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[Paint] Pre-assembling minis before painting and lighting

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Anonymous
August 26, 2005 3:09:36 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

A few months ago Hwang and I were posting about painting and I mentioned
that these were the first minis I had assembled before I painted them. I
also said that I wouldn't do that again as I found the painting tremendously
difficult. These were the new terminator models and I found that getting
that brush into a lot of the tight spaces was extremely annoying; the angle
required by the joined parts prevented a clear shot.
John responded that he was surprised that I had a hard time with these
minis as their size made them particularly easy to paint (perhaps it was
Erik, I'm not exactly sure of my memory on that...).

Anyway, I've been thinking about it and for those of you that assemble your
models before applying the stucco two questions come to mind on which I
wanted your opinions:

Do you leave the base of the model off until painting is finished?

More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?

I have two 100 watt floods positioned about two feet above my head, each
about a foot away from each shoulder and slightly behind me. I also have a
fluorescent tube two feet to my right about 6" above my hands (for ambient).
Yet sometimes I still feel like I can't see the mini well enough.

And yes, I'm over forty and my eyes are getting on in their years.

--
Sir Scott "Used to paint Ral Partha Orcs with no problem... " McDaniel
Anonymous
August 26, 2005 10:20:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Scott McDaniel wrote:
> A few months ago Hwang and I were posting about painting and I
> mentioned that these were the first minis I had assembled before
> I painted them. I also said that I wouldn't do that again as I
> found the painting tremendously difficult. These were the new
> terminator models and I found that getting that brush into a
> lot of the tight spaces was extremely annoying; the angle
> required by the joined parts prevented a clear shot.

"If you can't get your brush to it, nobody can see it!"

> John responded that he was surprised that I had a hard time
> with these minis as their size made them particularly easy
> to paint

Yup, that would be me. ;) 

Termies are large models, wide stance. Should be easy to paint from any
angle.

> Anyway, I've been thinking about it and for those of you that
> assemble your models before applying the stucco two questions
> come to mind on which I wanted your opinions:

OK, tho you may not like the answers... ;) 

> Do you leave the base of the model off until painting is finished?

Nope. Otherwise, there's nothing to support the mini while you're
painting it, or waiting for it to dry.

I prefer to assemble from the base up, then prime, then paint.

> More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?

I have a halogen room light.

Before, I had a really great halogen desk lamp. Swivel arm,
fully-adjustable angle. When I moved, I lost it. When I get some more
hobby money, I will buy another one.

> And yes, I'm over forty and my eyes are getting on in their years.

Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!


--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
August 26, 2005 12:13:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Snip

>> Anyway, I've been thinking about it and for those of you that assemble
>> your models before applying the stucco two questions come to mind on
>> which I wanted your opinions:

>> Do you leave the base of the model off until painting is finished?

> Nope. Otherwise, there's nothing to support the mini while you're
> painting it, or waiting for it to dry.

What he said.

>> More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?
>
> I have a halogen room light.

I use two 100 watt full-spectrum desk lamps I bought at Costco. I have them
on a shelf about 1 1/2 feet above my hobbytable, with the bulbs themselves
6 inches above that. One on the left and one on the right with about 1 1/2
feet between. Its bright enough that I can see fine detail, but not so
bright it washes out color, or hurts my eyes after a while.

> Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!

I cant find a decent swingarm desk lamp for under 250 bucks in my area
(Seattle, USA). Anyone know of an online store that sells them at a
reasonable price? Full-spectrum preferred.

drgrbek
Related resources
Anonymous
August 26, 2005 7:56:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

In article <denbil$rmo$1@gnus01.u.washington.edu>, Ryan Elkins,
relkins@u.washington.edu Varfed out the following in Timo speak...
> Snip
>
> >> Anyway, I've been thinking about it and for those of you that assemble
> >> your models before applying the stucco two questions come to mind on
> >> which I wanted your opinions:
>
> >> Do you leave the base of the model off until painting is finished?
>
> > Nope. Otherwise, there's nothing to support the mini while you're
> > painting it, or waiting for it to dry.
>
> What he said.
>
> >> More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?
> >
> > I have a halogen room light.
>
> I use two 100 watt full-spectrum desk lamps I bought at Costco. I have them
> on a shelf about 1 1/2 feet above my hobbytable, with the bulbs themselves
> 6 inches above that. One on the left and one on the right with about 1 1/2
> feet between. Its bright enough that I can see fine detail, but not so
> bright it washes out color, or hurts my eyes after a while.
>
> > Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!
>
> I cant find a decent swingarm desk lamp for under 250 bucks in my area
> (Seattle, USA). Anyone know of an online store that sells them at a
> reasonable price? Full-spectrum preferred.
>
> drgrbek

You don't of necessity need a special lamp - it's more the bulbs that
count. Try using GE's 'Reveal' full spectrum bulbs. The higher the
wattage (hotter) the better, but your lamp will get hot too so use some
care. Sunlight is high intensity 'blue-white' light, not yellow (which
is what standard bulbs are and why people in indoor winter photos look
like they're yellowish and ill.) Photographers tend to use heavy duty
500 watt blue-white light bulbs in special lamps with ceramic holders
and some even have built in fans. But I find that 100 watt or 150 watt
GE reveal bulbs work fine in the lamps I've got in my work area. (Even
the 60 watt reveal are better than the standard yellow bulbs if that's
all you can manage.) I've also got a couple halogen lamps on stands as
well.

