no
> > army can take more than one per 1k.
>
> So, by your own definition, can an Empire army take one? ;-P

No, but I don't own one, so I don't really care if the Empire can't take
one.

Karyth Teel

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

In article <d07c7t$m2j$1@eeyore.INS.cwru.edu>, Karyth Teel, spo2
@case.edu Varfed out the following in Timo speak...

<snippage>

> > > Hmm, I guess the only defence would be to simply ask "but where does
> > it say
> > > YOU can take it?" As long as your empire army is lacking in Steam
> > Tankness,
> > > the entry does not state if any armies can actually take them, just
> > that no
> > > army can take more than one per 1k.
> >
> > So, by your own definition, can an Empire army take one? ;-P
>
> No, but I don't own one, so I don't really care if the Empire can't take
> one.
>
> Karyth Teel

This is THE MOST non-cheesy answer I've ever seen. Which invites the
obvious question... What are you doing playing a GW product?

Myr

--
....unless of course you are a total cheese stick and want to
exploit the wording of rules to do something stupid and turn
your gaming experience into counting the number of frowny
faces looking at you, as opposed to enjoying a good ol sci fi
wargame.

GW games. Common sense not included.

--SupAmaN

RGMW FAQ: http://www.rgmw.org

Or...

http://www.sheppard.demon.co.uk/rgmw_faq/rgmw_faq.htm

 

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"Myrmidon" <ImNot@home.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1c919a434df605c098a4af@news-server.woh.rr.com...
> > No, but I don't own one, so I don't really care if the Empire can't take
> > one.
> >
> > Karyth Teel
>
> This is THE MOST non-cheesy answer I've ever seen. Which invites the
> obvious question... What are you doing playing a GW product?
>
> Myr

hehe, well, not winning too many games, I can assure you. Seriously, I
think that it's pretty common sense that only the Empire can field it. By
the same token, I think it's only one step more to say that even the Empire
should field it sparingly. I mean, how many other units represent unique
war machines with a documented history of unreliability? It's like a lot of
things in GW: sizzle over steak.

Karyth Teel

 

[Ewok]

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

In article <d08td4$q6c$1@eeyore.ins.cwru.edu>,
"Karyth Teel" <spo2@case.edu> writes:
> hehe, well, not winning too many games, I can assure you. Seriously, I
> think that it's pretty common sense that only the Empire can field it. By
> the same token, I think it's only one step more to say that even the Empire
> should field it sparingly. I mean, how many other units represent unique
> war machines with a documented history of unreliability? It's like a lot of
> things in GW: sizzle over steak.
>

Every dwarven warmachine, in most my games, atleast one of my two
cannons with rune of forging blows up every game I play and usually it
is a question whetter my flame cannon blows up before or after killing
a goblin. Wait, you said unique, I was just checking the documented
history of unreliability.

/Your friendly neighbourhood Ewok

--
" Oktober. Detta är en av de särskilt farliga månaderna för fondbörs-
spekulation. De andra äro juli, januari, september, april, november, maj,
mars, juni, december, augusti och februari." - Mark Twain