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TECH: TZ Flipper Porblems follow up

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Anonymous
June 13, 2005 6:25:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Hi all,

Some of you may remember I had problems a while back with weak lower
flippers on my TZ after a rebuild of them including correct coils placement.

Well they got better after I adjusted the EOS switches however I still
feel they are weak, I have measured the resistance of my coils and they seem
correct however I had a look at the coils I removed and I noticed that 1 of
them had no diodes fitted to it, they had actually been cut off the coil and
their legs were still there, now I am just wondering if this has damaged
something on my fliptronic 2 board? I should add the game had never reset
from the day I got it being like this which I find strange.

I do have another fliptronic 2 board in my HSII and I will swap them
over if I get advised to however I just thought I would ask on here first if
anyone has seen this problem and seen a board damaged due to removed diodes
on the flipper coils, and the other reason is if the board is damaged it
will need repairs made so I would like to know which components would be
damaged from this occurrence so I can replace them.

Thanks for the help in advance.

Kevin
Anonymous
June 13, 2005 6:25:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

My first question is what is it doing that you feel it is weak? Are
all the "flips" and "holds" working in the flipper test?

Step one would be to put the diodes back on the coil, unless they were
moved someplace else but that is unlikely. This needs to be done to
protect your boards whether or not they have suffered damage.

After you put diodes on and swap your boards if you detect that
something is not right on the one board I would suggest getting your
hands on the WPC schematic manual. There are three transistors as well
as some resistors and other smaller components for each flipper. Which
ones would you need to replace? That's hard to say off the top of my head.

-wolffy


Sojourner353 wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Some of you may remember I had problems a while back with weak lower
> flippers on my TZ after a rebuild of them including correct coils placement.
>
> Well they got better after I adjusted the EOS switches however I still
> feel they are weak, I have measured the resistance of my coils and they seem
> correct however I had a look at the coils I removed and I noticed that 1 of
> them had no diodes fitted to it, they had actually been cut off the coil and
> their legs were still there, now I am just wondering if this has damaged
> something on my fliptronic 2 board? I should add the game had never reset
> from the day I got it being like this which I find strange.
>
> I do have another fliptronic 2 board in my HSII and I will swap them
> over if I get advised to however I just thought I would ask on here first if
> anyone has seen this problem and seen a board damaged due to removed diodes
> on the flipper coils, and the other reason is if the board is damaged it
> will need repairs made so I would like to know which components would be
> damaged from this occurrence so I can replace them.
>
> Thanks for the help in advance.
>
> Kevin
>
>
June 13, 2005 6:25:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

If the flipper coils are wired the wrong way, you could get weak flips.
Your Fliptronic board should be OK.

The correct sequence should be:

Blue-yellow Grey-yellow banded end of diode
Blue-violet Blue-grey Middle connector
orange-green orange-blue unbanded end of diode

In your case, you don't have diodes. Wiring the coil backwards would
have been a good reason to cut them off!

If you have the blue-violet and blue-grey wires on the middle pins, I
would try reversing the outer pins on one of the flippers and seeing if
that helps.

You should get the diodes in there. There are more diodes on the
Fliptronic board, but it is better to be safer.
Related resources
Can't find your answer ? Ask !
June 13, 2005 8:05:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

In the hold test, the flippers might or might not raise. It is a
low-power coil, so it is no surprise.

At this point, I would be thinking new coils.
Anonymous
June 14, 2005 2:48:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Hi,

Thanks for the replies.

For Wolffy: The flippers seem to not be strong enough as many long ball
shots don't seem to make it around the ramps, I have done the flipper test
and the test works fine however the hold test is a bit thingy, considering
they have been completely rebuilt including bushing the hold should work, it
does work with a little assistance but the power one works fine.

For Martin: They are wired the way you describe and knowing now there
are diodes on the Fliptronic 2 board I am guessing there will be no damage
on there.

I am going to swap boards today and see if there is a difference,
thanks.

Kevin.

"martin" <martin.reynolds@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118684628.968732.206350@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> If the flipper coils are wired the wrong way, you could get weak flips.
> Your Fliptronic board should be OK.
>
> The correct sequence should be:
>
> Blue-yellow Grey-yellow banded end of diode
> Blue-violet Blue-grey Middle connector
> orange-green orange-blue unbanded end of diode
>
> In your case, you don't have diodes. Wiring the coil backwards would
> have been a good reason to cut them off!
>
> If you have the blue-violet and blue-grey wires on the middle pins, I
> would try reversing the outer pins on one of the flippers and seeing if
> that helps.
>
> You should get the diodes in there. There are more diodes on the
> Fliptronic board, but it is better to be safer.
>
June 14, 2005 3:23:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

Still not sure I have all of this. Where did the diodes go? And how do
you know that the yellow-striped wires are at the banded end of the
diode if the diodes are missing?

The reason I am asking is because if the wiring is reversed, the hold
coil will get the main flip current and the flip coil will get the hold
current. The hold current goes through a 220 ohm resistor so you would
get a slightly late, slightly lazy, flip.The coils are not symmetrical.
Anonymous
June 14, 2005 6:52:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

They are new coils I have.

"martin" <martin.reynolds@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118703908.142165.187490@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> In the hold test, the flippers might or might not raise. It is a
> low-power coil, so it is no surprise.
>
> At this point, I would be thinking new coils.
>
June 14, 2005 12:53:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

OK, now I get it. I guess the next easy step is to replae the
Fliptornics board, just to make sure that there is nothing funny up
there. Then all that is left is mechanicals.
Anonymous
June 14, 2005 3:26:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.games.pinball (More info?)

no my new coils have diodes one of the old wrong ones that I removed didn't
have diodes on it.

"martin" <martin.reynolds@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1118730224.534671.184960@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Still not sure I have all of this. Where did the diodes go? And how do
> you know that the yellow-striped wires are at the banded end of the
> diode if the diodes are missing?
>
> The reason I am asking is because if the wiring is reversed, the hold
> coil will get the main flip current and the flip coil will get the hold
> current. The hold current goes through a 220 ohm resistor so you would
> get a slightly late, slightly lazy, flip.The coils are not symmetrical.
>
!