Hope that helps,

Myrmidon


--
"I'm already impoverished from buying wargames minis,
and I'm too knackered for riotous living..."

-- Moramarth

RGMW FAQ: http://www.rgmw.org

Or...

http://www.sheppard.demon.co.uk/rgmw_faq/rgmw_faq.htm
Anonymous
August 26, 2005 7:58:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Ryan Elkins wrote:
>>>More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?
>>
>>I have a halogen room light.
>
> I use two 100 watt full-spectrum desk lamps I bought at Costco. I have them
> on a shelf about 1 1/2 feet above my hobbytable, with the bulbs themselves
> 6 inches above that. One on the left and one on the right with about 1 1/2
> feet between. Its bright enough that I can see fine detail, but not so
> bright it washes out color, or hurts my eyes after a while.

I might go this route, purely from a cost standpoint.

>>Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!
>
> I cant find a decent swingarm desk lamp for under 250 bucks in my area
> (Seattle, USA). Anyone know of an online store that sells them at a
> reasonable price? Full-spectrum preferred.

It's crazy how expensive a GOOD (high output adjustable halogen) lamp
has gotten.

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
August 26, 2005 7:58:34 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"John Hwang" <JohnHwangCSI@cs.com.no.com> wrote in message
news:J_GPe.21$k32.6@trnddc08...
> Ryan Elkins wrote:
>>>>More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?
>>>
>>>I have a halogen room light.
>>
>> I use two 100 watt full-spectrum desk lamps I bought at Costco. I have
>> them on a shelf about 1 1/2 feet above my hobbytable, with the bulbs
>> themselves 6 inches above that. One on the left and one on the right
>> with about 1 1/2 feet between. Its bright enough that I can see fine
>> detail, but not so bright it washes out color, or hurts my eyes after a
>> while.
>
> I might go this route, purely from a cost standpoint.
US$19.99 apiece last I looked (2 weeks ago)
>
>>>Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!
>>
>> I cant find a decent swingarm desk lamp for under 250 bucks in my area
>> (Seattle, USA). Anyone know of an online store that sells them at a
>> reasonable price? Full-spectrum preferred.
>
> It's crazy how expensive a GOOD (high output adjustable halogen) lamp has
> gotten.
I saw this sweet one that looked like it was built with modelers in mind.
Hi-Med-Low brightness switch, 3 different intensities of magnification, real
solid construction. Then I looked at the price tag.......US$540.00, and I
aint lyin'!
>
> --
> --- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
> \-|-/
> | A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
> | Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
August 26, 2005 9:30:12 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

On 8/26/05 11:13 AM, in article denbil$rmo$1@gnus01.u.washington.edu, "Ryan
Elkins" <relkins@u.washington.edu> wrote:

>
> I cant find a decent swingarm desk lamp for under 250 bucks in my area
> (Seattle, USA). Anyone know of an online store that sells them at a
> reasonable price? Full-spectrum preferred.
>
No! And I have searched. If someone knows, please tell us. I can't find
one for over $250.

janet
--
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better.
Samuel Becket
Anonymous
August 27, 2005 12:11:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

>> Do you leave the base of the model off until painting is
>> finished?

> Nope. Otherwise, there's nothing to support the mini
> while you're painting it, or waiting for
> it to dry.

Nope <G>. I finish each separately, each being a
sub-assembly of a complete model, but in effect,
two distinct models until ultimate attachment to one
another takes place. To wit:

To hold on to my miniature figures while work
is in progress, I usually either grab my pin vise,
or when I'm really lazy, just use a twisty, circular
motion of my x-acto, to drill a hole in the foot,
(or an otherwise invisible location, such as be-
tween the legs between the butt and um... front
of the model <G>) into which a straightened
paper clip or whatever one prefers is super-
glued. This has several advantages while work-
ing: providing a great hand hold, keeping the
fingers well away from the model at all times;
and using a piece of cork, or a small pile of clay,
or a piece of weighted styrofoam, etc., the end
(which I usually cut at a sharp angle to provide
a stabby-end piece <G>) of the hand-hold just
gets plunked into the any-material-that-will-
hold-and-keep-upright-a-completed-model-
with-a-piece-of-rod-in-its-foot between stages
of painting and such (also useful for keeping the
model perfectly still when painting a somewhat
*tough* area)); then ultimately, the metal (or
plastic or whatever) rod gets cut off just below
the foot, creating an excellent pin to very securely
attach the model to an already finished and pre-
pared base.

Also, I usually work on a pile of bases at one
time (similar to the *assembly-line* painting
and finishing of a bunch of similar figures all at
one time), giving them a basic finish job with
the base covered in the appropriate materials
of the expected playing surface(s). The ... I'll
call it *default* ... base covering being parts of
the base finished as dirt (starting with a black or
nearly black (such as 'Van Dyke') brown paint
job drybrushed with the usual couple'a few
successively lighter colors to bring up details),
probably with a few visible stones, and grass
flock and/or static grass here and there to finish
it up (small tufts of tall *field grass* or different
textures of flocking, small pieces of thin card cut
into *tiles*, or other flourishes easily being
attached at any time as well using this method).

Finally, if doing a model with a particularly
fancy -- quite tall, for instance -- base, this is
totally the only way to do it. One can't spend
a huge amount of time, maybe over the course
of two or more days, building a super-elabor-
ate base, only to then attach the figure for its
finish, using what certainly would be a very
clumsy (and expensive, in time and maybe a
little bit of cash), totally inappropriate base for
a *simple handhold* (not to mention injuring
or completely wrecking the base by using it
thusly). Oh well -- works for me. Diff'rent
strokes (paint srokes, get it? <ahem>) and all
that ....

--
Bubba Pearson
Manassas, VA

"[...] we must endure the present that those who
come after may continue the greater work" War-
hammer 40,000: Rogue Trader

bubbbapearson@comcast.net
bubbap0956@aol.com

AIM: bubbap0956
Anonymous
August 27, 2005 12:35:25 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

"John Hwang" <JohnHwangCSI@cs.com.no.com> wrote in message
news:xwyPe.21759$0U6.93@trnddc09...
> Scott McDaniel wrote:
>> A few months ago Hwang and I were posting about painting and I mentioned
>> that these were the first minis I had assembled before
>> I painted them. I also said that I wouldn't do that again as I found the
>> painting tremendously difficult. These were the new terminator models and
>> I found that getting that brush into a lot of the tight spaces was
>> extremely annoying; the angle required by the joined parts prevented a
>> clear shot.
>
> "If you can't get your brush to it, nobody can see it!"
>

This is a great answer for a few reasons, but what really struck me about it
has to do with my own attitudes and experiences in the video gaming
industry. We have to make sure, when making a 3D game, that everything has
a texture applied. As an example, the bottom of a coffee table must have an
appropriate shader applied in the event that a character is knocked to the
ground near said table... or if that table will be re-used in a building
that is ruined. The possibility that an area may somehow be seen, through
whatever circumstances, drives our overall strategy in this regard. This is
known as the "Mr. Lawrence Effect".

This makes me believe that some re-evaluation of my current painting
technique is in order.

Thanks!

>> John responded that he was surprised that I had a hard time with these
>> minis as their size made them particularly easy
>> to paint
>
> Yup, that would be me. ;) 
>
> Termies are large models, wide stance. Should be easy to paint from any
> angle.

Well, their also expensive. I think I'll start this new painting style on a
squad of Chaos Marines I have sitting around.


>
> Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!
>

Heh. I happen to have one at my REAL painting station (where I use paint on
canvas, etc.).

--
Sir Scott "Guache... " McDaniel
Anonymous
August 27, 2005 3:16:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Ryan Elkins wrote:
> "John Hwang" <JohnHwangCSI@cs.com.no.com> wrote ...

>>>>Buy yourself a halogen or high output desk lamp on a swingarm!
>>>
>>>I cant find a decent swingarm desk lamp for under 250 bucks in my area
>>>(Seattle, USA). Anyone know of an online store that sells them at a
>>>reasonable price? Full-spectrum preferred.
>>
>>It's crazy how expensive a GOOD (high output adjustable halogen) lamp has
>>gotten.
>
> I saw this sweet one that looked like it was built with modelers in mind.
> Hi-Med-Low brightness switch, 3 different intensities of magnification, real
> solid construction. Then I looked at the price tag.......US$540.00, and I
> aint lyin'!

I want this one:

http://alvinco.com/detail.asp?f=&FamilyID=2660&cat1=Dra...

Alvin Electrix Halogen Draftsman's Lamp #6005 - $237 MSLP

--
--- John Hwang "JohnHwang...@cs.com.no.com"
\-|-/
| A.K.D. F.E.M.C.
| Horned Blood Cross Terror LED Speed Jagd Destiny
Anonymous
August 27, 2005 5:37:11 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.miniatures.warhammer (More info?)

Scott McDaniel <smcdaniel1@cox.net> wrote:
> More importantly (I'm guessing), how do you light your painting station?

> I have two 100 watt floods positioned about two feet above my head, each
> about a foot away from each shoulder and slightly behind me. I also have a
> fluorescent tube two feet to my right about 6" above my hands (for
> ambient). Yet sometimes I still feel like I can't see the mini well
> enough.

OK, I'm curious, how does all the *heat* from those lamps effect your
painting? I typically paint with a 60-100W compact florescent above me, and
even that generates enough heat to be bothersome.

> And yes, I'm over forty and my eyes are getting on in their years.

My eye's are starting to become a problem, but light levels have yet to be a
major issue. In fact I prefer to stay away from bright light.

Zane
!